Affordable Housing Community Improvement Plan – Additional Dwelling Unit Grant Program Amendment as described in Report 2025-530, in accordance with Attachment-1 be received… be approved

14:31This evening I'm here to present the Affordable Housing Community Improvement Plan

14:35Additional Dwelling Unit Grant Program Amendment. Tonight is a statutory public meeting and I will

14:40be presenting the amendment for receipt and decision. In January 2024 the city was awarded

14:5021.4 million through the Housing Accelerator Fund by the federal government. Guelph's Affordable

14:54Housing Community Improvement Plan or CIP was created as an initiative under the city's Housing

15:01Accelerator Fund Action Plan. The Affordable Housing CIP was approved in February 2025 and

15:07launched March 6th and applies across the city of Guelph. A Community Improvement Plan is a tool

15:12under the Planning Act for municipalities to incentivize development to meet the local needs

15:17and priorities of a community. The Affordable Housing CIP aims to increase the supply of primary

15:22rental units, increase the supply of smaller units and increase non-market rental housing options.

15:28The CIP programs support the development of new homes to meet the unit target set out by the

15:33Housing Accelerator Fund Action Plan, the 2024 Housing Affordability Strategy, and the city of

15:39Guelph's Housing Pledge of 18,000 new homes by 2031. There are three programs under the Affordable

15:46Housing CIP, one of which is the Additional Dwelling Unit Grant Program, which is funded by the

15:51Housing Accelerator Fund. The changes to the Additional Dwelling Unit Grant Program being

15:56brought forward are expected to facilitate building more affordable housing faster by opening

16:01eligibility criteria and opportunities for more funding. The Additional Dwelling Unit Grant Program

16:09or ADU Grant Program was launched in March 2025. The program ends in December 2026. There are two

16:17streams under the program. The Homeowner Stream currently provides funding for one ADU where the

16:22property is the owner's primary residence up to a maximum $50,000 grant. The Project Stream

16:28targets developer-led projects that may include multiple ADUs and currently provides funding

16:34for up to six ADUs with a maximum $140,000 grant. The program provides funding for construction,

16:42funding to add accessibility features to a unit beyond the building code requirements for the

16:46project, and funding for upgrades to municipal infrastructure if required to accommodate the

16:52new unit or units. Municipal infrastructure includes water and wastewater infrastructure

16:58within the public realm and the city right of way or street. Currently, an interested party who

17:04has already received funding under the ADU Grant Program cannot receive funding for an additional

17:09project. Units must remain affordable for 15 years and meet affordability thresholds as set out in

17:16the Provincial Bulletin on Affordable Residential Units for the purposes of the Development Charges

17:21Act. The affordable rental rates are set to be updated annually and do not remain static.

17:26While the program has been designed to provide funds that can have an impact on projects,

17:31the objective of the ADU Grant Program is to increase units in the city and affordable housing

17:36while meeting the unit commitments of the city's Housing Accelerator Fund Action Plan. The amount

17:41of funding offered is not intended to cover all costs associated with building an ADU and may not

17:47cover the total rent loss when renting at the affordable rental rate instead of a market rental

17:52rate in all situations. Because of this, the program may work best from a return on investment

17:57perspective for internal units. Initial interest has remained high for the homeowner stream

18:07with 83 inquiries as of end of October 2025. Interest in the project stream has been limited

18:14with 12 inquiries. As of the end of October, 11 units had been incented. Since then, two more

18:20units have been incented for a total of 13 units all under the homeowner stream. One unit is for

18:26a detached ADU and 12 for internal ADUs. Almost all, they're almost all basement conversions.

18:33At a minimum, five more units are anticipated to be incented in the near future and are at various

18:39stages of approval. Two of these are for detached units and two would be dependent on the approval

18:44of this amendment. One of these units would be the first fourth unit on a low-density residential

18:49property in the city since the OPA and ZBA were approved by council last year to prevent four units.

