Final Design for St. George’s Square, as outlined in report 2025-548, dated December 16, 2025, be approved.

1:33:25so we're going to have some staff do some presentations for us. We've got three delegations

1:33:29as well that have signed up and we'll see what we do from there. So we got Kyle and Stacey from

1:33:44our staff that I think are going to come forward and I'll turn it over to you. Good morning, Mr. Mayor

1:34:05and Council. After significant community engagement, we are excited to present the final plan for St.

1:34:11George's Square for approval. My name is Kyle Gibson. I am the acting general manager of Engineering

1:34:18and Transportation Services. Attending with me today are James Goodrum, Stacey Lachlan, Andrew Miller

1:34:25and Red Russford. The reimagining of St. George's Square as part of the downtown renewal program

1:34:32of work aligns with strategic goal 12 make downtown a vibrant place for everyone. The approval of the

1:34:39final plan for St. George's Square means that another milestone in the overall downtown renewal

1:34:45program of work has been reached. The reconstruction of St. George's Square will be part of phase one

1:34:51of the work which will include Wyndham Street from Wellington Street all the way up to Woolwich Street.

1:34:58Based on the proposed construction sequence, surface works in St. George's Square

1:35:02will be completed at the end of phase one in late 2027 with the final touches or as Reg likes to say,

1:35:09the icing on the cake happening in early 2028. Downtown renewal, the reimagining of St. George's

1:35:18Square and the upgraded streetscape will provide the foundation for community success over generations.

1:35:31I think I pressed the wrong one. In July, Council approved this design concept for the square.

1:35:54This concept was inspired by Guelph's unique landscape and designed as a vibrant year-round

1:35:59destination at the heart of the community. It proposed a durable flexible layout with paved areas,

1:36:06adaptable seating and open spaces that could easily transform for festivals, markets,

1:36:12performances and gatherings. It was designed to be an active hub for connection, play and celebration,

1:36:20inviting people of all ages to come together and experience our downtown. At the July meeting,

1:36:26Council provided direction that the final design of St. George's Square should increase flexibility

1:36:31to support seasonal patios and community events. Council also requested that the final design

1:36:38reflect the heritage and character of downtown through the integration of natural materials

1:36:43and heritage inspired elements. In September of 2024, Council also provided direction that the

1:36:50downtown infrastructure renewal program of work, including St. George's Square, should provide

1:36:55an enhanced level of streetscaping for the most efficient operating budget. The Downtown Business

1:37:02Association also passed motions regarding the design concept. In September of 2025, the DGBA

1:37:09requested the concept plan for St. George's Square be modified to ensure that design reflects

1:37:15and enhances Guelph's unique heritage character while supporting a vibrant downtown for public

1:37:21space. To incorporate the placemaking initiative proposed by Barb Manette related to Robert Munch's

1:37:31Paper Bag Princess and to find more discreet location for the public washrooms. I'm now going

1:37:37to pass a presentation over to Stacey so that she can outline the changes to the plan and how those

1:37:42changes address what we have heard from Council, the DGBA and our community. Thank you, Kyle.

1:37:57So during engagement with the community, key interest holders and Council, we heard that the

1:38:02concept plan should include a wow factor. It should also have more natural materials, including

1:38:08more trees and native plantings and less concrete. The design should also be more flexible in order

1:38:13to provide space for events and to accommodate business. We also received comments that the

1:38:19design should be more sympathetic to the heritage character of downtown Guelph. We received mixed

1:38:24feedback regarding the public washroom, some in support of it, others were requesting that it be

1:38:29removed and still others requesting that it be relocated elsewhere downtown. We also received

1:38:35mixed feedback regarding the placemaking structure or the area for play. The feedback ranged from

1:38:41support and desire to see it expanded to those who think it was unnecessary to those who were

1:38:46suggesting it be relocated within the square. And then during our September open house, a community

1:38:52led idea for a tribute to Robert Munch in the form of a paper bag princess statue was brought

1:38:58forward for consideration in lieu of the potential interactive placemaking structures that were

1:39:03proposed. Some of the public feedback also requested reconsideration of the need for gateway features

1:39:11at the entrances to the square. And there were also requests for space for outdoor patios to be

1:39:17located and businesses to operate, additional lighting and more opportunities for shade and seating.

1:39:28So the final plan that we are presenting to you today directly responds to what we heard from

1:39:34the community, key interest holders including the DGBA and council over 2024 and 2025. In particular,

1:39:42the final plan addresses what we heard in response to the concept design that was presented to council

1:39:47in July and the more detailed plan presented to the public in September. This final plan balances

1:39:54the needs and desires of the business community with the needs and desires of residents, visitors,

1:39:59and downtown customers. It recognizes the existing heritage character of downtown. It also reflects

1:40:05our community and that we value the environment and nature. And we would also like to highlight that

1:40:11this plan is flexible to accommodate day-to-day use as well as being able to accommodate larger

1:40:17events and evolve over time. Elements that are not currently proposed or included in the design

1:40:23can be added to it. So this fly-through you can see in the northwest corner of the square that

1:40:31there is an open area for the future place making initiative. Trees and planters and soil cells to

1:40:36provide a balance between a natural setting and an open area to accommodate events. The trees also

1:40:42provide shade along with the movable umbrellas. In the southwest corner there's a flat area that

1:40:48can accommodate a temporary stage for different events. The trees and umbrellas provide shade

1:40:53for everyday use and the existing transit stops are also maintained on both sides of Windham

1:40:57Windham Street. On the easterly side of Windham Street the family fountain is located so that

1:41:03is highly visible both within the square but also to those traveling toward the square.

1:41:09Wide stairs are proposed that provide informal seating opportunities as well as a natural stage

1:41:14area if needed. The DGBA's Big Heart is accommodated and frames the view along Douglas Street

1:41:20towards St. George's Anglican Church. So again this video is just looping so this is the second

1:41:26time through and you're seeing the southwest corner here and then over to the easterly side

1:41:35of Windham Street. So to help identify and define the square and to add that wow factor we have added

1:41:58emphasis to the promenade that surrounds it. The width of the promenade has been increased and will

1:42:04be a minimum of six meters wide and maybe up to eight meters wide in some areas. The promenade

1:42:09will include overhead lighting supported by a wood structure that complements the heritage

1:42:13character of downtown Guelph and Guelph's natural heritage. The promenade will accommodate private

1:42:18patios or public seating as well as a pedestrian sidewalk that is intended to help drop pedestrians

1:42:24to the edges of the square to access the businesses that surround it. By defining the edge of the

1:42:29square ample flexible space is maintained for events as well as day to day use. In these images

1:42:35you can see the promenade lighting at night in the top left corner how the promenade can

1:42:40accommodate private patios in the top in the bottom right corner and then how the promenade

1:42:47still allows for the central portion of each quadrant to be used for events when needed.

