Committee of the Whole

11:21All right, good afternoon everyone,

11:22and thank you for joining our October 3rd, 2023

11:26Committee of the Whole meeting.

11:28And it is one o'clock on the dot,

11:30so I'll just officially call the meeting to order.

11:33I have not had any regrets today,

11:37sent to me in advance, so I'll get that out of the way.

11:41But we're looking to move into closed session off the top,

11:45and I'll just read what the titles are here,

11:49or a title actually, which is,

11:52Claire Mulpey, secondary plan,

11:54Ontario Land Tribunal update.

11:57This is under section 2392ENF litigation,

12:01or potential litigation,

12:03including matters before administrative tribunals,

12:06affecting the municipality or local board,

12:08and advice that is subject to solicitor,

12:11client privilege, including communications necessary

12:14for that purpose.

12:16That's the only item that we're looking to consider.

12:19Before I call the vote on that,

12:21does anyone have a disclosure of pecuniary interest,

12:23or any general nature thereof on that item,

12:25before we move in to closed?

12:29Okay, seeing and hearing none.

12:30Would someone be willing to move,

12:32so we can get that allowance to move into closed?

12:35Councillor Goller will do that,

12:37or Rourke will second for us.

12:40Is there anything further on this item?

12:43Seeing and hearing none.

12:44Is anyone against moving into closed?

12:48And that's unanimous then.

12:50So for those watching or joining us,

12:53just give us some time as we move into a closed meeting

12:57to the public in regards to only that matter.

12:59And when done, I will return and give a high level summary

13:03of what has taken place,

13:05but we'll just be a little while on that,

13:07and then we'll continue with our open session later on.

13:10Thank you very much.

1:05:58Okay everyone, I'd like to just call the meeting

1:06:00back to order, please, just for a moment,

1:06:03as we come back out of closed session.

1:06:06Our open session will officially start at two o'clock,

1:06:09but as I normally do,

1:06:12I do bring a high level summary out publicly

1:06:15from the closed session.

1:06:17So just about an hour ago,

1:06:20council approved to go into a closed session

1:06:23under the title, Claire Mulpey Secondary Plan,

1:06:25the Ontario Land Tribunal Update.

1:06:28And for my summary on that,

1:06:30council was presented with information

1:06:33in regards to that topic.

1:06:35We have obviously discussed that topic,

1:06:38and then the outcome was that direction was given

1:06:41to our staff in regards to that matter.

1:06:45And that's the summary for that.

1:06:48So that item is done.

1:06:50As I said, our open session will start at two o'clock.

1:06:53So we do have a little bit of time here,

1:06:56about four or five minutes, a quick break,

1:06:59and then I'll call the meeting back to order at two o'clock.

1:07:01Okay, thank you.

1:12:45Thank you.

1:12:46I'd like to call the meeting to order

1:12:48for today, October 3rd, 2023, at 2 p.m.

1:12:53And Mayor Guthrie is here today,

1:12:58but because most of the agenda items are public services,

1:13:01I've decided, he's decided that I could start off

1:13:03or should start off the meeting.

1:13:05So that's what we're doing here.

1:13:08So if you're able, I'd like us to stand

1:13:11and be able to think, oh, Canada, thank you.

1:14:43Thank you, we'll take a few moments for silent reflection.

1:15:04Thank you.

1:15:05And so now I'm going to read the,

1:15:06our new Indigenous Territorial Acknowledgement.

1:15:10As we gather, let us take time to reflect on our privilege

1:15:13to live and work in Guelph,

1:15:16a city built over rich Indigenous histories.

1:15:19We are guests here, and we should reflect upon

1:15:21the responsibility to care for this land,

1:15:24the people who live here today, and the generations to come.

1:15:28In our, if our actions today can move us

1:15:31towards reconciliation, we should take pause

1:15:34and make those decisions with intention and gratitude.

1:15:38This place we call Guelph has served as traditional lands

1:15:42and a place of refuge for many peoples over time.

1:15:45And more specifically, the Addie Wanderak and the Haudenosaite.

1:15:51This land is held as a treaty lands and territorial

1:15:55of the Mississaugas of the credit First Nations.

1:15:59Guelph lives directly adjacent to the Haldeman Tract

1:16:02and part of a long established traditional hunting ground

1:16:05for the Six Nations of the Grand River.

1:16:08Many First Nations, Inuit and Métis people

1:16:11who have come here from across Turtle Island

1:16:14called Guelph home today.

1:16:16Thank you.

1:16:19Are there any disclosure of precunity interests

1:16:22and general nature thereof?

1:16:26Okay, seeing none.

1:16:27So we have a few recognitions today,

1:16:30all of them under the public service.

1:16:34So I'm gonna go through them,

1:16:35and then we'll go through them first

1:16:37and then we'll do the photos afterwards.

1:16:40So it is my pleasure to acknowledge Mohamed Ismail,

1:16:44the city's infrastructure and program support specialist

1:16:48with the corporate and community safety division

1:16:50in his recent achievement.

1:16:52Mohamed has graduated from Wilford Laurier

1:16:55with a master's in public safety

1:16:56and emergency management.

1:16:59Laurier's public safety master's degree program

1:17:02is a Canada first and a one of its kind.

1:17:05The program was created in alignment

1:17:07with the pillars of public safety Canada.

1:17:10Students are provided education and the opportunity

1:17:13to critically examine current and emerging issues

1:17:16facing public safety both within Canada and worldwide.

1:17:21These issues include internal and external forces

1:17:24that are shaping security practices.

1:17:27Congratulations Mohamed.

1:17:31Secondly, and I'm happy to announce

1:17:33that five of our paramedics have been recognized

1:17:36for their exemplary service.

1:17:38The EMS Exemplary Service Medal is awarded

1:17:41to the Governor General,

1:17:43by the Governor General of Canada

1:17:44and recognizes professionals in the provision

1:17:47of pre-hospital emergency medical services to the public.

1:17:52This is not a year of service award,

1:17:55recipients of those who have performed their duties

1:17:58and exemplary matter characterized

1:17:59by good conduct, industry and efficiency.

1:18:04Three paramedics from the city of Guelph,

1:18:06Guelph Wellington Paramedic Service

1:18:08were selected to receive the award this year.

1:18:10They are Kerry Gordon and Edith Elker and Grace Perry.

1:18:14These medals were presented this past Thursday evening

1:18:17at an awards ceremony hosted by the Ontario Association

1:18:21of Paramedic Chiefs.

1:18:23In addition to the medals,

1:18:25a bar with a stylized maple leaf may be awarded

1:18:28to previous medal recipients

1:18:29for each additional 10-year period of exemplary service

1:18:34with emergency medical services.

1:18:38This year, two paramedics from the city of Guelph,

1:18:40Guelph Wellington Paramedic Services

1:18:42have been selected to receive a bar

1:18:44in addition to the medal that was previously received.

1:18:48They are Paramedic Superintendent Amy Benn

1:18:51and Paramedic Commander Wendy Beeman.

1:18:54These bars will be presented later this fall.

1:18:56So joining us today are the paramedics Kerry Gordon

1:19:01and Commander Wendy Beeman.

1:19:03And then we have one more special recognition

1:19:06before we go to take the pictures

1:19:08and Mayor Guthrie is going to speak to that.

1:19:11Well, thank you, Madam Chair.

1:19:13It's my pleasure to recognize someone

1:19:15that we work with very closely as members of council

1:19:20and the community too.

1:19:21I'm excited to share that Stephen O'Brien,

1:19:23our city clerk and general manager

1:19:26of the city clerk's office,

1:19:28has earned his executive certificate in public leadership

1:19:31from the Kennedy School of Government at Harvard University.

1:19:36The Kennedy School of Government is a public policy

1:19:38and public administration school within Harvard University.

1:19:42The public leadership concentration is for leaders

1:19:45with extensive public service experience

1:19:47with a focus on professional education programs

1:19:50that, one, explore innovative leadership

1:19:54and management strategies.

1:19:55And two, gain cutting edge insights

1:19:58on effectively delivering public facing services

1:20:00while managing diverse constituencies.

1:20:04Alumni with these executive certificates

1:20:07in public leadership include senior government officials,

1:20:11leaders of non-governmental organizations,

1:20:13and representatives from multilateral organizations.

1:20:17So please join me in congratulating Stephen O'Brien

1:20:20on earning this certification.

1:20:28Okay, we're just going to take a few photos

1:20:29with the recipients before we get into the meeting.

1:20:33Congratulations.

1:23:56Okay, so we're moving forward with our agenda.

1:24:00Thank you, everybody, for your patience.

1:24:03We are going to, so on the consent agenda,

1:24:07there's two items, 8.1, emergency management bylaw

1:24:11and program amendments, and community grant policy update 23-353.

1:24:19Would anybody like to pull any of those?

1:24:22Councillor Boulceville?

1:24:24Yes, thank you, the community.

1:24:25Yes, thank you, the community grant.

1:24:27Okay.

1:24:29Anything, oh, Councillor Caden?

1:24:34Sorry, could you repeat the consent agenda again?

1:24:38On the consent agenda, there's 8.1,

1:24:41emergency management bylaw and program amendments,

1:24:44and there's the community grant policy update.

1:24:48And Councillor Bousatel has asked

1:24:50for the community grant policy update to be pulled.

1:24:54Sorry, to you, Chair,

1:24:56is that different than the emergency management plan?

1:25:02Yes.

1:25:03Okay, then no thank you.

1:25:05Okay, so can I have a motion for the first day,

1:25:09emergency management bylaw program amendments,

1:25:12and then we'll go to the second item.

1:25:14Mayor Guthrie, seconded by Councillor Orr-Werck.

1:25:19Any questions?

1:25:20Anyone opposed?

1:25:23Okay, passes.

1:25:24Okay, Councillor Bousatel,

1:25:26you wanted to ask a question

1:25:27about the community grant policy update?

1:25:29Yes, thank you first to the staff for the report.

1:25:32I have two questions.

1:25:34Just a clarification, I read in the report

1:25:36that the decision for the community grant policy

1:25:38is final and not appealed, and I can't remember.

1:25:41Is this the same for community benefit agreements?

1:25:46Through the Chair, Councillor Bousatel,

1:25:49while Dana and Alex are getting seated,

1:25:50I'll start and then we'll probably pass it over to them.

1:25:53This is a different process

1:25:54than we have for the community benefit agreements.

1:25:56The community benefit agreements

1:25:58are delegated fully to staff,

1:26:00and so those come forward through the budget process,

1:26:03the decisions about the community benefit agreements

1:26:05are not covered under what you have before you today.

1:26:08Those are handled through a separate policy,

1:26:10but I'll look to see if Dana or Alex wants to add anything.

1:26:15No, I guess I answered it fully.

1:26:18Thank you, my second question is around the community,

1:26:21sorry, the community grants.

1:26:23How are KPI set and reported to council,

1:26:27and what is the cycle for the evaluation of these grants?

1:26:31Is it aligned with the strategic plan?

1:26:36Thank you for the question,

1:26:38through the Chair and the Councillor.

1:26:40So in terms of KPIs, so they're collected

1:26:45from every organization that is awarded a community grant.

1:26:50Those KPIs are determined at the point of application.

1:26:54They're gathered by staff and reviewed by staff

1:26:57and the grant panel,

1:27:01and then a, irrigated and reported annually to council.

1:27:07Thank you, and the second part of my question was,

1:27:10is the cycle for the evaluation of the KPIs

1:27:14part of the strategic planning cycle,

1:27:16like or is it in perpetuities,

1:27:19these KPIs for the community grants?

1:27:23That's correct, yeah, their annual KPIs

1:27:26determined with the organization.

1:27:30Yeah, so there would be unique to each organization

1:27:33that's developed.

1:27:35Sorry, maybe I'm not being clear.

1:27:36So are the KPIs about the organization

1:27:39or about the city who is awarding funding

1:27:42to further KPIs on behalf of the city?

1:27:45And that's my question,

1:27:47is the city's KPIs part of this process

1:27:50and is it part of the strategic planning cycle

1:27:54change those KPIs as an extension

1:27:57for those community grants to further the work of the city?

1:28:02Is that more helpful?

1:28:05I'm not sure.

1:28:06I can jump in through the chair to the counselor.

1:28:08They're unique to the organization

1:28:10and so the strategic plan drives the city work

1:28:13and certainly foundationally we look for partnerships

1:28:17with grant organizations that would align

1:28:19to the strategic plan and to our community plan as a whole,

1:28:22but the funding is linked to performance

1:28:25out of their organization,

1:28:27whether that's operating capital

1:28:28or even a special events grant.

1:28:31Am I getting closer for you?

1:28:32Yeah, I guess I was looking for like the roll up the rim

1:28:35kind of thing,

1:28:36because a community grant KPIs and indicators

1:28:39and successes roll into the dashboard

1:28:43for the city's strategic plan

1:28:45and what you're saying to me is no, it doesn't.

1:28:48It's about the organization and their objectives.

1:28:51There's no connection to the strategic plan.

1:29:00Thank you.

1:29:02Would you like to move the motion?

1:29:04Thank you.

1:29:04Moved by Councillor Bousetile

1:29:07for the community grant policy update,

1:29:08seconder, Councillor Allt.

1:29:12Any further questions, comments?

1:29:15Okay, is anyone opposed?

1:29:18Okay, that passes.

1:29:20Okay, we're gonna go right into the items for discussion

1:29:23with the public services.

1:29:26And the first one, three great topics today,

1:29:30is the public art policy

1:29:31and we're going to have Tammy Adkin,

1:29:34the manager of Guelph Museums,

1:29:36give her presentation first.

1:29:44Good afternoon, everyone.

1:29:46The public art policy that's before you

1:29:49is our latest recommendation for revision.

1:29:53The policy was first established in 2011

1:29:56and then last revised in 2014.

1:29:59And so the amendments or changes to the policy

1:30:02that are before you largely,

1:30:05to some degree, update references

1:30:06to reporting and accountability relationships.

1:30:10But in addition to that,

1:30:11with the revisions to the policy,

1:30:13we intend to accomplish three things.

1:30:16The first, the policy statement has been revised

1:30:20to center the artist and to recognize

1:30:23that public art encompasses artistic practice,

1:30:26not just the output, like the sculpture,

1:30:28the mural or the song,

1:30:31but the process of making art as well.

1:30:33And through the policy statement

1:30:35and implementation of the policy,

1:30:38we want to demonstrate our respect for artists

1:30:40and recognize the significant impact

1:30:43their work has on community well-being and vitality,

1:30:47place-making and prosperity.

1:30:49The recommended policy updates also align management

1:30:53of the city's public art collection

1:30:55with the museum's robust collection management practices.

1:30:59So from acquisition to conservation and preservation

1:31:02to record keeping to public access.

1:31:05It's our intent to be consistent in how we manage

1:31:09both the material heritage collection

1:31:11that the city has as well as the public art collection.

1:31:14And finally, the revised policy recommendations

1:31:21recommends regular contributions

1:31:22from the city's operating budget

1:31:24to the public art reserve fund

1:31:26to provide a funding mechanism

1:31:28for acquisitions and commissions.

1:31:30Contributions from community benefits charges,

1:31:34federal and provincial grants and private donations

1:31:37will also be used to grow the public art reserve.

1:31:40Currently, there is a budget

1:31:43for the maintenance of the public art collection,

1:31:45but not for acquiring new works.

1:31:47And this approach would ensure available allocations

1:31:51for legacy acquisitions or commissions,

1:31:55such as public art projects to mark the bicentennial,

1:31:58for instance.

1:31:59So at this time, we're asking council

1:32:02for approval of the policy and principle

1:32:04as a guiding document and the actual budget request

1:32:07will be forthcoming through the budget process.

1:32:12Thank you.

1:32:13Are there, I think we don't see any delegations

1:32:17on this topic.

1:32:18So are there any questions for staff on this?

1:32:23Councillor Bousetail.

1:32:25Thank you.

1:32:26And through you, Madam Chair,

1:32:27thank you very much for the report.

1:32:29This is exciting.

1:32:31I have three questions.

1:32:33So the first one, I'm gonna refer

1:32:35to the consolidated report page numbers.

1:32:37So it's on page 43 in it.

1:32:39It's around the funding section 2.1.

1:32:42My question is twofold.

1:32:43The first one is this a fixed formula

1:32:46of 25% for governance.

1:32:48And if you can elaborate a little bit,

1:32:50what exactly is governance?

1:32:52And my interest is the community art initiative,

1:32:56as part of engagement and everything else,

1:32:58and that the process for engagement

1:33:00might be greater than 75, 25.

1:33:02So is that funding fixed?

1:33:05Is it set out in policy?

1:33:06Is it negotiable?

1:33:08By initiative?

1:33:10If you can explain a bit more, please.

1:33:15The ratio set out in the policy are best practices,

1:33:22and they are our targets that we work towards.

1:33:26We do want to ensure that investment in public art

1:33:30is benefiting the artistic community primarily,

1:33:33and we want to ensure that our administration

1:33:37of that work, while important,

1:33:40is secondary to the investment that goes to community.

1:33:49Okay, thank you.

1:33:50The second one is section 3.1, page 44 and 45,

1:33:54and this is the evaluation criteria set out as A to K

1:33:59for sites owned, public art sites owned.

1:34:03So how is community art valued in this process,

1:34:08especially if it's not on a public site?

1:34:10Is that part of the conversation,

1:34:15especially in neighborhood residential areas

1:34:17where there may not be public space?

1:34:25Again, the section of the policy provides guidance

1:34:28for public art and public spaces,

1:34:31and we hope that our practices are modeled

1:34:37for art within private spaces.

1:34:42So again, we're trying to model best practices,

1:34:46but we don't have a mechanism through this policy

1:34:52for insisting on selection and criteria

1:34:57for art in private spaces.

1:35:01Thank you, and I guess I'm thinking of some of the youth

1:35:04in the neighborhood and so on

1:35:05that may not be artistically connected to public spaces,

1:35:09but more other areas in the community.

1:35:13The final question that I had is,

1:35:15and then I have a comment, Madam Chair,

1:35:17is the overlap in planning and funding for community art

1:35:22with community engagement and the city's equity initiatives.

1:35:26And I didn't see any reference to this.

1:35:27It speaks to collaborating and so on.

1:35:31Is there an intentional process for community art?

1:35:37Certainly through the presentation

1:35:41on the culture plan that you will see

1:35:44in just a few moments, community art

1:35:47and equity diversity inclusion in art initiatives

1:35:52is writ large in the culture plan,

1:35:55and that will influence the public art policy and practice.

1:36:02Okay, are there any other questions?

1:36:06Councillor Cato and then Councillor Coron.

1:36:09Thank you, through you, Chair.

1:36:11I was interested in that in a COVID recovery section.

1:36:14I was just wondering what we're doing to address air quality

1:36:17in our culture buildings that we own personally

1:36:20and what we're doing to encourage air cleaning

1:36:22in other locations.

1:36:28Through the chair to Councillor Caton,

1:36:29that really wasn't within the bounds of this study.

1:36:32This was simply looking at public art

1:36:34and not our cultural facilities specifically,

1:36:37but that's certainly a question that we can take away

1:36:39and refer to our corporate facilities staff

1:36:42who sit in this home section

1:36:44and can get back to you specifically

1:36:46about the facility question.

1:36:49Great, thank you.

1:36:50I said one more question.

1:36:51So I saw that there was identified

1:36:55that we had inadequate event structure

1:36:57and some red tape that were issues,

1:37:00but I didn't see where we had listed the solution to that.

1:37:03Is that work that's gonna happen separately

1:37:06or is that in his other document?

1:37:11Through chair Downer, I think you're referencing

1:37:13the culture plan, which is the next item up on the agenda.

1:37:16And so if it's okay, maybe we can answer that question

1:37:19when we get to that next agenda item.

1:37:21Sorry, I'm very excited.

1:37:22Thank you.

1:37:23We are too, it's okay.

1:37:27Okay, is that, have you finished, Councillor Caton?

1:37:32Okay, Councillor Caron.

1:37:34Thank you.

1:37:35It sounds like we're all excited.

1:37:36I know this has been on the work plan for a long time

1:37:38and I just wanna thank you for bringing this report forward

1:37:41and it is comprehensive and I'm too excited.

1:37:45Public art, I'm sure we've all visited cities

1:37:48and seen public art and said,

1:37:50why don't we have more of it in Guelph?

1:37:52And I think there's not a lot of awareness

1:37:55of the public art that we do have,

1:37:56some of the beautiful pieces that we have

1:37:59throughout the city.

1:38:00So I'm excited to add more.

1:38:01I do think it adds to vibrancy

1:38:03and is reflective of who we are as a city.

1:38:07That is my preamble.

1:38:08I know in section 1.2,

1:38:11and I have interacted with staff

1:38:13on some of these questions already.

1:38:14I just think that it does part of our public discourse.

1:38:17It's good to have this information out there.

1:38:20Under roles in the report, section 1.2,

1:38:23the stakeholders listed in the report

1:38:26are community representatives, city staff and city council.

1:38:31I consider community representatives

1:38:33different than the community and citizens at large.

1:38:37I know we use our community engagement framework

1:38:39in everything we do,

1:38:40but I wonder if staff could elaborate

1:38:42on what community engagement practices will be used

1:38:47during the acquisition and display

1:38:50of our public art collection.

1:38:55Through the chair to the Councillor Caron.

1:38:59In terms of acquisition, selection of public art,

1:39:04there is process through the council appointed public art

1:39:09advisory committee to advise on

1:39:15and help us set calls to artists.

1:39:18And then there is a practice

1:39:19of the public art advisory committee,

1:39:22and community members on the public art advisory committee

1:39:25to be involved directly in the during and selection of calls

1:39:29for larger projects.

1:39:32We also engage with the public art advisory committee

1:39:35on smaller public art projects

1:39:37like the artists in residence program.

1:39:40And then for any major investments in public art

1:39:46or unique projects,

1:39:48we would engage with community engagement

1:39:53if there is a decision to be made outside of

1:39:58the direction we already have for public art.

1:40:01And in addition to that, the public art advisory committee,

1:40:06it has a say in all of our activity

1:40:09in terms of determining acquisitions, projects,

1:40:13and how we approach those.

1:40:15Okay, so specifically,

1:40:17other than the public art advisory committee,

1:40:21how would your average citizen who perhaps wants

1:40:24to participate in ideation on a theme?

1:40:28For example, an indigenous space having public art identity

1:40:36to it, how would your average citizen provide input

1:40:40into public art in general?

1:40:44Not specific acquisitions, not an RFPs

1:40:47or purchasing or commissioning specific pieces

1:40:55or a call for an artist competition,

1:40:58but just in general on public art

1:41:01and where a location for future public art

1:41:05or themes for public art,

1:41:06how would our citizens get involved

1:41:09in providing input into those decisions?

1:41:16Through the chair to Councillor Cronn.

1:41:19I think in the last couple of years

1:41:23and informing the culture plan

1:41:27that you will have an opportunity to see,

1:41:31we have had opportunity for community

1:41:35through our community engagement activities

1:41:36on the culture plan to advise us

1:41:39on aspirations for public art,

1:41:42suggestions for where public art should be located,

1:41:46identifying gaps for public art.

1:41:49And so we have received a lot of that input

1:41:51through our community engagement for the culture plan.

1:41:56In moving forward, we always welcome input from citizens

1:42:01and look forward to having one-on-one conversations,

1:42:06conversations with arts organizations

1:42:08and ongoing dialogue with the community.

1:42:10And then again, where there is an opportunity

1:42:13to explore major public art opportunities,

1:42:18we would go through a formal community engagement process

1:42:22as outlined in the community engagement framework.

1:42:25Okay, thanks.

1:42:27My second question had to do with

1:42:32the difference between an art and an artifact

1:42:35because the city collects artifacts,

1:42:38historical artifacts, anything from pieces of architecture,

1:42:44stained glass, carvings, stone gates,

1:42:51lentils or keystones from demolished buildings.

1:42:54We have quite a lot,

1:42:55and I know there's one in the lobby of the museum,

1:42:57there's signage, a beautiful sign from an old building.

1:43:00How does a city asset and become part

1:43:06of our public art collection,

1:43:08how do you determine what is art and what is an artifact?

1:43:14And how do you determine what is just put

1:43:18into a city storage facility

1:43:21versus put into the museum collection for potential display?

1:43:27Through the chair to Councillor Caron.

1:43:30So the difference between art and an artifact,

1:43:36we consider art to be creations

1:43:39that have been developed by artists

1:43:44that contribute to aesthetics,

1:43:49that make artistic statement,

1:43:52that are unique in their creation.

1:43:54An artifact is material,

1:43:56either objects or archival records

1:44:00that have historical cultural value.

1:44:03And so artifacts are,

1:44:09represent material that's acquired by

1:44:12and accepted into the museum collection.

1:44:15There is a process for acquiring that material

1:44:20that is quite robust.

1:44:22The material has to be aligned with the museum's mandate,

1:44:26our collecting mandate.

1:44:28We have to be assured that we have the ability,

1:44:30the storage space and the ability

1:44:32to care for that object and perpetuity.

1:44:36And when we are collecting those objects,

1:44:40they are sometimes for exhibition,

1:44:42oftentimes for research and education value.

1:44:45And so that's what an artifact is.

1:44:47From time to time material that is city property,

1:44:52that is deemed to have a historic value,

1:44:55has been offered to the museum via transfer.

1:45:00That material is considered by our acquisition committee.

1:45:05As we consider all material that's on offer

1:45:07to the museum collection.

1:45:09And if it meets our criteria for collecting,

1:45:13then we accept that transfer.

1:45:14And if it doesn't, we return, we decline the transfer.

1:45:19Okay, thank you.

1:45:20Sorry, my camera just slipped

1:45:21as we were talking some off screen again.

1:45:23I may not be centered,

1:45:24but thank you for that explanation.

1:45:26I know, I did a little bit of what's the difference

1:45:29between an art and artifacts,

1:45:31kind of Google unscientific research.

1:45:33And it's really an interesting conversation

1:45:36in the art community

1:45:37and in the conservation museum community

1:45:40on what the difference is.

1:45:41But so I think you've done a really amazing job

1:45:43synthesizing for me the difference.

1:45:46So thank you for that.