18:56If current allocated funds are exhausted by the program's conclusion in December,

19:002026, it's estimated that up to 28 units could be incented, inclusive of already approved units,

19:07with the current program criteria in place. The ADU grant program is nearing the halfway mark.

19:16As staff had received inquiries about the increased flexibility within the program,

19:20staff felt a review of the program was beneficial to determine what changes could be made to the

19:26program criteria to increase applicant interest without impacting existing approved applications.

19:32In August 2025, staff initiated a comprehensive review of the program.

19:38Feedback received from potential applicants included interest in funding for more than one

19:43unit on a property under the homeowner stream. Feedback received suggests funding caps in combination

19:49with existing affordability terms could be contributing to lack of uptake in the project

19:54stream. Feedback indicated that increases to funding for infrastructure upgrades may help

19:59support interest in the project stream, but the current economic climate is challenging for

20:04building units, even with incentives. Feedback received also included interest in funding for

20:09more than one project on different properties. Changes are proposed to increase uptake in the

20:17program and aim to provide more flexibility for potential applicants while not making changes

20:22that would be out of line with already approved applications. Proposed changes were informed

20:28by inquiries and feedback received from potential applicants. Changes have been targeted to the

20:33project stream and homeowner stream, and changes aim to make eligibility requirements more flexible

20:39across both streams and to increase funding in specific scenarios with limited uptake.

20:45A draft of the ADU grant amendment was circulated to the Ministry of Municipal Affairs and Housing

20:50for comment. Comments were received from the ministry and these administrative changes have

20:54also been reflected in the amendment. First, I will go through the changes proposed to the

21:01homeowner stream of the program. There are no changes proposed to the funding amounts for the

21:06construction grant. This amount is proposed to remain at the current 20,000 per unit. There are

21:11no changes proposed to the funding amounts for the accessibility features grant. This amount is

21:16proposed to remain at 10,000 per unit. Proposed changes include changing the municipal infrastructure

21:22upgrades grant by removing the set amount of 20,000 per project and replacing it with a tiered

21:28funding approach that also includes funding for private utility service upgrades in certain scenarios.

21:35As well, increasing the number of units eligible for funding on a property from one to three.

21:40This is to support interest in funding for more than one unit and permitting an applicant to

21:46receive funding for multiple projects under the ADU grant program. For example, this means a homeowner

21:51could receive funding for a second or third ADU after already receiving funding for an ADU on the

21:57same property or a homeowner could receive funding for a project on the property in which they live

22:02under the homeowner stream and funding for projects on one or more rental properties under the project

22:08stream. This proposed change supports interest in receiving funding for more than one project.

22:17Next, I will go through the changes proposed to the project stream of the program.

22:22Staff propose to increase the funding amount for the construction grant from 10,000 per unit to

22:2715,000 per unit. This change aims to make the project stream more advantageous with more funds

22:33for upfront costs of construction and to provide funding more comparable to that of the homeowner

22:39stream. The funding levels in the homeowner stream remain higher to support circumstances where

22:44there might be limited familiarity with the permitting process and the potential for unforeseen

22:49financial costs. There are no changes proposed to the funding amounts for the accessibility

22:54features grant. This amount is proposed to remain at 10,000 per unit. Staff propose to change the

23:00municipal infrastructure upgrades grant by removing the set amount of 20,000 per project

23:05and replacing it with the tiered funding approach that also includes funding for private utility

23:10service upgrades and certain scenarios. Staff propose to remove the current cap of six units

23:16as eligible for funding under a single project. There would be no cap on number of eligible units.

23:22This change aims to provide funding for projects with a larger number of units.

