Approves the draft by-law 2024-20944, as attached to this report, and that staff be directed to place the by-law on the July 23, 2024…

50:13property standards bylaw amendment 2024267

50:18and we have two delegations on that matter.

50:22There's no presentations.

50:23So I'll go straight to the presentation.

50:26Is Susan Watson here?

50:27Is she joining us?

50:28She's joining us by telephone.

50:31Okay.

50:33Hello.

50:35Hi, Ms. Watson.

50:36You know the drill, right?

50:38Five minutes and then there'll be a warning beforehand.

50:42I do and I'm just telling you,

50:43I'm actually driving in Northern Ontario,

50:46so self-service of body.

50:48So let's hope I,

50:50and I just have a very short few things today,

50:52but that's my situation.

50:56Don't be distracted.

50:58Okay.

51:00So I wanna say that I am in favor of moving ahead

51:03with enhanced heritage property protections.

51:08I think it's long overdue,

51:10but I am concerned that it doesn't apply to buildings

51:13which are on the heritage register

51:16that it only applies to designated buildings.

51:20I'm unclear why the cost implications

51:22in the report are none,

51:24because if we're going to have proactive inspection

51:27of heritage buildings,

51:28then that is going to cost money.

51:31I think what is actually critically needed

51:34in addition to the bylaw support today

51:36for heritage building is that we actually need

51:39a comprehensive city-wide vacant buildings registry

51:44like the city of Hamilton has.

51:47In Hamilton, property owners with a vacant building

51:50pay a registration fee to that city,

51:53and then they also pay an annual fee,

51:56which covers the cost of quarterly inspections,

51:59and they're defined for non-compliance.

52:02So I think that such a registry in Guelph

52:04would serve to protect also heritage buildings

52:07which are not designated,

52:09as well as protecting vital housing stock

52:12throughout the city.

52:13So I support the bylaw for you,

52:16but I think a vacant housing registry

52:18is also desperately needed as well.

52:21Thank you.

52:23Okay, thank you.

52:24Are there any questions of the delegation?

52:29Okay, seeing none.

52:31Thank you.

52:32You're welcome.

52:33That's why I say,

52:36okay, so the next delegation is Werner Zimmerman.

52:51Thank you very much, council members,

52:55councillor Downer.

52:57I'm here just representing myself,

52:59but I think I carry the feelings of many others.

53:04First of all, I applaud the bylaw.

53:06I think it's wonderful.

53:08It's great.

53:09But what makes Guelph really unique

53:13is the aspect of the older city,

53:19the architecture,

53:20and the standard of it being maintained.

53:24And just having a standard for heritage buildings,

53:29it sort of forgets about the neighborhoods,

53:32the overall look,

53:34and I think something has to be done to extend that

53:37so that not only a building is maintained,

53:41that's designated as heritage,

53:43but the look of a neighborhood,

53:44whereas sometimes vacant buildings are left,

53:47they're older,

53:48and as they crumble,

53:51they disappear because of neglect.

53:54Something happens to the neighborhood,

53:56to the look of the city.

53:57When we travel,

53:58we often look at the surroundings around us.

54:02We just don't go for one building

54:03or one little unique spot.

54:06And so I just hope in the future

54:08that consideration is given

54:10that this standard is extended in some way

54:17that the uniqueness of neighborhoods

54:20that have sort of a heritage quality to them

54:25is considered, okay?

54:28That's really it.

54:29Thank you.

54:30Okay, thank you.

54:31Are there any questions for Mr. Zemehman?

54:35Okay, thanks.

54:36Okay, thanks, I appreciate.

54:38Okay, would somebody please put the motion on the floor?

54:41Councillor Altsakated by Councillor Seniors' moment

54:49already, right?

54:52And are there any questions or of staff?

54:56We'll go to questions first and then comments.

55:03Okay, Councillor Kerr-Ran.

55:05Yeah, thank you.

55:07Chair Ganners.

55:08This has been on the city's radar

55:12since the amendment to the Heritage Act in I think 2005.

55:16So it's been a long time coming.

55:19So I'm really, really happy to see this come forward.