1:45:48And I don't have any more questions,

1:45:53but do we have the motion on the floor, Madam Chair?

1:45:55Because I would like to...

1:45:57No, so if you wanna put the motion on the floor,

1:46:00then if there are no more other questions,

1:46:02then I will go to comments.

1:46:06Okay.

1:46:07I'm happy to move the motions.

1:46:10And then I have one amendment to the report.

1:46:14Okay, wait for a seconder.

1:46:15Yeah.

1:46:16Okay, Councillor Orc is going to...

1:46:18Sure, can I have a question?

1:46:20Oh, Councillor Orc is gonna second it,

1:46:22but she has a question first.

1:46:23So if you could wait,

1:46:24Councillor Rosatel was up first for comments

1:46:27and then I'll come back to you, Councillor Caron.

1:46:33Question, Councillor Orc?

1:46:35Thanks Chair Downer, through you to staff.

1:46:37I have two questions, one about vandalism

1:46:39and one about revenue, which I enjoy.

1:46:43I'm wondering at a very high level,

1:46:46I see that there's a policy around insurance

1:46:49and there's a policy around,

1:46:50if there's a repeated vandalism,

1:46:52there'll be a decision about whether to retain

1:46:54that artwork there.

1:46:57But how do we prevent vandalism in the first place?

1:47:01And I'm thinking specifically of some of those lovely murals

1:47:03that were on the underpass that have been restored or removed.

1:47:07So how do we prevent vandalism in the first place?

1:47:13Through the chair to Councillor Orc,

1:47:16when considering citing public art,

1:47:19we do give consideration to environmental conditions

1:47:23and crime prevention through environmental design.

1:47:26So ensuring or considering lighting conditions,

1:47:31eyes on the site in terms of traffic.

1:47:36And so those are all considerations we make

1:47:38when citing public art.

1:47:43Thank you.

1:47:44And through you Chair Downer,

1:47:45the next question is the policy refers to

1:47:47having planning and building and economic development,

1:47:50talk to business, encourage them to have private art

1:47:54at their locations.

1:47:56And there's also a reference

1:47:57to private sponsorship for public art.

1:48:00So do we have mechanisms,

1:48:03even if we have a public art project that's planned

1:48:06through city funding,

1:48:08do we have a call out to sponsors

1:48:10to see if somebody would like to sponsor that piece of art?

1:48:13And so how do we invite the community in

1:48:17to sponsor public art or to create it on their own premises?

1:48:23Through the chair to Councillor Orc,

1:48:26I would say that we are open to opportunities to partner

1:48:31with private partners and sponsors

1:48:35in the acquisition or commissioning public art.

1:48:38We have not had the opportunity to be proactive about that,

1:48:41but it is certainly something we will consider

1:48:44and this policy allows for in terms of private contributions

1:48:48to the public art reserve fund.

1:48:51We have had experience though with community members

1:48:56stepping up and offering a donation of artworks

1:49:02and two examples that I can share with you.

1:49:07We did have a community group raise funds

1:49:09to develop a soapbox sculpture to honor Alan Pickerscale

1:49:14and offered that sculpture to the city

1:49:17through a public art donation.

1:49:19And so we accepted that.

1:49:21And back in 2013, 2014,

1:49:26there was a very active community fundraising campaign

1:49:30to raise funds that enabled the second casting

1:49:33of the In Flanders sculpture

1:49:36that is cited outside of the Civic Museum.

1:49:38And that sculpture was donated by the community to the city.

1:49:45So we do have precedent of having community member sponsor

1:49:49and donate towards public art,

1:49:54but we haven't had the opportunity to be proactive

1:49:56in developing a system for that.

1:50:03Okay, does anyone else have any questions?

1:50:07Okay, I'm gonna go to comments now,

1:50:09Councillor Busuttil first.

1:50:11Thank you very much and through you Chair Downer.

1:50:14As a European culture, I have sculptures

1:50:17and artists in my family and every doorknob in Genoa

1:50:20is handcrafted and the cemetery in Genoa

1:50:24has beautiful sculptures and so on.

1:50:25So I would hope that Councillor Caron was talking about

1:50:31and even Councillor Arorak about the policy references private,

1:50:35but I didn't see anything explicit about school boards

1:50:38like the upper grand district school board

1:50:40where I think about GCVI and the work that was done there.

1:50:43And for me, culture is everywhere.

1:50:46It's the food you eat and everything that you see.

1:50:48And I didn't see art and I'll speak to this in culture as well,

1:50:52but art is everywhere.

1:50:54It's in the bridges and everything that is done and planned.

1:50:59So I would hope that that happens.

1:51:01My second comment is I was a art gallery

1:51:04at Guelph board member for a number of years.

1:51:07And as a board member, I raise concerns.

1:51:09I live in the West End and I find that community devoid

1:51:14and I just had a European family over

1:51:18who found it very difficult to connect to the community

1:51:23because there weren't those historic and other landmarks.

1:51:26And again, I'll speak to this in culture,

1:51:29but thank you very much for this policy.

1:51:33Okay, thank you.

1:51:34Councillor Caron.

1:51:36Yeah, so I do wanna make one amendment.

1:51:39I was happy to put the motion on the floor.

1:51:41I did hear our staff and I recognize

1:51:45that our community engagement framework

1:51:48is embedded in what we do.

1:51:51But I think it's really important for a policy

1:51:53called public art that we make sure

1:51:58that the policy has the embedded language

1:52:02so that the public know that there is an engagement process

1:52:06at the front end and Mazad can alluded to that,

1:52:09that when it comes to identifying themes

1:52:12or identifying locations or cultural opportunities

1:52:20that the public is invited at the part of the process

1:52:26where we're developing the plan.

1:52:28And so I think we need to be a little stronger

1:52:30in community engagement.

1:52:31So my amendment, I did send it to clerks

1:52:35and I've talked to staff about this ahead of time via email.

1:52:44So my motion is that section 1.2 of the cultural plan,

1:52:51of the public art plan be amended

1:52:53with the addition of clause H

1:52:57that staff will ensure the role,

1:52:58and that's under role of city staff.

1:53:00So the role of city staff includes a list of A through G

1:53:04and I'm adding H to ensure that the community engagement

1:53:07framework is implemented early in the process

1:53:10of identifying opportunities for public art.

1:53:13And what I mean by that is locations and themes,

1:53:15not acquisition and jurying and selection of art,

1:53:20but early in the process

1:53:23as we're developing our public art acquisitions.

1:53:27So if I have a seconder for that,

1:53:28I think that adds some clarity to our policy.

1:53:33And then I have another amendment, another amendment.

1:53:36But I don't think that my other amendment.

1:53:38Councillor Kerron,

1:53:39can we just deal with this one amendment at a time?

1:53:41And I think your second motion is actually an addition,

1:53:44an additional motion, not an amendment.

1:53:46Agreed.

1:53:47But I just want to,

1:53:49was there a seconder for this first motion?

1:53:56Councillor Richardson.

1:53:58Okay.

1:54:00Are there any questions?

1:54:01So have you spoken enough to that, Councillor Kerron?

1:54:05Okay.

1:54:06Are there any questions for that motion?

1:54:10Mayor Guthrie and then Councillor Allt.

1:54:13Thank you very much, Chair Downer.

1:54:14It's actually.

1:54:15I recognize you, Guthrie.

1:54:16Oh, sorry.

1:54:17We're getting ahead of ourselves today.

1:54:19That's it.

1:54:20You're back in your own time zone now.

1:54:24Thank you.

1:54:25Through you Madam Chair.

1:54:27I just need to know what the impact to staff,

1:54:30how they interpret this.

1:54:33So how do you interpret this?

1:54:34What do you interpret it as what it means

1:54:36that you have to do?

1:54:38And what are the impacts staffing, finance, time frames?

1:54:42I'm concerned about,

1:54:44does this add a lot of time frames to something?

1:54:48So I just, I'm not opposed to it

1:54:51until I hear your answer.

1:54:53Thank you.

1:54:53So thank you.

1:54:54So through Chair Downer.

1:54:56So we had very brief sort of email discussions

1:55:00with Councillor Kerron about this earlier,

1:55:02but we, I had actually only until a moment ago,

1:55:04shared the motion with Evans and Ms. Edkin.

1:55:07So we probably need some time to actually better understand

1:55:10the intent and in fairness to speak to our colleagues

1:55:13within our community engagement team,

1:55:14because we have not done that yet today.

1:55:16So if this were to pass today,

1:55:19we would certainly want to take it back

1:55:21and have some further discussions internally between now

1:55:23and the council meeting so that we can get back to you,

1:55:25perhaps with some better response

1:55:26to the questions that you've asked.

1:55:28It would also probably we would benefit

1:55:30from a little bit more clarity

1:55:31on what Councillor Kerron's intent is.

1:55:33I will say that the community engagement framework

1:55:36guides everything that we do at the city already.

1:55:38And so I'm, so well, I can completely appreciate the desire

1:55:43to make sure that we are incorporating community engagement

1:55:46that by design already is embedded

1:55:48in everything that we do.

1:55:49So I think I want better understand the intent

1:55:52to see if this is in fact going to change the process

1:55:55for our public art advisory committee,

1:55:57or if this is something that we already sort of inherently do

1:56:01through our existing corporate community engagement framework.

1:56:03So I'm going to stop and look to my right

1:56:05because I actually haven't spoken to Ms. Evans

1:56:07or Ms. Hopkins about the specific motion.

1:56:10So I'll see if either of them wants to jump in for it.

1:56:13Through the chair.

1:56:14No, thank you, Ms. Clark Bush.

1:56:15I think certainly just understanding the policy

1:56:18does speak to an operational plan,

1:56:20which would talk to location sites,

1:56:23sort of general concepts, and that would be really great.

1:56:25And we absolutely have intent in further communication

1:56:28to make a more robust and publicly available

1:56:32sort of operations plan in relation to public art.

1:56:35Where we'd love to take this offline with the counselor

1:56:38is then, is it in relation to every new possible acquisition

1:56:42or funding or if a sponsor comes forward

1:56:46with an opportunity where again,

1:56:48are we duplicating the work of the current public art committee?

1:56:51That's where we would probably hit some resourcing timing

1:56:54and potentially financial concerns.

1:56:57But I think that taking this offline with the counselor

1:57:00can find some great opportunity to know

1:57:03that the community has opportunity

1:57:04to participate in public art and we love that.

1:57:08So I just...

1:57:08So, I'm not...

1:57:10I just wonder given staff comments,

1:57:12Councillor Ciaran, if you want an opportunity

1:57:15to withdraw that and bring it back

1:57:19and have more discussion with staff on this.

1:57:22Absolutely, I'm willing to do so.

1:57:24So I'll withdraw the motion.

1:57:27My intent is that I don't see the words community,

1:57:31engagement framework, anywhere in the public art policy

1:57:34and maybe I've missed it when I've read it,

1:57:36but I've read it a few times.

1:57:38So I wanna make sure that that language is in there.

1:57:42And the list of stakeholders in the policy

1:57:45says community representatives, staff and council.

1:57:50And I think the public art advisory committee

1:57:53as community representatives isn't broad enough.

1:57:56So that's my intent.

1:57:58I'm willing to withdraw the amendment

1:58:01back at the end of the month

1:58:03once I've had some clarity with staff.

1:58:05Okay.

1:58:05Is the seconder willing to withdraw as well?

1:58:08Councillor Richardson?

1:58:11Yes, okay.

1:58:12So that motion has been withdrawn

1:58:15but understanding that that may come back

1:58:17at the end of the month.

1:58:18So, sorry, Mayor Guthrie?

1:58:21Yeah, could I just have the floor then?

1:58:22Just just one follow-up then.

1:58:23Thank you through you.

1:58:25I just want to understand

1:58:28it's becoming kind of normal practice,

1:58:30which by the way, I actually like,

1:58:32where this discussion is really good and open

1:58:34amongst kind of poking and prodding

1:58:36about different issues that are in front of us.

1:58:38And then staff kind of bring a memo forward

1:58:40at the end of the month with sometimes

1:58:42where we're just needing a little bit of clarity

1:58:44to understand whether or not we do move forward

1:58:46with an actual motion or not.

1:58:48Are staff taking what Councillor Caron mentioned

1:58:51as does it meet sort of your suggestions of a memo

1:58:56to all of council and which includes the public

1:58:59that could then be attached to the updated agenda?

1:59:02I just would rather, because again,

1:59:04I wasn't a no or a yes on what the Councillor was asking.

1:59:08I just wanted more information myself on it too.

1:59:10So is there a way that this could be brought forward

1:59:14as a memo instead of just like emails

1:59:16or conversations with Councillor Caron,

1:59:17just so that we're all in the loop?

1:59:20Through the chair to the mayor,

1:59:21absolutely we will endeavor to make sure we have that out.

1:59:25We're tight on time in October

1:59:27because of the timing of the meetings,

1:59:28but we will try to get that out on the regular agenda

1:59:30and if not on the addendum for sure.

1:59:32But we will work with Councillor Caron

1:59:34within the next week to get a memo completed

1:59:37and out for council and public consideration.

1:59:42Okay, thank you.

1:59:43So I believe Councillor Caron,

1:59:46your next motion is an additional one.

1:59:50It's not an amendment to the main one.

1:59:54So I'm gonna take the vote.

1:59:56Is there any more questions or comments

1:59:58on the main motion for the public art policy?

2:00:02And thanks for staff for bringing this forward.

2:00:05All the work.

2:00:07Okay, so I'm going to ask,

2:00:09is there anyone opposed to this motion, to the motion?

2:00:16Okay, I haven't seen none, that's passed.

2:00:20Okay, and I'm gonna pass the floor over to you.

2:00:22Councillor Caron, you have another motion

2:00:24that you would like us to consider.

2:00:27I do, Madam Chair.

2:00:29And this is a specific,

2:00:34it has to do with the discussion

2:00:36between the difference between art and artifact.

2:00:41And there's some voids in that definition.

2:00:46And specifically, I'm speaking about the artifact

2:00:52of the City Hall Bell from 1857 and the City Hall Clock,

2:00:59which have been in a storage facility for decades.

2:01:01And we talked about it in public about,

2:01:05where are they, what are we doing with them,

2:01:07why are they sitting in storage?

2:01:08And had lots of conversations with city staff about that.

2:01:11So I don't wanna go through all of that.

2:01:13But they're in that gap zone.

2:01:16They're not technically art,

2:01:19they're not part of the museum collection,

2:01:20and they're not part of our public art collection.

2:01:23But they're not artifacts that are in a collection,

2:01:26they're just city assets that belong to the people of Guelph

2:01:30that have been sitting in storage.

2:01:31And one of those items has recently been installed

2:01:38in the interior courtyard in City Hall,

2:01:40which I think is a great news story, it's a beautiful space.

2:01:44But I would like to put a motion on the floor

2:01:48that because we have this policy void for those two items,

2:01:53and because I consider those two items

2:01:55to be two of the most significant pieces

2:02:00of our city's cultural heritage,

2:02:05I also consider them to be art.

2:02:08I think what we need to do is specifically,

2:02:12and just as part of my preamble,

2:02:15this was the only place I could land.

2:02:18This matter, this issue,

2:02:20I know it seems like it's outside of our discussion today,

2:02:23and for that I apologize,

2:02:25but there's really no other place for this to land,

2:02:28and get council direction on.

2:02:30So this was the advice that I was given

2:02:32as the place to land it.

2:02:35So my motion is that the potential future relocation

2:02:39of the City Hall bell and clock be referred back to staff

2:02:43in consultation with the Public Art Advisory Committee,

2:02:46which is what we're talking about today,

2:02:47and the Guelph Museum Board, which deals with artifacts,

2:02:50for costing and prioritization

2:02:52as part of a commemorative celebrations in 2027.

2:02:56There have been a lot of community conversations

2:02:58about the bell and the clock,

2:02:59and I think there's a disconnect in where it's landed.

2:03:03So if this gets referred back to staff,

2:03:06then we can have those conversations

2:03:08in the appropriate place.

2:03:09Is there a seconder for this motion?

2:03:13Councillor Allt.

2:03:16Okay, is there any discussion or questions

2:03:20that anyone else, okay, councillor Orr-Werck?

2:03:24Thank you, Chair Downer.

2:03:25Through you to the mover.

2:03:27I'm just curious, I'm sorry,

2:03:28we've lost the text for the motion.

2:03:32So the bell has been installed in the courtyard

2:03:35for the moment, but are you saying

2:03:37we should prioritize its relocation,

2:03:39or you're saying we should consider

2:03:42what we do with the clock and the bell

2:03:45in the context of the 2027 celebrations?

2:03:50It is that the potential future relocation

2:03:53be referred back to staff.

2:03:56In consultation with our art committee

2:03:59and our artifact committee

2:04:03to review the costing and prioritization

2:04:05of whether or not it would be included

2:04:07in our bicentennial celebrations.

2:04:09There's no predetermined outcome that that would occur,

2:04:14but we haven't had that discussion.

2:04:17And the only way to get it into the discussion

2:04:19is to refer it back to staff.

2:04:21Okay, thank you.

2:04:24Councillor Allt.

2:04:26Thank you very much, Chair Downer.

2:04:29The reason I seconded this is because I think

2:04:31that it's incredibly important that we show

2:04:34that we have, that we're taking,

2:04:37believe faith with the community

2:04:38that is very anxious to get on with 2027.

2:04:42And it seems to me that these two particular artifacts

2:04:45are equally appropriate for really starting

2:04:49City Council to look at these particular items

2:04:52that we might consider as part of the 2027 commemoration

2:04:55and show the public that it's not

2:04:57that we're sleeping on this,

2:04:58we're doing something that matters

2:05:00in the context of city icons that we already have.

2:05:05I think that this is positive.

2:05:07And I think that the other thing that's really important

2:05:08is this will clearly have a cost item associated with it

2:05:12and we'll have staff weigh in on the appropriateness

2:05:15of what we might do with these items as well.

2:05:19Thank you.

2:05:20Other questions?

2:05:21Mayor Guthrie, because I have a question too.

2:05:23Yeah, thank you.

2:05:24Through you, Madam Chair.

2:05:25I just want to make sure I understand the 200th anniversary.

2:05:32Like that, isn't that committee like already going?

2:05:35Isn't there already, is that,

2:05:38or is it about to become established?

2:05:40I forget, I'm so sorry.

2:05:42Just can't remember.

2:05:44So through Chair Downer,

2:05:46so if now that I'm talking,

2:05:48I can provide a couple of points of clarity on the motion.

2:05:51The bicentennial, so Council has received

2:05:54previous information and I will let Ms. Evans jump in

2:05:57on where we're at in the planning process

2:05:58for the bicentennial.

2:06:00But the one note that I want to make sure I make

2:06:02is that the bicentennial in terms of our planning process

2:06:06is in, needs to be referred to the multi-year budget process.

2:06:09So that is kind of the next step.

2:06:11And so it's difficult for us to comment on this motion

2:06:15in advance of that multi-year budget

2:06:16because we don't know what is going to be considered

2:06:20as the budget that we have to work with for the bicentennial.

2:06:23So we're a little bit premature, I would say.

2:06:28The other sort of quick notes that I,

2:06:31it's okay for me to keep going

2:06:33on something that the Mayor didn't ask.

2:06:35Just for clarity on the motion,

2:06:36we don't have a Guelph Museums Board anymore.

2:06:39We do have a Guelph Museums Advisory Committee.

2:06:41It's a really subtle nuance,

2:06:43but the museum is a department of the city of Guelph.

2:06:45So depending on the mover's comfort level with that,

2:06:48there is a little bit of clarity there.

2:06:49And then the other note that I just really want to make sure

2:06:52that I make on the record is that while the bell

2:06:55has been installed in the courtyard and is on display now,

2:06:59I don't want to leave the impression

2:07:01that we have a complete understanding

2:07:03of the state of the clock

2:07:05and what could be done with the clock

2:07:07because it was dismantled many, many, many years ago

2:07:10by none of us who are on staff now.

2:07:12And so, and I provided that clarity,

2:07:14I think in the email to Councillor Caron earlier today.

2:07:17So a next step for us with the clock in particular

2:07:20is probably even looking to see what we have

2:07:23in terms of the pieces

2:07:24because we don't know if the individuals

2:07:26who took it apart many decades ago,

2:07:28whether they kept enough of the pieces

2:07:30that we can actually put it back together

2:07:33as a functional foresighted clock,

2:07:35which is what I believe it was.

2:07:36And so again, it's not that we are being contrary

2:07:39to the motion that Councillor Caron has put forward.

2:07:41We are more than happy to take this away

2:07:43and look at all of those options,

2:07:44but I just wanted to make sure that I had stated that.

2:07:47But if I can come back to the mayor's original question,

2:07:49maybe I'll let Dana or Tammy jump in

2:07:51on the bicentennial planning.

2:07:53Thank you through the chair to the mayor.

2:07:55Yes, we're a little bit ahead of ourselves

2:07:57in the sense of looking for some budget support.

2:08:00We've have suggested to, from staff, to the executive team,

2:08:05a plan that looks at sort of some major events,

2:08:08community partnerships, even legacy naming

2:08:11and some other themes, very much conditional

2:08:13on some budget support for resources.

2:08:16That also, that plan includes a community citizen

2:08:19advisory committee that we would establish in 25,

2:08:23or as Councillor Allt alluded,

2:08:25great interest in wanting to start that,

2:08:26so potentially earlier, that would look to take

2:08:30the sort of funding envelope and reestablish.

2:08:33So just because we have a rough plan,

2:08:35we've presented we're not tied to anything,

2:08:37so there is some flexibility there.

2:08:41I think you'll find it a little more conservative

2:08:43of a budget request versus some of the large asks,

2:08:46multimillion dollar requests that we've had

2:08:48sort of come through from community,

2:08:50but with Council's will, we can provide you

2:08:53some more detail on that going forward.

2:08:57Okay, thank you.

2:08:59Councillor Bruce-A-Tail and then Mayor Gretzky.

2:09:01Nice to have you.

2:09:02Oh, okay, go ahead.

2:09:05Thank you, thank you, Councillor.

2:09:06Thank you through your chair.

2:09:08So I'd like to move an amendment.

2:09:10Sorry, the wording of the original one

2:09:11wasn't up on the screen, so I'm gonna have to send it through,

2:09:14but to strike any reference to the bell,

2:09:17the bell, so I'll just stop there.

2:09:21The bell's been established and it's beautiful where it is.

2:09:25I don't mind the allocation question in regards to the clock,

2:09:30but so I don't know if I have a seconder for that,

2:09:34Madam Chair, but like it's-

2:09:36Is there a seconder for that amendment?

2:09:37It's there, it's done.

2:09:39Is there a seconder for that amendment?

2:09:44I don't see.

2:09:44Okay.

2:09:45Oh, Councillor Gibson.

2:09:49All right, well then if I can just speak for a moment.

2:09:52There, you know, the bell is, it is where it is.

2:10:00I feel that it's in a public enough area

2:10:04and I think it's beautifully displayed

2:10:10in a place where it works.

2:10:12And so, you know, beauty is in the eye of the beholder,

2:10:14so I have a lens that I look through on this

2:10:17and others may have something different,

2:10:19but with a lot of prioritization in regards to finances

2:10:25and where we're putting our energy and money

2:10:28into things in this city,

2:10:29reallocating a bell at this point

2:10:33is just not on a priority list for me.

2:10:36And so I have no problem in referring to the clock issue,

2:10:40but I would hope that my colleagues understand

2:10:43the prioritization of things in front of us here

2:10:47for our community.

2:10:48I just don't see this very high on the priority list

2:10:51of trying to move a bell.

2:10:54Thank you.

2:10:57Councillor Ciaran.

2:10:59Since we're just speaking to the amendment,

2:11:04I'm obviously going to vote against.

2:11:07It's great that we have a lens

2:11:10on where the bell is currently located

2:11:11because we can see it.

2:11:13It is not visible to the public.

2:11:16It is not accessible to the public.

2:11:19Even during operating hours,

2:11:21it isn't an inaccessible location.

2:11:24There are no door openers, no access.

2:11:26You have to book the space.

2:11:27You have to go through security.

2:11:30There was no public consultation.

2:11:31This was a staff decision to relocate the bell.

2:11:34I don't think that this is the place to have that discussion.

2:11:38I think the place to have the discussion

2:11:40for where the bell was located

2:11:43should have been a public discussion.

2:11:45And that is why I want to try to bring it back

2:11:48into a public discussion through this motion.

2:11:52I'm not presupposing the outcome.

2:11:54Don't get me wrong.

2:11:54The outcome to this motion could be that staff

2:11:57and the community and the public art advisory

2:12:00and the Guelph Museum Board decide

2:12:03that this is the appropriate location for the bell.

2:12:05I'd be okay with that if there was a community consultation

2:12:11that led to that conclusion.

2:12:12So if we leave the bell in the motion,

2:12:14we'll have that community consultation.

2:12:16If we take it out, the public cannot weigh in

2:12:21on the most significant piece of the city's cultural heritage

2:12:26that we have in our possession.

2:12:32Thank you, Councillor Lucetill.

2:12:34Yes, thank you.

2:12:35And through you, Madam Chair,

2:12:37I'm turning to staff because I'm new, a new Councillor.

2:12:40I can still use that.

2:12:42I really don't understand the process

2:12:44that was undertaking to where we are right now.

2:12:48Is there a process, a report or something that I'm missing

2:12:52around the decision around the location of the bell,

2:12:55whether it's heritage Guelph or whoever,

2:12:58how did we come to right now

2:13:00so that I have a better understanding of how we got here?

2:13:03Thank you.

2:13:04Thank you.

2:13:05And through the chair to Councillor Lucetill.

2:13:07So as we were going through the design process

2:13:10for the courtyard,

2:13:13one of the ideas did come from our staff

2:13:17to incorporate the bell.

2:13:19We thought that it would be actually a nice,

2:13:22not in a connection between the old city hall

2:13:25and the new city hall.

2:13:28And so we did coordinate with Heritage Guelph staff

2:13:34and the museum staff as well,

2:13:35just to try and get some information

2:13:38and went through the usual approval process

2:13:40that we do through the steering committee

2:13:43and through the executive team.

2:13:46I will say that there was no,

2:13:48it wasn't outside of city staff

2:13:51that we had that collaboration with.