1:42:56To increase flexibility the planters have been reduced in size and shifted toward the edge

1:43:01areas of each quadrant of the square. This revision allows for different configurations of the square

1:43:07to be used to accommodate events of different sizes including each quadrant to be used individually.

1:43:13The westerly side of Wyndham street to be used as an event space if you close down a portion of

1:43:17Quebec or using the square in its entirety with the option to close down the streets using the

1:43:22proposed removable ballards. As I mentioned during the fly-through a stage area is located in the

1:43:29southwest corner of the square near the current location of RBC. This stage area will be a flat

1:43:36space that it can accommodate temporary stages of different sizes with each event bringing in the

1:43:41size of stage that best fits their event. For day to day use or events that do not require a stage

1:43:47this is a flexible flat area. On the easterly side of Wyndham street the family fountain has been

1:43:54shifted further toward old Quebec street shops to create more flexible space between the fountain

1:43:59and Wyndham street. The lower basin of the fountain will be reduced in size by approximately 1.2 meters

1:44:07while generally maintaining the existing shape. The location shift and reduction in size also

1:44:12creates the opportunity for the area at the top of the stairs to be used as a natural stage

1:44:17with room for an audience at the bottom of the stairs. And in these images you can see how we've

1:44:23also tried to show how events such as Spirit of the Season can be accommodated in the revised

1:44:28design that's in the sort of right-hand side bottom picture. To introduce more natural materials

1:44:39and better reflect the heritage character of downtown we've added more trees and modified

1:44:43materials. Trees in soil cells and planters have been grouped to replicate the edge of a small

1:44:50forest in each quadrant of the square. This helps to provide a more natural feeling in the area

1:44:54and reduce the impact of the proposed hardscaping all while maintaining flexibility.

1:44:59The addition of more trees also increases the amount of shade that will be provided.

1:45:04Again the lighting structure that's part of the promenade has been designed as a wood structure

1:45:11and has an organic shape which is to be reflective of sort of that natural materials and the heritage

1:45:16character of Guelph. With the introduction of the lighting structure and the additional trees

1:45:23we have proposed to remove the shade structures because it created conflicts between the elements

1:45:28but if the shade structures are required in the future they will be designed to fit into the space

1:45:34constructed of wood and similar to the lighting structure. For the planters we're looking at

1:45:40the use of limestone or something that is a limestone appearance. The design of the planters has

1:45:46also been modified to no longer have any ramped edges which then allows for more public seating

1:45:51as part of the planters. As I briefly mentioned earlier the public feedback regarding the

1:46:01placemaking structure was mixed. Some community members expressed enthusiasm for family and child

1:46:06friendly elements within the square. Others expressed concern about creating an area for play within the

1:46:11downtown and then again that community led idea for a paper bag princess statue did come forward

1:46:18in September. So with the mixed feedback on the interactive placemaking structure as well as the

1:46:25new idea the revised plan for St. George's Square protects space for one or both of these elements

1:46:31to be installed in the future. The protected space is located in the northwest corner of the square

1:46:36to be more directly linked with the new public library and that's to help support people moving

1:46:42between the two areas. The community led paper bag princess suggestion is currently proceeding

1:46:49through the approved proposal process identified in the city's public art process. So we've set up

1:46:54our plan to be able to accommodate that should that public art process decide to to put it in the

1:46:59square. So additional lighting has been added to the design. A catenary lighting structure has been

1:47:17added to the promenade which adds a significant amount of lighting. The lights themselves will

1:47:21have a more traditional appearance while being appropriately shielded to direct light downwards.

1:47:27And again as I've mentioned a couple times we've looked at the design of that structure

1:47:32made sure it's built out or proposed to be built out of wood and that it has a more of an organic

1:47:37shape to reflect Guelph's natural heritage. So the top left image on the slide shows that

1:47:43lighting structure at night. Area lights which can be seen in the top right image are proposed

1:47:51all around the square and these are additional lighting on taller poles to ensure that we have

1:47:56appropriate lighting levels throughout the square. These lights will be the same as those that are

1:48:02proposed for the Baker district. The shape of these lights is somewhat organic and whimsical

1:48:07informed to play nicely with the design of the promenade lighting structure and the shape of

1:48:12the planters and the natural elements within the square. The lights can also accommodate

1:48:16specialized lights that can project shapes or images as part of enhancing the placemaking

1:48:22aspect of the lighting. In the bottom two images you can see clusters of light sticks have also

1:48:28been introduced into the square and they provide visual interest and add some dynamic lighting

1:48:34and the size and color of these light sticks will vary. We have been and continue to explore adding

1:48:40more string lights to connect to the catenary lighting structure and other elements within the

1:48:45square. In order to connect string lights to things they have to be able to withstand the weight of

1:48:51the cable and the lights both in normal conditions but also on windy days and during winter weather

1:48:57that include ice and snow. So those requirements have created some technical challenges but we

1:49:02will be adding more if it's technically feasible. And then planter lighting which you can see in

1:49:08the top left image and then around the base of the family fountain you can see in the bottom

1:49:13right image. We've added lighting to those elements to again add lighting to the square and visual

1:49:20interest. For all of the lighting within the square the fixtures used will be dark sky friendly to

1:49:25ensure that light shines down towards the square rather than up to the sky. So other modifications

1:49:34to mention in the July design concept there was a self-cleaning automated public washroom proposed

1:49:40as council is aware from the October 31st information report. Staff undertook some additional

1:49:46consultation with other municipalities that have experienced operating self-cleaning public washrooms.

