Clause 3 of the main motion, be amended to replace the word encouraged with directed.

2:41:13to move the motions to at least just get them on the floor all right i'll go downer and boost

2:41:20it till as moving in second day and um i already am aware of some amendments that want to come

2:41:27forward so council if you don't mind it wouldn't mind just sort of walking through them just

2:41:31just the best way to sequence through them okay um with the first one i'd like to go to councillor

2:41:38clausen who again was not here uh at the committee meeting and some of her uh motions that were passed

2:41:48at committee have flown now to the council but she would like to just address that with an

2:41:54amendment so i'll turn it over to councillor Klassen and then after that i'll go back to uh

2:42:00to us as council maybe over to councillor downer um yes thank you through you mr mayor um my

2:42:08consideration to council is just to rethink the my understanding is that we changed the direction

2:42:16from direct to encourage and i would just like to turn that back to direct and i'm just seeing it

2:42:24in two places uh under three i in three uh sorry three one and three two so i was reading it uh

2:42:34literally um and i would just suggest that i think that the word direct is appropriate in these

2:42:42circumstances perhaps um it's not going to be everywhere but it will be in some places

2:42:49and so i don't think encourage is is necessary um and i'm just looking potentially for a seconder

2:42:55thank you goller okay councillor goller has seconded so as simple as it is in front of us

2:43:01i will obviously open it up to any questions or comments but it's very simple we are changing

2:43:07two words from encourage back to direct uh and i will ask if anyone has questions

2:43:14if not i councillor Allt thank you mr mayor it is to you uh council clausen used the word

2:43:22reconsideration uh and i'm wondering if this is a motion of reconsideration because it changes the

2:43:28vote count no i think her commentary about reconsider is just to reconsider our position

2:43:35not to reconsider a vote of council since it came from committee it's not actually uh the

2:43:41will of council yet until it's ratified here so it's just a motion i think i made sense there

2:43:47i was that was that was pretty good yeah okay so um i'm gonna call the vote then on this amendment

2:43:55please and is anyone against that all right katyn and gibson and billings thank you so that does

2:44:06pass uh i'll change it over to councillor downer now who has a sequence of amendments that show

2:44:14both table and uh present to us go ahead yeah so i have um four motions uh and uh

2:44:22to the amendments and then a new motion at the end and if staff would clerk's office would like

2:44:28to put them up so one two and three will be in addition to number three this is how it's gonna

2:44:34go it's what i've been told and then the number four will be a final one at the end but i'll speak

2:44:40to them to them all now except number two which was a suggestion of the mayor and i'll let him

2:44:46speak to that after i've spoken to it so um i watched the committee the whole meeting i wasn't

2:44:52here i was i was away um and then i i've met with staff and thank you uh stacey lachlan for all

2:44:59the patients with me meeting with them and i've talked to colleagues i've talked to

2:45:03councillor crassan and councillor Goller and and the mayor on on this matter and it's um so the

2:45:10first one was around the playground a concern around the playground in sort of agreeing that

2:45:15yeah the size of it um and maybe the misplacement of it is a concern for flexibility the play

2:45:23structures that we saw in there were probably for very young children so you know you're not looking

2:45:28at youth 13s it's sort of um only a very young age group and and um what i would prefer to see and

2:45:36the sort of what i think is more appropriate is to reduce it to a one interactive place making

2:45:42structure um something like just if it's just a chickadee if it's a chickadee that's fine but that

2:45:48will be at that the uh design stage that that would be decided but it would be interactive that

2:45:54children could climb through it so it's partly a play structure it's partly a place making structure

2:45:58where people could have their pictures taken with it it could be instagram moments those types of

2:46:02things um i have no problems with kids in the downtown i think it's great the dgba does a lot

2:46:08of children's programming like the egg and um the Santa Claus parade they do halloween so there's

2:46:15lots of that going on and i'd like to see a lot more of that going on in the downtown once we've

2:46:19done this work as as well so i think it's um i think you know the square has a lots of opportunity

2:46:26for that um maybe just for sequencing we could just go one at a time okay it just makes it simpler

2:46:36just even if there's questions right if that's okay first of all is it council clausen are you

2:46:41willing to second uh yes council clausen okay thank you so why don't we just look at at the first

2:46:46amendment which is number one which councillor downer just described is there any questions on