2:13:54It was all internal staff,

2:13:56but we thought that the bell was sitting in storage

2:14:02for the longest time and we thought this was a great way

2:14:05of getting it out into a place of significance.

2:14:08Now, it's not necessarily a public space,

2:14:11as Councillor Caron had mentioned,

2:14:13but we thought it was appropriate

2:14:15just in terms of the connection to the new city hall,

2:14:18but also provides a bit of,

2:14:22as a focal point, if you will, for special events,

2:14:27whether they be weddings, tours, things like that.

2:14:29So again, we did talk to Councillor Caron

2:14:33and we thought we had done a good thing

2:14:35in terms of bringing something

2:14:37that was just sitting at 45 Municipal

2:14:40out into the light, if you will.

2:14:43I know it wasn't intended to be so,

2:14:45but it was a bit of a gut punch when we did hear

2:14:47that it wasn't approved or wasn't accepted.

2:14:53So anyway, it's there now and I think it looks great.

2:14:58The other thing we were also trying to consider as well

2:15:01is the fact that we wanted it in a place

2:15:03where it was protected from vandalism as well,

2:15:06so we thought that might be,

2:15:09we were trying to balance a whole bunch of things

2:15:11by making sure that it saw the light of day,

2:15:15but was not subject to some of the vandalism

2:15:17that we do see for some of the public art.

2:15:19So that's how we got here,

2:15:22but we're happy to take Council's direction

2:15:25on where they want to go next.

2:15:27It will be significant cost

2:15:29because we did have to crane that in.

2:15:30It is doweled into the foundation,

2:15:32so there will be costs associated, of course,

2:15:35with moving it at a later date.

2:15:38Thank you.

2:15:41Councillor Old.

2:15:42Thank you very much, Chair Downer.

2:15:45I too will not support the motion.

2:15:48I think that primary two, Councillor Kerron's motion,

2:15:51actually is the question of where the bell is located.

2:15:54And I too am not presuming the outcome,

2:15:56but there are a couple of things

2:15:58that I think are really to be appreciated.

2:16:01I appreciate that the bell has come out of storage,

2:16:04and I appreciate in my mind

2:16:06that that is a temporary location, possibly,

2:16:09or perhaps a permanent one.

2:16:10I will not presume the outcome

2:16:12of whatever deliberations occur

2:16:14and whatever budget determinations occur,

2:16:17but the bell has always been a public icon.

2:16:21It was in the history of Guelph

2:16:23something that people actually relied on,

2:16:25believe it or not, to tell time.

2:16:27And as a consequence of that,

2:16:29we should recognize that it should be publicly present.

2:16:32It should be something that people can again engage in easily.

2:16:36And maybe, I don't think it's exactly the same,

2:16:39but like the Liberty Bell in Philadelphia,

2:16:42become an icon that people will refer to

2:16:44in their visitations downtown.

2:16:50Are there any more comments?

2:16:51Oh, Councillor Lucitell and then Councillor O'Rourke.

2:16:54Thank you.

2:16:55Again, I just have a question for staff.

2:16:57So I'm clear.

2:16:59Is there the Bicentennial Committee already established?

2:17:02I don't mean the staff one.

2:17:03Is there a public one?

2:17:04And just around the timelines,

2:17:06we're about to start the multi-year budget.

2:17:08If there is a committee to be established

2:17:11and to have this dialogue,

2:17:12they're gonna kind of miss informing

2:17:16any budget considerations.

2:17:17Can you help me understand what already exists

2:17:19and the processes?

2:17:23Through the mayor to the Councillor.

2:17:25We're definitely in a bit of a justice position

2:17:29around looking for something for 2027.

2:17:32Just because we're putting forward some,

2:17:34a budget request that is coming from staff

2:17:36to Council for consideration,

2:17:38does not preclude the community

2:17:40and the community celebration.

2:17:42We can't do it alone anyway, or just on the taxpayer.

2:17:45We need partnerships, we need collaborations,

2:17:48even matching development or sponsorship.

2:17:51We need some programs.

2:17:53In our current resources,

2:17:55though we can't take on that level of work right now.

2:17:58So part of your budget request is for some contract staff

2:18:01to help support and develop that.

2:18:03So currently the committee,

2:18:05the citizen committee is not started,

2:18:08is not established.

2:18:10The sort of compromise for community partnership

2:18:13was a sort of small, quiet,

2:18:16just hearing from folks taking and collaborating.

2:18:19So we did, we have heard from some people

2:18:21last little bit.

2:18:23It is not a robust community engagement plan at the moment

2:18:26and we will take that on in the coming years.

2:18:31Again, from a staffing resource point of view,

2:18:33we needed some support to help fund that.

2:18:35If we do, are successful with some funding from you

2:18:38to help leverage these other opportunities,

2:18:40including even some federal provincial grant funding,

2:18:43then we can not necessarily be tied to any one thing.

2:18:47We would be tied to the funding envelope.

2:18:49So there still would be a lot of flexibility

2:18:51for community to be able to help shape

2:18:55what a celebration in 2027 would look like.

2:18:59Thank you, just so I'm perfectly clear,

2:19:01there is no citizen committee at this point in time

2:19:04and it would have to go through

2:19:05the public appointment process, is that correct?

2:19:08At the moment we're suggesting just a call for a committee

2:19:11rather than the time through public participation,

2:19:16but a clear and open transparent opportunity

2:19:18for lots of community members to participate.

2:19:22And so that would be in Q1, 2024?

2:19:26At this moment we've marked 2025 as starting this work,

2:19:30but recognizing that things are evolving

2:19:33and changing on a daily basis that we may need

2:19:35to move forward as soon as budgets approved.

2:19:42Councillor Wurk.

2:19:45Thank you Chair Downer, I'm just struggling

2:19:48with this motion and maybe I can't get my head around

2:19:52how important the bell is.

2:19:55And I regret that there was no public process to this point,

2:20:00but it has been installed and they have very little appetite

2:20:03and really to pay to move it.

2:20:06So through you Chair Downer, I guess I have a question.

2:20:10Do we not have in our meeting rooms at the back public art?

2:20:14Are there not throughout the city other places

2:20:16where the public can access, not as freely obviously

2:20:20as our main hall or a library or rec center,

2:20:26but do we have other places where there's artifacts

2:20:31that aren't on regular display?

2:20:33I am genuinely struggling with this.

2:20:37And at the same time, I have a concern about priorities

2:20:41and budgets, so through staff, are there other instances

2:20:45where important artifacts are not easily accessible?

2:20:50So through the chair to councillor Wurk,

2:20:52we certainly have other locations even here at city hall.

2:20:54We have our installations in all four of our meeting rooms

2:20:56across the back of city hall that are not publicly accessible.

2:21:00And so sometimes we do make those choices.

2:21:02And I certainly hearing the discussion

2:21:05and like Ms. Holmes said, I think it genuinely

2:21:08caught us off guard because staff took such a great effort

2:21:12to get something that has really been languishing in storage

2:21:16out into what we felt was, as Jane has said,

2:21:19a safe location because that is a huge concern for us.

2:21:23And we are committed to looking and having conversation

2:21:27that the renovation of the courtyard here at city hall

2:21:30has only been finished for about three days, I think.

2:21:33And so we haven't yet even had the conversation

2:21:36about what does access now look like.

2:21:38I think we've had three sets of wedding photos there already,

2:21:40which is fantastic.

2:21:41So we know that it is publicly accessible for wedding photos.

2:21:44We're gonna have some further conversations

2:21:46about what does access to that courtyard look like

2:21:49during the day.

2:21:50It isn't actually the only artifact we have out there.

2:21:54We also have the center ice circle

2:21:56from when this was the Memorial Gardens Arena,

2:21:59as well that was also reinstalled out in the courtyard.

2:22:01And so we have a couple of things in the courtyard.

2:22:04There's been some discussions

2:22:05about how we make sure we commemorate that.

2:22:09Absolutely hearing the feedback about the public process.

2:22:13We are here where we're at right now,

2:22:15I think for all of the best of intentions.

2:22:18Moving forward, the bicentennial,

2:22:20certainly when we talk about the clock,

2:22:23that is a good conversation to have

2:22:25because quite frankly, I don't wanna be sitting here

2:22:27in 15 years and we make a decision about what to do

2:22:29with the clock and we make a similar error.

2:22:32But my concern, as I stated about the clock is,

2:22:34I also don't wanna make promises that we can't deliver.

2:22:37And so, and then the last thing just that I'll say

2:22:39on the bicentennial, there is gonna be a budget reality

2:22:42for the bicentennial, Ms. Evans sort of alluded to that.

2:22:45I don't wanna leave anyone with the impression

2:22:47that the bicentennial budget is going to be able to afford

2:22:49to bear the costs of relocating the bell,

2:22:51even if that's what a community engagement process told us.

2:22:57Because the community engagement process

2:22:59to date on the bicentennial has told us

2:23:01we need millions of dollars to commemorate the bicentennial

2:23:04and that's not what you're gonna see in the budget ask.

2:23:06Staff are coming back with what we feel

2:23:08is a more reasonable budget ask,

2:23:09given the budget pressures that we're facing

2:23:12and balancing all of the importance

2:23:15of celebrating the bicentennial,

2:23:17but also recognizing that we need to do it

2:23:19within the context of a time

2:23:24when we need to be very sensitive

2:23:26to what celebrating some of these more colonial milestones

2:23:28can mean for many, many members of our community.

2:23:30So there's a lot of competing interests

2:23:33and I'm not trying to suggest that that all needs to play

2:23:36into your decision about the bell and the clock right now.

2:23:38Certainly, if you want to send it back

2:23:40to the Public Art Advisory Committee

2:23:42and the Guelph Museum's Advisory Committee,

2:23:44we will come back with a recommendation

2:23:47for both the bell and the clock with all of the information.

2:23:50I just don't wanna publicly sort of leave the impression

2:23:53that, and I know Councillor Caron has already stated that.

2:23:56She's not presuming the outcome and I appreciate that.

2:23:59Neither are we.

2:24:00So if this motion passes, we will take it away

2:24:02and we will do that work and have the conversation

2:24:05with those two committees

2:24:07and then eventually the Bicentennial Working Group

2:24:09or whatever we're calling them.

2:24:10I don't know if we've named them yet,

2:24:12but I just wanna be very open and transparent

2:24:15that I don't know that in either the case of the bell

2:24:17or the clock that we can easily presume

2:24:20a different outcome than we are currently looking at

2:24:23right now.

2:24:27So Chair Downer, I just wanna make sure

2:24:31I'm understanding correctly

2:24:33through you Chair Downer and staff.

2:24:34So if the amendment fails,

2:24:38then people will tell us what the bell means,

2:24:41what the clock means, what some options might be.

2:24:44It would just provide more information

2:24:46and then another opportunity to say,

2:24:48it's great where it is or move it

2:24:50or we could move it what it would be this much

2:24:52and we would have another opportunity to say no

2:24:53at that time, is that correct?

2:24:55So through the Chair, I'm actually gonna admit

2:24:57that I've a little bit lost the plot on the amendment

2:24:59on what we're talking about.

2:25:00So I'll maybe answer in a specific way.

2:25:02Remove the bell.

2:25:03If you do not give us direction about the bell,

2:25:06the bell will stay exactly where it is

2:25:07and we will look at opportunities for public access

2:25:10and education about the bell.

2:25:12If you do nothing today,

2:25:13we are still going to do that work.

2:25:16If you direct us to have conversations about the bell,

2:25:19we will look at whether the bell should be, could be,

2:25:24is it potential for relocation at a later date or not?

2:25:27And we would then consider that and come back.

2:25:31In terms of the clock, at this point,

2:25:34staff have no plans to look at what is going to happen

2:25:39to the clock beyond we continue to store it.

2:25:43We have no immediate plans,

2:25:44although certainly through the bicentennial,

2:25:46I would imagine we might talk about the clock,

2:25:49but regardless of what you do about the clock,

2:25:52the very first step for staff is gonna be figuring out

2:25:56who can help us figure out what we even have

2:25:58in terms of the clock and whether we have something

2:26:01that could be made into an art installation

2:26:04with pieces of the clock or whether we actually have

2:26:06enough pieces that we would ever have

2:26:08a functional clock face and I don't know the answer to that.

2:26:11Sorry, I don't know if that helped.

2:26:13Hey, Councillor Cossin, did you have your hand up?

2:26:18I did, but it was answered in Deputy CAO's

2:26:22clock wishes response after I put my hand up.

2:26:25Thank you.

2:26:26Okay, great, thanks.

2:26:27I am gonna support the mayor's motion.

2:26:29Maybe surprising to some as you know my history with heritage,

2:26:33but I'm okay where it is.

2:26:37It was in the old city hall.

2:26:39It's been moved to the center of the new city hall.

2:26:42I think it creates a sense of space for our place

2:26:45for our staff here, all the staff

2:26:47that come through this building.

2:26:49I think that's great.

2:26:50I think it is visible, I'm a number of angles.

2:26:54I'm not sure, but I think it's even visible

2:26:55from the Margaret McKinnon room,

2:26:59which is where we hold most of the public meetings

2:27:01in city hall.

2:27:03So I'm quite happy with, you know,

2:27:06while I don't like the process and I would have preferred,

2:27:09you know, better discussion about it,

2:27:11I'm quite happy to leave it where it is

2:27:13because it creates that sense of space

2:27:15within the city hall from the old city hall.

2:27:18And I actually chaired the redevelopment committee

2:27:21of this building and I think it, to me,

2:27:24it just sort of makes that nice connection here.

2:27:27And maybe it might have been better out front or not.

2:27:30I don't know, maybe there's something else we can do there,

2:27:32but I'm okay, I'm accepting the decision

2:27:37that was made by staff.

2:27:39And I'm okay with it being where it is.

2:27:42So I will vote in favor of the mayor's motion.

2:27:45So is there anyone opposed to the mayor's motion?

2:27:56So on the screen, I see two, three in here.

2:28:03So three are opposed.

2:28:06That would mean that we have nine in favor, is that?

2:28:11Correct?

2:28:14Oh, 10, sorry.

2:28:16My math, not good.

2:28:1710 in favor, is that correct?

2:28:19Mr. Court, okay.

2:28:21Okay, so that motion passes.

2:28:22So let's go back to the main amended motion.

2:28:31If you could put up the new motion,

2:28:35I guess that's what we'll be seeing.

2:28:37Because I'm not sure if, it has to be amended to,

2:28:41to the, it's not a board, it's,

2:28:46so the potential future relocation

2:28:48of the city hall clock be referred to staff

2:28:51in consultation with the public art advisory committee.

2:28:55And this now needs to read the Guelph Museum

2:28:58advisory committee for costing and prioritization

2:29:02as part of the commemorative celebrations in 2027.

2:29:10I just want to make one thing clear here.

2:29:13To me, the motion sounds like that,

2:29:15that we're making a decision for it to be part of the

2:29:18commemorative celebrations of 2027.

2:29:21It's kind of the way it's worded.

2:29:23And so it's, but I know that's not the intent.

2:29:35Okay.

2:29:37So Mayor Guthrie is, is suggesting an amendment

2:29:41to make that prioritization consideration.

2:29:44Would you be willing to change that also to the?

2:29:46Yes, Madam Chair.

2:29:47Yes.

2:29:49I'd like to make an amendment to change the word

2:29:50prioritization to consideration.

2:29:53And I think we'll be going to, yes.

2:29:55Councillor Busuttil will, will second that amendment.

2:30:02Okay. And would you, and okay.

2:30:05So is there any discussion on that consideration?

2:30:11Okay.

2:30:12Is anyone opposed to that?

2:30:15Okay.

2:30:16And then the second amendment we need is to change that

2:30:20to the advisory committee instead of the board

2:30:22or the museum.

2:30:23Can I have somebody move an amendment for that?

2:30:25Councillor work and councillor Busuttil.

2:30:27Any discussion on that?

2:30:29Okay. Seeing none.

2:30:31Anyone opposed?

2:30:33Okay. That passes.

2:30:35Okay. Let's go back to the main motion as amended.

2:30:44Those were a quick couple of motions there.

2:30:48If we could have that put up.

2:31:41All right.

2:31:42That the potential future relocation of the city hall

2:31:43clock be referred to staff consultation with the public

2:31:46advisory committee and the growth museum advisory committee

2:31:50costing and consideration as part of the current

2:31:52member of celebrations in 20, 27.

2:31:55Okay. I'm not going to, we're not going to discuss this

2:31:58anymore. So is there anyone opposed to this?

2:32:03Okay. That motion passes.

2:32:06Thank you.

2:32:10So now we are going to move on to, oh Councillor Curran

2:32:15do you have another motion?

2:32:17I don't have another motion.

2:32:18I wanted a closing comment.

2:32:19I did not want this discussion to focus on these two matters.

2:32:22So I just want to conclude this public art section of the agenda with positive comments

2:32:29that this is that this just shows you how important expressions of culture through public art

2:32:36are to our community.

2:32:38And thanks staff for the excellent work in bringing this forward.

2:32:43Thanks.

2:32:44Thanks Councillor Caron.

2:32:45Thanks for any of that unpositive note.

2:32:47I agree.

2:32:48Okay.

2:32:49We're going to go on to 9.2 the culture plan 2030 staff report.

2:32:56And there is another presentation by Tammy Atkins, our manager of GoF museums.

2:33:03And then we have some delegations as well.

2:33:06And this matter.

2:33:09Thank you.

2:33:10Far away.

2:33:11Thank you Chair Downer.

2:33:13As excited as I am about public art policy, I'm really, really excited to share with you

2:33:18culture plan 2030, a whilst long anticipated first culture plan.

2:33:24This plan has been in the making since 2019, starting with conversations and community

2:33:30engagement with the creative community.

2:33:34And the work was interrupted by the COVID pandemic, which exacerbated the challenges

2:33:40artists and culture workers faced as the culture economy was the first to shut down

2:33:46and the last to reopen.

2:33:48The pandemic also underscored how essential the arts and culture are to our community.

2:33:54We all remember online concerts and painted rock gardens and fashionable and functional

2:34:00masks.

2:34:03And through the darkest days of the pandemic, arts and heritage continue to bring community

2:34:07together as we sought connection, inspiration, innovation and comfort through culture.

2:34:13As I share the highlights of the culture plan with you this afternoon, the words you will

2:34:18see on the screen are the brilliant voices of community members who contributed to this

2:34:22plan by sharing their experiences, suggestions and wisdom through surveys and conversations.

2:34:34So what we heard from Guelph culture contributors is that there are serious challenges threatening

2:34:39the continuing existence of the local culture scene, which has been such a prominent feature

2:34:45of Guelph's identity.

2:34:47We've heard about a lack of affordable studio rehearsal exhibition and performance space.

2:34:53We've heard about limited representation and opportunities for equity deserving community

2:34:57members both artists and audiences.

2:35:01We've heard about difficulties attracting community support and audiences.

2:35:07And we've heard a lot about shortage of affordable housing and inflated cost of living that's

2:35:11driving artists from our community.

2:35:14But in spite of these conditions, there remains amongst the culture community a real passion

2:35:19for this place and an optimism that with the city and community working together, we can

2:35:25collectively stabilize the sector, enabling culture contributors to survive and thrive

2:35:31while contributing to community vitality and economic prosperity.

2:35:39And so when we talk about culture, we're talking about the experiences, engagements and expressions

2:35:46that foster a sense of belonging that contribute to a collective identity and that spark inspiration,

2:35:52connection, innovation, comfort and joy.

2:35:57We envision a Guelph where all citizens feel welcomed and represented and where they feel

2:36:02culture wherever they live, work and play morning, noon and night, weekdays and weekends,

2:36:10year round.

2:36:11This isn't our current reality, but it is what the community aspires to.

2:36:16And this plan strives to create conditions for culture that is everywhere, every day

2:36:21for everyone.

2:36:25While this plan identifies tasks, priorities and commitments from the city, it's not just

2:36:31a municipal culture plan.

2:36:33This plan is rooted in community relying on collaborative action to advance our collective

2:36:38vision.

2:36:40The city's role in this plan is to provide foundational support.

2:36:44Described during community engagement by some as a city serving as a plate on which the

2:36:50culture community can combine ingredients and present creations which nourish the community's

2:36:56soul.

2:36:57And by others as a city serving as a terrain on which artists plant seeds of creativity

2:37:03that grow and build community.

2:37:06All analogies speak to the city as a cultivator.

2:37:12And so cultivating culture includes funding in the form of operating budgets for anchor

2:37:17sites and service organizations, community benefit agreements and community grants for

2:37:22artists and cultural organizations and capital investments.

2:37:27It also includes providing and encouraging development of space to create, rehearse,

2:37:32perform and exhibit at municipally owned and operated sites or through private public partnerships.

2:37:39It also includes holding space and removing barriers for indigenous peoples and equity

2:37:44deserving community members so that they can reclaim, practice and share their cultures

2:37:50in this place.

2:37:52It includes modeling and supporting environmentally sustainable practices and adopting culture

2:37:57friendly bylaws policies and practices.

2:38:01And it also involves creating conditions of livability, addressing affordability and

2:38:06attainable housing for the creative class which because of the inherent precarity of

2:38:12arts and culture work tends to be disproportionately impacted by the current economic circumstances.

2:38:22In addition to cultivating culture, the city has an opportunity and a role to play in fostering

2:38:29connections and communication between the city and the culture sector, amongst the culture

2:38:34sector and between the culture sector and the community.

2:38:38This looks like the development and maintenance of a digital wealth culture hub that includes

2:38:43a collective culture calendar supported by a marketing and promotion strategy.

2:38:49It also includes nurturing networking and collaboration within the sector, building on

2:38:54the really rich conversations that we've experienced over the last few months as we prepared for

2:39:00this plan.

2:39:02It involves engaging growing and diverse audiences and shifting our programming approach from

2:39:08presenting diverse programming for our traditional audiences to presenting programs designed specifically

2:39:15for equity deserving audiences.

2:39:18And it also involves fostering collaboration between the culture sector and adjacent sectors,

2:39:23economic development and tourism, planning, parks and recreation.

2:39:30In addition to cultivating and connecting culture, the city has an important role to

2:39:35play in ensuring the culture sector is championed and celebrated and recognized for their contributions

2:39:42to community identity, prosperity and well-being.

2:39:46Development of a comprehensive recognition strategy that ensures local culture sector

2:39:51contributors are seen and appreciated would go a long way in showing our artists and culture

2:39:56workers the love.

2:39:59And in support of opportunities to seek designations for key cultural industries could help to build

2:40:05profile and attract investment.

2:40:08Working with economic development and tourism and community partners, we would hope to identify

2:40:13and support attraction of culture-focused conferences, meetings and events.

2:40:18And finally embracing wealth by sepanel in 2027 would be an opportunity to commemorate

2:40:25heritage and inspire collective community aspirations about where we move forward as

2:40:30a community in the future.

2:40:33And so as we look forward to 2030, if we are to retain, evolve and sustain our local culture

2:40:41scene, we need to be intentional in supporting and collaborating with the creative sector.

2:40:48The conversations we've had to date, the 51 recommendations in this plan and the work

2:40:53plan which is soon to follow represent a framework for a new strategic approach to protecting,

2:40:59nurturing and advancing wealth culture so that we can continue to benefit as a vibrant,

2:41:06healthy and safe community with an innovative workforce supporting progressive industry and

2:41:12as a welcoming, engaging destination that drives the visitor economy.

2:41:19Thank you.

2:41:22Thank you.

2:41:23So before we go to questions of staff, we're going to go to delegations.

2:41:32And just a reminder to our delegations that we have, you have five minutes and 30 seconds

2:41:39beforehand there'll be, is it a buzzer or a bell?

2:41:43A chime.

2:41:44There's a chime that will warn you that you've got 30 seconds left and then the hook comes

2:41:50out.

2:41:53Seconds another chime will come on when you're done.

2:41:55So first off, we have Jay Wilson.

2:41:59It's a pleasure to be here.

2:42:15This is a theater in the round where most of the audience is behind me.

2:42:18How strange that is.

2:42:20Is this a Matthew Bell or a William Bell or a City Bell that will strike when I'm done?

2:42:25Anyway, we were presented with three wonderful documents and the first one was something

2:42:30called community engagement.

2:42:32And I'd like to quote that document.

2:42:34It says, players in the cultural sector would like to get to know each other better through

2:42:38mixers, meetings, conferences, and my particular favorite, familiarization tours.

2:42:46Really like to see that happen so we get to know each other.

2:42:49I can't stress enough the excitement and inspiration that came out of the live engagement sessions.

2:42:56Not only was it a chance to speak and be heard, but it was also a chance to listen.

2:43:02Both participants and facilitators commented on how much they learned during these sessions.

2:43:10More of this, please.

2:43:12I also asked that attention be paid to the weaknesses and threats listed in the community

2:43:17engagement document.

2:43:19The second document, the staff report.

2:43:23Culture both points to our differences, customs, tastes, and to our similarities.

2:43:32In the end, we all want the same thing.

2:43:34Mental and physical well-being, healthy homes, healthy environment, a place where life in

2:43:40all its forms can thrive.

2:43:43Culture is the glue that bonds community citizens together, and it is only together that we

2:43:48can overcome challenges that threaten a community.

2:43:54A word about value.

2:43:56I know this will sound cliche.

2:43:58However, often we measure cultural value with the same yardstick we use to measure other

2:44:04sectors.

2:44:05Financial value, monetary return on investment.

2:44:09Even cultural institutions have been duped into playing this monetary value game, bringing

2:44:14forth documents showing how many bums in beds, meal purchases, local gas purchases occurred

2:44:19during a cultural event.

2:44:21But culture's value goes well beyond its dollar value or its tourism expenditure figures.

2:44:29Culture is what gives its citizens a sense of belonging.

2:44:33Culture is what defines one's self-worth.

2:44:39The culture plan itself.

2:44:41I love this.

2:44:43Everywhere.

2:44:45Every day.

2:44:47Everyone.

2:44:49This plan clearly outlines the proof that culture's value is not merely monetary.

2:44:55In closing, I quote Gwelf's founder, John Galt, oh, I'm very well aware the caution

2:45:01must be paid when quoting Mr. Galt, caution that we don't reinforce a colonization story.