23:27Finally, as discussed earlier, staff are proposing to allow an applicant to receive funding for

23:32multiple projects under the ADU grant program. While the criteria for what is considered a

23:37single project or property or project for the ADU grant program is not proposed to change,

23:43staff have included clarification. This clarification includes that at the time of a CIP application,

23:50an applicant may be concurrently applying to subdivide their property so that what was originally

23:55one property can result in more than one property. Each of these properties can be considered as part

24:00of one project under the project stream. For both streams, there is currently 20,000 in funding

24:12available per project if municipal infrastructure upgrades to the public realm within the city right

24:17of way or street is required for a project of any scale. Municipal infrastructure for the purposes

24:23of this grant includes water and wastewater infrastructure. A tiered funding approach is

24:28proposed to replace the flat amount of 20,000 per project. The tiered funding approach adds

24:34additional funding for projects where the ADU proposed is the third or fourth unit on the property

24:40or where there are multiple ADUs being added as part of a single project. The table on the screen

24:45shows the amount of funding available per projects that add one ADU where the unit will be the second

24:51unit on the property. There are no proposed changes to funding available for these types of projects

24:56with 20,000 remaining available for municipal infrastructure upgrades. In some instances,

25:04when multiple ADUs are added to a property, proponents may be faced with the need to upgrade

25:09hydroelectric utility services. This includes work to be completed within the city's right of

25:14way or street and on private property. Private utility service upgrades can come as unexpected

25:20with high cost, which can increase with the number of units being added to a property.

25:24A funding approach has been designed to provide a grant for these costs when jumps and costs are

25:29anticipated to occur, as well as additional funding for municipal infrastructure upgrades

25:34for larger projects. The funding approach is designed to reflect the potential increased costs

25:39associated with adding additional units beyond a single ADU to a property, as well as to provide

25:45financial incentive to add multiple ADUs as part of a single project at once. The table on the screen

25:52shows the amount of funding available for infrastructure upgrades for projects that add one ADU,

25:57which will be the third or fourth unit on the property, and projects that add multiple ADUs

26:02as part of a single project. In these scenarios, funding is available for private utility service

26:07upgrades within the city, right of way or street, and on private property, up to including the meter

26:12base if required for a project, in addition to funding for municipal infrastructure upgrades.

26:18If an applicant is adding one ADU that is the third or fourth unit on the property,

26:2320,000 is available. If a proponent is adding two ADUs as part of a single project, then 40,000

26:29is available. And for a project of three or more ADUs, 60,000 is available. That concludes my overview

26:38of the proposed amendment. City staff are recommending that the amendment to the Affordable Housing

26:44Community Improvement Plan, additional dwelling unit grant program, be received by council, and

26:48that the amendment be approved. If the amendment is approved by council, then changes will be

27:00incorporated into the Affordable Housing Community Improvement Plan program document. And if the

27:04amendment is passed, the changes proposed will be in effect in January following the statutory

27:09appeal period. Thank you, and I'm happy to take questions. Fantastic. Ms. Manley, thanks for the

27:16presentation. I'm sure we have a lot of questions, and we do have a delegation, but any questions

27:22of clarification or would my fellow councillors prefer to have the delegation first, then we'll

27:29ask and answer questions. Okay, we have one delegation on this item. Mr. Eric Martin. Mr.

27:35Martin, because this is an item under the Planning Act, you have 10 minutes to speak at the 32nd

27:44mark before the end of the 10 minutes. You'll hear a ding, and the mic will be turned off at 10

27:48minutes. And then I'll remind anyone watching this evening or in the gallery that at the conclusion

27:54of this delegation will take a pause. And if you are interested in delegating on this item,

28:00please identify yourself. The floor is all yours. Thank you. I'm here to speak in favor of the

28:08amendment, and I want to recognize that the efforts the staff have put into this, it certainly seems

28:15like they initiated this review. And as a result, this amendment's coming forward. So credit to the

28:21staff. I'm going to do a little case study here. Not my problem, is it? Yeah, the microphone's on.

28:39Oh, it just turned off. There we go. Okay. So I've built, I've completed two ADUs in Guelph.

28:49The first one on the left was over a year ago, and then in September I moved into the one on the

28:55right. So I've had some experience dealing with the staff and and the reviewing the requirements

29:03of the eligibility. This one's under construction right now. It's a two-bedroom. So the first two

29:11were one bedrooms, 425 square feet each. And this one is a two-bedroom, and it's under construction.

