City Council

6:17Thank you. Thank you. Good morning everyone. I'm going to call the meeting to order the

6:23choosing March 25th 9 30 a.m. City Council meeting the first thing that we have is a

6:32closed item if we can have a motion that the Council of the City of Guelph now hold a meeting

6:39that is closed to the public pursuant to section 239 subsection 2f of the Municipal Act regarding

6:46advice that is subject to solicitor client privilege including communications necessary

6:51for that purpose. If I can have a mover, Councillor Allt and Councillor Caron.

6:56Are there any opposition to that? Seeing none, thank you. We will break and return for public

7:04session at 10 o'clock. Thank you. Good morning everyone. Prior to the start of this public

36:17meeting, a closed meeting was held with Council to discuss item 3.4, municipal franchise agreement

36:26with Enbridge where Council received information and provided direction to staff.

36:32Before we start the open meeting, just formal regrets were received by from Councillor O'Rourke

36:38and just we will be taking a break at 10 30 for 15 minutes to address an IT issue connecting

36:46that is affecting the chamber so we will take 15 minute break so that IT can come and help us

36:54problem solve. With that, I would ask if you are able to please stand for our national anthem.

38:34Thank you. Can we have a moment for a silent reflection please? Thank you. And now our Indigenous

38:54territorial acknowledgement. As we gather, let us take time to reflect on our privilege to live

39:00and work in Guelph, a city built over rich Indigenous histories. We are guests here and we

39:06should reflect upon the responsibility to care for this land, the people who live here today,

39:11and the generations to come. If our actions today can move us towards reconciliation, we should take

39:17pause and make those decisions with intention and gratitude. This place we call Guelph has served,

39:23has traditional lands, and a place of refuge for many peoples over time. But more specifically,

39:30the Attawanderach and the Haudenosaunee. This land is held as the treaty lands and territory with

39:36the Mississaugas of the Credit First Nation. Guelph lies directly adjacent to the Haldeman

39:42tract and is part of a long-established traditional hunting ground for the six nations of the Grand

39:48River. Many First Nations, Inuit, and Métis peoples who have come from across Turtle Island call

39:54Guelph home today. Are there any disclosures of pecuniary interests and general nature thereof?

40:07Seeing none, can I have confirmation of the open minutes?

40:12Councillor Billings and Councillor Downer, is there anyone opposed? Seeing none, that carries.

40:19Thank you. Item 7, Committee of the Whole Consent Report. We have a number on consent,

40:267.1, 2025 property tax policy, 7.2, redesigning advisory committees of Council,

40:347.3, governance review, and 7.4, single use item strategy phase two, reusable containers.

40:44Are there any separations? Councillor Caron. Terms of reference for committee, 7.2.

40:52Thank you. Anything further from Council? Seeing none, what I'm going to suggest is that we approve

41:007.134, moved Councillor Allt, seconded Councillor Goller. Are you approving or

41:16you have questions? Councillor Caiten and Mayor Guthrie, or is that in favour?

41:22Just approving. I was just trying to second it. In other words, I'm approving too.

41:30Anyone opposed to approving those consent items? I'm not quick enough. Seeing none, those are

41:37approved. Can I get someone to place recommendations, the consent item recommendation 7.2. I've got

41:47Councillor Klassen and Mayor Guthrie. Those are placed, moved seconded. Councillor Caron,

41:53you'd like to speak to those. Yes, I'm just speaking on the item related to heritage wealth.

42:00If you remember, Madam Chair, I placed an amendment that failed on a 6-6 at Committee of

42:05the Whole. I've since had some discussions with our heritage planning staff. I want to thank staff

42:10for that dialogue. It was very helpful to me understanding the needs of the Committee,

42:17the technical experience and skills that are needed on that Committee. In the course of

42:21that conversation, I have an amended recommendation to add some additional skills and expertise to

42:27the Committee, the addition of Indigenous knowledge and the addition of landscape architecture,

42:35and then clarifying statement related to library archives and heritage and history education.