2:46:51this item okay just kate and go ahead thank you terry i just have a question to staff um so the

2:47:01the feedback that we got when we were doing the extensive feedback that we've done on this is

2:47:05that people wanted a play space and uh this feels like it's removing the play space um and i assume

2:47:17that this would be like making sure that it's interactive and also already could be done in

2:47:22the design phase does this reduce it so that there's no more play space and there's only just one art

2:47:28piece uh through the mayor to councillor Caton um actually the type of thing that councillor downer's

2:47:35talking about like an interactive place making structure is the type of thing that we were

2:47:39considering for the play area for play and in fact we are designing the whole square so that kids

2:47:46can play throughout it like the planters and all those types of things they're designed for play but

2:47:50this specific area while the motion would reduce the overall area it still provides that opportunity

2:47:56for play thanks and through miss the mayor um so this isn't really prescriptive and like do we have

2:48:06like a specific dimension on the play space already like what does this do uh through the mayor

2:48:14to councillor Caton um we don't have a specific dimension on the concept but um you can see on

2:48:21the concept sort of that one interactive place making structure plus a few other little structures

2:48:26so the motion is clear that it would be reduced to sort of including one which provides that um

2:48:32sort of that instagram opportunity a place to take pictures also provides the opportunity for play

2:48:37but you will be able to see that the area will be reduced so that we're increasing the flexibility

2:48:43around it for other types of events and things to occur in the square thank you so it would just be

2:48:52one structure instead of a couple of structures so like you'd get like a conglomerate of children

2:48:58rather than more spaces for them to be free is that the uh my understanding it sorry

2:49:09through the mayor to councillor Caton um so we would have one um structure specifically designed

2:49:15as an interactive place making structure which children are encouraged to climb on and all of

2:49:19that um but as I said we are designing the whole square so that it's you know open for sort of

2:49:25playfulness like the design of the planters children can walk sort of go up the sides walk

2:49:30along if they're able all all those sorts of things so I think we are designing the whole square

2:49:36to be fun and interactive but this would be one area dedicated to that okay so we're not

2:49:42we're reducing the playability of the area we're just defining that there's going to be an interactive

2:49:48structure that's correct okay great thank you so much great thank you I'm going to call the vote

2:49:57then on this one okay is there anyone against this particular motion nobody so that's unanimous thank

2:50:06you so let's go on to the second one what can you pull it back up on the screen oh this one's mine

2:50:15okay so it's been moved and seconded I'll be very quick um so in talking with staff I just I I brought

2:50:22up the sort of discussion that we in my in my mind anyways we were kind of not on purpose but sort of

2:50:31forgetting about what the space could look like beautifully at night as well and so I was thinking

2:50:39about interactive lights uh placemaking lighting that can be throughout the whole square um and so

2:50:46some of that might be incorporated into the pavers and into the roadway and the sidewalks uh and then

2:50:53also I was thinking about is there an opportunity for interactive uh projectors that are I've we've

2:51:01all I've we've probably all seen them they they're up high and they can project down onto the ground

2:51:05into a large area um you know different different things for different seasons and different

2:51:12opportunities and some some of it now from a technology point of view can also be interactive

2:51:16too you know you you step on something that is projected and it it goes away or like I just think

2:51:24there's a lot of opportunity in in lighting I'll just keep it very high level there you go and so

2:51:30staff were I hope I'm not speaking at a term but they they thought it was a good idea um

2:51:36in talking to some colleagues as well just quickly about it they they agreed as well

2:51:40and they they thought that it would be good to bring that forward now so thank you counselor

2:51:44downer I'm bringing it forward I'll stop there and see if there's any questions no okay I'll call

2:51:52the vote then on on the lighting piece is there anyone against that no one okay great and if we

2:51:59could go to the third one third one is about the fountain so I'll just stop right now and I'll go

2:52:06back to counselor downer so this is asking staff to explore modifying the size and materiality of

2:52:11the lower basin of the family fountain so that it is consistent with the design in St. George's

2:52:17Square and accommodate off-season intervention that contributes aesthetically to the St. George's

2:52:22Square includes place place making lighting and honors the integrity of the artwork so this is

2:52:29just to further explore that um it would be good to see that that lower base is the part of like