29:18Should be ready in February. I should say I haven't, I haven't accepted any or I haven't

29:28signed any documents for any any incentives yet. This is the layout of the two-bedroom.

29:36I had another slide in here for Councillor Allt, but my presentation was too big, so I had to take

29:41it out, but it showed how the efforts we had gone through to save mature trees on the property.

29:46And also for the next agenda item, this is on one of the streets that's in the orange color,

29:53so it could have held, it could have held four or five units. Okay, so this is a case study that

30:03it's a real, it's my place. So it's the two-bedroom and what costs go into it, and so you'll see as

30:10we go through, hopefully I'm making a clear case. So it starts out, the contractor wins $300,000,

30:19and then the upgrade in the public realm on the on the city street is $27,000. When you add an

30:25HST to that, you're up over $30,000 to increase the size of the water pipe from the middle of the

30:31street to the unit. So that's a huge cost. Then of course there's HST, there's no development charges

30:38except there are for the school, and then you might have to repair the fence or things, so

30:44there's other stuff. Anyway, the total cost to build that 850 square foot house is $400,000.

30:53Let the comments begin about cost per square foot. And what would you rent it for? So in Guelph,

30:59a two-bedroom apartment, now this is just an apartment in Guelph. We typically cost between

31:04$2,200 and $2,700 per month. Many things influence that price. The location of the apartment, the

31:11neighborhood, there's up, you know, different rates, the size of the apartment, and then what's got

31:18parking, or it's got utilities, or it's got laundry, or the age of the unit. So this one that

31:27will be completed in February, it's an entire detached house, everything will be brand spanking

31:32new. There's going to have six appliances, one parking spot, custom designed kitchen,

31:38all electric heat and cooling, utilities aren't included. So what would that rent for? So I break

31:46even at $2,300. So that's what I set the rent at, because I've been doing this since 1981. I don't

31:55need to put money in my pocket, but I'm not going to take money out of my pocket to do it either.

32:03So the operating costs, you'll see the $2,300 is highlighted. So this is the operating costs

32:07without the grant. So you've got a $400,000 mortgage, you've got property taxes, insurance,

32:14and that's pretty much it, because the tenants are going to pay the utilities. So at $2,300,

32:21I have $75 a month for maintenance, or about $900 a year for maintenance, and that's pretty much

32:27break even. Then if I accept the grant, the only thing that changes is the mortgage now is $365,000,

32:36same interest rate, the payment goes down, but the property taxes, insurance are all the same.

32:43Now the rent's $1740, which is the amount in the schedule. So I'm losing $315 per month,

32:51or $3775 per year to accept that grant. So if you put them side by side, in the first case,

33:00if I don't accept the grant, I'm making $900 a year for maintenance, so I'm breaking even,

33:09but if I accept the grant, I lose $3,775 in a year. But it's not just for one year, right? It's for

33:1815 years. So the total cost to me to accept the grant is $70,000, and I think that's why

33:27there hasn't been much uptake. And so the staff changes that are proposed will improve that,

33:32but these are the grant amounts that, this is the updated grant amount. So then the last slide is

33:42that it would cost, if I was to be in the same position, these are where the comments are going

33:51to really go crazy. If I was to be in the same position, it was $75 a month for maintenance,

33:56the incentive would need to be $115,000. Now I know the staff presentation did remark that

34:05there's costs. I don't know exactly how it was worded, but yeah, that's kind of what I've got here.

34:15And I think that's the last slide. One thing I would like to slay, does it go back?

34:21Oops. So the city made a change in 2025. Oh, did it go off? I blew it up. It doesn't need a slide.