2:45:08We're learning, however, that Galt may have been an anomaly in the Canada Company story.

2:45:14While the Canada Company wanted to carry out perhaps a destructive colonization plan,

2:45:19it now appears that Galt, the poet, novelist, playwright, was of a different mind and viewed

2:45:30fellow Indigenous people as allies, partners, equals, not subjects to be exploited.

2:45:38So in closing, I quote John Galt's Canadian recollections.

2:45:44At Pensive Eve, what time the sun peeped through the trees his journey done, I loved to walk

2:45:51the greenwood still, where gloom seems silence visible.

2:45:58And note the fading hues of light my heart partaking to of night.

2:46:04When flowers that anew beamed shone with colors like my hopes were gone, oft in the twilight

2:46:13of the wood, I owned that odd prophetic mood, which sees the future as a dream and life a

2:46:20shadowed woodland stream.

2:46:23Till through the boughs I chanced to see the heavenly orbs bright revelry, and felt assured

2:46:29however late the time would be my advocate, and make my dreams, despite my fear, as stars

2:46:38from darkness come appear.

2:46:44Thank you for this cultural plan.

2:46:46Thank you.

2:46:47Thank you.

2:46:48Thank you for the walk.

2:46:51I do.

2:46:53That was a lovely walk for us.

2:46:57Are there any questions of Mr. Wilson?

2:47:02I have a cure game.

2:47:07I know.

2:47:08That was so good.

2:47:10That's why his walks are so popular.

2:47:13Okay, Mr. Mike Salisbury, you got a tough act to follow.

2:47:19And welcome back to the chamber.

2:47:20It's good to be back.

2:47:25It looks different from up here.

2:47:27You all look smaller.

2:47:29Good afternoon, everyone.

2:47:34It is good to be back.

2:47:35Over the last few months, I've been working with an organization on a proposal for a community

2:47:40art space in the drill hall.

2:47:41That's not what I'm here to talk about.

2:47:43That's a whole different issue.

2:47:45What I want to share with you today is some of the things we learned during that process

2:47:49that relate directly to the cultural plan in front of you today.

2:47:54We had a team of four people working over the summer reaching out to over 100 individual

2:47:58artists, groups, and organizations to inform our proposal.

2:48:03We can absolutely reinforce the findings in the cultural plan that there's a lack of affordable

2:48:08space to create, rehearse, perform, and exhibit.

2:48:13What we found early on is that the Guelph arts community is incredibly siloed.

2:48:18Each sector seems to believe that the other sector has what they don't have.

2:48:21So the artists think the musicians have all the resources, and the musicians think the

2:48:26theater people have all the support.

2:48:28So the community plan recommendation to partner with the Guelph Arts Council to establish a

2:48:34quarterly gathering for community culture is an excellent first step in breaking down

2:48:39those silos and making better use of the spaces that we already have.

2:48:44However, we were consistently told that it was facilities for rehearsal, building, and

2:48:50practice that were the biggest need.

2:48:53These are the places that maybe aren't as sexy as a big art gallery or a performance

2:48:57hall, but it's the behind the scenes facilities, the places where people work and learn, that

2:49:04we think are the key to culture in our city.

2:49:08Now, the cultural plan refers to this issue of artists leaving Guelph as culture drain.

2:49:15It identifies affordable housing as one of the important aspects, and there is no question

2:49:19about that.

2:49:20Affordable housing affects everyone, and artists are included with that.

2:49:24However, what I would like to do is read to you a number of quotes from letters of endorsement

2:49:29that we received that specifically address the issue of cultural drain.

2:49:33Ron Schuberk, Professor Emeritus and former President of OCAD University, this discouraging

2:49:38studio situation is now approaching a crisis proportion and may, in fact, cause the most

2:49:45adventurous, often the most financially vulnerable artists to relocate to more encouraging and

2:49:51supportive environments.

2:49:55Professor John Kisick, who's with the University of Guelph, wrote, I've heard endless accounts

2:50:00of young artists who have been forced to leave our city due to the dearth of adequate

2:50:04studio spaces.

2:50:06This seems particularly tragic considering the University's national reputation as one

2:50:11of our country's top art schools, and the fact that a significant percentage of our graduates

2:50:16would clearly choose to stay in the community if access to safe and cost effective working

2:50:21spaces were available.

2:50:23And this is not a new problem in Guelph.

2:50:25The Guelph Creative Arts Association described their struggles to find workspaces way back

2:50:30in 1948.

2:50:32They started off in the basement of the old Carnegie Public Library, then they got moved

2:50:36to the basement of the Norfolk Street United Church, and then finally the basement of Old

2:50:40City Hall, which they referred to as the Dungeons.

2:50:44Quote, a rough spot to work, but warm.

2:50:49So creatives have been trying to find cultural workspaces in Guelph for 75 years.

2:50:56I was asked in this process what my unreasonable goal would be for community art space in Guelph,

2:51:02and I believe what I said was a movement.

2:51:06I'd love to see a movement come out of Guelph, and I have no idea what that would look like,

2:51:10but I can tell you this, one of the key ingredients for that would be fellowship, community,

2:51:16collaboration.

2:51:18It involves proximity.

2:51:19It involves bringing us together.

2:51:22And just as Guelph saw a resurgence of interest in the arts just after World War II, 1948,

2:51:27so too we're starting to see a similar explosion in cultural interest and activity as we come

2:51:33out of a global pandemic.

2:51:35I believe that when the earth shakes, we all look for something that's important to us,

2:51:41and of course that's going to be health and family and friends, but it's also joy and wonder

2:51:48and hope.

2:51:49And that's what we get from arts and culture.

2:51:52And so the timing of Guelph's cultural plan is very significant.

2:51:56It's easy for us to fall into considering things like arts as a nicety when we've got things

2:52:01like a housing crisis, an opioid crisis, an infrastructure crisis.

2:52:05The list of community needs goes on and on, but consider the possibility that culture

2:52:10as a defining characteristic in building community will play a huge role in finding creative solutions

2:52:18to the challenges we face, particularly social challenges.

2:52:21So in closing, we would strongly encourage Councillor LeBow support and fund the cultural plan,

2:52:27and of course I would be remiss if I did not express support for staff's recommendation

2:52:31for support of cultural uses in the drill hall, but as I said, that's a different story.

2:52:39Thank you.

2:52:39Are there any questions of Mr. Salisbury?

2:52:45Okay, seeing none.

2:52:46Thank you.

2:52:47That was good.

2:52:49Okay, we have one more.

2:52:50Damian Weston from the Guelph Arts Council.

2:52:53Is he here live?

2:52:54Yep.

2:53:03Okay.

2:53:03Hey, Mr. Weston.

2:53:04Thank you.

2:53:05I don't know how I'm supposed to follow Jay or Mike.

2:53:08To be quite honest, and I think I just made the decision I'm not going to.

2:53:11I have prepared remarks and a speech here, but I would just be echoing what they said.

2:53:16So let me just say I completely echo all of their sentiments,

2:53:18in particular the question of value of the arts and culture.

2:53:22And I'm throwing away my speech, and I'd like to tell you about something.

2:53:26To talk about what we're really talking about when we talk about art and culture.

2:53:30And if you don't mind, if you'll indulge me for a moment, I'm going to make it just a touch personal.

2:53:34I've worked for about 20 years in the arts and the social services.

2:53:39The way I came to that is when I was about eight years old,

2:53:43I was invited to join a theater company for children that had experienced traumatic upbringings.

2:53:50I joined that theater company.

2:53:51Through that, I learned piano.

2:53:53Through that, I became for a while a professional pianist,

2:53:56a composer for film and television.

2:53:59In addition to my other career as a social worker.

2:54:02From there, I helped develop a theater company for children in youth and foster care.

2:54:12When the lockdown happened, we saw the sheer economic destruction that happened to that sector.

2:54:17The arts and the culture sector was by far one of the hardest hits.

2:54:21There are many other that were hard hit as well.

2:54:24And we heard a lot about how people turned to Netflix, they binge watched shows.

2:54:29I certainly did.

2:54:30They baked a lot.

2:54:31They turned to creative outlets.

2:54:33And the thought was that it was an escape, an escape from our present reality.

2:54:36But I dispute that.

2:54:38What it was was hope.

2:54:39What people were looking for was hope.

2:54:41Every act of creation, every act of artistic creation, every act of culture is an act of hope.

2:54:47It is someone asking to be heard.

2:54:49And it is an audience who is there to hear.

2:54:51It is someone asking to be seen.

2:54:53And it is someone who is there to see them.

2:54:56It is not just the artist.

2:54:58It is the community who responds.

2:55:01Going back to what I was saying about the theater company, I know for myself.

2:55:05And I know for every child that went through that theater community.

2:55:10It didn't change lives.

2:55:11It saved lives.

2:55:12And that's what we are talking about.

2:55:14That's what this culture plan, which the Gwalfarts Council wholeheartedly endorses and supports.

2:55:19And hopes will support and fund as well.

2:55:22We are supporting hope.

2:55:24I, as a child, those children were not KPIs.

2:55:29We were not data points.

2:55:31We were children.

2:55:33As you go through the four-year budgetary process, you'll look at roads.

2:55:36You'll look at infrastructure, the question of housing, et cetera.

2:55:38That is the where.

2:55:39That is the what.

2:55:40But culture is the why.

2:55:42And that's why this culture plan is essential.

2:55:46The Gwalfarts Council is having our 50th anniversary next year.

2:55:49And the one thing we have never had is a plan.

2:55:51And now there is a plan.

2:55:52Culture is not a luxury.

2:55:54Culture is hope.

2:56:00Hang on a second.

2:56:02Mr. Weston, are there any questions of Mr. Weston?

2:56:04Councillor Orr work.

2:56:06Thank you, Chair Downer.

2:56:07Through you to Mr. Weston.

2:56:09You have an interesting vantage point as the D for the Gwalfarts Council.

2:56:14As you can see, the private sector piece and also the municipal piece.

2:56:17We're talking about the municipal piece here.

2:56:20But what does the whole piece look like?

2:56:23So, you know, do we have an idea of how big the private galleries or private

2:56:29rehearsal spaces are?

2:56:30And I understand that there's a big question of affordability and that we

2:56:33need to look for that.

2:56:35But can you give us a bit of a picture of the health of other facilities that exist?

2:56:42Well, it's going to be different for every artistic sector.

2:56:44I mean, there's a lot of differences between disciplines.

2:56:50However, one of the commonalities is there's just not enough.

2:56:53Recently, and again, not to compare, but to look at, say, the city of London,

2:56:58which achieved UNESCO City of Music status.

2:57:04We have nothing compared to what they have.

2:57:06We have about two, and I'm a musician as well.

2:57:10We have about two rehearsal studios, two rehearsal facilities.

2:57:14In fact, our new office, which is the former E-bar, is currently and

2:57:17constantly being rented out, or sometimes very low cost as a rehearsal space,

2:57:22because there just aren't any.

2:57:24Similar to theater spaces, the Downtown Theater Project, which has a sold out

2:57:27run of company there in October, had no place to rehearse.

2:57:33Nothing affordable.

2:57:34I would imagine it's dance studios, it's the same thing.

2:57:38There are private galleries in Guelph, and visual arts takes a different

2:57:42tact because studio space is a little different than exhibition space,

2:57:48and finding the commonality between the two, it's a bit of a different beast.

2:57:51But there's just not enough.

2:57:54There's not quite enough of anything.

2:57:57And through you, Chair Dannard and Mr. Weston.

2:58:01We're talking a lot about co-locating, we talk about that for parking and

2:58:05other things.

2:58:06When you're talking about the collaboration and the plan, and

2:58:09I'm assuming you've had lots of input into the plan.

2:58:12Are there opportunities to bring other stakeholders into this mix so

2:58:16that spaces that aren't used during the day and are used primarily in the

2:58:18evening can be used for rehearsal or a range of things during the day?

2:58:26And inversely, facilities that are used during the day could be used in the

2:58:29evening.

2:58:30Are we looking at really maximizing potential use of all spaces?

2:58:34Absolutely.

2:58:35And any new space I think should be designed or designated with multi-use

2:58:41intentions behind it.

2:58:44In fact, our own office, that's precisely what it is.

2:58:47It's a co-working space on Wednesday.

2:58:49It's a performance venue at night.

2:58:51It's our office during the day, and it works for all those things.

2:58:54And it's a good model.

2:58:55It's not a perfect model for everything.

2:58:57You do need designated theaters because there are requirements in terms of

2:59:01lighting that are expensive, and once they're set up, they're hard to move.

2:59:04But they're definitely, in fact, our entire mandate right now is to make

2:59:09space, specifically in partnering with Harkor United Church and other spaces to

2:59:14help them efficiently maximize that space and that reuse and that, so that

2:59:19they're consistently full.

2:59:23Are there any other questions?

2:59:24Deler?

2:59:25Okay, thank you very much.

2:59:27Would somebody be prepared to put the motion on the floor before we go to

2:59:32questions?

2:59:33Councillor Claesden and Councillor Richardson.

2:59:37Okay, so we'll go to questions of staff first.

2:59:39Councillor Bousatiel.

2:59:44Thank you very much to the staff.

2:59:46This is really an ambitious kind of all encapsulating document, so thank you.

2:59:52And it's exciting because of the earlier presentation on public art, and for me,

2:59:56it's about community art as the organic spaces where new ideas come from and

3:00:01creating those spaces for that to happen.

3:00:04I do want to give a shout out to Mike Salisbury because he said everything I

3:00:08wanted to say and have no questions.

3:00:10And in his history lesson, I don't have to go as far back as he did, but

3:00:15in 1990, the Youth Music Center, the music group that I volunteered and

3:00:20advocated in the city played a role in.

3:00:23So I think it just reiterates that the need for space, rehearsal space and

3:00:28art space and continues in the community.

3:00:32So I have a couple of questions and I just want to draw attention to,

3:00:35I appreciate the diagram in the parks report that's going to follow this.

3:00:39That is two halves of the walnut, right?

3:00:42Culture and parks.

3:00:44So some of my questions, Madam Chair, are better suited for parks.

3:00:47Please just, I will park it and get back to it.

3:00:51So I'll park it, that's right, yes.

3:00:54So under the plan, I'm going to go by the page numbers and

3:00:59the consolidated report because the other report, it's hard for me to figure stuff.

3:01:04It's on page 58 and this is the bullets there, it's the first bullet.

3:01:11So this is around parks and park spaces.

3:01:14I was curious why your first bullet of identify and

3:01:18build capacity for cultural activities at municipal properties,

3:01:21including upgrading of amenities, didn't specify parks.

3:01:27And as a community person, we had to advocate over many years to get

3:01:31electrical outlets for arts activities in a park.

3:01:35So I'm curious why there wasn't that marrying of calling out that space for

3:01:42parks, if you can speak to that one, then I have a couple more questions.

3:01:48Through the chair, to the counselor.

3:01:50We wanted to keep that opportunity broad.

3:01:55Parks is definitely a part of that equation.

3:01:59But our community centers are as well, our museum sites are as well,

3:02:04City Hall potentially could serve that role.

3:02:08And so we did want to keep it broad, but parks was definitely in our mind with

3:02:12that recommendation.

3:02:14And if you can speak to just keeping that, that was a community request that took

3:02:19many, many years to operationalize and had to get the mayor involved in that.

3:02:25Almost ten years as a community request that was trying to create culture and so

3:02:29on.

3:02:30Is there a process in your bullet number one for the community to say look,

3:02:34we've been working, we're getting nowhere, we have a stack of letters here and

3:02:38emails and so on.

3:02:39Is there a process, earlier we talked about community engagement for

3:02:43that conversation and those needs to be operationalized?

3:02:49Through the chair, to the counselor.

3:02:53We did hear about those frustrations, attempts and

3:02:59frustrations through the community engagement process for that informed this plan.

3:03:05And we have indicated within the plan that through museums and culture,

3:03:12we will act as advocates to work with our colleagues within various city

3:03:18departments to advocate for the creative center and

3:03:24advance working together to resolve some of those issues.

3:03:29Thank you.

3:03:30On the same page, it's the fourth bullet that specifically calls out the west and

3:03:35south neighborhoods.

3:03:36And as a west neighborhood, trust me, I'm not going to look to eliminate any.

3:03:40But I was curious what data informed or evidence informed put the west and

3:03:46the south on your radar versus the east, if you can speak to that place.

3:03:52Yes, through the chair to the counselor.

3:03:55Those neighborhoods were identified repeatedly in our community engagement.

3:04:00That informed the plan and so that's why they were called out.

3:04:04Part of this plan, in terms of activating this plan,

3:04:09we do need to do a gap assessment of cultural activations and

3:04:16sites across the city.

3:04:18And so while those two areas of the city were identified through community

3:04:22engagement, it is our intent as we continue to work on implementing this plan to do

3:04:28a complete gap assessment.

3:04:31Thank you.

3:04:31And again, marrying with the parks report, their gap assessment didn't address

3:04:37electrical outlets and some of the cultural things that I will be speaking to.

3:04:42It was falling between the cracks there around those things.

3:04:46The next one is the same page, actually next page 59.

3:04:51And it's the heading around adopt culture friendly bylaws policies and

3:04:56practices, work with planning, identify and recommend levers that support

3:05:02infusion of culture in city building.

3:05:04And I took that two ways.

3:05:06I said literally city building as you are with the planning department.

3:05:11But I also took it as the opposite side of building.

3:05:16And if you can just bear with me, it's a couple of layers here in sections in

3:05:20your document.

3:05:21It's around the demolition.

3:05:22And as Ward 4, I'm going to speak about the Mitchell farmhouse.

3:05:27I sent many people to your consultation process who during the election and

3:05:32even prior, eight years prior, asked about this.

3:05:36And this is a demolition of a farmhouse 2005, 2006 that seems to have disappeared.

3:05:43But it's around, I think on page 61 that speaks to,

3:05:48sorry, page 60 that speaks to place making.

3:05:51On page 61 that speaks explicitly about working with UNESCO outside for

3:05:57some of these bigger.

3:05:57And what I find missing is the capturing of our local history,

3:06:03culture for communities.

3:06:05And again, the West End, we don't have much of a culture.

3:06:08So I said I brought family from overseas and there's nothing in there.

3:06:12And so can you speak to this item around what happens to things like this?

3:06:19And in my comments later, I'll talk about bringing emotion forward at the end of

3:06:22the month to counsel on this item.

3:06:25Because it seems to have disappeared with the funding from the developer for

3:06:29the creation of something in the community.

3:06:33And so what I hear from the community is it was there.

3:06:35We got money and it was 2005, six.

3:06:38Where has it gone?

3:06:39And I don't see anything in your plan that speaks to capturing those things or

3:06:44plans and I didn't see it in the art policy either.

3:06:50Through the chair to the counselor, I will pass it off to Ms.

3:06:53Akhen in a moment, but certainly specifically to the farmhouse.

3:06:56It's not something that we have a lot of information on.

3:06:59Certainly with cultural heritage and our friends in planning,

3:07:04we can certainly get you some further information on that.

3:07:07I think what I'm hearing though is that there's an opportunity for

3:07:11Ms. Akhen to certainly respond about the crossover sort of from heritage to culture.

3:07:15I'll pass it off to you.

3:07:20Thank you.

3:07:23Certainly we would be happy and I'm not well versed enough on the issue of

3:07:28the farmhouse to speak to the application of this plan or

3:07:33the recommendations that we have.

3:07:35But certainly something that we can take away and consider and

3:07:40strengthen our recommendations with the plan so that we can address that.

3:07:44Thank you, I appreciate that.

3:07:45I've raised this a couple of times with planning and it seems like a bit of a hot

3:07:48potato here or there.

3:07:50I'm not sure where I'm going with that.

3:07:52But again, as a European heritage history is part of that place making.

3:07:58It is very much part of the culture, whether it's you're in an old tower and

3:08:03you're eating pizza.

3:08:05We're capturing the history rather than taking it apart, shelving it and

3:08:09forgetting it.

3:08:10So thank you very much and I'll bring, I'll work with staff to bring a motion at

3:08:14the end of the month.

3:08:16I do have a comment about a page 59,

3:08:21eliminate barriers to participation and culture.

3:08:25I did kind of find, it talks about the city developing culture programming in

3:08:30neighborhoods where there is a deficiency in culture spaces and experiences.

3:08:36And I have to tell you, I kind of took a breath in and I'm in ward four,

3:08:41where I would not say there is a deficiency.

3:08:43I would say the deficiency is in the acknowledgement by the city funding.

3:08:48And I found the comment offensive, I'll be very honest.

3:08:52I found it a bit patronistic.

3:08:55So can you speak to that?

3:08:57Where did the data come for this to inform such a comment?

3:09:02Through the chair to the Councillor.

3:09:04That is language that was used by participants in community engagement,

3:09:10identifying gaps in neighborhoods and

3:09:14gaps in the programming that the city was presenting through culture.

3:09:18There was recognition that it was important to continue to support a strong

3:09:24cultural presence downtown.

3:09:26But people were looking for activations and

3:09:30cultural experiences in their neighborhoods.

3:09:32And so a really concrete example, our Cinema in the City initiative,

3:09:38was a movie, Market Square program that over the last year has evolved into

3:09:46films shown on inflatable screens in neighborhood parks.

3:09:50Where there hasn't been cultural programming presented by the city.

3:09:55It was, that experience was very informative and

3:10:01inspiring in terms of community reaction to those opportunities.

3:10:07And so the strong language of deficiency was really inspired by the messaging we

3:10:13were hearing from the community.

3:10:16And thank you for bringing up the example of the films in the parks,

3:10:19because that was the initiative in the Margaret Green Park for

3:10:22the outlets in 2014 where they approached the city.

3:10:27And it was a long process to try to get it.

3:10:29So it's great to see that it's now happening, but it's many, many years.

3:10:35So I think that's it for me and then I will, sorry,

3:10:39I just wanted to say bullet number one on page 59.

3:10:43I don't think you want rush tickets, although I think the mayor would probably,

3:10:46I think it's supposed to be bus tickets.

3:10:50Is that correct?

3:10:51I'm page.

3:10:52I like buses too.

3:10:53Buses too.

3:10:55I think that's what you meant.

3:10:56That can take that away.

3:11:02Yeah, absolutely, we'll take that away.

3:11:03Thank you.

3:11:04We're just working off of slightly different pages, page numbers than you.

3:11:07So we will take that away.

3:11:09Certainly rush tickets has come up in this plan as an opportunity across

3:11:13performing arts environment.

3:11:16Specifically has the program of rush tickets in some communities where at

3:11:20the last minute you can get tickets that are slightly less than the original

3:11:26posted environment.

3:11:27So there could be an opportunity where it is tickets of some environment,

3:11:31but we'll have a look.

3:11:32Thank you.

3:11:32So thank you for that.

3:11:34Thank you.

3:11:35English isn't my first language.

3:11:36So thank you very much.

3:11:39Are there any other questions?

3:11:42Councillor Orwork and then Councillor Cunn.

3:11:46Thank you, Councillor Downer.

3:11:47There's a lot I like about this plan, the digital culture hub,

3:11:50the convening and collaboration.

3:11:52Like it sounds like we're really going to maximize everyone's skills and resources.

3:11:55So that's great.

3:11:56I love the geographic distribution.

3:11:59I've been asking before every single budget cycle whether we can do rush tickets.

3:12:03Why would there be empty seats in the river run if we could subsidize for

3:12:08somebody to fill that seat and have a cultural experience?

3:12:10So I'm thrilled to see it there.

3:12:12Really happy to see the examination of our bylaw approach.

3:12:16Because very recently I was at a significant fundraising event,

3:12:20big culture thing, music there, food, all kinds of people.

3:12:24And the organizer said to me, bylaw came by and

3:12:27told us that there's been a noise complaint.

3:12:30So when an arts organization is putting on something that convenes the city and

3:12:36they get the exemption, then we need to make sure that we've aligned those things

3:12:40in a reasonable way.

3:12:42So I was really happy to see that.

3:12:44As well as the accessible performances in particular, the more relaxed ones.

3:12:47So people with sensory issues and ASL and other.

3:12:51But many other communities have these types of things.

3:12:54And so I was really pleased to see those.

3:12:57Where I had a couple of questions was with respect to our comparator municipalities.

3:13:02I was surprised to see provincial capitals that have obviously a different mandate

3:13:08as a provincial capital, a lot more funding.

3:13:11So I'm wondering what were our facilities identified in terms of how we compare there?

3:13:18And is this plan stating we want to be second in this list competing with provincial capitals, right?

3:13:28So can you just help me understand where the comparators come from?

3:13:31Because I'm not sure I'm comfortable with them.

3:13:35Through the chair to the councillor.

3:13:38When we were looking at finding good, reliable data on municipal culture spends,

3:13:44we reached out to our traditional comparator municipalities, but we found that there was a lot of diversity

3:13:51in what municipalities considered culture, where their spends were.

3:13:55And so we weren't confident in that data, but we did find the municipal benchmarking network

3:14:01of Canada Culture Performance Measurement Report to be good, consistent, reliable data.

3:14:08And so that's where the municipalities identified as comparators come through that data,

3:14:16which is updated annually.

3:14:21And there's a history of data that we can track changes over time.

3:14:28What I will say, while there's varying sizes of municipalities and some are provincial capitals

3:14:36and others aren't, we are looking at the per capita spend by municipalities on culture.

3:14:42And I know, for instance, well, if we look at Sudbury and Science North,

3:14:51Science North is a provincial agency, the bulk of their budget comes from the province.

3:14:58The municipality makes a modest contribution annually to their large budget.

3:15:03And so even in provincial capitals or in Ottawa, the nation's capital,

3:15:11local museums and culture tend to have a municipal investment that is aligned with

3:15:23a municipal level spend, even though the larger organizations get large influxes of funding

3:15:30from either the province or in Winnipeg, the federal government, for the Human Rights Museum there.