2:52:34around it um that that that would be consistent with other um planter maybe things in the square

2:52:41that are going to be happening as well and you know something like that too I I suspect will come

2:52:47back and that the more detailed design stage as well if that is possible so great thank you so

2:52:53speaking to this one is there any questions specifically on the fountain no okay I'll call

2:53:00the vote on that is anyone against that nobody that's unanimous as well uh we're to number four

2:53:10which is actually not an amendment you said it was so this is an additional one that would go at

2:53:16at the end yeah and this is uh so so in this when I discussed this with uh with staff um since a lot

2:53:24since the committee of the whole meeting they had they had had some internal discussions and

2:53:30and I don't want to put words in their mouth but they had decided that they wouldn't need to bring

2:53:35back the um uh that the fine because design could come back to council as they wouldn't need it to

2:53:42go to for tender in November that type of detail is am I correct in saying that miss Loughlin

2:53:49through the mayor to councillor Downer but we would still plan to go to tender at the end of

2:53:54October um we can um tender it in different ways we would ideally like to tender it with like the

2:54:02overall concept being included because that will give us sort of the most love um the most degree

2:54:07of certainty with respect to what's being tendered and the price that comes back but we can um structure

2:54:13the tender in a way so that some of the final details can be decided after um so that there's

2:54:20opportunity for council to have input after we tender it so the concept that we're doing

2:54:25tonight is what's really important is right so and I just wanted to say too that I had some

2:54:30concerns around the renderings that were provided to council the sort of the blank white wall behind

2:54:36them and the not clarity around the pavers um and I've asked that I asked staff about that when it

2:54:42comes for engagement with the public on the design that the actual buildings be shown within the

2:54:49renderings and and the pavers because I think that context uh makes more much more effective input

2:54:56from the public on that and um I think councillor Cossin and I are going to suggest to the dgba

2:55:01that they actually hold the town hall for the whole membership on the design and not just for the

2:55:06board so um uh so I think I think um I think that would be good so I'll be talking to staff about

2:55:14that in the dgba at our meeting next week so that's um that's uh that's that number four and I

2:55:21remember in the discussion that was an issue for council that they want to design yeah is there any

2:55:28questions on that being brought back then that particular emotion as a standalone okay I'll call

2:55:35the vote then on that uh anyone against that detailed design coming back for council no okay so that

2:55:43is uh passed as well is there any other questions on the matter uh just questions

2:55:53okay is there any comments at all before we move forward council billings

2:56:00so mr. mayor clause three still has the concept plan uh be approved however number three is

2:56:08different from cow because it goes on to say including the following so I'd still like to

2:56:14separate three out not one two three four and everything else just number three the recommended

2:56:23concept plan for st. georgia square is outlined in the report dated July 8th be approved if that

2:56:29could be separated out and voted separately I would I would really appreciate that okay yeah

2:56:37yeah just like it was at cow and there and and the reason I voted against it at cow and will

2:56:42still I know it's the concept plan I'm very happy with respect to what councillor downer has put

2:56:48forward but I still disagree with respect to the the fountain in the washroom in front of the the

2:56:54mall and the um in the drugstore um I supported the reducing the play structure only because it's

2:57:02better but I still think the play structure should be more like uh by the new library and not in the

2:57:08in the square and there's there's other issues but but those are the two big ones and and I really

2:57:14do think that in front of the mall instead of the fountain and a washroom we're missing an

2:57:20opportunity with respect to uh because of the natural slope I think it could be an amphitheater

2:57:26and we could work with the owner of the mall and have events there we heard from um the downtown

2:57:32board that where the fountain currently is there won't be a lot of space there anyways for four

2:57:38events so anyway I just think it's a this concept plan is just a missed opportunity so I'm just

2:57:45going to vote against it again okay thank you thank you so much and I'll make sure that's separated

2:57:52then so what I'm going to look to call the vote on then is one which is the renewal program

2:58:00oh I'm sorry sorry Councillor Cossin my apologies go right ahead yes uh thank you through you Mr

2:58:11Marin I appreciate the um the opportunity to speak I don't have anything prepared but I

2:58:16I wasn't at the committee of the whole and I and I did uh want to share some of the thoughts

2:58:22that I had around these motions um I'll just be blunt for me the concepts it just it wasn't it wasn't