34:32The city made a change in 2025. So the first unit I built was the simplest,

34:37easier to follow rules. Everyone has gotten more and more complicated. So there are more and more

34:42barriers. Sometimes the city is just the messenger saying the province has required this or whatever,

34:47but one that could be so easily fixed, I think. The first house I built had a three-quarter inch

34:56waterline from the street. I miss it. It doesn't really matter. You don't need this slide. I had a

35:08three-quarter inch waterline from the street and there it is, upgrade water on city street. So I

35:14had three-quarter inch waterline on the city street. It was a bungalow, three-bedroom up, two down,

35:22and they said, okay, you just put a one-inch pipe out to the curb and when we upgrade the street,

35:28we'll take care of that. It was like, great. So that cost zero and the people have been living

35:35there now since October of a year ago. So we're up to 14 months. No problems with the water,

35:41but somebody in the city decided no more three-quarter inch pipes. Flat out, doesn't matter.

35:48Got to be upgraded to one inch. So that's between $27,000 and $33,000 for that pipe.

35:57And I just wanted to raise that because I'm here. Okay. I'm done.

36:04Thank you very much, Mr. Martin. A very informative presentation. Are there any

36:08questions from members of council? Councillor Goller?

36:12Thank you for your presentation, Mr. Martin, and thank you for building the Sheldon Units

36:16here in the city. Could you help me understand? You said that you supported the staff recommendation.

36:22So could you help me understand that would the additional units allowed on the same lot? Would

36:28that make the difference? Because you showed what the dollar amount for a grant to make you whole,

36:36but is the staff recommendation, does that get closer to making you whole?

36:39Yeah, I'm not. I was showing you that, but I'll go ahead. So I had applied with staff,

36:45working with them. We put it all on hold when the review started. So I could have gotten one.

36:51I could have gotten the homeowner one in the summer and they said wait and see. So it turns out

36:58that was a good decision because I can still get the homeowner one and it won't change anything.

37:03So that'll probably go ahead this week. And then the other one I'll qualify for. So it'll end up,

37:13that'll get up to, it's always up to 40,000 for the homeowner one and now up to 35 for the

37:24two bedroom one. And I don't know, I didn't quite understand the rules about stacking up. If I

37:31change the hydro base, I'll have to go back and talk to staff. So there could be a little bit more.

37:35But so I am going to go ahead and, you know, the $70,000 out of my pocket one,

37:42I'm going to do it anyway. But if you could raise it to 115,

37:50I just don't know where the other 20 million went. So if you're hoping to get 20 units,

37:55I bet, I could bet of 10 of those 11 that are finished got up to 20,000. So there's 200,000.

38:02And then the 11th detached one could have gotten up to 40,000. So you're only at 240.

38:09I don't know. I'll be asking stuff about that. But thank you.

38:12Ask them about the pipe too. Thank you very much. Thank you.

38:16Thank you. Okay. Thank you. We had a question as well from Margot three.

38:23Thank you madam chair and through you to the delegate.

38:27Thank you very much for showing us your pro forma. You know, I wish actually more people would do

38:32that. I think it is a good education lesson for us to understand sort of the economies of scale

38:39that are into these types of projects and what people like yourself and others are up against

38:45in this type of a market. But I just wanted to say like on a flip side,

38:53you are giving us your pro forma based on this kind of larger ad you that you're building a

38:58detached ad you. And I guess as the staff presentation said of the, I think many, the

39:07majority of the ad use that were used in the last year with the grants, they were mostly

39:15basement apartments. And what I'm trying to get at is that a basement apartment probably won't

39:21cost $398,000 to build, right? So a basement apartment might be $80,000 to $100,000 maybe

39:32depending like a third or a quarter of the cost of what yours is as a separate detached ad you.

39:39So do you, so my question is, do you think that what staff are presenting today

39:45will incent more of the ad use that you are trying to build the detached actual backyard

39:53sort of tiny homes? Or do you think that what is being proposed is still going to favor

39:59from a pro forma point of view the basement apartments that are getting built at the date?

40:07It's the basement apartments. Awesome. Have a good day. Thank you very much.

40:13I have a question from Councillor Downer. Thank you, through you, Madam Chair. So this is just

40:18more of a curiosity thing looking at your case studies. So when you're doing a separate ad you

40:25in the backyard, like you've completely 100% mortgaged it. You don't need to put a downpain.

40:31You don't need to. It has to be 100%. Right. But even if I did, I would want a 4% return, wouldn't I?