3:15:40So through you, Chair Downer, so we've had some correspondence this week and you indicated that

3:15:44in our assets and cultural spend, we include the river run, the museum, the Archeology of

3:15:51Guelph Contributions, festivals, and art specific granting. But why wouldn't we also include

3:15:58library space that hosts culture days or even the Sleiman Center, which can host concerts and

3:16:04things like, and I'm just chafing at where we are on that list, okay? And I'm not challenging the

3:16:11perception or the need for more. But why wouldn't we include those other or informal spaces like

3:16:17outside of City Hall where the Jazz Festival just had an awesome couple of nights? So why don't we

3:16:24include those and do we include an amortization of those big buildings, right, that are a significant

3:16:32capital spend? Through the Chair to Councillor O'Rourke, the library investment isn't included

3:16:39because it isn't included in the municipal benchmarking reports and so we did want to compare

3:16:48the same metrics as reflected in the municipal benchmarking reports.

3:16:55The Market Square programming, cultural programming is included in our investment report so

3:17:05and I can't speak to the amortization but I don't believe that that is captured by

3:17:11comparators participating in municipal benchmarking study. And my last question,

3:17:19two questions. The plan that we have in front of us that we're asked to approve,

3:17:27is that the list of things that the City will now commit to doing in the next

3:17:32period of time? I don't know if it's a 10-year plan, five-year plan, seven, okay?

3:17:40So yeah, so are we approving all the bullets in this plan? It's my first question and then I have a

3:17:46specific follow-up. Through the Chair to Councillor O'Rourke, it is our hope that Council will approve

3:17:53all of the bullets in the plan. It is a Culture Plan 2030, it was intended to be a seven-year plan

3:18:01and that would enable us to request modest investment through this multi-year budget

3:18:10and then provide us an opportunity to request budgetary support starting in 2028 for other

3:18:18items within the budget. Thank you for clarifying. So through you Chair Downer to Ms. Atkins. So then

3:18:26my other question, and there's no page number in the separate report so I can't refer you to the

3:18:32separate report but under the address gentrification piece, the second bullet says advocate for basic

3:18:38income opportunities for artists and culture workers. So I have no problem advocating for basic

3:18:44income for lots of people, right? My concern is we are presented by our intergovernmental team with

3:18:54a list of these are our priorities this year for what we will advocate to government. It's part of

3:18:59the delegations we have at AMO, it's part of the conversations that staff focus on. So does this then

3:19:07become part of that advocacy piece because really there's no question that the arts and culture

3:19:14sector was hit extremely hard through COVID and there's no question that I support a basic income

3:19:22but my concern is about the specificity of this bullet. Are we now committed to above all other

3:19:29priorities or in line with other priorities going to put one group or over another and I'm

3:19:33uncomfortable with that. So can you tell me please what was the process to vet that through

3:19:39intergovernmental to have that you know sit within the overall strategy of advocacy?

3:19:46Through the chair to Councillor Orror, thank you for the question. Certainly in discussion with

3:19:54the culture community when discussing affordability and affordable housing it's recognized that

3:20:01these are issues that are impacting the broader community and that work that council does to

3:20:07address those issues will hopefully have a positive impact on the culture community.

3:20:14But it was important for the culture community to for council to understand from the culture community

3:20:22that the current economic conditions are impacting the culture sector in a unique way.

3:20:30Again because of traditional precarity employment in the arts and culture sector

3:20:37and that we are seeing a culture drain artists leaving the community or considering leaving

3:20:43the community and so through community engagement the culture community wanted council to know

3:20:51that among the many things the community loses if we don't address affordability and attainable

3:20:58housing we will lose our creative community and that will be a cost to the community. So that's

3:21:06why it is singled out in this plan for consideration by council. Again the culture community recognizes

3:21:16that these conditions have broader impact than just the culture community but they are impacting the

3:21:22culture community in a unique and outsized way. So through you chair down or to Ms. Adkin I'm just

3:21:34wondering if there can be a conversation before the end of the month like this is not the what we

3:21:38heard section right this is the what we'll do section and I just want to know that our colleagues

3:21:47at intergovernmental are comfortable with that and that we're comfortable with that

3:21:52because we don't have other plans that say we're going to advocate for affordable housing for

3:22:00artists specifically right or for specific areas we want to advocate for affordable housing for

3:22:08everybody or basic income for everybody and so the specificity of this is a little bit concerning

3:22:14on the whole I love the plan I've done lots of work with you know art and belonging and all that

3:22:19stuff but the specificity of this one is a little concerning. Thanks. If I may Madam Chair to the

3:22:25Chancellor certainly there's other ways to advocate as well through then just through

3:22:30AMO and to government levels that we can still have a voice a collective voice and collaborate with

3:22:36all of the artists in the community to have and heard and hear that voice but certainly

3:22:41happy to have an offline or another conversation to bring back towards the end of the month

3:22:46happy certainly to share some different ways where we might be able to do that.

3:22:49There is often a staff long long level a long long list of advocacy's that do go through to other

3:22:57levels of government and to your example of the administration of municipalities list your AMO list

3:23:02and that that needs to get streamlined of course because time with ministers is very

3:23:07narrow and so even though this may be on that list it may not get to you at any rate so

3:23:13happy to share some other things that we might be able to do going forward to help support this to

3:23:18provide some comfort. Councillor Croson. Yes through you Chair Downer to staff first of all

3:23:29thank you for the the strat of the plan I am a big fan of it I think it's such an important

3:23:35part of what happens in our community. I have a question about some some language on page eight

3:23:43I have two questions two different so you've got foster collaboration between the culture sector

3:23:50and adjacent sectors with a bullet point underneath it saying work with all city departments to

3:23:54develop and support placemaking strategies so staff is is no stranger to me talking about

3:24:00placemaking and how important I think it is it has a different definition for everyone and I was

3:24:08also really happy to see it in the parks and recreation and I know that it's also part of the

3:24:12economic development and tourism plan. In this in this plan I see one line and it does does speak

3:24:20to it being a collaborative role but I feel that culture is really the seat of placemaking.

3:24:28How people use and interact with public spaces is culture you know and and the arts culture sports

3:24:36recreation tourism you know these all fall into these public use of public spaces so I was hoping

3:24:41you could talk a little bit about why there's not a strategy specifically in the plan about

3:24:46placemaking and maybe I'll stop there for that question. So through Chair Downer maybe I'll jump

3:24:54in and Ms. Holmes may also want to contribute so certainly as you said placemaking is an inter

3:25:00departmental function we typically have tended to view it more through the economic development

3:25:06and tourism lens but not to say that there isn't obviously a strong connection both for culture,

3:25:11for our parks and recreation and those teams definitely work strongly in collaboration with Ms.

3:25:17Holmes teams where placemaking is is concerned and we can definitely take that away if there is a

3:25:24desire for us to look at how we can strengthen the language related to placemaking then the other

3:25:28sort of note is I mean this is a broad community wide culture plan placemaking tends to be a little

3:25:35bit more site specific and I think when we're for example talking about the downtown downtown and

3:25:40particularly placemaking in the downtown core that maybe is where I'll pass it over to Ms. Holmes

3:25:45to comment further. Thank you and through the Chair to Council class and so for the downtown in

3:25:51particular we did we have committed to Council that we will be coming back specifically with the

3:25:59Wyndham EA recommendations and results and with that as part of our discussions we will be talking

3:26:04about placemaking very specifically for the downtown so for the downtown part that would be

3:26:10the probably the best place to have that discussion because it's already part of our design our

3:26:15streetscaping and what we're recommending bringing forward it sounds to me look like this is a

3:26:20broader request across the city so I'm not quite sure if we need a bit of scoping with that just to

3:26:27help deliver what what you're what you're trying to accomplish. Yes thank you for that and through

3:26:34the Chair to the DCAOs I think you know it started off with potentially thinking about the

3:26:40downtown specifically but it it has broadened after you know looking at the culture plan specifically

3:26:47because I started to think about you know Councillor Bousetil bringing up the West End Rec

3:26:52Center for example and as we look forward to the South End Rec Center how will that space also be

3:26:59animated from a cultural perspective. I just think that there's opportunities as we're building to

3:27:04look at these spaces as potential placemaking spaces you know and and maybe this is already done maybe

3:27:10you can clarify for this for me because for me you know even it could be applied to looking at a new

3:27:16development how how are we integrating placemaking when we build a new place. Through the Chair to

3:27:24the Councillor I can't speak sort of specifically around development but culture and recreation

3:27:32and when we move next into the Parks and Recreation Master Plan there's lots of crossover in creating

3:27:37opportunities for interaction in our community but in our place and so art plays a culture and art

3:27:43plays a strong role in creating those opportunities when we look at interactive art we look at

3:27:48opportunities for benches not to just be a stick and a back but to potentially include an artistic

3:27:56feature that then has a slide and has an opportunity for involvement of all ages in creating these

3:28:03sort of opportunities we see examples of interactive art we see textiles we see opportunity to try new

3:28:10things that can be both for wellness can be cultural based can be recreational based as well

3:28:18and that spaces become beautiful we can walk through umbrellas hanging in the air that are

3:28:23become an artistic feature and so very much in the in the culture and allowing artists to be

3:28:29inspired and and create that space for us we just need to say yes and go ahead and the creative

3:28:36community will certainly respond to some of that very much in some of our advocacy work through the

3:28:41culture plan would be absolutely to inspire and and the public art policy I would suggest to and to

3:28:47supply private space and community space and whether that's development or otherwise to

3:28:53work in interactive features to consider architectural features as art as well that

3:28:59again can create those sort of place spaces as well okay thank you I do have a second question

3:29:08and it's regarding something completely different and and I'm sorry I didn't ask this earlier it just

3:29:14came to me after I heard our our delegations as well you know we've heard that there's a great

3:29:19need for spaces that are affordable and accessible and I have received a number of emails as well

3:29:25asking for these types of spaces so I have a question with regard to art the city's role and

3:29:30perhaps in the cultural plan and I'm sorry if I missed it but I am wondering if are we mapping

3:29:37our cultural spaces and what's available in them like how public spaces can be used you know who

3:29:44can use what and you know if somebody has a creative approach to using a public space for a rehearsal

3:29:51or for art installations from you know from the public at large is there is that integrated into

3:29:57the plan currently through the chair to councillor class and thank you for the question the need to

3:30:06map cultural spaces has been identified through the plan and is hopefully the first order of work

3:30:12and part of the work we will be doing with the digital hub we need to have a better understanding

3:30:18of what's available both traditional spaces and non-traditional spaces what's available

3:30:25for for artists to create rehearse perform an exhibit so that indeed is is part of the plan

3:30:35okay thank you okay thank you so next we have councillor Chew and then councillor

3:30:43kate and then mayor Guthrie thank you ma'am chair through you just to bounce off of councillor class

3:30:52and then the placemaking ideation that we're talking about here I'm just trying to find a way in which

3:30:59we can connect the dots from this culture plan which I appreciate which is broad and allows for more

3:31:06ideation in the future for how that manifests itself just as an example you talk we talk about

3:31:14gentrification and to a lot of us we think of the south end we have to admit as well the south end

3:31:20is quite new it's recent and there's opportunity as well for culture to incubate itself through the

3:31:27new record center but I'm also just thinking are there costs effective public private partnerships

3:31:33that we can leverage through the language from the culture plan into the parks and rec master plan

3:31:39because I think as it stands right now not to speak too much in the parks and rec master plan but

3:31:45it really alludes more to sporting facilities and sports theming but I do think there's opportunity

3:31:52to create that synergy with our artists and residents that are highly invested in this culture plan

3:31:59to perhaps create a space in which we can talk about wayfinding educational signage

3:32:07that can be cost effective and can link into our trails master plan which talks a lot about the

3:32:12different types of wayfinding and educational signages so I say all this and just asking very

3:32:20simply how do we connect the dots and how do we create a broader vision for people so there's

3:32:25something to be excited about and there's also a way to set the expectation up front especially

3:32:30when we're talking to our development partners who would be more than happy to find ways for cost

3:32:38effective strategies through interested partners that especially within our highly engaged artists

3:32:46community so perhaps if you can jump off a bounce off of that that would be appreciated

3:32:54Through the chair to the councillor thank you for the question you do you will see placemaking and

3:33:02intersection with arts and culture in the parks and rec master plan of course placemaking is in

3:33:07our plan it's reflected in economic development and tourism and in planning I know anecdotally

3:33:15in speaking with my colleagues across the city that there is a commitment and an enthusiasm for

3:33:22placemaking and so by articulating it in all of our plans it gives us the impetus to to come

3:33:30together and work together to advance our placemaking strategies and just to follow up with me you

3:33:37kind of spoke briefly about programming opportunities like the theater in the park which took place in

3:33:43the in order to repark this summer I was just wondering as well if there are ways in which you

3:33:49can engage particularly minority groups in the south end visible minority groups to insert themselves

3:33:57into programming opportunities in those existing park spaces so I'm just thinking right out loud

3:34:02we have our park steward programs we have community gardens taking place wayfinding is

3:34:08something that's low hanging fruit that can easily be brought into the conversation through

3:34:14conversations within arts and culture through the culture master plan and through these grassroots

3:34:19organizations in front of us today how do we tie some of the I how do we tie in some engagement

3:34:27opportunities from folks that don't wouldn't necessarily come into city hall or engage

3:34:32through our engagement process at the park at Orrin Reed and how do we connect the dots with

3:34:39folks here that are very passionate today it's not really a question but I guess if you can

3:34:44bounce off of those ideas that I have that would be appreciate it just to kind of help model how

3:34:50we connect the dots for everybody with this plan in front of us through the chair to counselor

3:34:58to thank you for the question cinema in the city at Orrin Reed park this past summer was one of my

3:35:03favorite cultural experiences that since I've been at the city of Guelph it was a beautiful evening

3:35:09that really brought community together and we did see people that we typically don't see when we

3:35:15do cultural events downtown or at the civic museum and so that was really inspiring we know that we

3:35:21have work to do to build relationships with diverse communities that we that typically

3:35:28haven't been engaged in the cultural offerings we have to build those relationships because we

3:35:35are hearing that people are not represented and we need to follow their lead and learn how

3:35:43best to represent and so I can't speak for my colleagues in Parks and Rec although I know

3:35:51equity, diversity, and inclusion is important is writ large in their plan as well but certainly

3:35:58in cultural activities at our facilities at the museum at river end center at the cultural

3:36:05events we offer in the community we have identified in the plan a priority to ensure representation

3:36:13and one of the you know nuggets that we learned in developing this plan is that there have been

3:36:19efforts made to diversify our programming but it has been for the benefit of our traditional

3:36:24audiences and what we have learned are there are audiences who are not represented that we need

3:36:31to actually program for diversified audiences and so that's the work that has is outlined in this

3:36:38plan. Yes I appreciate the response and just one last question and question slash statement we

3:36:48I just wanted to kind of capture the nuances that don't necessarily get highlighted in

3:36:54the south end for example there's a court right plaza just close to the Y there's a

3:37:01there's an Italian pizza shop that has kind of a creative space for artists to hang their canvases

3:37:10but it's kind of a hole in the wall you wouldn't know that it existed if you were to you know be

3:37:16an existing resident or be happening to go to the optometry or dental office I was just wondering

3:37:22if there are ways in which the this culture plan in the future maybe not now to kind of highlight

3:37:28that there are experiences like that in south guelph that are not represented and I was wondering if

3:37:34there are opportunities not just through working with economic development but also through yourself

3:37:41and the folks downtown if we can kind of bring to light some of these stories so it's a win win for

3:37:48everybody and also it makes people excited that there's actually stuff happening in the south then

3:37:55so I just wanted to highlight just a little bit of that storytelling piece and also just wonder if

3:38:04there's room for opera for engagement on those types of nuances if that makes sense through the

3:38:12chair to the counselor yes that's the importance of the next stage of our work in terms of mapping

3:38:18cultural spaces across the city and again we will be looking at the traditional cultural spaces

3:38:25non-traditional cultural spaces and we know that magic happens in those holes in the wall type places

3:38:32and so we want to ensure that that they are captured when we develop our cultural map and our digital

3:38:40cultural hub thank you so much thank you councillor kathan and then mirgothry thank you chair through

3:38:50you to staff this first of all I just wanted to say I really like the plan it's great I was really

3:38:55happy that you had even mentioned that there is accessibility barriers as part of the deaccession

3:39:02of different art pieces so I thought that was pretty awesome and I was just wondering if the plan to

3:39:07help with the inadequate events pressure and red tape is an output of this or if it was something

3:39:14that was an input sorry chair to the counselor can we just have a little bit of clarity we

3:39:30certainly can speak to the previous statement around if there's gaps that appear sort of from

3:39:36red tape and looking at different you know moving forward and trying to remove some of that red tape

3:39:40around advocating for with our colleagues around different bylaws and policies and streamlining

3:39:47systems but can you maybe just sort of clarify how we or reframe your question for us please

3:39:54yes absolutely so one of the the things that you identified in the report was that we had

3:40:01an adequate event structure and red tape and I was wondering what are we doing to solve that

3:40:11through the chair to the councillor thank you for that clarification yeah certainly within

3:40:16community engagement those were issues that were identified within the plan we have identified

3:40:25that we will open conversation about some of the red tape issues that have been raised not just

3:40:32recently but over the years with our colleagues in in bylaw in planning and helped to guide that

3:40:42conversation so that we hopefully come to a place of resolution that meets the needs of

3:40:50of the city as well as our cultural partners great thank you and through the chair I just had

3:40:56one more question so I love that you're doing a gap analysis I think that's super important

3:41:02I was just wondering is there a plan to work with transit to identify gaps in public transit access

3:41:10once we find different areas I'm just thinking that like Eastview community park is a great

3:41:16area and would be good for different cultural events but like the bus doesn't even go up to

3:41:21the top entrance so those are kind of barriers to the spaces being used through the chair to the

3:41:29councillor again thank you for that question we did identify within the plan the need for public

3:41:36and active transportation options to culture for community and certainly part of our cultural

3:41:44mapping exercise will be to overlay accessible routes and ways to access culture in the community

3:41:54great thank you very much thank you Mayor Guthrie thanks chair through you I think

3:42:01Councillor Caton just basically asked my questions it was all around the barrier kind of stuff so

3:42:07you've answered that very well I guess my only follow-up question would then be

3:42:11you know how quickly can we start to actually change these things like we recognize the barrier

3:42:16issue you guys recognize the barrier issues so what you know I don't want another strategy that

3:42:22takes forever to try to figure out how to get overcome these barrier issues like how can we just

3:42:27start getting this stuff done how fast can we move on this through the chair to councillor

3:42:36or to Mayor Guthrie within the strategy there are a number of quick and I think easily achievable

3:42:48actions that we can take to improve conditions for culture and wealth and so it's our intent I

3:42:54mean I think to a large degree the communication we've had over the past couple of months

3:43:03past few months with the culture community we've already started walking down the road in terms of

3:43:09improving communication and developing connection and talking about cultivation so

3:43:16I think the work is already underway I think there are some really easily achievable objectives

3:43:22in this plan and that we intend to to act on immediately so we can have some

3:43:30quick wins for the culture community and then there are things that will require more analysis

3:43:38some deeper thinking about and and ultimately

3:43:43a budgetary investment in and so the plan has a range of scales but I do think that

3:43:51the work has begun and we can expect to have some immediate or quick impact

3:43:58okay thank you so just as a follow-up the money that is being forwarded or for us to recommend

3:44:03forward to budget is specific around the strategy I believe am I right yes yes okay

3:44:11so so what happens if there is a barrier that we want to eliminate for people to be able to

3:44:18experience more culture that has a financial impact does that mean that we can't move on that for

3:44:26like another full year because it's only the money for a strategy or does staff have the ability to

3:44:37low hanging fruit on some of the things like start to remove the barriers I just you know

3:44:44where I'm going I'm just gonna be quiet you can answer the chair to the mayor yeah absolutely if

3:44:49there is opportunity to remove barriers there may not be a cost involved or there may be a low cost

3:44:53that's included already within our operating dollars in order to support arts and culture in

3:44:57the community as well certainly anything that is vastly different across a policy piece we have

3:45:04the right to come back to council anyway so we don't need to wait four years to do such thing

3:45:09as well and a lot of these things aren't necessarily all specific to the arts community we've talked

3:45:15about that this afternoon as well and that there are some items that we heard specifically from

3:45:20the arts community because that's who we were asking but housing and affordability is across

3:45:26our entire community and province and country for that matter so I think that we can take some stride

3:45:34the beginning of our recommendation or our advancement to budget does gives the ability to

3:45:41look at some of that cultural mapping and not necessarily so strategy work but implementation

3:45:46of that sort of strategy work so there's a little bit of flexibility in what we've presented to you

3:45:51for consideration as a part of the budget process okay thank you and my last question about the

3:45:56strategy is your intent to look at reducing the cost for people to be using public places for culture

3:46:06because I hear that complaint a lot I'm sure you did too the engagement right so

3:46:12it not only the process I could just be blunt not only the process to check and get themselves

3:46:22involved in trying to figure out how but then there's the sticker shock as well so you know we have

3:46:32subsidies if we could call it that for you know non-profit groups or whatever that in sports as an

3:46:38example one around to field or something like that how are we good are you intended to take a lens in

3:46:43your strategy around that but for the arts and culture perspective as well because I actually

3:46:49really think that that is something we first of all I think it's a low-hanging fruit thing we should

3:46:54do but I think it's a big need I think we're missing a lot of arts and culture or place making

3:47:02because the barriers are very evident both in process availability and and the costs

3:47:10so is that strategy going to be really focused on that?

3:47:15Through the chair to the mayor yes certainly we want to look at that and we want to generate all

3:47:20of those ideas and opportunities there is great programs now in the recreation side just sort of

3:47:25being farther ahead our youth subsidy for an example and so does that you know is that a

3:47:31similar program that it could apply we would need to and we would then absolutely come back to you

3:47:38as council in presenting those programs and those bigger policy pieces right now we're stuck a little

3:47:43bit on our rates and fees schedule and some of our city facilities but is there a way to inspire

3:47:49packages programs uh collectives we collect you got it absolutely right yeah okay thank you are there

3:47:59any other oh councillor billings okay so I don't have it yet so the mayor asked some of my questions

3:48:09because the financial implications are 75 000 but I'm assuming the way it's written it'll be 75 75

3:48:1675 for the next three years so I'll start there is that correct? Through the chair to the council

3:48:22yes that's correct okay and so then the mayor speaks of the strategy but it's the initial three years

3:48:27to conduct an in-depth cost analysis so the cost analysis is the strategy? Through the chair to the

3:48:35councillor it is all in some of the above yes okay so then do we have to have the strategy or cost

3:48:44analysis complete before we start collecting with the you know the community benefit charges

3:48:51or are we collecting right now through that for culture so when when does that start or has it

3:48:58already started? Through the council through the chair to the councillor I would have to defer to

3:49:04finance in specific on timing but yes if community benefit charges are active now from developers

3:49:11and so they are being collected and there is opportunity to use community benefit charges

3:49:17towards culture where the original or the old style DC charges development charges didn't apply

3:49:23to culture opportunities and facilities so it's new it's really new ground to us and we're greatly

3:49:30excited as you know the different new and provincial bills it is being collected certainly at a slower

3:49:35pace than what was initiated as well but there is opportunity to add this to funding for both

3:49:42culture and public art as well. Okay because that I see that being really helpful then because

3:49:51maybe there's there there's a cap on it maybe you can find that out because the more community

3:49:57benefit charges we have then it would be maybe not as much an impact to the capital budget would

3:50:04that be correct or no? Through the chair to the councillor yes I think I'll work with my finance

3:50:10colleagues to find out what could be applied all in the background finances working hard now for

3:50:15our 24 to 27 budget to present to you shortly that includes those funding streams and funding models

3:50:21so we'll see if we can get a sneak peek directly on the community benefit charges. Okay thanks for

3:50:27your help. Are there any other questions? I just have a brief one would it be possible when this

3:50:37comes back to have and I mentioned this the other day so to have a implementation timeline like we

3:50:45have in the parks and rec attached as an appendix to this report? To the chair absolutely we're

3:50:54happy to commit to showing these recommendations in sort of a work plan environment so a short-term

3:51:00long-term or short-term medium-term long-term opportunity and to be able to present that sort

3:51:06of through a staff memo opportunity before the council meeting at the end of the month

3:51:10is not a problem absolutely. That's great it just helps we keep track and as we're going along.

3:51:17Sorry is oh councillor Keran you have a question? I did I had a comment I was waiting for comments.