42:42I've removed any reference to communications and media that was in my previous amendment,

42:51placing that on the floor for consideration. Thank you, and do you have a seconder? I hope so.

42:56Councillor Downer, thank you. The amendment, it was up on the screen. Does everyone have

43:02that amendment? Can you just put it back up on the screen, please?

43:08Councillor Allt? I was just wondering if it would be possible, Chair Boussatiel,

43:13whether we could hear from staff, whether they support, have any concerns, or have anything

43:20further to add? Certainly. Through the Chair to

43:24Councillor Meeke. Yes. Councillor Allt. I was trying not to call you Phil, so sorry.

43:36So through the Chair to Councillor Allt, we appreciate the discussions with the

43:40Councillor and have no issues with the amendment. Thank you. Are there any other further questions?

43:46Did we get the amendment up on the screen? Yeah. Councillor Gibson, were you able to capture it?

43:54Okay, good. Thank you. Is there any further discussion? I will call the question then.

44:02Is anyone opposed to the amendment? Seeing none, that carries. Thank you. Now I require

44:11a vote on the consent item 7.2 as amended, please. Is anyone opposed? Nope. That carries.

44:25So 7.2 as amended carries. Thank you. Items for discussion. We have vision 0 action plan.

44:36We have a delegation. And this is not in person, I believe. Good morning, Morgan. Can I just get

44:58you to turn your camera? Oh, there you are. Got you. Sorry, a little dark. Give you a minute. Okay.

45:07Thank you. So, you know, the five minutes presentation and then after your presentation,

45:13we will ask Council if they have any questions of clarifying nature. Go ahead.

45:18Thank you very much, Chair Boussettil. And Mayor, Councillors, I really just want to say thank you

45:27for putting together vision 0 with staff, making sure that nobody is killed on our roads due to

45:37a collision. One of the things that I really noted during the workshops last week is there were

45:47a number of Councillors that were saying that one of the things that they really wanted to make sure

45:54didn't have any degradation in budget is transit. We've already stretched transit

46:03so-called improvements. I call them bringing things up to a world-class level. I have to go to a

46:14doctor's appointment today. And if I have to take regular transit, I'm going to have to go on three

46:20buses. I'm super glad that I've got the ability to use the mobility transit and be able to have

46:30door-to-door service. But if I didn't have that option, I would literally have to take at least

46:38three separate buses to get from the ward to Stone Road Mall, essentially. So, one of the things that

46:49I believe really needs to happen as we are working through vision 0 is that we remember two things.

47:00One, cars are the things that create the congestion within the city. And two, our transit system

47:17does not work in a way that allows the majority of our residents to be able to have transit as an

47:26option. There was a challenge issued to counselors, not this iteration of counsel, but in the past,

47:36to take a week and use transit solely as their mode of transportation to get around.

47:47And from my memory, the only one that actually made a commitment to even trying was counselor alt.

47:54And he found that it was literally impossible for him to be able to use the transit system

48:02in this city to be able to get around to his meetings in the city. We were talking about

48:13parking. And one of the things that will happen as we improve our transit system

48:21is that less people will feel that they are obligated to have a car. The other thing that

48:29will happen is our employment system. Our employers will be happier because their employees will be

48:38able to get to and from work without having to create more traffic congestion because they have

48:45to use a car in order to get to work from where they live. I've used transit since I was two years old.

48:54My grandmother never had a driver's license. I am a strong advocate for transit. I didn't even get

49:01my driver's license until I was forced to by my mother at age 19 because the transit system

49:09where I grew up was such that I could get anywhere in the city that I wanted to be without having

49:17to use a car easily and quickly. Wealth needs to rapidly move to a grid system, modified grid,

49:28because of the way that our streets are. But we need to move to that modified grid system as

49:34quickly as possible because one of the things that's going to start happening as our economy

49:41is being decimated by the leader down south is people are going to have to give up their cars.

49:51Thank you. Thank you. Are there any questions for the delegation? Seeing none, thank you very much

50:00Morgan. Okay, so can I have the motions put on the floor please? I've got Councillor Allt,

50:09Councillor Goller seconded. So the motions are on the floor. Are there any separations?