55:23The delegation who asked about registered properties,

55:26I know we're in this kind of quandary right now

55:28where we have two years,

55:29unless that changes and is extended,

55:31where the heritage register won't exist beyond 20 years.

55:37So I wonder if staff can address kind of that gap

55:44that we're gonna find ourselves in,

55:47where we have identified via the register properties

55:50that are worthy of designation.

55:53We just don't have the capacity to designate them

55:55and how those properties could potentially be added

56:00to this protection by law that we're proposing.

56:03Otherwise they fall under the regular standards

56:05of our property standards as any other property would.

56:08But I do think that the situation

56:10that we have found ourselves in,

56:11which is demolition by neglect,

56:14is more at risk of registered buildings

56:17and not designated buildings.

56:19And can you address how we might fill that gap?

56:25Who's going to answer that question?

56:30Ms. Walkie.

56:31Thank you, Chair Janner.

56:33So at the time of writing the report,

56:35the legislation was that the listed property registry

56:40expired at the end of 2024.

56:42So January 1st, 2025,

56:44it has been extended to January 1st, 2027.

56:47We have only kept the designated property.

56:52There are getting close to 300 of those right now.

56:56If we looked at the listed properties, which is 1700,

57:00then there would be staffing and financial impacts

57:03to that as well.

57:06Suggestion that we add vacant properties,

57:10on the vacant properties that are also

57:13on the heritage register,

57:14is that a possibility and what additional resources

57:17would be needed to inspect and protect those in?

57:25Through the chair to Councillor Caron,

57:29currently right now, any vacant property

57:31that comes to our attention, we are inspecting.

57:34So if a property was on that list

57:39or was not on the list,

57:40if we are identified that it is vacant,

57:43we are doing proactive patrols of it.

57:47Then last but not least,

57:49the bylaw speaks mostly to residential,

57:52but we have other non-residential such as bridges.

57:58Is there a provision for that?

58:01Or again, those would be engineering standards

58:04rather than residential building standards.

58:12Through the chair, currently the focus is on residential,

58:15but it is something we can take away and take a look at.

58:19Okay, great. I'll follow up on that.

58:23Okay, thank you.

58:24Councillor Gibson was next.

58:27I think he had it.

58:27And then Councillor Oak and Councillor Rower.

58:29Thank you, through you, Chair Downer.

58:30So I think I understand the bylaw

58:33as it pertains to designated properties.

58:36And I'm assuming staff have done a calibration

58:38on what that means across the city.

58:40But anytime council now talks about any expansion

58:43of this bylaw to say a registry

58:46or a listed property,

58:48I'm assuming that staff would immediately be able

58:50to help us calibrate that decision-making

58:52in terms of the number of properties that are impacted

58:56or I guess would be wrapped around by this bylaw.

58:59I guess it's always just,

59:01it's always apparent to me that we need to be careful

59:04when we make decisions around council, around heritage,

59:08specifically when we need to understand what that means

59:10in terms of the number of properties.

59:12So our staff able to,

59:14like if council was to make decisive changes

59:18or additions to this bylaw,

59:20would staff be prepared to help us understand the size

59:25and scope of that decision?

59:30Through the Chair, to Councillor Gibson,

59:32we would obviously report back.

59:35Currently we are aware that's approximately 300 properties

59:38that we are proactively inspecting.

59:40So every time that a property is added,

59:42that would become part of that inspection list.

59:46Right, thank you.

59:46And through you, Chair, I did hear the number 1700 though.

59:49Is that the number of properties that are on the registry?

59:52So if we were to look to include the registry properties

59:57on the bylaw, that would be a sizable increase.

1:00:03Through the Chair, to Councillor Gibson, yes.

1:00:06If we were to add that registry,

1:00:08there would be obviously a staffing impact

1:00:10or resource impact to conduct all those inspections.

1:00:13Currently the amount 300 were able to do

1:00:16with existing resources.

1:00:19Right, thank you.