3:51:23Okay I'll say we can start off with comments go ahead. Just my comment is and some of you have

3:51:29heard this personal anecdote about what when it really really clicked for me how valuable access

3:51:36was to culture and the arts and it was at one of the Market Square movie nights it was early in my

3:51:44first term when we had a movie night the Wizard of Oz was playing and I was sitting at the back

3:51:49and it was packed Market Square was absolutely packed and I sat on one of the concrete benches

3:51:55and beside me was an elderly man who was an obvious member of our community that's experiencing

3:52:01homelessness and he had joined the community event and he was crying during a scene in the movie and

3:52:07I asked him are you okay and he just sobbed and he said this is my favorite movie of all time

3:52:14and I haven't seen it in years and for me something clicked about access that you can pay for a show

3:52:21at the River Run you can pay for a concert you can pay to go to an art gallery but what we need is

3:52:25more public free expressions of culture and community events and that's what makes people

3:52:33feel like they're truly part of the the community of Guelph so I really love that

3:52:39marginalized communities and public access and affordability free is embedded into this plan I

3:52:48think it's really what what drives what we as counselors believe in when it comes to building

3:52:56community in the city and so that's my that was my comment that I really love this plan for that reason

3:53:05Councillor Bousichil thank you very much I have a couple of comments first I want to thank you very

3:53:10much for this plan I think it's it's great to see an intentional priority on our equity deserving

3:53:17artists communities neighborhoods and a commitment to have you know meaningful community engagement

3:53:23I also I did catch it the water wagon in there I'm looking the additional water wagon so thank you

3:53:29for for that and I just want to make a comment on the rush tickets sorry it's not my culture rush bus

3:53:41tickets I didn't know what that meant but just eliminating barriers and that this is really

3:53:46complex and I know I'm going to speak about the west end and you're going to hear about this in the

3:53:50park and you're going to hear that in my entire term as a Councillor about the Metrolinx underpass

3:53:55and that part of our communities are chopped up and we don't have access even to Margaret

3:54:00Green Park which is a regional park I call it the piazza in the community and to the rest of the

3:54:06city of Guelph and so that's big undertaking so you know I'm trying in regularly I do want to give

3:54:14a shout out to Councillor Clausson because placemaking is absolutely an underpinning for me

3:54:21in in culture and I'm going to speak to this in two ways the first is in your report your plan

3:54:28you speak about economic development and again I said this during the presentation of staff around

3:54:33economic development I'll say it during parks and I'll keep on saying it it's about threading culture

3:54:38into our local neighborhood parks and specifically the point that I raised is in the regional parks

3:54:44the importance of concession stands and you know not that we're going to beaver tails but we have

3:54:50may have squirrel snacks or something so we can have some kind of cultural content there

3:54:56or connection there to the diversity but also what I see and I hear from the community is the need

3:55:02to have that place in our park for our community well-being to walk to for an ice cream to walk

3:55:11to for a tea to sit down and to connect with one another and that also ties into mental health

3:55:16and well-being and I keep on raising it I'm going to keep on raising it as well and and you know

3:55:21your the report talks about the increasing age of our demographics and that is what I hear and

3:55:28and you're going to hear it in parks parks are more than just kids we need to have a place for

3:55:32people to go and share a cup of tea and sit down the other thing is I'm going to bring a motion at

3:55:40the end of the month I'm going to work with staff is placemaking and you know I think I became a

3:55:46little bit animated at you know the conversation around the bell and the clock and my concern

3:55:51around the Mitchell farmhouse I don't want it to go the well way of bell and and the clock and this

3:55:57isn't I'm not going to allow us to hot potato this because there's a commitment to the community

3:56:03that was made in 2005 2006 it is a perfect opportunity for placemaking it's an it's part

3:56:10of our cultural landscape that we allowed the demolition of that we have not reciprocated and

3:56:15recreating so for me this is culture as you know this is part of our culture that I I need to see

3:56:22so and and that is it for my comments thank you thank you councillor class yes thank you

3:56:32um and uh council abuse until I just want to you know say thank you for bringing up the

3:56:37placemaking I've actually been behind the scenes chatting with staff and Mary Guthrie um about

3:56:43putting forward a placemaking strategy so or placemaking policy um so um thanks for bringing

3:56:50that up and I can be happy to work with you on that as well um and thank you to staff for um

3:56:54chatting with me and I look forward to working on it a little bit more with you this month

3:57:00are there any more comments councillor Chew

3:57:06through you madam chair it's that's exciting to hear that there's some plan that's prefaced

3:57:11around placemaking I do think as well just to put it out in the public realm wayfinding is probably

3:57:21one of the best ways in which we can add depth and meaning to our social fabric especially

3:57:28in the south end and I think I would encourage our staff to work creatively to cut up to find

3:57:35interventions through that mapping that is going to be done uh so we can come up with something

3:57:42that's more tangible that has some brass tacks to it in the future and uh I would look forward to

3:57:48working with my council colleagues as well on some of the ideas that they may have in store

3:57:56thank you are there any other comments mayor Guthrie

3:57:59through you madam chair I just want to say thank you to staff and everyone that put this together

3:58:03but I actually just really want to say thank you to um councillor Caron she brought it home with

3:58:09her remarks there at the end I just thought that was really well well stated so kudos to you council

3:58:15Caron yes thank you um and I too just want to acknowledge staff for the work that you've done

3:58:22um we originally had a parks and rec and culture plan and culture plan in it had a few pages but

3:58:30not it wasn't as robust as this plan and I know that originally this plan was going to come after

3:58:37the parks and rec plan and staff have worked to bring this all together with the public art policy

3:58:43and the parks and rec plan and that's very much appreciated so that we can consider this all together

3:58:47because they're all very much interrelated so kudos to all the work that's been done to bring

3:58:53this forward now so having said that um I'm going to go to the vote is there anyone opposed to this

3:59:01seems like we're actually all quite excited about it so uh that passes right and we will now go on to

3:59:10the parks and rec master plan we I think we we do have a possible delegation like I just pardon

3:59:30just I sent out an email earlier that somebody had missed the um the senior center

3:59:37had missed the deadline and wanted to speak and so uh I think it would be appropriate if

3:59:45do we want to hear them before the presentation if I put that to a vote first we have to suspend

3:59:49the bylaw because they didn't meet the deadline so I just sort of seeing some nods ahead do we want

3:59:55the presentation and then the delegate and then a vote for the delegation and then take the break

4:00:06then the delegation and then yes and then we'll have a break that's yeah okay so we're going to go

4:00:12to break to the presentation and then we're going to have a vote on whether to allow the

4:00:19delegations to speak or not um and which is patty gauge from the senior center are you okay to go

4:00:29ahead no no this isn't for the um the delegation the delegation would come after the presentation

4:00:54yeah that's yeah that's the way the meetings go so okay that's up that's up to you

4:01:15presentation's about five minutes my guess is five or ten minutes yeah okay thank you

4:01:33good evening mayor members of council and delegates my name is malary lemon and i'm the

4:01:36manager of park control development at the city i'm here today with my colleague eric pool who's

4:01:42the supervisor of programs and community development in recreation services together we were we will

4:01:48present the parks and recreation master plan afterwards we can answer any questions you may have

4:01:54the prmp is a multi department community driven document i would like to acknowledge all the staff

4:02:00and residents that have put their time thoughts and effort into crafting this plan

4:02:05i would also like to remind council that in 2022 council approved the city's park plan the park

4:02:10plan focuses specifically on land needs and was a legislative requirement under the ontario planning

4:02:16act in order for the city to have a parkland dedication bylaw in place the park plan was

4:02:21accelerated before the completion of the prmp to meet provincially mandated timelines the park

4:02:27plan remains a strategic document for guelph and together with the prmp is the foundation of a

4:02:32parks and recreation growth plan parks and recreation are vitally important to our residents

4:02:39city of guelph staff listened learned from our residents community partners and organizations

4:02:44to understand the needs and interests of the community building on public input and the

4:02:50values established in the community plan and strategic plan the prmp identifies a renewed vision

4:02:55and core values for a parks and recreation system that our citizens can take pride in

4:03:01the actions recommended as part of this plan will help guide the city over the next 10 years

4:03:05and beyond to achieve the vision for parks and recreation in guelph today we will describe some

4:03:14key findings of the plan and strategic directions for guelph's parks and recreation system this will

4:03:19include a brief overview of the needs of for a prmp and alignment to the city's strategic plan

4:03:24and the project processes and community engagement activities staff initiated to develop the plan

4:03:30we will also present a renewed vision and core values for parks and recreation

4:03:34and describe how the plan will be implemented it's important to understand how the prmp fits

4:03:41with other plans and strategies and how it relates to the services we provide to the community

4:03:47the prmp builds on what we learned through the community and strategic plans and applies a parks

4:03:52and recreation lens to shared objectives that information is used to guide how we plan design

4:03:58fund build and maintain our parks and recreation system the prmp builds on the strategic plan pillars

4:04:04of sustaining our future working together for our future and building our future and aligns with the

4:04:102024-2027 strategic plan themes of city building environment and people in the economy an update

4:04:21to the plan was initiated to set new priorities that align with community need the city's strategic

4:04:26plan and new approaches legislation and best practices in park and recreation planning the prmp

4:04:32addresses park and recreation system needs including land infrastructure indoor facilities

4:04:38outdoor facilities programs and services and operation it sets the direction for the next

4:04:4310 years and beyond the recommendations of the plan guide the planning design construction

4:04:49and operation of the parks and recreation network and help prioritize parks and recreation initiatives

4:04:55in future capital and operating budgets so the prmp was developed over four phases of work

4:05:04a detailed inventory of resources was compiled using data for many different sources including

4:05:09facility condition assessments asset management plans and booking system data to confirm parks

4:05:14and recreation assets a review of emerging trends in comparison of services and infrastructure to

4:05:21similar communities was undertaken to identify strengths and opportunities within Guelph's

4:05:26parks and recreation system an in-depth review of park needs was conducted which resulted in the

4:05:33development of the council approved park plan and finally the parks and recreation needs assessment

4:05:39and the prmp were developed the needs assessment used data and community engagement input gathered

4:05:44throughout the prmp project to identify gaps and opportunities among the city's indoor and outdoor

4:05:49recreation facilities the purpose of this assessment was to recommend evidence-based provisioning

4:05:55of parks and recreation assets to be carried forward into the prmp the final prmp builds on

4:06:01the needs established in the park plan and the needs assessment throughout the four phases of the

4:06:14prmp staff engaged with thousands of people through various platforms to ensure that the

4:06:19prmp reflects community opinions and priorities efforts were made to consult with a broad range

4:06:24of guelph residents and organizations across various geographic areas and demographic groups

4:06:31public consultations took the form of community surveys intercept polling and identified

4:06:35priority neighborhoods open houses public workshops focus groups community pop-ups meetings with local

4:06:41school boards meetings with representatives from indigenous nations and presentations to advisory

4:06:47committees of council in total over 40 different opportunities to share feedback were offered

4:06:53common themes identified throughout the engagement included accessibility and inclusion

4:06:57green spaces land supply amenity and program variety and investment in aging infrastructure

4:07:05these themes are woven throughout the master plan and recommendations the plan is guided by an

4:07:12overall vision that outlines a desired future for parks and recreation in guelph our renewed vision

4:07:18is parks and recreation are essential to everyday life in guelph to be future ready guelph needs

4:07:23parks facilities and programs that are sustainable inclusive adaptable and have built-in ability to

4:07:28respond to a growing and diverse community the city needs to connect people to each other healthy

4:07:34living and the environment six core values of the plan support the vision for parks and recreation

4:07:40these core values drive the outcomes for the PRMP and will be embedded in the work of the parks

4:07:44and recreation departments to ensure that our parks and recreation facilities are spaces where

4:07:49everyone belongs and can participate community health and well-being is at the forefront of our

4:07:54services and we prioritize stewardship of the natural environment the PRMP provides near 100

4:08:03recommendations relating to park planning park amenities indoor and outdoor recreation facilities

4:08:08departmental strategy documents recreation programming community development and aquatic

4:08:13service delivery key themes throughout the plan recommendations include strategies to improve

4:08:19equitable access to parks and recreation opportunities strategic investments in

4:08:24place making and animating parks and community spaces strategy stops to my sports field service

4:08:29levels and increased recreation opportunities in existing facilities a parkland acquisition and

4:08:35a parkland acquisition strategy the plan also provides a balance of recommendations with

4:08:41many actionable in the short term and others taking more time to make sure community engagement

4:08:45remains at the core the core driver behind parks and recreation planning a complete list of all

4:08:5097 recommendations can be found on page 114 of the plan the implementation of the plan's recommendations

4:09:00will require a balance of investing in new and existing infrastructure and services the capital

4:09:06investment for the PRMP initiatives over the life of the plan is approximately 17.25 million

4:09:10dollars based on the outcomes of recommended strategies within the PRMP such as the sports

4:09:16field strategy and the inclusion diversity equity and accessibility strategy further initiatives

4:09:21and capital investment may be required the funding requirements to implement the recommendations of

4:09:26the plan will be referred to future operating and capital budgets the proposed pace of implementation

4:09:31allows for flexibility and will be based on need resource capacity budget approval and in some

4:09:36cases timing of secondary plan development including the golf innovation district in clear malty

4:09:43updates to the master plan are recommended at five-year intervals to ensure that the plan

4:09:47recommendations continue to align with community need trends and best practices in parks and

4:09:51recreations for this delivery the PRMP is a true collaboration between two distinct departments

4:10:00staff community advocates and residents the outcomes of this plan are a reflection of what

4:10:04we've heard and what is needed to ensure that we continue the golf tradition of providing excellent

4:10:09parks and recreation spaces and services to our residents thank you so much for that presentation

4:10:17so we're going to wait and have questions after the break and what we're going to do now is we're

4:10:22going to do a vote and if the clerks could put it up to see if council was willing to allow a

4:10:29delegation to speak that did not register in time it's from the golf senior center but they'll be

4:10:36identifying themselves if we need a three-quarters approval for this oh sorry two-thirds approval

4:10:42for this so if I could have a motion that counselor alt and counselor classen thank you

4:10:50is anyone opposed to allowing the speakers okay thank you if the I believe it's miss pat gaige

4:11:00you'll have five minutes and if when you come up if you could clearly state your name and the

4:11:09organization you represent because that we need it reflected in the minutes because it's not there

4:11:15now because you didn't get your name into the agenda thank you very much I really appreciate

4:11:20you listening to us my name is pat gaige I'm president of the guelph wellington seniors

4:11:26association and Linda Jeffrey is our executive director in august we had sent out to all the

4:11:35counselors a copy of our requests and our proposals for the parks and rec

4:11:44I'll make this quick because my board meetings don't go this long

4:11:49in the our proposed recommendation for number 92 to continue work outlined in the older adult

4:11:55strategy and implement seniors driven initiatives to maintain guelph's designation as an age friendly

4:12:01community our proposal was to work and initiate and complete a needs assessment for older adults

4:12:0855 plus in the city of guelph to the research data and information collected through the needs

4:12:14assessment will be shared collectively with us in the city of guelph and to move forward to an

4:12:22age friendly community and we've committed and we have committed uh $60,000 towards this initiative

4:12:31we'll share the data with the city and we would like your help in distribution and awareness for

4:12:37the best participation rate rate and we want to work with you number 93 improved geographic

4:12:46distribution of older adult programs to ensure programs are offered throughout the whole city

4:12:51we're proposing that possibly the community guide uh be reinstated a printed copy will ensure that

4:12:59residents lacking access to consistent technology and internet are not left behind and better promotion

4:13:06of the fair program our comments proposed gws a recommendations to work with the staff to explore

4:13:19opportunities to acquire grants that benefit all residents in guelph we received a trillion grant

4:13:25for our acoustic tiles in the evergreen auditorium uh for $27,000 we received that grant and those

4:13:34tiles are now up in our auditorium the company was absolutely wonderful to update the city's older

4:13:43adult strategy reframing as an age friendly strategy to better align with current industry

4:13:50language and terminology to understand and support the evolving needs of older adults and ensure

4:13:56the city remains a great place to live and age well support a recently proposed community benefit

4:14:04benefit modeling this five-year renewal would be strategic investment by the city which would

4:14:09allow the gws a and our partners to continue to provide diverse programs activities and services

4:14:16the age friendly action plan could guide the language and future community benefits agreements

4:14:21with actionable deliverables as well as a blueprint to guide the city with future future budgets and

4:14:28planning none of these were put into this proposed program i ask you to consider these

4:14:38you're all going to be seniors some of you are darn close and uh we we really do have fun over

4:14:46there at the evergreen and the west end community center um so we we just need your assistance on

4:14:53this and please consider some of our recommendations thank you thank you are there any questions of

4:14:59miss gauge councillor oh it's uh i'm sorry um councillor downer it's a bit awkward in terms of

4:15:05process but um the delegates have raised an important concern from their perspective that

4:15:12issues were not put in and i was wondering as i say this is procedurally awkward but i was wondering

4:15:17if we could hear from staff on that if that's appropriate because i know the delegates want

4:15:21to get on with their day and i as a senior at 67 i appreciate that well actually if you don't have a

4:15:29question of the delegate then i think they could leave the podium if you don't have a question

4:15:33directly of them no i don't but i was hoping that i could hear from staff while they're still

4:15:37present i think because while they're still present if they want to sit down and wait for you to ask

4:15:41jev but does anybody have a question of the delegate councillor work uh thank you chair downer

4:15:47through you to miss gauge and miss jeffrey um so i'm just uh we did receive your email i'm just

4:15:53looking at what the recommendations are so on 92 and 95 both of them refer to updating the older

4:16:00adult strategy reframing it as an age-friendly strategy um so i'm just wondering and then

4:16:09there's there's going back to see how do we maintain our designation as an age-friendly

4:16:13city which i think would create a lot of work there um so i'm just wondering why these are

4:16:19insufficient or why you would modify the wording or is the concern elsewhere like those are those

4:16:26two okay uh through through you um uh chair to the councillor uh what we were trying to do was uh

4:16:38update what language is here it's it's pretty broad you're using a plan that is in year eight of a

4:16:4610-year plan and we're trying to um provide some money because our board just approved $60,000 to

4:16:54do this uh assessment and we are prepared to do in wealth as well as wellington and uh almost every

4:17:02one of these points is very specific as to how uh we want to work with the city and how we could

4:17:08use the city's help in moving forward or an older adult strategy and an age-friendly um plan going

4:17:14forward we wanted to make sure that it wasn't approved today that you had time to look over the

4:17:20recommendations that we made so that those suggestions could be incorporated and knowing

4:17:26what we've already done to demonstrate our willingness to be a good partner is are you

4:17:38finished councillor okay are there any other questions okay you can sit down now if you want

4:17:44to hear any more thank you for your time but if if go yes please sit down um i i just i'm going to

4:17:52allow for um councillor ought to ask a question of staff while the delegates are still here

4:18:01and then we'll take a break so councillor thank you i believe probably staff has heard of just

4:18:07a comment on the concerns presented by the uh guava uh wellington seniors association with regards to

4:18:15what was omitted or not included uh thank you through the chair to uh the councillors and

4:18:20certainly to our partners in the room um we feel these items are captured in the plan and we

4:18:24absolutely um value the importance of our partner um guava wellington seniors association is

4:18:31essentially a major tenant at the evergreen senior center and yes has absolutely invested in the

4:18:36building alongside of the city um and we're very glad and couldn't do that work specifically at

4:18:42evergreen but in the community without them we just recognize that there are other community

4:18:46partners that are also advocating for both an age-friendly community as well as for seniors in

4:18:51our community and so um look to partner heavily with the seniors association but certainly with

4:18:57others in the community and and want to be strong advocates in this lead um of some of the work both

4:19:03in reactivating the older adult strategy and certainly making it right for 2023 and beyond

4:19:10thank you very much so what i hear you saying is you have captured what was presented and

4:19:15we'll be moving forward with that uh through the chair certainly um from what we're hearing that

4:19:21we're in we're in a bit of conflict um if we're hearing that uh that our colleagues are talking

4:19:26about it not being right and not being right in a timing plan um we did hear um council received a

4:19:33letter at the same time as we heard some feedback through our have your say portal um and we hope

4:19:38that we captured some of those pieces um we recognize i would suggest that the neighborhood

4:19:43or the senior association wants it to say that they will do this work or that they will do it in

4:19:49partnership with us and we are being more broad to capture um all services and all others that

4:19:55are doing some of the similar work in the community um we will continue to talk to them um and make

4:20:00sure that we can do this in lockstep thank you very much i hope that that would help uh both of

4:20:06you communicate to the gws a with staff's intent okay uh melgothry thank you councillor Allt i think

4:20:15actually wrapped it up very very well just to make sure that as the delegates leave the room

4:20:20there's that that intent is is clarified so i think that's important um but through you to

4:20:25staff like when i look at our strategic plan and um you know it sits of course with you danon and

4:20:33park staff but sits really a lot under colleen and our deputy ceo's uh uh portfolio like on page 18

4:20:43number seven says grow and care for our community spaces and places and then there's 7.1 0.2 and 0.3

4:20:507.1 is build the south end community center check point two is build the library at the baker

4:20:57street check and number three is attract more people to our parks and programs by making them

4:21:02easier to access and enjoy and specifically under the supporting actions of our approved strategic

4:21:08plan it says implement the parks and rec master plan including the creation of an outdoor sport

4:21:12field and surface strategy and recreational service delivery strategy and leverage actions from

4:21:19an older adult strategy and youth strategy so i'm under the impression that you're we're about

4:21:27at the end of this month if we approve this we're about to do another check because this is exactly

4:21:31what we're talking about um here that that their council was you know pre-firm on our strategic plan

4:21:39it was a unanimous decision for having this older adult strategy embedded in this you're saying that

4:21:45you did you did hear that and it you're just fulfilling what our strategic plan is is in front

4:21:51of us am i correct uh through the chair to the mayor yes okay are there any other questions

4:22:00it just in regards to the to the delegation that we just said okay thank you we are going to take a

4:22:09break now and then come back for any further questions of staff half an hour um we'll come back at

4:22:31540 warning okay council i think we're 541 do we have enough okay we are good to go

4:52:32and we've had uh the great presentation by malarie and eric we've heard from a seniors association

4:52:44answered those questions now we're going to resume the meeting with um if i could ask somebody to

4:52:52put the motion on the floor first and then we'll go to questions mayor Guthrie seconded by councillor

4:52:57thank you um are there any questions of staff on the report

4:53:04so over work and then council gibson okay council gibson well that was fast

4:53:18well i will say this i i have a feeling just because i did i did spend some time with staff

4:53:22today on the phone thank you very much mr matthews um answering questions and i have a feeling that

4:53:28for the most part a lot of my questions and probably council of my council college questions

4:53:33will be focused primarily on um implementation of this plan there's a lot of questions stemming from

4:53:39the finalization of this plan and what comes next similar to the cultural plan so i i have

4:53:45primarily comments but i just i had a few items that i wanted to just cover off in the public

4:53:50forum to ensure that uh we're not precluding things as i'm going through my checklist of the plan i

4:53:56just look for make to ensure that the things that i were looking for were in the plan and that

4:54:00we weren't going to be precluding anything following um approval of the plan so the biggest one that i

4:54:07looked at was um to staff was the idea around partnerships and other communities that are

4:54:13partnering with i know that there's comments about public sector so schools and and g rca and

4:54:18things like that partnering with other organizations to accelerate the plan and so um and mr mathews is

4:54:26forwarded as actually been kind enough to forward me a response to that today but i just wanted to

4:54:30give staff an opportunity to just voice it in public that you know this plan is robust and it

4:54:37allows for partnerships and conversations to happen with organizations throughout our community

4:54:43as well as not just publicly owned but actually privately owned as well to help accelerate the

4:54:48aspects of this plan including the field sports um the strategic plan around an open field strategy

4:54:55and things like that so i just want to give staff the floor for a minute or two if they if they care

4:55:00to to help answer that question for the public thank you for the question and through the chair

4:55:08to the counselor uh yes we have built in opportunities um to work with the private sector

4:55:14if you take a look at recommendation number nine uh it says explore partnership opportunities with

4:55:18the private sector for project funding sponsorships as part of this work ensure equitable prioritization

4:55:24of departmental work is maintained that's great thank you and again i think it's just an important

4:55:32point that uh the it's a very robust plan with lots of opportunities and an opportunity to

4:55:38accelerate our our field strategy would be great i only have comments after this chair so i'll i'll

4:55:44see the floor uh thank you chair downer through you to staff um i just have some specific questions

4:55:58just so i'm comfortable with the recommendations i'm just looking at number 19 about shade so

4:56:02i appreciate we're looking at more splash pads given you know we know that with global warming

4:56:09people are going to need places to cool off so so i like the 2.5 kilometers to the splash pads

4:56:17um and on 19 we're saying we're going to install those shade structures at water play facilities

4:56:22playgrounds with rubber surfacing specialized facilities like skateboard parks bike parks

4:56:26amusement rides and dog parks so what happens in a park that is built in what was a farmers field

4:56:34right i'm thinking of 90 of the parks in the south end where there's a big group from a cultural

4:56:40community them and go and they sit around in the park after dinner and there's literally there's no

4:56:46shade and the trees that we did have we lost two in the windstorm last summer so when we are

4:56:54are is this a going forward proposal or are we looking at in existing parks where there's really

4:57:00no shade can we install shade sale shade sales retroactively can we be looking at how we create

4:57:07shade in some existing parks uh yes so through the chair to the counselor um yes we can

4:57:15retroactively install shade structures we actually have a recommendation in here um to

4:57:21to intensify parks in existing areas those would be typically smaller projects

4:57:28that would include potentially adding seating potentially adding a shade structure that type

4:57:32of work um through your chair downer looking at uh number 21 i'm really pleased to see we're

4:57:39going to develop a memorial program i'm wondering when people will do a plaque for a bench or a

4:57:48plaque for a tree currently they have to buy like a new tree or a new bench and it's in the

4:57:54neighborhood of about 1500 will this new plan have a lower price point where people can put a

4:58:01plaque on an existing tree or bench because we have those and then again i'm thinking about revenue

4:58:08generation and a more accessible price point um so are we looking at not just an equity piece but

4:58:16increasing the revenue by bringing that price point down through the chair to council yes um maybe

4:58:22not in that exact form but staff are we we've seen ideas um engaged in other park settings

4:58:28it's just out London uh last week for a conference they've done a memorial tree um plaque area um

4:58:35in a beautiful area where they're putting plaques on stone walls um in parts that are planting a

4:58:40lot of trees so there are a lot of ideas that are out there um that can work uh for us um and

4:58:45press uh price points so more people can engage very much um beyond our list i would like to note

4:58:51because this has been some time for this program to relaunch staff are looking to relaunch

4:58:56the memorial bench program and we will um look before this is complete because there's some

4:59:02community um needs um out there um so it will look very similar to what we have engaged in the past

4:59:11that would include the price point um though this program will very much take price point

4:59:15into account that the new one councillor rock great thank you um my next question is sort of a

4:59:21group of recommendations that are on page 116 and so the plan is primarily very high level around

4:59:28we're going to you know implement these general policies but then there's some really specific

4:59:33recommendations and i'm not familiar with drew cart drew park basketball court but i'm just wondering

4:59:39this one's very specific if there are others in our wards that we know are coming up and they're

4:59:44not there right or our constituents are looking at the plan and they're like well what happened to

4:59:50or in reed or whoever else can you just give us some comfort around the fact that all the things

4:59:55that are in the pipeline will continue to happen and this is just an ad

5:00:00yeah so through the chair to the councillor that's correct everything that we've talked about through

5:00:05budget process previously um it's still in there this is an ad and it's not a bump for other projects

5:00:12through engagement we did get some particular correspondence on this area being in need in

5:00:20many ways um and the park is reflective of that and needing some upgrades so that's why this particular

5:00:26one sort of made it into the parks and rec master plan it was something we heard very much about

5:00:30thank you so people should know though that all the other things in the priorities list they

5:00:36continue they're still in the capital budget that's all still good that's correct thank you um i had a

5:00:43question around 38 in terms of park signage there's a park on uh what's it called pinch park

5:00:51i forget the street so pinch park has a lovely story about dr pinch and you know why the park is