40:39Yes. Yes. No, that's, I'm just curious about that. Yeah. But an investment perspective. Yeah,

40:45it's all leveraged job. Thank you. But it's creating housing and it's not taking money out of my pocket.

40:50So are there any further questions from members of council? Okay. Thanks. Thank you very much for

40:58your delegation. We will put a number up on the screen. If anyone at home would like to comment

41:05on this agenda item, please call in. Is there anyone in the gallery that would like to speak

41:12to this agenda item? I'm seeing none. So we're just going to take a few minutes pause,

41:18wait for any phone calls that might arise. While we're waiting for any phone calls to come in,

42:05I just want to note that agenda item 2.2, which was a public meeting and decision on the Hanlon

42:12Creek Business Park phase three, housekeeping amendments, this item has been removed from

42:17the agenda. So if there is anyone here or at home who's waiting for that agenda item to come,

42:22it will not be on tonight's, on tonight's docket. Okay. We did not have any phone calls. So we're

43:18going to move forward on this agenda item. We have a staff recommendation. If we could get

43:22that placed on the floor and then we're going to open it up for questions. So moved by Councillor

43:26Gowler. Do we have a seconder? Seconded by Mayor Guthrie. Questions and comments. Councillor Goller

43:32and we'll start a speakers list. So put up your hand. Okay. Great. Councillor Goller. Thank you.

43:38And through you, Chair, to staff, thank you for the presentation and thank you for coming forward

43:43with these changes. I would love to hear a little bit about those 11 units that have been

43:49incented. Could you tell us, you know, like what sort of, what type of units they are and that if

43:55they have been built and are they providing affordable rental housing at this time?

44:02Through the chair to Councillor Goller. So of the 11 now 13 actually units that we have

44:10approved. One of those units is for a detached ADU and the rest are internal ADU. So a mix of

44:17basement units as well as some just internal on the main floor of the unit itself. A few are built

44:25and are now being rented out at an affordable rental rate. Okay. That's fantastic to hear.

44:31Thank you. Thank you so much. And with regards to some questions that I had previously when

44:39this was came forward and also does the delegate mentioned, there is certainly a gap in what the

44:46funding provides to make the property owner whole. So could you help me understand with these changes

44:55how many more units are you expecting based on what you've heard that will be applying

45:00based on these changes? Through the chair to Councillor Goller.

45:07It will depend. We do know of some instances where the changes are depend or what we're proposing.

45:15Units could move forward and the amendments that we're proposing are required to move forward in

45:19order for those units to be approved. What we are seeing though is that what we want to do is increase

45:25the potential and the number of pathways for which a project can proceed and which it makes

45:30financial sense to do so. And that's what we're proposing here. Okay. Okay. No, I appreciate it.

45:36And will there be a threshold at which you may review the program and come back with more changes

45:44or do you expect that these changes will be sufficient to sort of use up the rest of the funds?

45:52Through the chair. We are limited on time. So that is the major factor here. We have until

46:00the fall, if not the winter to make sure that the money is spent, the building permits are issued

46:05and illegal agreements are signed. So we are limited by that factor. If the program is of

46:12interest, we can of course look to do further amendments, but time is a limiting factor here.

46:18Okay. Okay. I really appreciate it. And just one last question to you, Madam Chair.

46:24The applicants, have they all been private individuals or have some of them in nonprofit

46:29organizations operating in the city just to understand who is applying for these?

46:36Through the chair. At this time, it has been primarily homeowners who are applying. We have

46:42had interest from not-for-profit organizations. They've had various intake meetings, but of the

46:47approved applications we have are all homeowners. Thank you. This is fantastic. Thank you so much

46:53for this work. Thank you, Chair. Thank you. Our accounts are down next and then Mayor Guthrie.