1:00:20And I guess my last question through you, Chair Downer,

1:00:21is that if a decision like that from council

1:00:24was brought forward and tabled,

1:00:26I'm assuming that staff's strong recommendation

1:00:29would be that this would again,

1:00:32it would cause another round of public consultation

1:00:35for this bylaw.

1:00:36Because then all of a sudden we'd go from 300 properties

1:00:38to 1700 properties.

1:00:39That's 1400 more landowners that are unaware

1:00:43that they're potentially impacted by this bylaw.

1:00:45I would assume that staff would request more time

1:00:47to consult public.

1:00:51Through the Chair, to Councillor Gibson, that is correct.

1:00:53We, as part of this review, they were not consulted

1:00:57because they weren't impacted.

1:00:58If they were now to be impacted,

1:00:59we would request to go and seek information

1:01:03from them or input from them.

1:01:05Okay, thank you.

1:01:05I think that's deeply critical to this conversation.

1:01:08Thank you.

1:01:10Okay, thank you.

1:01:11So Councillor Allt.

1:01:13Thank you Chair Downer.

1:01:14And this is just a comment, but I do wanna thank both.

1:01:18Sorry, just questions now.

1:01:19I'm just doing questions.

1:01:20I'll come back to you then for comments.

1:01:23Councillor Goller.

1:01:24Thank you, and through you, Chair Downer.

1:01:27Thank you for bringing the bylaw forward.

1:01:29I do have a question about the increased cost

1:01:33to residents.

1:01:34When we recommend they replicate the original

1:01:38or the day repair rather than replace,

1:01:40sometimes the cost will be higher to do that,

1:01:44you know, the fixing too much original.

1:01:47So is there any provision to effectively reimburse

1:01:52or provide some service support for those property owners?

1:01:54We're saying if you're going to fix your home

1:01:56because it's got a plaque on it,

1:01:58it's going to cost you more than

1:02:01than you would otherwise have to pay.

1:02:03So is there any provision to support

1:02:05with those increased costs?

1:02:13Through the chair to Councillor Goller.

1:02:15So at this point it's, it is really like a maintenance bylaw

1:02:19and we're expecting the maintenance

1:02:20of the heritage attributes on the property.

1:02:22There is nothing in this bylaw to provide funding

1:02:26to repair or replicate heritage attributes.

1:02:32At this point it's the property standards bylaw

1:02:34and can having minimum maintenance for it.

1:02:39Right, so there's no way that they can get

1:02:44reimburse for this work.

1:02:46Okay, is there any work being done to sort of acknowledge

1:02:50that we are asking people to pay more

1:02:53to bring this up to the standard

1:02:54that you know, to maintain the heritage designation?

1:03:00Through the chair to the Councillor

1:03:02as part of the ward West Heritage Conservation District,

1:03:06one of the commitments from that study was to look at

1:03:10if there is an incentive program,

1:03:11if there is an incentive program

1:03:13that would be brought back to council as a whole

1:03:15and if there's heritage incentives,

1:03:16but it's definitely not part of this bylaw at this time.

1:03:19Okay, thank you for that.

1:03:20Thank you chair.

1:03:21Thank you, I just have one question.

1:03:23Do you have a question too?

1:03:24Yes.

1:03:25Councillor Cossin.

1:03:27Yes, through you chair Downer to staff.

1:03:30I have two questions.

1:03:31The first is with regard to a vacant building registry

1:03:34for all of Guelph.

1:03:36This is referring to delegate Watson's statement.

1:03:42My understanding is that we did discuss

1:03:45a vacant building tax.

1:03:49I'm not sure if we have or where we are

1:03:52with the consideration of a citywide

1:03:54vacant building registry.

1:03:56Is this something that you could speak to?

1:04:03Through you chair Downer to Councillor Cossin.

1:04:06The topic of vacant home tax and registry

1:04:09has come before council on a number of occasions.

1:04:11Staff continue to look at ways to manage the data sets.

1:04:15The challenge is the availability of data

1:04:17and the ability to aggregate it

1:04:19and provide you with a comprehensive policy consideration

1:04:23is the challenge.

1:04:24So we are continuing to address that.

1:04:28Okay, thank you.