5:00:56named after him and i i'm still not sure if there's a plaque like that at uh the park on daland drive

5:01:04for the number two construction battalion which is too bad because i mean it's such a compelling

5:01:10story so will we be doing something to cancer karan's earlier point will we be doing something

5:01:15with a qr code or something that tells the story of why that park was named after that person

5:01:21because we have it in some places and then not in others so through the chair to the counselor

5:01:30yes we are working through some signage strategies internally currently um alongside the active

5:01:36transportation network studies some outcomes from that so we're working collaboratively internally

5:01:41with other city departments to come up with a signage strategy um if you drive around the city

5:01:47we we acknowledge that we've got many different types of signs that came from different areas of

5:01:51park planning or eras of park planning i should say um so yes we do have plans to update our

5:01:58strategy our signage strategy okay super and uh chair downer just a couple more i had a meeting

5:02:04with a large group from um the arab women's society of guelph and you know engage with young

5:02:10people and about different things that they like to see in the city and one of the things they

5:02:14identified was could there be a quiet room or a multi-faith prayer room in recreational facilities

5:02:22the reason being that either if they they're staff members or if they're there for an extended

5:02:27period of time and they need a place to go pray or a place to just sort of relax could be you know

5:02:32because i saw the reference to the snowsland room going forward or can we retrofit or can we create a

5:02:39space that is accessible for people um if they need to pray and then you know go back to their mom

5:02:47and taught swim lesson or whatnot um or just have a quiet space is that in the cards yeah thank you

5:02:58for the question uh through the chair to the counselor um we haven't noted that specifically

5:03:04in the plan but i think what we've talked about more generally is um the idea of allowing or

5:03:11creating plate like we've heard the term place making a lot tonight um but uh how do recreation

5:03:17centers factor into everyday life for for residents and they factor in many different ways so um

5:03:23we saw things through the pandemic like the digital divide so what role could um recreation

5:03:28centers play in filling those needs like access to to wi-fi which is being seen as a basic need

5:03:34yeah the snooze in room is a great example of sensory space and how we can

5:03:38dedicate some of our spaces so this as we talk about um sort of the equity diversity and inclusion

5:03:44piece and and those strategies and some of those strategic investments that we're talking about

5:03:48we talk about places to gather um and places to ceremony within the the master plan we haven't

5:03:54made a specific recommendation around that specifically but i think that's that that's really

5:03:58the intention in there is is how do we look at the role that our recreation centers are going to

5:04:02play going forward um in terms of not just being physically active but how they play a role in kind

5:04:08of everyone's day-to-day life and being sort of hubs of community rather than just a place that people

5:04:14come do an activity and then leave okay great and my last question chair downer it pertains to the

5:04:21delegation from the girl fallington seniors association um they raise a good point around

5:04:28can we continue to print some of the copies like i myself will circle stuff show it to my kids

5:04:34or whatnot right so do we have it in the budget for maybe you know not not at every household

5:04:41copy of it um but do we have plans continue to provide some print copies at a minimum on on demand

5:04:50through the chair to the counselor certainly very much supported um

5:04:53um uh mr. pool's just identified uh action number 61 uh in the plan but certainly in this even in

5:04:59this current year um we're working with it to have a more interactive online uh guide community

5:05:06guide so not just your registration platform but an opportunity to almost like turn pages um with

5:05:13that we recognize that then specific sort of sectors or the lists or partnerships um need to be in

5:05:19print um we had a resident at the front desk at west end this week who was trying to understand

5:05:25the leadership cycle to get through um to get their youth through into being a lifeguard and so

5:05:30there is already a sort of card that shows that path um and it doesn't it doesn't time out it isn't

5:05:36just for this year's session but it helps show that path so they can circle and check off and so

5:05:42just trying to find um the balance between the old community guide that actually printed some and

5:05:48they ended up in the back of a rec center's dumpster or recycling bin um because they were

5:05:53just stale dated so quickly um so definitely seeing that we need some printed hand-holded

5:05:59pieces yes absolutely and some of that work is happening now but also supported through this plan

5:06:04great thank you okay thank you uh counselor busatil thank you very much for the presentation

5:06:14and for the report um i'm going to start with placemaking so it's on page four of the memo page

5:06:21four of seven uh it refers to placemaking investments can you just help me understand

5:06:27what does this mean to you in parks and recreation thank you for the question and through the chair

5:06:36to the counselor um it means a lot of things and and maybe nothing at all at this point because

5:06:43i think that that's what makes place placemaking so exciting is that it is a sort of generation of

5:06:48ideas and it's it's it's built collaboratively so um from a strategic investment perspective

5:06:53really what we were looking at um was how can we do more with the recreation assets that we

5:06:58already own so instead of looking at large investments um obviously we have the south end rec

5:07:02center coming on board we're not going to build 17 more south end community centers in the next 10

5:07:07years but how can we take the spaces that we already have make small investments in them and

5:07:11increase uh recreational opportunities for others um how can we create new opportunities um through

5:07:18through placemaking through those small investments so i think this is where community engagement

5:07:22and going back to the presentation and some of the uh some of the items being very actionable now

5:07:27whereas others are going to take uh more time that more time is really to make sure that we

5:07:32engage the community and that we um understand in very different spaces you know appreciating

5:07:38that someone at the west end might want something very different at the west end community center

5:07:42compared to say victoria road compared to south end so how are we engaging with the community to

5:07:47understand what we're looking for and how we can make the most of those opportunities through

5:07:51those small investments to existing recreation spaces thank you um again i hope my pages match

5:08:00yours page 30 and page 35 this introduces a new language for me on um co-loc sorry let me back

5:08:08up first the question is a data one when uh city park co-locates next to a school is the cumulative

5:08:16green space park space school plus city included in the data or is it just the city space

5:08:24so through the chair to the counselor we only count parkland that is owned by the city of

5:08:28gulf or under maintenance agreement with other public bodies like the g rca thank you now my

5:08:35second question is that page 30 and 35 a new language of multifunctional land um and so i

5:08:44understand bill 23 has negative consequences for the addition you know acquisition of parkland

5:08:51but it feels like a double slap to the taxpayer you're getting a less parkland and now by the way

5:08:56we're taking the parkland that you have and we're going to put infrastructure underneath it and so

5:09:02my question is uh does this multifunctional land new classification space in a park um does it get

5:09:11factored out of the parkland total and does it get compensated in the parkland balance sheet

5:09:19we've taken it out here we've got a storm water water feature whatever it is full of ducks um

5:09:24and we're going to compensate and purchase parkland somewhere else can you just say animate that for

5:09:30me please that's sure so through the chair to the counselor um i think you may be referring to

5:09:36through the storm water master plan there was infrastructure proposed mainly under parks we

5:09:44worked closely with other departments on that and determined that there could be other city of

5:09:51infrastructure within parks without compromising recreational infrastructure and so it's about

5:09:58communicating with our with our partners and making sure that recognizing that yes there could be a

5:10:05dual use of land without compromising the actual parkland itself so i would say no once we have

5:10:11underground storm water facilities beneath sports fields most people won't even know they're there

5:10:17we will still count that as parkland thank you and i i guess i wasn't referring so much to the

5:10:22underground uh storm water which i i have been told is phenomenally expensive i'm talking about the

5:10:28surface so changing a green grassy space where you know spontaneous recreation takes place into

5:10:37a surface different use storm water does for me transform that green space now into not use the

5:10:44same um so you're saying to me that that now transform space still is considered parkland

5:10:52although the spontaneous use is not possible to continue

5:10:57so through the chair to the counselor we have not worked through any design details yet on any of

5:11:03those surface ponds within parks but there's very much understanding between all departments that

5:11:08there needs to be a recreational component built into that storm water management plan so we do not

5:11:15expect it to be a fenced off location where people cannot enjoy nature and cannot enjoy recreation

5:11:20we expect that there may be trails potentially signage and other recreational opportunities

5:11:27built in with that so we are hoping not to silo we are hoping to blend them so that it serves two

5:11:32functions thank you it still feels like a reduction in green park space regardless of how you you

5:11:39quantify it it is a reduction and it's due to you know bill 23 and infrastructure needs and so on

5:11:46which which build I didn't see in here is some kind of a plan that is comprehensive I'm ward

5:11:52four so deer path park where the infrastructure has collapsed and in ward four there's no longer

5:12:01a basketball full court and the redirection of young people to the other side of the handlin

5:12:09is is a huge concern so you know when we get to developing these plans

5:12:13um and and referring them to the shelledale area that already has very limited facilities and a lot

5:12:19of pressure some kind of plan around what if you know it you know the the roof of whatever it is

5:12:28it's uh I can't remember it's uh I can't remember what it's called anyway when that falls in what

5:12:33happens to the recreation where is the second place for these youth to go plan and I didn't see that

5:12:39in your plan I saw the idea of putting together the infrastructure looking at a decision matrix

5:12:47around where and where it does and it doesn't go but I didn't see contingency plans around

5:12:52what happens if um it's in my notes here somewhere I can't read it but what happens when that roof

5:12:59collapses and that recreation opportunity is no longer there so can you speak to kind of that

5:13:05bigger vision of the what if so through the chair to council that's an example where we do need to

5:13:12look at our park system as a whole so with the closing of that facility with the shelledale

5:13:18and norm jerry basketball park refurbishment in that area which has been highly highly successful

5:13:24that would be an example where obviously the city has a lot of demands on our infrastructure a lot of

5:13:30priorities um facing us where we just couldn't put the courts back over that structure or in that area

5:13:40which again is why investment in facilities like norm jerry is important not just the local community

5:13:48but for others that are relatively close to travel to so we would take that continuum approach in

5:13:53that scenario with the services that we offer in our parks thank you very much and again I appreciate

5:13:59the response however the handland is a huge barrier and the metro links underpass did I mention I'm

5:14:04going to be advocating for that for the next four years um is is an essential part of creating that

5:14:10and and in terms of budget you know it's great to say infrastructure is going to be you know underneath

5:14:15our parks but it's that contingency plan of what if what happens because it is not accessible to our

5:14:22youth and having those conversations whether it is and why I ask the question of if in the

5:14:28balance sheet we're taking it out for infrastructure there is an inherent cost and potential loss

5:14:33that needs to be built into that budget for future basketball courts or or or things like that so

5:14:40that's the reason I ask that in that kind of language of the balance sheet um the next question

5:14:47I had is about it's on page 41 recommendation number 20 about park stewardship and I apologize

5:14:53my understanding of stewards is lord of the rings so you know so you know there is a decision

5:15:00making function there is a stewardship you are in charge of this and I didn't quite understand

5:15:07if there is a stewardship policy is this essentially just volunteer labor for the city's

5:15:13objectives is there dialogue between the stewards and the city of gualaf in terms of

5:15:21like an advisory committee on activities that are happening so I'm just and it is is it the same

5:15:27model as the community gardens that there is some kind of convening of the stewards if you can

5:15:31animate that for me please sure so through the chair to the councillor there is an existing

5:15:37park stewardship program and we get all kinds of volunteers who are happy to help out in our parks

5:15:44particularly there's some orchards that I know that the park stewards help with

5:15:50some of the community gardens some other tasks that they can can participate in volunteer in

5:15:56in city parks and we're sort of advocating that that continue through this plan thank you so I've

5:16:01seen stewards used in forestry I've seen them in parks you know the park cleanup and so on

5:16:06I guess I will be looking for at some point some kind of consolidation of where this fits in and

5:16:12this also for me you know looking at the clerks around our governance what is the role of the

5:16:17stewards are they part of an advisory structure in terms of our governance and consultation

5:16:22and engagement I don't know I don't have all the information but that's what I was looking for

5:16:28the next one and you heard a little bit of this in the culture side and you you too I see the two

5:16:34departments are two halves of the walnut is on page 41 43 and page 44 around the inventory of the

5:16:42gap in infrastructure in our parks I didn't see anything about concession booths and this is

5:16:48something that I did here as you know a citizen not a counselor in the community consultation

5:16:53around the parks master plan mainly around the seniors saying I want to be able to walk

5:16:58someplace I'm going to sit down I want to have a cup of tea and I want my you know to meet my

5:17:02friends there what I did see is food trucks and so I have a concern about that if we're

5:17:08placemaking to me a food truck is not placemaking that is you know kind of an extension kind of

5:17:15thing so my question is about and I raised this during the presentation from the economic

5:17:20development department as well is about community economic development and neighborhood economic

5:17:24development creating spaces where young people can get jobs where they can be there and also the

5:17:30cultural side of that I'm European you know I live and breathe you know the food the sense the

5:17:35congregation and I think this is a missed opportunity and for me food trucks just doesn't do that so

5:17:41I'm looking for a comment on when I looked at the list of infrastructure gaps I didn't see concession

5:17:49concession stands specifically to a regional park is what I'm speaking to not every park

5:17:55but a regional park so through the chair to council not in the PRMP I'm at length because we didn't

5:18:02hear a lot about that topic specifically through our engagement processes I would say though there

5:18:09are a variety of examples where that's working in our park system so the boathouse as an example

5:18:15ice cream is working smaller concessions and vendors in our parks also works we have seen

5:18:23though where we've added that larger infrastructure at Eastview at Qualcomm sports fields and the

5:18:28uptake just isn't where we thought it was going to be there's a lot of factors that play into that

5:18:34infrastructure changes and expectations in our parks changes in volunteerism so council

5:18:40boosted so that's maybe something staff can take away for further consideration again not

5:18:45in our PMP documents at length because through our engagement processes we just didn't hear a lot

5:18:51about that thank you and and again I I know I did and the ones that I said that I participated

5:18:58and heard that and I guess what I'm looking for is some kind of a feasibility around that when I

5:19:03think of Margaret Green Park with the activities that are happening there and what I see in the

5:19:07garbage from you know the tournaments that are happening in the food that's coming there

5:19:11and as a priority neighborhood recently identified by social services at the county economically

5:19:17there's a perfect opportunity to kind of layer a job opportunity for youth and bring someone into

5:19:24an understanding of city operations and so on so it's a missed opportunity I think and you know I

5:19:30would advocate for something there and again you know we're not going to get beaver tails but maybe

5:19:37you might get squirrel squares you know we can go and enjoy there as part of a cultural you know

5:19:42let's go there and the families that I speak to that that are at Margaret Green talk about a

5:19:47destination place making going someplace for an ice cream where they can meet as a group so food

5:19:53is part of culture and should be a part of this so that's all I'm going to say on that one. The next

5:20:00comment that I have or question is recommendation number 37 again when we speak to our diverse

5:20:09community and like Councillor O'Rourke you know there are 35 women doing exercise class right now

5:20:16at St. Peter's school the Muslim community said that when it comes to park benches keeping in

5:20:22mind congregate settings so many of our families are large and our benches are small or too few

5:20:30and that there's you know that sense of community coming together so when we are looking at developing

5:20:37our parks just that congregate that need for congregate settings and so if you can you know

5:20:43kind of speak to that how how that is done ensuring that you know there is that diversity kind of

5:20:49reflected. Sure so through the chair of the Councillor as you mentioned there is a recommendation

5:20:56in the master plan that basically acknowledges that within our existing parks we may need to add

5:21:02some more benches and seating areas this would be part of a park intensive education project

5:21:08and we would be doing engagement on any of those projects to make sure that you hear what the

5:21:14community needs. We also recognize that a simple heavier say is not necessarily going to reach all

5:21:20the people that may have an opinion on this so I think through through that process a good solid

5:21:27engagement plan to make sure we're reaching all the right people will will ensure that the parks

5:21:32are actually useful to to the people that use them. Thank you and you know the range of comments I

5:21:37hear about you know an outdoor bread oven and you know many other things that families would like to

5:21:41see we'll get there we'll get there. Two last questions are is around what Councillor O'Rourke

5:21:47I had it down as well the community guide and I refer a lot of people to the west end community

5:21:52groups struggle with the cost of printing color the burden is on them to do this and so my question

5:22:00is in the old days community groups used to receive you know bunches of guides is it possible to have

5:22:07a network of you know where they have one in the office they can sit down with something because

5:22:11from my experience families miss opportunities if you're savvy with a computer you got your credit

5:22:17card handy and everything else you're right there in swimming lessons but if you have to come to a

5:22:22community agency to see a computer with the information to have it explained you you miss those

5:22:28opportunities so having some kind of a paper guide to sit down or to send home with someone and have

5:22:34them bring back the next time they're at the community center it is really is really helpful so

5:22:40just you know some some feedback or some comments back on you know the access to the information

5:22:46in terms of equity of opportunity through the chair to the councillor yes we've heard this before

5:22:53we've heard it currently we've heard it through the engagement of some sort of print material

5:22:57we we went sort of probably too far in the pendulum through COVID and we need to bring

5:23:02ourselves back that full the full guide with all of our offerings per season is never going to come

5:23:08back in that form it still dates too quickly it has the the opportunity for error is is too great

5:23:15in human behavior but yes we are committed we're starting that now and it is shown in the plan

5:23:21that there still needs to be something printed and so maybe there is programs talking about just

5:23:27the preschool programming or just the tennis programming that's offered and so yes we recognize

5:23:32that not everybody is going to be savvy to be able to flip pages on a fancy pdf online so absolutely

5:23:41in in pilots and trials coming in sort of multiple micro pieces that we can control the content

5:23:49and both volume content and accuracy of information much better thank you very much

5:23:56the last two i'll combine them because i said i only had one more left ice rinks i think it's

5:24:00recommendation number 27 thank you for that my question is is this just for city ice rinks or

5:24:07will there be a collaboration with school boards that also have ice rinks and combining my last

5:24:13question is on page 79 recommendation number 68 states that to investigate indoor pools

5:24:22and you know as a former school board trustee in the conversation with centennial and so my

5:24:26question is is there a location for the need that has been identified in that statement of an

5:24:33expression to explore this thank you through the chair to counsel so for the outdoor part of that

5:24:39conversation first we'll recall in our park plan it calls for that continuum approach to find space

5:24:46for us to do park things as we add more community ice rinks as we add other features like pickleball

5:24:55engaging conversations with other property owners including school boards which historically has

5:25:00happened that's been lost a little bit through time for circumstances on both ends of that

5:25:05conversation we very much again through that park plan as malory noted earlier which is a backbone

5:25:12for this prmp document will be something that we pick up for those park needs and through the

5:25:21chair to the counselor for the the indoor pool inventory from that perspective this would be

5:25:27one of our sort of longer term goals and really what when we look back at the needs assessment

5:25:32really what we're seeing is the growth in swimming in general sort of the leisure based swimming

5:25:38and appreciating that south end is still yet to come online so that's obviously going to bring

5:25:43us into like a really healthy provisioning state but if we if we forecast out population growth

5:25:49pools above all other sort of recreational amenities is is going to kind of come out of that

5:25:55that healthy state quicker than others so I think what we're talking about is once south ends online

5:26:00and we've seen what the trends in data like is that is that growth consistent like I think that's

5:26:06the thing is as we look one of the things I think this plan does really well is suggest that we

5:26:10need to continue monitoring these these trends because they are changing so much especially along

5:26:14with population growth in 10 years do we need to look at a feasibility study for another

5:26:20municipal indoor pool or are we still in a healthy supply at that particular point in time but

5:26:25as we look at this sort of forecasting and the trends now the need for pools seems to be growing

5:26:30at a much faster rate than other sort of larger recreation infrastructure thank you and if I might

5:26:34offer I know in conversations with community members townhouse pools apartment pools seem to be

5:26:39being filled in I don't know if that's data that's captured through planning but that might

5:26:44also be beneficial as part of the data data point thank you okay thank you so I now have

5:26:54Councillor Richardson Mayor Guthrie and Councillor Chew okay so we have Councillor

5:27:01thank you through your chair downer to staff my question is around community gardens we all

5:27:07know the benefit of community gardens for food security but also for community engagements

5:27:11and opportunity for socialization and I'm hearing that a number of our maybe smaller parks

5:27:17and neighborhoods that would really like to do a community garden but one of the deterrents is

5:27:21that they don't have access to water so I'm wondering if that's something that's built in or if there's

5:27:25an opportunity to request a refillable water tank or something so that they could participate in that

5:27:32thank you for the question so through the chair to the Councillor yes our community garden program

5:27:39is very popular and I understand that there are wait lists to be able to participate in a community

5:27:44garden so we very much understand the need there so we have a couple of recommendations in the

5:27:49parks and rec master plan that we think will alleviate some of the pressure there on that

5:27:53community gardens are facing so one being during the design process for individual parks assess the

5:28:00man and available space for community gardens so right off the bat when we're when we're designing

5:28:05new parks it's much easier to implement the infrastructure that's needed at the beginning

5:28:11versus in an older park where we don't necessarily know where all the services are the other

5:28:18recommendation is to survey and put into GIS where all the underground infrastructure is in parks

5:28:25we have data we have as built drawings we have some infrastructure mapping in our GIS system but

5:28:34we know that that there is a gap there from what we are aware of in some of the older parks that

5:28:38have been through three four five redesigns at this point in time so our community garden group

5:28:47was very much supportive of making sure we understand where we have water in parks or close by two

5:28:53parks so that we can start strategically locating those community gardens in a in a more efficient way

5:29:00great thank you okay thank you councillor Chew

5:29:07thank you through you madam chair first of all this is a very excellent plan so

5:29:12thank you for all your hard work i do have a question on the classification of the park spaces and

5:29:18i understand you you kind of rifted off of the official plan and their current classification

5:29:25but i was just wondering if there may be opportunity to further disseminate the different types of

5:29:31open spaces and i think there's you definitely acknowledge uh pop spaces and uh co-location

5:29:38just as a i guess a vocabulary mechanism when engaging with developers and different stakeholders

5:29:45so i know there's like a bit of agility and opportunity to kind of work through a pre-con site

5:29:53plan to make the expectation clear but i was just wondering even in this plan because it is a storytelling

5:29:59piece as well if there are opportunities to further disseminate open spaces particularly for urban

5:30:05areas because these days we're talking more about intensification and i think the nature of intensification

5:30:11how needs in how do i how do i say this there needs to be a mental shift in how we

5:30:20have basic expectations up front especially when we're communicating with our

5:30:26business proponents i think just from my experience if you make the the communication clear up and

5:30:31up front not only will that help inform the official plan update in the in the future but also

5:30:38uh it could help set public expectations very up front so when we do have stakeholders come in

5:30:44and delegations come in uh there's a policy piece that we can attribute just right up front so i was

5:30:51just wondering if you've maybe looked at different municipalities and uh if this is something that

5:30:56you guys are thinking about and it's something you can take away as well so yeah thank you

5:31:02yeah thank you sure so through the chair to the councillor um agreed that parks are changing

5:31:10there's a number of factors for that the city's becoming more intense in some of the already

5:31:15developed areas where there isn't a lot of land availability to get parks so the parks in those

5:31:20areas there's still a need for parks in those areas we're getting more more people that need to still

5:31:24recreate um so what are those parks going to look like in the future they could be a pops for example

5:31:31as you mentioned um an urban square versus you know a large a vast community park we need a range

5:31:38of parks and and it's going to be important to um have everything from our urban squares or

5:31:44neighborhood parks community parks and regional parks in the city um and very much through the

5:31:49development application process we are we're communicating with the um development community

5:31:55what is needed in our park so we're taking more of approach now um to do a facility fit so what are

5:32:03the actual recreational components that are needed in this particular area that you're developing

5:32:09and how are you going to fit that into a park and we're willing to kind of look at that creatively

5:32:13versus just a simple give us a piece of land and we'll figure out what to do with it later

5:32:19yeah just a quick follow-up I appreciate that comment and I appreciate as well that you mentioned

5:32:24you know working collaboratively uh when you're doing a facility fit for example I think

5:32:29if you make the expectation clear upfront uh even though this isn't necessarily non-binding

5:32:35it just makes the conversation go a lot smoother especially to our folks from the outside that

5:32:40aren't very aware with the culture the development culture here in Guelph that way you can bring

5:32:45in new stakeholders as well that are more willing to work collaboratively uh and share the same set

5:32:51of principles that we do here at the city of Guelph um yeah I think this is just more of a messaging

5:32:56on there's an opportunity to set very clear basic expectations and really shift the way in which we

5:33:02think about how we go about open space because I think times now require us to be more creative and

5:33:10yeah like I appreciate this uh this is a great start that you guys have put forward so thank you so

5:33:15much thank you councillor classon yes thank you through you chair downer to staff um I thank you

5:33:25for the the plan it's great I have some comments about it too but I have one question which is

5:33:30kind of similar to a question that I asked about the culture plan um so I appreciate that our parks

5:33:37and recreation plan is centered around uh city-owned municipally owned facilities when we do our needs

5:33:43assessment for the community do we look at um other other recreation assets within the city

5:33:50including schools the university uh non-profits and even for-profit businesses like gyms for example

5:33:58when we're kind of looking at the entire kind of mapping exercise of what's what's happening in the

5:34:05city so through the chair to the councillor we specifically noted in our needs assessment that

5:34:12we did not um look at privately owned types of recreation so the Guelph Grotto for example

5:34:19that was just out of scope for for this plan but in cases where we know that schools for example

5:34:26have facilities that are serving the community or the GRCA they were noted in those specific instances

5:34:34okay thank you are there any more questions

5:34:40councillor work oh and councillor Billings too sorry sorry chair downer I just thought of a

5:34:48new question because I was looking at what is there and I wasn't focused on what isn't there

5:34:53there's references periodically to dog parks um but there's nothing specified but there's a specific

5:35:00reference to skateboard park or other things right so one of the this is a hot hot debate

5:35:06when I was first on council in 2018 2019 so I'm just wondering at the time I think the city

5:35:11undertook to look at where we could potentially add a dog park is that still part of the parks

5:35:19planning but just not specifically included here so I'm just I'm trying to close the loop on the

5:35:24conversation from about three years ago is that still part of the conversation through the chair

5:35:31to council so the supply and operation of our dog parks remains an ongoing conversation

5:35:38with our parks planning team and our operational team based on those conversations

5:35:46conversations with the community we are right now not exploring additional

5:35:51fenced off leash dog parks and then we are continuing with the two that we have obviously

5:35:56there are some operational improvements that we can make that may make the experience better

5:36:01and our off leash areas on sports fields will remain as well there may be an expansion or