1:49:52The feedback we received highlighted that there are both benefits as well as operational

1:49:56supplier and maintenance challenge with those facilities facilities right now. This feedback

1:50:03together with the mixed feedback we received from the public on the proposed washroom within the

1:50:07square has resulted in it being removed from the plant at this time. Well we still feel it's important

1:50:14to pursue a public washroom within or close to St. George's Square. So we are going to install the

1:50:21underground infrastructure to accommodate it in the future but we are also going to continue to

1:50:26explore other options. It could be a more traditional washroom either a standalone one or in a store

1:50:32front or we'll continue to monitor the technology that supports the automated public washrooms

1:50:38to be in a position to install it in the future. So in these images on the easterly side of

1:50:44Wyndham Street you can see that the public washroom has been removed. I also briefly mentioned that

1:50:50the gateway features have been removed and again that was due to sort of the conflict between the

1:50:56elements when we added the added the promenade lighting structure and the additional trees.

1:51:00It created too many sort of vertical elements in one location and created those conflicts

1:51:05in the similar situation for the shade structures. So as Kyle mentioned at the beginning of this

1:51:14presentation there has been extensive internal and external consultation on the design of the square.

1:51:21In 2024 we focused on collecting ideas and opportunities about the square. In early 2025

1:51:27the project team worked through various design options and evolved that design from multiple

1:51:32options to a design concept which was presented to council in July. Since July we have received

1:51:38valuable feedback which has led to the design evolving into the final plan before you today.

1:51:44As council is aware one of the key interested parties in downtown is the DGBA. In late November

1:51:51the DGBA reviewed the final plan and passed a motion recognizing that the final plan addresses

1:51:56the board's previous motions and concerns and the board also passed a motion supporting the final plan.

1:52:03In addition to engaging with members of the Guelph community the project team has met and

1:52:08shared information with the Mississaugas of the Credit First Nation about the downtown infrastructure

1:52:12renewal program and specifically about the proposed design for St. George's Square.

1:52:18Following council approval of the concept in July MCFN provided some ideas into how the indigenous

1:52:24history of the lands could be recognized and honored in the final design. These ideas include

1:52:30the utilization of the planters and the plants within them as a method of teaching the First

1:52:35Nation stories and the value of green space. Another suggestion was to use text or symbols

1:52:41within the promenade area to recognize that St. George's Square is a long travel path as well

1:52:46as being a destination. So as we finalize the technical details of the design discussions with

1:52:52MCFN will continue. So the changes to the plan between the concept that you saw in July and the

1:53:05final plan results in changes to the cost to construct the square. Some of the changes reduce

1:53:11the cost some of the changes increase the cost and technical details related to the final plan

1:53:17as well as how the family fountain will function when it's reinstalled are still being developed

1:53:22and refined. However given the nature of the changes both increases and decreases we don't

1:53:28anticipate a substantial change to the project budget to accommodate the final plan. So as directed

1:53:34by council in July if there are any budget impacts stemming from the final plan staff will report

1:53:40back through the 2026 budget monitoring process or the 2027 budget update. So in conclusion we are

1:53:48recommending that council approve the final plan that is being presented today recognizing that as

1:53:54the technical details of the design are worked out minor details may be slightly modified. However

1:53:59the overall final plan of the square will remain. This final plan addresses what we heard from various

1:54:05interested interest folders and groups again over 2024 and 2025. In particular it addresses what we

1:54:12heard in response to the concept design presented to council in July and the more detailed plan

1:54:17presented to the public in September. So again we feel that the the final plan balances the needs

1:54:24and desires of the business community with the needs and desires of residents visitors and

1:54:28downtown customers. It recognizes and honors the existing heritage character of downtown.

1:54:34It reflects our community and in that we value the environment and nature and it can and will

1:54:39evolve over time. Elements such as gateway features and public art can be added to it.

1:54:44So the reimagined St. George's Square will be an active urban plaza and central gathering place

1:54:50that provides flexibility to accommodate a wide range of events and activities including daily

1:54:55use and self-activation as well as larger events and festivals. Thanks. Thank you both very much.

1:55:05And to the team that worked on this too. I mean it was a lot of work and engagement

1:55:12and a lot of refinement and you know just right off the top I just want to say thank you for

1:55:21listening to the community and what you've presented here today. You know this I get so upset

1:55:28sometimes when I hear people say oh staff never listen. Exhibit A you know right here you did that

1:55:37and so thank you very much for for presenting that to us. We do have as I mentioned off the top

1:55:45three delegations so why don't we go to the three delegations then if there's questions back to staff

1:55:50as well we can go. Uh Sia I think my glasses on. Sia here oh there's Sia. Sia Vanguiste is coming up

1:56:04and then is Alex Purves here in the room. Okay you're going to be coming up next. So just so

1:56:10everyone knows no more than five minutes you'll hear a chime at the four minutes and 30 second

1:56:16mark which is your warning that your microphone will be cut off at five minutes so don't get there

1:56:22because we want to hear everything you're saying. All right so go right ahead the time timer starts

1:56:26when when you start Sia go right ahead. Thank you Mayor Garcia and thank you Council and thank you

1:56:35the staff at City that park is so impressive that's going to be an absolutely amazing drawing card.

1:56:42I'm here to address the amendment to include paperback princes and Robert Munch. Now we all

1:56:50know a lot of the statistics about Robert but behind that data those that want us to reflect a

1:56:55little bit what the implications are. For instance the whole idea that uh uh there are over 87 million

1:57:05million uh Robert Munch books uh Worldwide Soul has already been sold. Think of the implications

1:57:12of that that means all over this globe so when my husband and I were traveling in Japan we

1:57:18imagine our delight that here in the show window was the paperback princesses in Japanese or being

1:57:25in the Netherlands and seeing the enormous suitcase there. So everybody around the globe knows Robert

1:57:32Munch and just to reflect a little bit on some of the implications that we've seen in Guelph itself.

1:57:38So when I'm a member of the Guelph Guild of Storytellers and we organize a number of events

1:57:45and every time we have Robert Munch on the agenda there's startling things that happen.

1:57:50Just this past year Robert had hoped to be at Canada Day and he was able to be there. We had

1:57:57over 700 people in the shelter in Riverside Park. That same year earlier in the summer we had a

1:58:05children's event organized in the enabling garden our our staunch partners and again over 700 people

1:58:13in that enabling garden and that was the last time we had Robert Munch on the agenda and did

1:58:18nothing but but have them in the shelters. Road to eat uh Trilliums, Ribfest, the Saturday morning

1:58:26event that we had for children. Now think of this over 1200 people came in that park. So there we

1:58:33were in that front of that central stage and all these people are just coming so I don't need to

1:58:39tell us just how significant Robert Munch is in Guelph but the important part is he's a draw.