1:04:28And should we expect some sort of report in the near future?

1:04:34If you chair Downer to a Councillor Cossin,

1:04:35I will confer with my colleagues

1:04:37and see what I can get for an answer

1:04:39as quick as I can for you.

1:04:41Thank you.

1:04:42And my second question is with regard to the mechanism

1:04:45for residents to be able to, you know,

1:04:48if there's a concern with property standards

1:04:50for a heritage building,

1:04:52will that mechanism continue to be through

1:04:54the report a problem app

1:04:56or will there be something separate as a consideration?

1:05:00Through the chair, that is correct.

1:05:02It will go through the report and problem

1:05:04or by phone call to bylaw.

1:05:07Perfect, thank you.

1:05:10Councillor Bousatio, you have a question?

1:05:11Thank you and through the chair,

1:05:13just two quick questions.

1:05:14The first one is some time ago,

1:05:16we talked about the city storage of limestone

1:05:19from heritage or buildings and so on.

1:05:22My question is whether or not that is made available

1:05:25to residents who may need that for building

1:05:28and repair and maintenance.

1:05:29Is there a charge for that or is that a free support?

1:05:38Through the chair to the Councillor.

1:05:39So right now we do work at properties

1:05:41that are on the register for repair and maintenance.

1:05:45Internally, we're also working on a program

1:05:47for the acquisition or disposition

1:05:50of some of those materials as well,

1:05:52but that won't come forward until 2025.

1:05:55Sorry, so currently if I have an old house

1:05:57and I need to replace some stone,

1:05:59is that I understand there's somewhere,

1:06:01some kind of a lot where I can go

1:06:03and people access this, is there a charge for that?

1:06:06There is not a charge if you're designated.

1:06:08We only look at designated properties right now.

1:06:11Thank you and my second question,

1:06:12and I should know this is,

1:06:14if I own a heritage home or a home that's not designated,

1:06:20is there a self designation process that is shorter

1:06:23or anything like that?

1:06:28Through the chair to the Councillor,

1:06:30absolutely call planning at Guelph or assembly planning

1:06:33at guelph.ca in email and we'd be happy

1:06:35to take a look at that.

1:06:36Thank you very much.

1:06:37Thank you, chair.

1:06:39Thank you.

1:06:40So I just have one question that the 300 properties

1:06:46that have the designations,

1:06:48is that, does that include the ones

1:06:49within the heritage district as well?

1:06:55Because basically they're all designated

1:06:57within a heritage district.

1:07:03To chair Downer, so there's an additional 160

1:07:06that are in the existing heritage conservation district.

1:07:09Okay.

1:07:10That are not part of that 300 individual.

1:07:12So there's up to 460 then that are protected

1:07:15through the Pila.

1:07:17Okay, so comments, Councillor Allt.

1:07:19Thank you very much, chair Downer.

1:07:21Just very quick comments, but first of all,

1:07:23I'd like to thank the residents who have been

1:07:25so passionate about this

1:07:27and in particular I'd like to thank Mr. Zimmerman,

1:07:29whom I have had many contacts with

1:07:32over the last 10 years on issues like this.

1:07:36I appreciate especially the notion

1:07:38that there's a requirement of minimal utilities

1:07:41in vacant and or damaged heritage buildings

1:07:44to maintain appropriate heating and ventilation,

1:07:47which will address what Councillor Caron is concerned about,

1:07:50which is demolition, by neglect.

1:07:51And many of us have seen that.

1:07:53Staff, I appreciate what you've done

1:07:55especially Mr. Godfrey through property standards

1:07:58when I've had to call you

1:07:59because of something just like this.

1:08:03Okay, thank you.

1:08:04Are there any other comments?

1:08:05I just want to go to Deputy CAO Lee first.

1:08:09He has something he wants to answer

1:08:12and that'll come to you, Councillor Caron, after that.

1:08:15Thank you, chair Downer.

1:08:16In discussions with my colleagues,

1:08:18the strategy on vacant home tax

1:08:20and the consideration of that topic

1:08:21is coming through our housing affordability strategy.