5:36:08contraction of a park here and there just based on specific site needs but largely will remain

5:36:14status quo for now with dog parks okay thanks thank you okay I have councillor Billings and

5:36:21councillor Katelyn and councillor Chew again go ahead sorry through you madam chair I just

5:36:31wanted to ask about part of the report identifies under bill 23 the lack of parkland dedication

5:36:40and cash and loo and so then it refers to I believe maybe in the next one to four year timeframe

5:36:49we'll get a report back but it would deal with the amount of hectares per population and

5:36:56size minimums of parkland so I was wondering is is staff thinking that we need to change our target

5:37:05in the official plan or keep the same target and just use these you call them options or

5:37:14tools in order to get to the 3.3 hectares per 1000 thank you for the question so through the

5:37:22chair to the councillor yes we will be doing a parkland acquisition strategy that would come back

5:37:29to council and that would describe the challenges that we are facing through bill 23 frankly

5:37:38sufficient parkland was a problem before bill 23 came in and it's just exacerbated now

5:37:44so yes we will be reporting back to to council on that okay and then also through you madam chair

5:37:51this was a report that came and I can't remember but I'll say a while ago and it was a comparison

5:37:56of other municipalities and in their official plan what their targets were we know ours was the 3.3

5:38:02what I can't remember though was golf coming in high for the number of hectares per per 1000

5:38:09people or were we sitting around the average so through the chair to the councillor I believe

5:38:19Guelph is actually doing quite well for what our targets are we're fairly close we do through the

5:38:26parks and rec master plan although we're not suggesting a change to our official plan targets

5:38:31now we are acknowledging that there could be better metrics to measure ourselves again so for

5:38:37example access to parkland could be a good metric for us to consider in the future for council to

5:38:43consider in the future so rather than the quantity of parkland perhaps we look at can you access a

5:38:49park within a reasonable walk from your home so that there is some language in the PRMP about that

5:38:56and we will and then we could count that then through you madam chair so then we could count

5:39:02that other land that you're referring to as part of our target like so for example

5:39:12there's a school built so we're going to use or we're going to maintain maybe a larger area

5:39:18so it's not our land it's not city land but do we get to count that in our target

5:39:26so through the chair to the councillor I don't believe there's any

5:39:30legislation that requires the city to inventory their land in one way or another it would be

5:39:36I think a direction from council to say yes we want you to count it one way versus another

5:39:42currently we only count the land that we own or facilities that are maintained by the city of

5:39:48Guelph so if we were to take on additional maintenance of other properties that could be a

5:39:56conversation that that we could have currently we only count the land that we own okay thank you

5:40:05okay thank you so councillor kaitlyn and then we have councillor chur again

5:40:13for you to park staff so first off I was just wondering I have a number of different comments

5:40:19on different objectives and I was wondering if I wanted an edit of something would that have to

5:40:25be a motion or is it something that you can discuss and take back and then come back at the

5:40:31end of the month and say hey we change this or how would that work through the chair to council and

5:40:40I'll look to our friends at clerks we can take comments back and if we need to add a just change

5:40:48we can explore that for council in in two or three weeks yes so I think if you've made your

5:40:55comments tonight councillor kaitlyn and then have maybe an offline discussion between now and then

5:41:02and then staff can come back with a memo about changes possible changes or possible not changes

5:41:08and then work with you to prepare any motions that you need for the end of the month does that

5:41:12sound reasonable pardon may I jump in madam chair the only the only thing I would add to that at

5:41:17mr math is quite right but I'll I'll go what dco clock bush said in that we've got a shortened

5:41:23window between tonight's meeting and the end of the meeting at the end of the month so it

5:41:27just be mindful to be fast acting on that if you're engaging with staff that would be my

5:41:31recommendation to council okay all right so do you have comments or questions i have questions

5:41:39okay go ahead so thank you through new chair to staff with objective 59

5:41:51um for healthy food options in the city recreation facilities uh I was wondering are we also looking

5:41:57at culturally diverse and allergy aware foods as a part of that category yeah thank you for the

5:42:06question and through the chair to the councillor I yes I think would be the short answer um we

5:42:12haven't investigated anything I think what we're we're seeing is uh public health playing a much

5:42:16larger role in in recreation facilities and creating healthy environments and seeing you know

5:42:22we're promoting come come have a healthy active lifestyle and then if a vending machine is

5:42:28selling unhealthy products like there's kind of a bit of mixed messaging so really what I think is

5:42:32let's start the conversation and engage the community about what they'd like to see work with

5:42:36some of our health partners on what that might look like and also work with some of our community

5:42:40members and equity deserving groups around um what what that could look like again going back to

5:42:45trying to to transform recreation centers into more sort of hubs for the community rather than

5:42:50specific activities um so I would say it's it's more of we're at we're at the start of the conversation

5:42:56rather than full intention at this point great thank you um and through the chair I was wondering

5:43:03about I know that you had mentioned a lot about trying to increase the amount of public washrooms

5:43:09in parks and the accessibility to them and having them be open all year round are we looking to do

5:43:15some more gender neutral options as well in the outdoor public spaces so through the chair to the

5:43:25councillor we have not um directly said that within the PRMP but certainly I believe that that would

5:43:31be a consideration through our our process great thank you so much um also so one of the the big

5:43:41things that I kind of noticed was in objective 33 so for rubber services I was a little bit

5:43:51surprised at the 2.5 kilometer recommendation in between rubber services and I think it's a

5:43:57matter of interpretation in the document what you see there I looked at the AAC meeting where that

5:44:03was approved and it seems like they're considering this a jumping off point based on that meeting

5:44:10um they seemed like 2.5 to start to make sure that we're bridging gaps within that amount

5:44:17but that didn't seem like what they wanted is the final amount based on what I saw in that meeting

5:44:24um and I was wondering uh if you could speak that a little bit and if there was the ability to have

5:44:30the chair of the ACB president at the meeting at the end of the month so that she can clarify

5:44:36their intent with that so through the chair to the councillor um I was I presenting at that AAC

5:44:46meeting that you're speaking about and we did clarify that the 2.5 meter service radius would

5:44:52apply as the city grows so throughout Claremont B and throughout GID and potentially Dolheim as well

5:44:58so what we noticed within the city boundary as it is we noticed two service gaps once we did that

5:45:06that mapping um but we would be applying this 2.5 kilometer service radius to the entire city as it

5:45:13grows so that means we will get additional rubber surface playgrounds if that's what you're asking

5:45:20yes so through the chair would that preclude anything less than 2.5 kilometers apart from

5:45:27happening because we've got a metric of 500 to 800 meters for people who are in neighborhoods who

5:45:34potentially are more able to get to different locations um so while I'm I can see it as like

5:45:42the starting point of a gap analysis I would imagine that a ratio of how many accessible

5:45:48versus non-accessible playgrounds would also be a part of deciding where more rubberized

5:45:54surfaces would go through the chair um councillor kate I'm not sure if we're entirely

5:46:07understanding the question if we can just ask for maybe a rephrase or some clarity yeah absolutely

5:46:14is are there going to be any other playgrounds put in because you've only got two in a 10-year plan

5:46:21and it expands when the city expands but there's still all of this space within the city where

5:46:27there's inaccessible playgrounds so is that a starting off point of 2.5 and we're sticking to

5:46:33that for 10 years and we're not going to build less than 2.5 away or is that just the first gap

5:46:39that we're filling in the first five years through the chair uh the councillor kate and that's the

5:46:44gap right now as the city grows as the city intensifies um that's a number and a metric that

5:46:50we will need to revisit um to make sure that we're providing um many other services but uh

5:46:56specifically your convert your question about um rubberized surfaces in in our playgrounds which

5:47:01are accessible um that would be something that we would explore with ACC um moving forward so again

5:47:08as our city intensifies um that would be a number that we would need to revisit but for right now

5:47:15that's the number that we are working towards okay um so through the chair the objective 77 the

5:47:27idea strategy so is that something that would result in more objectives but just specific to

5:47:34accessibility yeah thank you for the question uh through the chair to the councillor uh yes

5:47:46I would imagine that it would likely result in more recommendations I think what we've noticed

5:47:51through the whole process of both the needs assessment and the parks and recreation master plan is that

5:47:57we do have a lot of gaps in terms of our service and and how we're reaching equity

5:48:02deserving groups how are how we're building services how are ensuring that we're being

5:48:06culturally competent um in the delivery of those services so I think that this would be a strategy

5:48:11to help guide the department in ensuring that our services going forward over the next 10 years and

5:48:15beyond um are driven by equity diversity inclusion and accessibility thank you um and I had one last

5:48:27thing on uh objective 19 similar to councillor or work um I was just wondering why not install

5:48:34shade structures in all parks if possible but prioritize those with accessible services as

5:48:39your first targets so through the chair to the councillor um we are prioritizing some of the

5:48:48parks that receive um more visitors um so some of the specialized facilities like splash pads

5:48:55playgrounds with rubber surface they tend to attract um a lot more people than a typical

5:49:00neighborhood park so that's why you're seeing those called out specifically for um shade structures

5:49:07however having said that we we are also saying through the PRMP that the best long-term solution

5:49:14and economical solution for shade in parks is trees so we will with all of our parks consider

5:49:20shade in fact it was the number one most mentioned comment throughout all of our community

5:49:25engagement that we did is that people want shade in parks so that's not lost on us but we do recognize

5:49:31that uh it takes a while for trees to grow so where there's a need for immediate shade we're

5:49:36suggesting installing shade structures at these specialized facilities and then of course trees

5:49:42trees in in all of our park developments I am super glad to hear that and I just have sorry

5:49:47one final question um through the chair I was just wondering is it possible to expand the

5:49:54number of accessible play options um in the non-rubberized surface parks to more than one

5:50:02because some of the things that were mentioned in the list like accessible swings if they're not on

5:50:07an accessible surface become inaccessible right so it requires someone who could like

5:50:12actually physically get the person who needs that swing to that swing and then I know that

5:50:17sometimes we consider those little talk tubes as an accessible option in parks and if that's all

5:50:24like kid has is a talk tube on the corner like that's that doesn't count for me as an accessible

5:50:30option so I think um I would wondering if it's possible to bring it up to two that were specifically

5:50:39independently accessible on the side surfaces like you know there's those xylophone things even

5:50:45I wouldn't play with those but um anything else basically sure so through the chair of the counselor

5:50:55we typically do consult with the AAC on all of our playground projects so we will receive that

5:51:00that feedback what the AAC is looking for also community engagement through our typical processes

5:51:07where we will no doubt hear from people that face barriers so we are happy to kind of work at the

5:51:14programming for each park with the AAC and through community engagement so there's no way

5:51:20to like just up our minimum so that we again I think that we could be open to that but I think

5:51:29it would be a conversation with the AAC to make sure that our park our basic park programming

5:51:35is aligned with what the AAC is looking for and sorry if I just jump in for a moment

5:51:42thank you chair downer I just to maybe elevate us a little bit above some of the specifics which

5:51:47are all really good and I know our staff are going to take this away I think the other thing just

5:51:52to keep in mind this parks and rec master plan similar to the culture plan in the public art

5:51:57policy they're before you tonight to set the the lofty goals for the next five seven ten years in

5:52:04each case ultimately as our board of governors you ultimately set the pace of how fast we implement

5:52:11and that's the budget and that's to quote CAO steward who isn't able maybe he's listening

5:52:18you're that the budget is a gas pedal so to all of the things that councillor

5:52:22caten is mentioning I don't think that as staff you know if you want us to put that gas pedal

5:52:27to the floor and go faster and do things quicker we're here to do that on your behalf but that

5:52:33comes through the multi-year budget process as you look at what it costs to actually implement

5:52:38these things so I just kind of wanted to jump in and take that moment to say we'll take all of

5:52:42the very specifics away and we'll look at them but the actual pace and if you're looking at us

5:52:48speeding things up that you need to direct us to do during that multi-year budget process because

5:52:55that's the gas pedal for how fast we go and that's probably an overarching comment to all of the last

5:53:00three agenda items thanks and I totally agree with that and I'm glad that we have that ability to

5:53:09kind of prioritize I was just being specifically the standards and the processes that we have in

5:53:14place so if we set a goal saying you know two per accessible two accessible pieces per playground

5:53:22versus five playgrounds a year that's a different thing right this like setting

5:53:26accessibility standards versus targets of how many we can implement but thank you very much

5:53:35okay uh Councillor Chew and then I believe we will go to comments

5:53:42thank you Madam Chair just a quick question to

5:53:45rift off of my colleague Councillor Ork on uh dog parks I'm just wondering I really appreciate the

5:53:54section on community requests and just the the candidness up front just to help people understand

5:54:00that we have a process in place and this is and there are priorities that need to be met

5:54:07I'm just wondering uh I we get a lot of requests from folks that frequent with Linglend for example

5:54:15and some people like the fact that it's an awfully stock park some people don't some people would

5:54:21love a fence how do we prioritize that um within the framework that you guys are planning to develop

5:54:27within that five nine-year period um just like we talk about accessibility but is there a safety

5:54:34component that we can add as well as part of the um verbiage so for example we come here with you

5:54:43with a budget ask there's some kind of a justification that we can uh link through a paper trail if that

5:54:49makes sense so through the chair to council um as we look develop that process we we do need to

5:54:57keep them in mind that the process needs to work for the community needs to work with us not us

5:55:02for the process right so um as we work through that things like dog parks and requests for those new

5:55:09facilities we've obviously learned that there needs to be a robust process robust engagement for those

5:55:15things councillor busatel I would agree it should not take a decade to add electrical infrastructure

5:55:21to a park um but we're at this moment in time now but it does need some consideration right we've

5:55:27had requests in the past to put um in water infrastructure at silver creek park the public

5:55:32doesn't know nor should be expected to know that getting water to that asset is a significant

5:55:37challenge based on the infrastructure that's there but we do need to have that process so the

5:55:42community knows that we're evaluating their thoughts their thoughts are on the books they're

5:55:46they're formalized they're going to outlive staff sometimes that are here and when we can get to

5:55:51yes we can but when we can't get to yes it's done timely um and an informed way so long story to say

5:55:58that that process needs to take into a lot of factors but one of those factors being time and

5:56:04making sure that we're being responsive okay uh last one councillor guffrey and if anybody has

5:56:11more questions i'd ask you to take the time between now and the end of the month to do those

5:56:15and we'll go to comments after this one more question councillor gov mayor Guthrie sorry it's

5:56:21okay i i found my i found my old card that says councillor Guthrie so you're not you're not wrong

5:56:28you're not wrong i just emoted you i hey i i i'm just not going to say anything back to that um

5:56:37uh through you uh madam chair uh i i just want to i want a response to what was just stated there

5:56:46from a perspective of the question being what type of filters are you going to be using as you move

5:56:52forward through this plan to make sure that things like plugs aren't missed if they're necessary

5:57:00or like when we build a silver creek um sorry um yeah was it silver creek the skateboard park

5:57:07okay like look let's just be let's just be a friend we should we should have probably had a

5:57:12we should probably had water there like we really we should have had water available to that park

5:57:18right um we should have had shade built into that park but it's it's in fact i remember um one of

5:57:28the first complaints that i got after the skateboard park opened up was all the parents had nowhere to

5:57:34sit so it feels like when we do these buildings of these assets it's like we're missing this filter

5:57:43of like the things that that should also be included as we build these things out like electrical like

5:57:52water fountain like benches like shades so how can we have um how can we have some certainty

5:58:00that this plan is going to have those filters in place so you know we get less complaints number

5:58:07one but that it's done once and it's done right and it's done probably the most economical way

5:58:15possible then to try to go back and retrofit things that the community would have wanted from the

5:58:20from the get go anyways through the chair to council a few things um i think one of the bigger

5:58:27ones is community engagement so we have some examples that do work and our playgrounds there's

5:58:33of course some accessibility things to work through but we engage um in that program with

5:58:39neighborhoods and communities as we all know recently as today um very very regularly and of the

5:58:47of the 20 or so um upgraded in the last few years we receive very little um negative feedback or

5:58:56would have could have should have type feedback because we have engaged the community and we

5:59:02listen um maybe in the past for you know process reasons budget reasons um we don't know in the

5:59:09moment we haven't taken the opportunity to listen to the community engage in the community on what

5:59:14they want to see the bike skills facility is an example of um we haven't built one of those

5:59:20at the city of quels before we have great staff competent staff they're going to lead that project

5:59:25but we have and we'll continue to engage the community as to what they want to see with that

5:59:29facility so that we do so that we do get it right we also need to look at things like our formal

5:59:36processes like our asset management plan to make sure that we're replacing infrastructure

5:59:41in a timely manner as well so that doesn't become too outdated that we're trying to um you know put

5:59:48a band-aid uh where a cast is needed and not meet any community expectation so good process good

5:59:55design and community feedback along the way input and that's being true to that and listening to that

6:00:01and engaging that which we do I think will be a way to avoid um those circumstances yeah thank you

6:00:08Madam Chair I appreciate what you just said there about um I would I would echo that you know

6:00:14recently I think that engagement and stuff that processes have been a lot better um so my last

6:00:20question is the engagement up front is obviously important when you're answering in regards to the

6:00:25kind of examples I gave uh to move forward on but are we going to make sure that there's also

6:00:32coordination with other departments in the city so that when you know something is being ripped up

6:00:39because of an infrastructure issue you know that's the time to go oh you're you're ripping up that

6:00:44area because you're you're doing something we could from a parks perspective we can add a pipe

6:00:50to that and we can get a water fountain in there like so is there are we going to make sure there's

6:00:55integration between all the departments and it's not an afterthought that oh I wish I had known that

6:01:01I could have done this in the parks how is that integration going to be confirmed

6:01:07sure so I can start so through the chair to the mayor um we we there is a recommendation in the

6:01:13PRMP to to coordinate projects with each other um timing wise um also efficiency um from a

6:01:23uh a financial perspective um where we can um integrate dc funded projects with tax funded

6:01:30projects we mobilize once um and we don't you know we save some some funds there and hopefully

6:01:36use pressure on the tax base so there is a recommendation in there in in the parks and rec master plan

6:01:41great through the chair if I may add um that expectation prior um to this recommendation the

6:01:47plan uh for that interdepartmental collaboration has been made crystal clear from the executive

6:01:53team and for public services specifically um dc al uh clock wash great thank you madam chair

6:02:02okay we're going to go to comments now counselor to counselor our work

6:02:08counselor gibson counselor karan counselor to yeah through you madam chair just a quick question

6:02:21if I may not no no just comments I'm going to cut off the questions now okay but I would encourage

6:02:28you between now and the end of the month to call up staff and I said before we're cutting up we've

6:02:33gone around in circles like quite a few times okay yeah no that's okay but if you'd like have a comment

6:02:38that's great yeah sure I'll phrase my question into a comment great that could be taken away if

6:02:43that's okay yes I don't I don't need a response from them okay great I think just to go off of mayor

6:02:50guthrie's comments on uh expectations and prioritization and just making it clear if there's

6:02:57a way in which we can make that asset management process uh which is and just develop it in a way

6:03:04that's accessible front facing maybe through story maps or something just to show like our citizens

6:03:11what parks are being prioritized and if there's like a technical piece that isn't that that can be

6:03:16more transparent uh and non-confidential if that can be uh included as like a takeaway I think that

6:03:23would be fantastic so we can just point people to hey this is the park that is that needs fixing and

6:03:29this is these are the reasons why I think a lot of people are very rational and very understanding

6:03:34so we just set it the expectation clear it even makes a conf eliminates a lot of the confusion

6:03:40amongst us as counselors who are going to be tabling things on behalf of our constituents

6:03:46during budget time so that's my comment great thank you and feel free to call follow up with them

6:03:55council work thank you chair downer so as happens with every master plan right we dig deep into the

6:04:01what about this particular line and the timing on that and the budget for this but I want to say

6:04:07then in the last five years in this city there's been massive progress on trails with the trails

6:04:13master plan on the south end rec center that is coming soon for real this time that's going to

6:04:20change recreation for everybody across the city because it's going to really increase the supply

6:04:27and the availability of recreation um you know and and also this parks and rec master plan that we've

6:04:33been waiting for for quite some time so I want to say thank you and acknowledge the massive

6:04:38policy and also infrastructure and programming progress that we've seen in the city in the

6:04:45last five years I appreciate that and I appreciate all the little details that are in here so from

6:04:50the big policy the big capital programs uh the big plans all the way down to the micro grants so the

6:04:58folks at rickson ridge neighborhood group can finally get a bulletin board I just really appreciate

6:05:04and thank you for your work great ditto thank you councillor gibson thank you through you chair

6:05:12downer um so acknowledge this represents a lot of work staff so thank you very much for the the

6:05:18work that's gone into it thank you very much for making yourself available um to questions from

6:05:23councillors I would encourage all councillors to to utilize that opportunity to get some of these

6:05:28questions answered um I really enjoyed the the piece in the document about the changing demographics

6:05:33of our city and how um migration into the city is really driving population growth um that's going

6:05:39to be that's that's acknowledged and and how those demographics are changing but while at the same time

6:05:45enrollment in our in our programs is still increasing so um to that point I thought the

6:05:51the knot to the senior strategy was important uh the youth strategy was important as well as um even

6:05:58some of the smaller pieces like an elite like the elite sports and trying to encourage their um

6:06:03participation involvement in the city sport tourism was acknowledged uh all this is you really

6:06:08did cover a really strong breadth of the of the task in this document and it's um it doesn't go

6:06:16without noticing um I was looking for things that weren't mentioned because everything seemed to be

6:06:21mentioned so uh good job to staff I think you were listening I think you did a really great job to

6:06:27this point um similarly to what's been mentioned uh the the priorities and the tasks like there was

6:06:34some really tangible items in here that um even the drainage on uh the gulf lakes road up into the

6:06:40gulf lake uh soccer fields like those are some really small minutia tasks that are getting

6:06:45accomplished through this that I know are important to people so um again a really good document um

6:06:51nothing but kudos for me and uh no more questions so thanks very much great thank you council karon

6:07:02all of my colleagues have expressed what I'm feeling I wanted to add on to that parks as

6:07:07placemaking uh when I think of what we've discussed here this evening public art and culture uh

6:07:13parks are much more than just playground equipment places to play they're more than places to read a

6:07:19book they're more than places to uh for groundwater recharge they are more than places to have a

6:07:25picnic they are landmarks they are where memories are made think of us all back to our childhood

6:07:31where do we have you know where do we what do we say to our friends we'll meet at the park um so

6:07:35access to park um being able to walk to a park uh for kids uh of young ages being able to get to a

6:07:42park to play with their friends um that is where memories are made so I really feel like this is

6:07:46legacy work we're doing here moving our parks uh forward uh and making sure that all of our new

6:07:54areas and uh and older areas of town um have parks that are um are fully functional in every way

6:08:01and accessible to all okay thank you uh councillor altman and councillor Keith thank you very much

6:08:12chair downer I do want to thank staff and I do agree with the council caron that this is legacy

6:08:17work particularly I'd like to thank mr mathews because you reminded me of something that I

6:08:23think is very important in this and that is the need to uh replace in a timely matter and

6:08:30upgrade as appropriate standards we need to recognize uh do change and we must be on top

6:08:37of the current new standards and and the expectations of the public and respond appropriately and I

6:08:42think I've heard that we're doing this I want to commend councillor Caton's remarks and advocacy

6:08:46for accessibility um it's uh something that is more than commendable it speaks to the need to adapt

6:08:52to the standards and changes as we address issues of of the public having greater and different

6:08:59expectations I think for example that trails were virtually non-existent 20 years ago we didn't hear

6:09:05frisbee golf and riverside park in fact riverside park was where people learned how to swim when I

6:09:11was a kid I wouldn't suggest anybody swim in there today splash pads have replaced waiting pools

6:09:18which were installed originally by community groups like kinsman and they're replacing them

6:09:22because they are in many respects the sensible hygienic way to go sands replace more expensive

6:09:28surfaces because they have to and we have to pay for it and recognize that this is the responsibility

6:09:33of council to to adapt to the new fiscal financial realities and so with this I think what we're doing

6:09:39is we are just scratching the surface and we will need to continue adapting and that's what this is

6:09:44all about so today it's pickleball maybe tomorrow it's bocce or laser tag or something else we're

6:09:51going to see in the parks but we're never going to know we're always going to be playing catch up on

6:09:55these things and thanks staff for doing the best thank you uh council kate thank you through you

6:10:04chair um I really love this document I I feel like I don't really sound critical but that's just

6:10:12because I really want us to be the best um it's really hard when you do comparators to communities

6:10:19for things like accessibility because it's kind of abysmal in a lot of places so in order to to

6:10:27find a comparator you're looking through standards that are based on low provincial standards that

6:10:35have not been updated in terms of the aod a for like you know our words of six years so we're always

6:10:42going to seem like we're doing more if we're doing a really good job with equity and I really applaud

6:10:49all of the work that has gone into this we've got amazing core values objective 16 through 18 are

6:10:54fire all of 63 to 72 are great we've got sensory rooms hardly anywhere has that we've done such a

6:11:02good job and I know that we can do even better thank you are there any more comments on this

6:11:12and I have to say ditto to all the comments we just heard yeah I think that was a lot of work

6:11:19and I'd like to thank my colleagues here for the lots of great questions and a lot of discussions on

6:11:26all three of these master plans today actually it was been a good day for us so but no further

6:11:34ado is there anyone opposed seeing none that passes so three we got done tonight so that's a major

6:11:46work having been done in public services and kudos to staff for bringing this forward and we just

6:11:53got the end of the month to get through and then you can get on with implementing it right yeah

6:11:59so is there anything else from council like there were any additional motions I don't think there

6:12:04who are I think any no it councillor caron you you had your discussions with staff about what

6:12:10some things okay I think I think she's I saw her nodding her head the prince up in front of

6:12:18sorry I didn't realize you're asking question things I'm going to take offline with staff and

6:12:22assurance and stuff on things that are moving okay great thanks okay so I think we're I don't

6:12:29believe there's any surface service area chair or in staff announcements so I'd be looking for a

6:12:39motion to adjourn I think councillor classon seconded by councillor bruce a tail

6:12:48if anybody opposed great thanks and I think just to our media here I think deputy CEO

6:12:58clack is going to talk to you about the bell great