1:58:45If you go to Copenhagen nobody in the right mind would leave Copenhagen and not visit the little

1:58:51mermaid. It's a real tourist draw and Robert Munch and everything that he represents is going to be

1:58:57that draw. That's going to be translated into economic kinds of advances as well. I love the

1:59:04idea of the paperback princess and then organizing that and linking that to the new Guelph public

1:59:10library because they want to enhance that collection as well because as Robert Munch said in his recent

1:59:16interview on CBC that that's where his collection is going to go. So the value of having the arts,

1:59:25the rich arts of Guelph we are and amazingly blessed with the most profound authors and I'm not sure

1:59:33we're giving them enough recognition to tell the honest truth and I think budget wise even we should

1:59:39think about that. I hope that the cost of this would not be an issue. Just imagine if you put out a

1:59:46crowdsourcing oh my goodness we'd have millions of dollars guaranteed or corporate sponsors that we

1:59:51would have in Guelph. So I urge us to recognize that and recognize that for its artistic impact

1:59:59and influence but also economically and for the dollar ones.

2:00:07We know that Robert is recognized globally in terms of his awards. Do you know that he's been

2:00:13nominated a number of times for the Astridge Lindberg Award which is the richest word for

2:00:21children's literature. It's 750,000 Canadian dollars. It's an award that globally recognizes

2:00:30a children's author in a story and Robert has been nominated by Canada for a number of times to be

2:00:37a candidate in that award. He's going to get that someday absolutely guaranteed. Think back in the

2:00:4470s when the New York Times first calculated the highest selling children's authors and they were

2:00:55amazed. There's what there's there's a book called Love You Forever and it's by whom it's by Robert

2:01:02Munch who is he. We haven't even reviewed this book so they were amazed and beat out all these

2:01:07profound children's literature books. So Robert has an amazing man. He has an amazing influence

2:01:15and I think we all know that and but I want us to think of that in a larger context of the arts

2:01:23and I know budget's a huge issue here and I must say that in the last budget I was a little bit

2:01:28taken aback by the lack of emphasis in the arts. Okay. Thanks. Thanks. Thanks so much. Sorry I

2:01:41had to cut you off there but I didn't want to cut you off thanking staff so that's a good part.

2:01:45Thank you. Is there any questions for this delegation at all? Councillor Caron.

2:01:52Yes thank you and thank you to the delegate and an excellent presentation and I know that you have

2:01:57a history of being passionate about literacy in our city and the new public library near that space.

2:02:04So my question was actually about your role as a storyteller. When you look at the design of the

2:02:09whole square not just the area where the public art project will be located do you see this as an

2:02:17area where the wealth guild of storytellers might be able to have some of their events? Is there

2:02:22event capacity there or are you speaking just to the public art piece? Actually I was looking for that

2:02:29and I'm glad you mentioned that because I thought there was a little there could be almost a little

2:02:35more inviting designated space for storytellers. We know that Indigenous concept of stories

2:02:42circles and I think it'd be wonderful to have that invitation and even clearly marked so that we

2:02:48invite international tellers, local tellers, the storytelling guild who focus on storytelling

2:02:54and I think that would be a lovely feature and I could see that as being part of encompassing

2:03:01Robert Munch's Paper Bag Princess and having that very much an integral part and just even an

2:03:06invitation for families to even sit down and listen to stories. Have a storytelling bench,

2:03:12have some children around there so yes absolutely integrate that as part of the concept.

2:03:18Thank you. Anything else further from council?

2:03:27Nothing more. Sayah thank you so much and all the best in the holidays. Thank you.

2:03:32Okay we have Alex Perves coming up and good morning everyone. First of all as far as Robert

2:03:53Munch is everything that she said I would 100 100% agree with except for one thing is to have a bust

2:04:02or a statue or a bench named after him in St. George's Square. We could do so much more.

2:04:08We have Jean Little has a public school named after her. Ken Danby has a school named after them.

2:04:15I know this is not within your jurisdiction to be able to do that and I know that in 20 29 2030

2:04:22that the school board is actually coming forward and they're revisiting their renaming of schools

2:04:28and everything else so I would more imagine with Robert Munch there would be more of an ideal

2:04:34of having a school named after him and the impact that would have on that community.

2:04:39And all likelihood that school in 2030 2032 with the growth of Guelph there will be a new school

2:04:47down in the south and in Ward 6 probably being being built and everything else. That would be

2:04:53the ideal time to be able to really put pressure on the school board and for those that are really

2:04:59interested if they want to honor the man named in the school after him where hundreds of kids will

2:05:05come through that door on a daily basis and families and that entire community that would have a

2:05:10bigger impact of who this man was and knowing more about what he is. Now talking about St. George's

2:05:16Square there's just one thing that that I would like you guys to consider and it wouldn't cost it

2:05:23to the city a penny is that up to now is that we've looked at the layouts of the square there's been

2:05:29revisions and changes and everything else and that's great but the one thing that's missing is

2:05:35why would people want to come down to the square? All you're doing is moving pieces around right now

2:05:41you're adding a few trees you're putting in a lot more tables but that's basically it. I've been down

2:05:48during the summertime almost every second third day going down grabbing a coffee at the

2:05:54beast throughout the square getting a suburbia or getting a sausage and bun from Moe's and there's

2:06:02always been those three tables that are there they've always been empty or only one of them's occupied

2:06:09in the drawing that you have you have 40 of these tables throughout the entire square. To me that

2:06:16seems like an overkill first of all you don't need that many because most of them are always going

2:06:21to be empty. The three that we have now the majority times when you walk by they're empty during the

2:06:28summertime that's before construction so that's the first thing. The second thing is is that when

2:06:34you've been down there in the mayor you were down there about three weeks ago when when they had the

2:06:39lighting ceremony and and Roger you were there as well is that the stage is facing towards the royal

2:06:47bank is that it's three quarters of the stage the back is against it is what I would suggest is move

2:06:56the power box right into the corner where the royal bank is and more importantly stop with the

2:07:01temporary stages you know it costs taxpayers money every time that you end up fronting the stage

2:07:07bringing it in you then you got to bring in all the technicians and everything else and hook everything

2:07:11up have a permanent stage in that corner have a power box there a permanent stage that corner

2:07:19and don't let the city pay for it there has to be corporations people from the music community

2:07:26maybe one of the financial institutions maybe an individual would be willing to be able to fund the

2:07:31money to be able to have that stage there so that when when you are having storytellers or you are