46:59Thanks for you, Chair. So the question I have, the rental rates, the affordable rental rates,

47:06so the one bedroom of 1598, does that include, I forget, does that include utilities or is that

47:13just the rent? It's up to the owner if they would like to have that amount include utilities or not,

47:24but there is the option to charge utilities on top of that affordable rental rate. So that's the

47:29base, right? Okay. So that's the base and okay. So they couldn't charge more than that and have

47:37utilities in? No, that's the maximum amount they could charge. So they could charge utilities on

47:42top of that. So and I understand these are registered on title. So if somebody sells the

47:50property, it goes with the property. What happens if the, so say you, they get into the

47:58the homeowner grant as a homeowner and they decide to move out of that house and rent out the primary

48:05dwelling unit that they were living in, say what happens in that situation? So they can just rent

48:10out their primary, but see then they wouldn't be the homeowner. So I'm just trying to think

48:14how does that work? Through the chair. So there is a requirement that the homeowner live on the

48:22property for the duration of the 15 year affordability term. Okay. So they have to stay there for 15

48:30years on the property if they get in under that grant. So the monitoring that how are we going to

48:38monitor these? I mean, it's, you know, I'm just curious about, I'm just worried about over the

48:45years, over five or six years, like the programs done with and how are we going to continue to

48:50monitor these and have accountability? So through the chair, as part of the legal agreement, there's

48:57a requirement that the property owner submit an annual declaration letter to the city,

49:02stipulating that they are charging the rent at the affordable rate for that specific year.

49:07And as part of that legal agreement, the city can ask for a rental receipts or a copy of

49:12the lease agreement as well, just to confirm that the rents are at the appropriate rate.

49:16So we ask for the declaration, but we don't ask for that supporting documents to come with the

49:21declaration? Through the chair, we can ask for it if we have concern that the that the rental

49:27rate is, is not. But it's not, they don't have to do that. They don't, it's just a declaration they

49:32provide every year. At the outset, yes. Just my thought, I would think that you would ask for

49:40those automatically, the copies of the rent receipts or the leases on an annual basis too.

49:47You could go a long time with just putting in a declaration and rents going up, right? So I just,

49:56seeing how some of these things happen, I would be very concerned about the

50:00accountability and monitoring of this program over the years. Just, just a suggestion.

50:08I'll leave that you're doing the implementation. So I would leave that up to you and that's fine.

50:14That's all my questions. Thanks. Mayor Guthrie. Thank you very much, Madam Chair, and through you.

50:25I just, I appreciate that staff have reviewed this. I think that's healthy. And I think it was

50:33raised, I think at the outset several months ago when we started the program that we were,

50:37you know, maybe a little bit concerned just about what the uptake was going to be. So your

50:42monitoring of this program was very wise because that's why we're here today. I just wanted to

50:50ask though, you did in the report show that you were looking at maybe some other municipalities

50:57and seeing what they were doing. And I'm just wondering, there are some that are sort of in

51:04the same realm as us and what's being proposed today, but there are others that are seeing

51:11what I'm hearing is a lot of uptake and it's because the grants are more. So I'll just give an

51:17example like Burlington is $95,000. Like, you know, there's lots that are getting more uptake

51:27because the incentive is higher. So we got this 21 million bucks from the Housing Accelerator Fund.

51:34We do have to spend the money. What is your, what was your work to qualify and quantify that

51:45what's proposed today is going to drastically increase more ADUs with the incentive today

51:54versus what might be more in, more of them built if there was a larger incentive such as Burlington

52:02or another city that is doing a lot more with a tight timeframe to get these additional units done.

52:10Sorry, just excuse me on the, and by the way, I'm not suggesting we change anything here. I don't

52:15know. I'm just giving an example, but Burlington's a 10-year commitment, not even, not a 15-year.

52:22So you can get almost $100,000 from Burlington with a 10-year commitment. And so I'm just wondering

52:28why did you find this sweet spot today for us and do you really think we're going to see a huge

52:36uptake compared to what others are doing? Through the chair to the mayor. So through this amendment,

52:45we are limited to what we have on title already, the existing legal agreements we

52:50have registered with other applicants on title. So if we're to go outside the bounds of that,

52:54it could affect those, those legal agreements. We could potentially have to go back and review

52:59them. For example, if we were to increase the funding amounts, we would have to go back and

53:04potentially give those units and those homeowners opening up those legal agreements and looking at

53:10those already awarded applications already. So that's why that's what we're operating under

53:16and the kind of confines that this program amendment is coming to council under.