2:58:31there for me um I I there's a great cost to this project for the city and for business owners and

2:58:41I I really had hoped that within the designs I could see something that I was really excited about

2:58:49that I would want to pitch to to to everyone I spoke to but there's something within the

2:58:54renderings as as as Councillor Downer has picked up that is just it just doesn't quite uh hit the

2:59:00mark for me and so I do think that many of these motions start to address some of the holistic

2:59:08issues that I have with the design overall um there's just lack of cohesiveness for me like a theme

2:59:15there's like some of the storytelling elements some of the strategies that we've invested in as a

2:59:19city I think could be better reflected however I do I think that with these motions um we'll get a

2:59:27little bit closer to what I hope and I also just want to thank Councillor Downer for bringing back

2:59:32the design I do hope that when we have a design back that perhaps I will change my mind um and I'm

2:59:38gonna I'll I'll hold out for that um because there is another opportunity but um I would

2:59:44love to see some designs and I've I've spoken to staff about you know some of the images that we

2:59:49have for the library and some of the squares that um are included within those designs as well as some

2:59:55of the detailed floor plans there's just imagery in my mind that tells the story whether or not

3:00:02you like the architecture whether or not you like the design I think there's an elevated design

3:00:08story within within those images and I hope to see something similar as we come back in the fall

3:00:14and um and I think I'll I'll end it there but I I do thank you for the for the work because I know

3:00:21there's so many different pieces that have gone into this so much community engagement so many

3:00:26layers to this project and I overall am deeply excited about the opportunity to create something

3:00:34special within our downtown with st. George's square and I think that that's the intent and I'm

3:00:39and I'm hopeful that when we come back with some designs that I can also uh cheer uh with excitement

3:00:49great thank you maybe just before I call the vote on everything can I just ask a quick question

3:00:54on going out to the public and doing the engagement for the detailed design can you just explain like

3:00:59how will that be promoted and how can how can you rely on us to amplify that to get like a lot

3:01:06of people involved just wondering what the next steps are on that piece to you mr. mayor

3:01:13we will be promoting it in many of the ways that we've promoted our other public open houses so

3:01:17through our downtown update newsletter through social media we can make sure that we email

3:01:24counsel about it and provide social media messaging that you can share and amplify using your own

3:01:28accounts should you wish to do so but again we we have a communications strategy and plan

3:01:33um for all of our public engagement events um so we would be making sure that we follow all

3:01:39of those different types of things okay great and maybe you could in some cases you guys do a proactive

3:01:46thing to counsel it has a little nudge and maybe you could do that on this as well just so we can

3:01:51get as much uh you know interaction uh around this before the detailed design that'd be great

3:01:57yeah thank you very much I think that these amendments also speak to um a better place

3:02:05where we landed in my opinion and I think that uh there's still I think I said at the committee

3:02:14it didn't feel like sort of a wow moment or something like that at committee but

3:02:18I think the wow moment is to come with the detailed design so I think uh I think that

3:02:24that will be an exciting moment so it's sort of a stay tuned moment for us and hopefully that we

3:02:29can hear from um from everyone uh both some feedback before that comes back so what I'll do

3:02:35is I'll call the vote on one two and the the new number well and four and five and six and seven

3:02:46I think number eight would then be the new one of having the detailed design come back

3:02:53okay you want to put on the screen okay and then and then after that I'll call the vote

3:02:57separately on number three okay so basically I'm calling the vote on everything except for number

3:03:04three which I will vote on separately for councillor Bounds okay is everyone good I'm good at calling

3:03:10it a call to vote okay um so is anyone against everything except for number three okay so that's

3:03:19unanimous and then I'm going to call the vote now separately on number three which was as amended

3:03:25because there was a few changes there so call the vote on that is anyone against okay um we have

3:03:36Guller and Richardson and Klosson and Billings and two or five I got five so that passes okay thank you

3:03:55and um thank you to staff as well and just a just a side note I think I think

3:04:08the closeness of the vote of council I think speaks to the importance of the detailed design

3:04:14so I say that as encouragement I do not expect that to be that close

3:04:20so I think that's kind of a wake-up call maybe for everybody that there's work to do on that

3:04:24details designed to have it come back so that we maybe have a bit more unity around what we can

3:04:28rally around okay thank you uh we are on the last one I think