2:07:38having things like the downtown golf and association has as far as their friday concerts or if you want

2:07:44to do bigger things like as far as the memorial cup or as far as the bicentennial is that that stage

2:07:51is pointing out to the entire square it's overlooking the entire square you're not segregating a small

2:07:59section of the square but you have the opportunity to be able to fill that entire square up for things

2:08:05like the bicentennial for maybe a new year's celebration for maybe something like the memorial

2:08:10cup and it gives you a second option what's happening at the marketplace right now at the

2:08:16marketplace oftentimes you end up shutting down the street and you end up bringing in staging and a

2:08:20whole bunch of things again that costs money if you had a permanent stage in that corner that gives

2:08:27you a second option as far as to be able to have a lot of bigger events or smaller events but it

2:08:34gives you that option and let the community have an opportunity to be able to pay for that to be able

2:08:40to fund that and give some recognition on their behalf so it doesn't cause taxpayers a single penny

2:08:46that's basically all I have to say fine thank you very much and let me see if I have a question

2:08:54from any of my colleagues on those suggestions no but thank you very much we appreciate it

2:09:01and Morgan dandy is going to be joining us I believe by video yep and we see you popped on the

2:09:14screen Morgan but just uh you might need to turn your camera on if you wish it's just slow

2:09:31okay no problem we can hear you okay um if it comes up great if it doesn't my

2:09:40computer's just not that great oh it's okay we we see and hear you now okay perfect go ahead thank you

2:09:50good morning mayor council members staff and fellow ball fights when I viewed the final concept

2:09:56drawings for st. George's Square I noticed some things that we may wish to change before these

2:10:03drawings are used in telling the good news story about the redesign of our downtown the

2:10:10predominance of bimo the windows of the bimo building and the stairs in front of the cibc

2:10:20the bank of montreal will shutter the downtown location in the spring

2:10:25do we truly want a defunct business to be prominently featured in our good news

2:10:33additionally the artist depiction of the windows is a misrepresentation of reality

2:10:39I also wonder why the sidewalk in front of the cibc is now stairs I have mobility issues

2:10:46and being able to get to douglas without needing to walk out to windham first is something

2:10:54I believe would benefit many including parents with strollers in July and again this morning

2:11:02when I rewatched the july meeting as I listened to the delegations I was gobsmacked about their

2:11:10stands on the location of the public washroom in the downtown the dgba is talking about adding

2:11:16more events following the renewal and have already begun use of social media influencers

2:11:24to bring in thousands of people yet they don't support the installation of a highly visible

2:11:2924 7 public washroom in the square the guelph labs report on access to public washrooms in guelph

2:11:38was clear on in its conclusion that a 24 7 public washroom in the downtown core is a necessity

2:11:49if the tgba wants to have events centered on st. george's square I would think they would be the

2:11:57biggest proponent of installing bathroom facilities for these visitors stating that the washrooms at

2:12:04the library are not far away and should be the place people go confuses me since the library is

2:12:10not open 24 7 there's already plans for washroom facilities at the transit building to be built

2:12:16at transit at the central station and when they mentioned the fact that the washroom facilities

2:12:24outside seahall are rarely open I remembered an encounter with a visitor on cargan street

2:12:31when he was trying to find somewhere to go to the washroom and having to tell him that we didn't

2:12:36have any that were regularly open that his only options were to go to the port of parties in the

2:12:42macdonald lot the old kebac street mall if it was open or to purchase something in a business that

2:12:50had a toilet I was embarrassed to give that response in the new concept drawing it's not

2:12:57indicated where access to the infrastructure for fountain will be I originally love the idea of

2:13:03colloic cating the infrastructure for the fountain washroom and transit shelter until I realized

2:13:10that the chemicals used for self cleaning would mean I wouldn't be able to use either the washroom

2:13:16or the transit shelter when I was a member of golf environmental justice collective we spoke

2:13:23with miss laughlin a few times regarding the access to sanitary facilities in the downtown

2:13:28and had conversations with the lead of the golf labs as staff continue to explore options for

2:13:35providing a public washroom including a more traditional not automated public washroom

2:13:42I have a suggestion the traditional washroom facility outside city hall that is rarely open

2:13:50the washroom facilities at the new transit building and the needed washrooms in the area

2:13:56of st. George's square could all be clean on a rotational basis in a similar manner to provincial

2:14:02and conservation area parks if there were a dedicated position we need easily accessible public

2:14:10washrooms if the dgba is going to draw more visitors to the downtown and I believe this could

2:14:17be an avenue to achieve that goal thank you for your attention thank you very much morgan

2:14:27and is there any follow-up for morgan on questions for her presentation

2:14:32there isn't and again thank you for joining us and have a good holiday to yourself as well

2:14:44we are back to us everybody and so right off the top can I maybe look to my colleagues that are

2:14:52in the downtown to move the to want to move the motion yeah I think that makes sense so clausen

2:14:58and galler will will move in second the recommendation and yep I'll put you second on the list I have

2:15:07councillor Allt first and then go to clausen and I can make my way around the room if necessary okay

2:15:14thank you mayor guthrie through you to staff we heard from delegates about final design concerns

2:15:21and I only have one and I'm being somewhat careful in the way that I present this there was comments

2:15:28about some sort of a recognition of robert munch and I have two concerns that I that I need to raise

2:15:35I understand from public uh from public uh statements that the library will become a

2:15:42depository for robert munch's papers at some point and so number one I wonder whether a more

2:15:48appropriate place for some sort of a recognition of munch might be at the library similar to what

2:15:55glen gould uh how glen gould is recognized in toronto um in front of the cbc that's the first

2:16:01start but the other concern is I recognize how important munch is um I love munch forever but

2:16:09the other thing is we have many people and in literature we have for example gene little as

2:16:14well who has significance um in in the same uh genre but we also have artists as well like

2:16:21ken damby who we remember because of the carousel and in music there's edward johnson and maybe even

2:16:26james gordon we have four nobel prize winners that we've never acknowledged uh publicly in guelph which

2:16:33I think proportionately to any other community in canada perhaps in the world that's a heck of a

2:16:38number uh including james or binski who received the nobel peace prize for medicines on frontier

2:16:44and then we could get to one of the most important things downtown which is drinking

2:16:50and there's george sleiman who has been identified as having been a tremendous city booster and

2:16:56builder and let's not forget premier george drugh as well so with all these things how will