1:08:23It'll come before council in the coming months.

1:08:26Oh, great. That's good information.

1:08:28Thank you.

1:08:29Councillor Caron.

1:08:31Thanks, I had comments and two additional questions that came up.

1:08:35I just want clarity on the heritage tax relief

1:08:37because that's a policy that we actually have on the books

1:08:39for quite some time.

1:08:41In fact, I think it was a recommendation

1:08:42in Brooklyn and College Hill Conservation District.

1:08:46One of the recommendations was a heritage property tax relief

1:08:49that would address Councillor Goller's question,

1:08:51which is a recognition that if you own a designated property,

1:08:54there's a higher standard of care

1:08:56and a higher standard of potential work that needs

1:09:01and type of work that needs to be done.

1:09:04So I was a little surprised that was coming up

1:09:05as a word-west initiative.

1:09:08The heritage property tax relief

1:09:10has been on the work plan for over a decade.

1:09:15Is that, am I misunderstanding?

1:09:20Perhaps it's with our finance department

1:09:21and not our planning department.

1:09:24Through the chair to the council.

1:09:26So we can take a look at that.

1:09:27My recollection is there is a specific motion

1:09:30tied to the word-west heritage conservation district,

1:09:32but I will double check the wording in the motions

1:09:34and respond to council.

1:09:36Okay.

1:09:37And then another question before my comment is that,

1:09:40it's been brought to my attention

1:09:42by a few designated property owners

1:09:44that any renovations related to the Guelph

1:09:48Greater Green Homes initiative

1:09:54makes it difficult, if not impossible,

1:09:56to replace things like windows and doors

1:10:00to the standard of the designation

1:10:03using products that are not approved on the list

1:10:09in the Green Homes renovation program.

1:10:13Is that something that is currently being reviewed by staff?

1:10:20Or is this outside of the framework of property standards?

1:10:24So for example, broken windows,

1:10:29egress and appropriate replacement doors for heritage

1:10:34that may be part of a designated element on a structure

1:10:37that don't meet the retrofit guidelines

1:10:41that we've established under the Green Homes programs.

1:10:43Is that under review or could it be under review

1:10:46in the future?

1:10:51Through the chair to the council.

1:10:52I'll have to again, double check the bylaw

1:10:55and the Guelph Greener Homes program.

1:10:58We did put specific wording in there

1:10:59for heritage buildings,

1:11:01especially around windows and those items.

1:11:02So I will pull up the requirements

1:11:06for the Guelph Greener Homes program

1:11:08and take a look and send those around.

1:11:10Okay, maybe between now and council,

1:11:14I can do a little bit of homework as well on that.

1:11:19And again, my final comment is that

1:11:20this has been a long time in coming.

1:11:22I am not nearly as concerned about designated properties

1:11:25as I am about properties on the register.

1:11:27So I just want to put that on the record.

1:11:30And I guess more of a public service announcement

1:11:33if there are properties on the register

1:11:37that are deteriorating or that neighbors and citizens

1:11:41have concerns about that are not designated.

1:11:44I encourage you to submit those concerns

1:11:49to our property standards,

1:11:51our standard property standards bylaw,

1:11:54so that they can be further investigated

1:11:56and quickly if Mr. Godfrey can tell citizens

1:12:00who might be watching where to submit those,

1:12:03whether it's bylaw at Guelph or building at Guelph

1:12:07or property at Guelph, bylaw I think.

1:12:15Through the chair, residents can report concerns

1:12:19at bylaw at Guelph.ca or they can report an issue online.

1:12:24There's forms on the city's webpage

1:12:26where they can call bylaw directly.

1:12:28Okay, yes, but how can we help you

1:12:30in the reported problem map

1:12:31or probably to have to the best administrative tool?

1:12:35Thanks so much, Mr. Godfrey.

1:12:38Okay, thank you.

1:12:39Are there any other comments?

1:12:41Okay, seeing none, I will go to the vote.

1:12:44Is there anyone in opposition to the motion?

1:12:50Seeing none, that passes.

1:12:52Thank you.

1:12:54So the next item is the,