53:21And sorry, through the chair, if I may add too to the mayor. So on this came to council for the

53:26first time, council actually had some discussion about having this at 25 years and our staff

53:32recommendation was 15 years. So we, we did stand strong on that at the previous one and we ended

53:39up with 15 years. And that was contrary to some of the comments we did here from council that evening.

53:46Yeah, thank you. Okay, I appreciate the sort of legal and reopening agreements

53:53answer from staff, Madam Chair, but I am just still just trying to kind of squeeze out an

54:00answer. If there is one, what do you think is actually going to be given for incentives?

54:06Is there a crystal ball moment here where you think, hey, council, we're going to get 50 more

54:11of these affordable housing units done? Or is it a completely unknown based on what you're proposing

54:18today? What I'm supportive of, by the way, 100%. I just want to know, is there, is there some feedback

54:24and numbers where you think we are going to actually start to see these being built?

54:31Through the chair to the, to the mayor. So for the half funding, we had targeted 40 units. So that

54:37is, that is the amount of half funding that was allocated to this particular program. So we're at

54:4113 now. With the project stream being opened up a little bit, I know we're going to be making some

54:48calls if this gets approved and talk to some of those folks to see if we can push that a little bit.

54:53And the intent is to continue with the homeowner's stream because that really does make an impact

54:57and across, across the city and then push some of the projects as well to see if we can get to that 40.

55:03Okay. Thank you. Two more quick ones. You can still stack.

55:08For you, Madam chair, you can still stack like the Guelph-Greener homes incentive program on top

55:12of this one. I'm just putting it out in the public so everyone knows. Through the mayor, or through

55:17the chair to the mayor. Yes. Okay, great. Thank you. And my final one, I think I have now forgotten.

55:25So I don't think everyone's probably pleased about that. So yeah, I forgot my third one. But

55:32other than that, I appreciate you answering my questions. Thank you, Madam chair.

55:37Thank you, Mayor Guthrie. Are there any further questions or comments on this item?

55:42I don't see any hands up. I have a quick question. I'm picking up where councillor Downer left off

55:46about the homeowner, the owner occupied bit. 15 years is a long time for an owner occupied

55:54commitment. If a homeowner were to sell a property where this affordable housing was built using

56:01this grant money and the new owner did not live on site, what would that do to the grant? Would

56:08there be a rollback or a percentage where that break the contract? Through the chair. So there is

56:15a sliding repayment schedule that's included as part of the legal agreement. So depending on the

56:20particular year that a homeowner or a new property owner wanted to exit the program, they would repay

56:26at least some portion of the grant back. It is sliding. So for example, if that homeowner were

56:31to exit the program in year two, it would be more punitive than if the homeowner were to exit the

56:37program in year 12 or year 13 as an example. Okay, that's great. And then building on Mayor,

56:44Guthrie's question, I too was going to ask about stacking the Guelph-Greiner Homes grants on top

56:48of that because we know that utilities and rising energy costs is part of the affordability equation.

56:55When an applicant approaches you, are you encouraging the net zero, the building of renewables,

57:03so that utility costs over that 15-year period are lowered and increasing the affordability

57:09calculations? Through the chair, yes, we are. And we, and all of our intake meetings, tell the

57:15applicants about the Guelph-Greiner Homes program and encourage them to go to the city's website to

57:19find out more information and to apply. Wonderful. Thank you so much for that and thank you to the

57:23planning team that put these recommendations together. Seeing no more questions or comments,

57:28we'll call the vote. Is there anyone opposed to the motions on the floor? I'm seeing none,

57:34so that motion is carried. Thanks so much. We'll move on to the next item, which is a discussion

57:39item. This is exploring the potential for five-plus units, and we have a presentation,