2:17:04taking this to the arts uh council uh for consideration how are we going to address this

2:17:10to see which would be the most important I recognize a paper bag princess would be fabulous

2:17:15but I recognize other uh recognitions would be important as well so I'm actually I'm going to

2:17:22answer the question over here councillor Allt through the mayor um because this is about our public

2:17:25art process so we have a council approved public art process and policy which was approved a couple

2:17:30of terms of council uh go um and so through that policy all um any public art that comes onto city

2:17:37owned property or in city owned buildings comes through our what used to be called our public

2:17:41art advisory committee that has recently been renamed our arts and culture uh council appointed

2:17:46advisory committee and so to your point the proposals that you've heard mentioned today those

2:17:50will and I don't want to get into specifics of proposals that may be in the works because I

2:17:54don't think that's what we're here to talk about today but um citywide not just in the downtown

2:17:59core any proposals that come forward come through that committee and they get vetted uh and and

2:18:04considered um the city we do not currently have uh money earmarked to go out and commission new

2:18:12public art ourselves simply because of budget constraints we do when we look at new buildings

2:18:17look at opportunities for where we can do public art however the public art advisory committee

2:18:22I should now call it by its new name the arts and culture advisory committee uh this is not a

2:18:25process that's new to that committee the exact same process uh occurred when we did the john

2:18:30necres statue that's at gulf museum so a community group came forward they fundraised they expressed

2:18:35interest in the proposal and then they worked through the public art advisory committee so

2:18:39what I can say is that both for downtown for st georgia square for the library we're already in

2:18:44conversations with those organizations or those individuals who are interested we will um work

2:18:49through the process with them um but it really in this instance it's about individuals in the

2:18:54community coming forward and bringing that proposal forward so that the committee can then

2:18:57consider it and decide next steps and thank you very much for that thorough answer I think that

2:19:02clarifies everything that that there is a a process and that the community can be involved but the

2:19:09the city very clearly has a an important role in establishing where and when anything might be

2:19:14erected okay clausen please thank you yes uh thank you through you mr. mayor um and I will just say

2:19:23I wanted to say thank you to staff um mr. mayor already said it but I I just I did want to say

2:19:31thank you because there has been so many opportunities for public input or along the way I've been at

2:19:36lots of those and there's lots that I haven't been at as well and I know that there's so much

2:19:41that has that has gone into this and I do appreciate all of your efforts and I know that

2:19:47there has been a lot of changes from the original from their first presentation until now and I do see

2:19:52those reflected did we all get everything we wanted perhaps not but I certainly think that

2:20:00this is a really good way forward and I just I also wanted to say that you know this space

2:20:06addresses those core functions of engineering of transportation but I think that it's going to also

2:20:13provide a really great opportunity for the public for everyone to be able to come down and use that

2:20:18space and also for the community to present more um and higher frequency of public events

2:20:25the spirit of the season I hope that everyone had the chance to go down but I really think that it

2:20:30you know it drew a lot of people to our core from both locally within our community and from beyond

2:20:35and I think that having a space like this that can accommodate and welcome um more more people will

2:20:43certainly be a benefit to the wider community for multiple reasons um and so with that said I

2:20:50this is question so I will withhold any further of my comments but um one of the delegates alluded

2:20:56to this um but I believe it was removed from the the final design there was at some point I thought

2:21:01there was a stage that was integrated into the design or maybe it was naturally built into like a

2:21:06stair structure and I just wanted to ask if you could clarify why why that change was made and

2:21:12and and how the stage will be integrated going forward through you Mr. Marietta councillor

2:21:18class and yes the July concept did propose um a stage area in the I would say the northwest

2:21:24corner of the square sort of where uh Royal sorry Bank of Montreal and Canada post meet and that

2:21:32was a function of how the natural grading worked and it became sort of a natural stage

2:21:37we heard through the consultation that there was a strong preference for the stage area to be in

2:21:43the southwest corner of the square so again we don't have natural grades there that would facilitate

2:21:49a stage so the idea was to create a flat flexible area for you know that could accommodate day to

2:21:57day activities you saw in some of the images umbrellas there and things like that which then

2:22:02can be moved out of the way to accommodate a temporary stage um we did also hear a lot about

2:22:09flexibility and maybe not having a permanent stage because the use of that on a day to day

2:22:14basis isn't very good or some events don't need a stage um so we have that for an option for certain

2:22:21events that could bring in temporary stages and then what we did on the easterly side of Wyndham

2:22:27Street um there are stairs there because there is a natural grade to make up there is an accessible

2:22:33route as well but there are there does have to be stairs there instead of having a retaining wall

2:22:37as we do today it's a wide open staircase to increase the ability to move through that area

2:22:43but it also creates a natural stage should you want to use that side of the street so we've

2:22:48tried to provide options and flexibility for stage areas within the square

2:22:54okay thank you for that explanation I appreciate it um so another question I had was with regard

2:23:01to another delegate but another question that came up for me as well during the process was that

2:23:05some of the community members had talked about our community's art scene and you know this is also

2:23:11kind of touching on what Kelsler Alt said um but but they wanted to see them themselves and the

2:23:17arts community reflected within the square will there be future opportunities um for you know public

2:23:23art or for um you know I don't know that's only the only the only thing but for animation and

2:23:31opportunities for the arts community to contribute to this space uh through you Mr. Maradon,

2:23:35Councillor Klassen, sort of building on Colleen's answer yes there this square sort of sets the

2:23:42stage or like creates that canvas so that we can then have those opportunities in the future so

2:23:48we've designed it so that it's flexible enough so that it can evolve over time and we can add

2:23:53things to it so it we've removed the gateway features but there could be potential gateway

2:23:58features that are also public art in the future those are the types of things that can be added

2:24:02over time thank you I appreciate that um and then through you Mayor another question and

2:24:11it's with regard to the Robert Munch structure and and thank you for the delegates and for

2:24:16Councillor Allt for for talking about all of the great um you know contributed to the arts in

2:24:21in Guelph and particularly Robert Munch we're hearing a lot about right now um it has been

2:24:27shared with me that friends of the Guelph Public Library have also been working on a tribute to

2:24:32Robert Munch within the new Guelph Public Library uh and it it's a bit of a nod to their fundraising

2:24:39efforts they they raised a million dollars for the new public library which is no small feat

2:24:43and so my question is is there going to be an opportunity for the city

2:24:47and for the committee to work with all of these stakeholders who have been kind of coming forward

2:24:52with you know similar seemingly similar proposals so through the mayor yes as I indicated the arts

2:24:58and cultural advisory committee who you appoint is who will do that work we we do know that there

2:25:03is more than one sort of there there are a couple of discussions going on about potential ways

2:25:08to honour Robert Munch so again I don't want to get into the specific details here because it

2:25:12hasn't come to the arts and culture advisory committee yet for their review we're still in

2:25:16that proposal stage but to answer your question yes the opportunity will be there and we will look

2:25:21to bring forward for the committee's consideration any of the proposals that come forward.

2:25:26Thank you um and Mr. Mayor through you two more um will staff continue their work on sourcing

2:25:33public washroom spaces for the downtown. Through the mayor to you Councillor Klassen yes we are

2:25:41going to continue that work. Okay thank you very much um and then lastly um one of the one of the

2:25:50the motions that were brought forward at the previous time this was brought forward to council

2:25:55was with regard to sort of including um heritage and I think in indigenous elements within within

2:26:01the square I was just wondering you did elaborate on on what we could be seeing with you know the use

2:26:07of um native plants for and and different ways of potentially storytelling that could be potentially

2:26:14approved as well but I was just wondering if you could speak to some of the heritage and natural

2:26:17elements that are within this current iteration of the design. Through you Mr. Mayor to Councillor

2:26:23Claeson um again the use of limestone materials for the planters or something that um has the

2:26:30appearance of limestone those are the types of things that we're considering um to bring in that

2:26:34natural element and then we really did focus on increasing the number of trees to really focus

2:26:40on the natural aspects of it um to respond to some of the comments that there was a lot of

2:26:45concrete so trying to balance that need for flexibility which requires paving stones and open

2:26:51areas um and then the natural elements of um like green space and having things in planters and having

2:26:58the trees so we focused on that and then adding in heritage elements where possible.

2:27:04All right thank you Mr. Mayor those are all of my questions. Thank you uh Councillor Pousatil is next.

2:27:13I do see Koran and uh Kate and sorry just to let you guys know you can save your hands.

2:27:25Thank you and through the mayor um to build a bit more on Councillor Art's question about uh

2:27:32what else? Alt. Alt's. You mean the Mona Lisa? Alt's the Annika. Um process about public art um

2:27:40not disrespecting Robert Munch who was a neighbor and our family is a funny story of how we're in

2:27:45one of the books but I do have a question about the process. Is this an open process or is it

2:27:53individuals who come with money in hand and I guess I'd just like to ask a question of equity

2:28:03in the process and I assume the committee the advisory committee would take that into consideration.

2:28:10Through the mayor yes that's part of the terms of reference and I can certainly send them around

2:28:13to council if you would like to see those the terms of reference both for that advisory committee

2:28:18as well as our public art process that council approved we have had public art um installations

2:28:24come through two mechanisms one where the city has a funding to contribute um the the the public

2:28:30art installation that's near the farmers market would be an example of that um and so then when

2:28:34we bring the funding forward and we ask the public art committee again now called the Arts and

2:28:38Culture Advisory Advisory Committee to go out and commission art we have also had the circumstances

2:28:44where a group comes forward with in the case of the McCrae statue an existing vision for a statue

2:28:49and the funding to do it in the in essence donated to the city both of those processes still go through

2:28:53the Arts and Culture Advisory Committee it is uh it is a council appointed advisory committee so their

2:28:58process is open and transparent um and so I can certainly send out to council the information

2:29:03about the terms of reference as well as the process. Thank you very much for outlining that.

2:29:09I just have two more through the mayor quick questions one of the delegations

2:29:13to the staff raised about the stairs and access to Douglas where the stairs are located next to

2:29:21the CIBC can you just comment on that and then I have one final question. Through the mayor to you

2:29:27councillor Boussatel there is a great change there so we do have to make up that great change

2:29:34and there's a combination of stairs as well which exists today in front of CIBC

2:29:40and then there is an accessible path it would require traveling out a bit towards Windham

2:29:44Street to get around but again to make up that great change it is necessary what we have done to

2:29:51improve sort of movement through that area is instead of having a retaining wall that everybody

2:29:55has to go around is opening up those stairs and making them wide so they also provide seating

2:30:00opportunities um they're intended to not be quite as steep so that it provides an easier way to get

2:30:07through that area but with the grades as they are today and as they will be into the future

2:30:13based on where buildings are we will need stairs in that location. Thank you so I did I did hear

2:30:19the piece about the retaining wall so there's no kind of Zed access for accessibility built into

2:30:25the stairs. Through you Mr. Mayor that's correct. Thank you my last question is just a clarification

2:30:33during your presentation around the washrooms I thought I heard you say that infrastructure will

2:30:38be built in and my question is has a location of that already been predetermined? Through the

2:30:46mayor to you councillor Boussatel at this time we intend for it to generally be in the location

2:30:53that we presented in July but we are not fully committed to that because it will also depend on

2:30:58where the mechanical elements of the fountain go and again if we proceed if we think we're

2:31:05proceeding with that standalone washroom so when we get closer to it would generally likely be on

2:31:11that easterly side of Wyndham Street is where we're looking at but we have we don't have a specific

2:31:17location for you today. Thank you that's all. And my apologies to my friends on screen but I did

2:31:25forget councillor Downer and she's closer to me to throw something at me so I'm going to go

2:31:29to her first and then I will go to the screen thank you. Thank you Mr. Mayor through you to the staff

2:31:35just also ditto thank you for doing such a great job engaging with everybody again going back out

2:31:42and I think through that you've certainly reached a lot more consensus and what I would say it's the

2:31:52this is such a great platform for so many events I don't know if any of you made it down to Spirit

2:31:56of the Seasome the last two weekends but I was volunteering thousands of people it was absolutely

2:32:03incredible and not just Guelphites who were raving about it but you know we met people from Sarnia

2:32:12Tottenham they do they'd heard about it through probably through those influencers but they heard

2:32:16about it and so it's a great platform for a lot of events for celebrating in Guelph but also just

2:32:25you know showing off our city and being a welcoming place for other people. So I just want to I do

2:32:32have one final question though because it keeps coming up at the the GBA too the heart you know

2:32:38looking at the design like is there a reason why it has to be moved or because most of those pictures

2:32:44like there's 24 seven people like getting their pictures taken in front of that heart but I noticed

2:32:50and this year I noticed it was the dogs that they brought their dogs to have their picture taken

2:32:55in front of it. Is it and the background actually of Quebec Street or Quebec Street mall with the

2:33:03lights and everything was was quite catching in the pictures is there a reason that has to be changed?

2:33:10Through you Mr. Miranda, Councillor Downer with the current location of the heart it would conflict

2:33:16with the proposed location for the family fountain. I don't see why we couldn't explore having it in

2:33:25that same area we just have to see what kind of conflicts what might be created for all the other

2:33:30things. We did try to place it in a location where you still have sort of that interesting vista

2:33:36behind it with St. George's Church and we had a lot of comments through the public process about

2:33:41how Douglas Street is sort of a jewel within downtown so it frames that view and St. George's

2:33:47Anglican Church so the intent was to keep that sort of Instagram view for all of those people that

2:33:53use it for that purpose but again it is an element that is relatively easily moved so through

2:34:00yeah through the technical details we can look if it fit. I mean even with the fountain in the

2:34:04background and the Quebec Street mall I mean it would there's lots but anyway I'll leave that to

2:34:08you but I would put that as something that to to further explore but and again thank you it's a

2:34:14great work. Okay for real this time Councillor Ciaran then Councillor Caton. Great thank you

2:34:21echoing all of my colleagues great work I always find that you know especially when you're looking

2:34:26pictures of your kids you see their evolution only when you look back at those first photos and you

2:34:33see where we've come from and where where they've gone and I looked back at the first iteration of

2:34:38this square and where we'd come and I think you've you've got that wow factor and listening to the

2:34:43community was certainly part of that so so thank you for that. More questions of clarifications I

2:34:48think I heard it in your presentation really quickly but the edge treatment along the street

2:34:53I see just these planters there is that because it wasn't in the scope of the St. George's square

2:34:59design and that will be part of the Wyndham Street design. Through you Mr. Brande, Councillor Caron,

2:35:08so just to clarify along the edge of the like the curb where the road meets the square I just see

2:35:18these planters in the renderings and yet when we did the Wyndham Street design we talked about

2:35:25good better best on street trees so I'm just wondering whether that's that interface where

2:35:31curb meets road is part of a different project. The two projects are combined there are bollards

2:35:39in in locations to again provide that distinction between where cars are to drive and where people

2:35:44are to walk there are street trees along Wyndham Street and we have when you get into the square

2:35:50it's not exactly sort of regular street trees at every interval because we've moved into that more

2:35:56natural setting for the trees so along Wyndham you'll see street trees in both soil cells and

2:36:02planters more at regular intervals and then within the square you see a lot of trees actually we

2:36:09have increased the number of trees but they're just not at that regular interval along the street

2:36:14so it fits in with the overall design of the square. Okay so on the on the on the renderings

2:36:20that we saw today wherever there's a planter it might not necessarily be just a planter with

2:36:26flowers it could it could be a tree. Agreed yes it could be. Great thanks. Thank you Councillor Caron

2:36:37and to Kate and please. Thanks through you to staff again like everybody else kudos on a very

2:36:47large project in tech we have a term that we say committee by design and and how horrifying that is

2:36:55on the the layer of people who have to actually create the design to take the feedback from

2:37:01a million different people and everyone's got a different idea of what they think is the best thing

2:37:06and so I know that that's a very very hard project and a onerous process and you all did a great job

2:37:13um I personally like the other design a little bit more but I am not everybody

2:37:19so I appreciate that you had to kind of do what you needed to do um I personally would really

2:37:26like to hear more about the the washroom as time goes on because I think um for usability

2:37:33and accessibility that's really necessary I know that the self-cleaning washrooms themselves are not

2:37:39as accessible with the types of chemicals they use their environmental impact and things like that

2:37:44so I I do understand and appreciate not going with that particular option right away um but I'm

2:37:51just wondering when we'll hear back about the potential for the washroom inside a building

2:37:58versus other places what's the timeline on that? Through you Mr. Mayor to Councillor Caton I can't

2:38:07give you a specific timeline today as we've worked through the details of this project to get to this

2:38:11point um but it is part of our 2026 work plan or my 2026 work plan to continue uh to explore options

2:38:20and opportunities to bring that back so I can't give you a specific timeline only to commit

2:38:25that work is continuing. Great thank you so much. Awesome and Councillor Chew do you have a comment as well?

2:38:35Our question. Thank you through you Mr. Mayor um yeah just the whole team here great work Stacey,

2:38:41Andrew thanks for meeting with me and Mike on a personal meeting uh I just want to address some

2:38:47of the comments that I made during my consultation with you guys which I feel like got captured

2:38:52I really appreciate the attention to the detail with the paving materials I think that really

2:38:58makes the biggest difference um just the variation um and also the alignment towards Douglas Street

2:39:05I personally like the heart where it is lining up to Douglas Street as a photographer myself

2:39:11and many others I think this will be a great thing to capture that subculture and niche that

2:39:17would patronize downtown. I also think this the steps by the CIBC is it'll correct me if I'm wrong

2:39:26but it will serve as a natural amphitheater of sorts for um for future events um I guess you can

2:39:36that is our attention yes okay yeah so I think like that kind of solves the stage issue from my

2:39:42perspective and I think it frames Colbeck Street better especially for all the storm games that

2:39:48happen it's a natural staging I'm from Vancouver and in Rogers Arena where the Canucks play

2:39:55there's a natural staging that happens before the queue up and I think this this area where the

2:40:01fountain is it'll naturally help frame a lot of those community conversions so great work I feel

2:40:09like for the first time with community engagement a lot of my comments have been captured so I really

2:40:14appreciate the thoughtfulness and I know a lot of people in the landscape architecture community

2:40:18also appreciates your work and I also just want to say the tapering of the the herb and the plancher

2:40:26that was a nice touch as well and to sub to add the heart there to really define that corner

2:40:33that honestly will make the biggest difference in draw so great work thanks councillor Chew

2:40:41all right I think we're ready to call the vote which staff would appreciate

2:40:47so uh I'm going to call that right now because I think I've given my comments off the top about

2:40:52how thankful I am too so I'll call it right now is anyone against this new design for st. George's

2:40:58Square nobody we'll get a shovel let's go all right perfect thank you very much

2:41:11uh we've already done the next thing on the agenda which was the public appointments