50:15I'm looking to Mayor Guthrie. There we go. Thank you. Mayor Guthrie.

50:22Well, thank you Madam Chair. So I did send a couple of amendments to my colleagues and to

50:32clerks and based on your leadership, your chair, you had indicated that you'd maybe like to go in

50:43order of one before the other. Which one would you like to do first? I'm sorry, I just can't remember.

50:52Thank you. So you are speaking to recommendation number one and in particular the action item

50:58number four in the attachment. If you can do that one and then number 57 next. And clerks have that.

51:06Perfect. So we'll go in in the right order. Thank you. So yeah, I'm sorry, I'm just waiting for,

51:15I think clerks are putting it up on the screen. My apologies. There it is. Okay. So it's that

51:20action four of the Vision Zero Guelph Action Plan for Safe Streets, the implementation of the Quality

51:25Transit Network, including the conversion of general traffic lanes to dedicated traffic lanes,

51:32be amended to require City Council approval prior to the implementation. And I just need a

51:40seconder for that. I think Councillor Billings had mentioned. Yeah. And so I think it's pretty,

51:48I think it's pretty straightforward that if anything warrants the removal of the lanes,

51:57that that has to come back to council. So we have that heads up in that discussion at that time.

52:03Both pros and cons to why that's being recommended and that the line of site for that decision is

52:10done in the public realm with the elected council to have that input at that time. That's it. I'll

52:18just stop there. Madam Chair, to see if there's anything further.

52:22Thank you. I have Councillor Allt. Thank you very much, Chair Busuttil.

52:27Thank you, Mayor Guthrie, for putting that forward on principle. I don't have

52:31any concerns with what is presented, but I would like to hear from staff because I think that this

52:36is a possibly an issue of implementation that might require some authorities. And I just want to

52:44get clear if there is any opposition or if it's clear sailing. Thank you. Through you,

52:53Chair Busuttil, to Councillor Allt. Certainly, from a staff perspective, implementing the

52:58quality transit network is direction that we have from council through the approval of the

53:02Transportation Master Plan in 2022. At that same time that I say that, of course staff are aware

53:07that things can continue to change over time. And with respect to implementing a transit system,

53:13has a change to physical lane use on the roadway system is certainly something staff will

53:19review, analyze the data and sort of come forward with that appropriate recommendation in terms of

53:25timing on when we think it's appropriate to implement that type of system. So there's no

53:29concerns with coming back to council with respect to an approval like that. But from a staff perspective,

53:35we do feel like that approval already is in place. Thank you very much. With that, I don't think I

53:42have any problems supporting the amendment. Thank you. Is there anything further from any

53:48other Councillor? Councillor Gibson? Speaking in support, just experience has shown me over the

53:57years that we approve a policy or we approve an approach and decisions are made. And it's tough

54:05for some residents to see those changes and then come to council and say, why did you approve this?

54:12Why did you approve that? And the easy answer for councillors is, well, I didn't approve that.

54:17I approved a policy that resulted in that. And I think that they're just, I'm welcoming of the

54:22accountability where we make tough decisions when it comes to transit, that it should be a

54:28committed decision of council so that we can look our constituents in the eye and say,

54:33we didn't just approve a strategy that resulted in that decision. We don't want to hide behind

54:38our staff. We need to be making those decisions in the public. And that's why I support on the

54:45big items this stuff coming back to council. Thank you, Councillor Chew. Thank you, Madam Chair,

54:55and through you. Yeah, I just want to say I have every confidence in our staff and they've demonstrated

55:00as well that they're very thoughtful and prepared whenever they come to us. And even when they

55:07liaise with us behind the scenes through email conversations. But for me, it's a very practical

55:13matter pertaining to my ward and I would assume Ward 5 as well. Just on Gordon Street, we're going

55:19to experience a lot of big changes coming up in the near future. And in the long term as well,

55:27there's going to be a discussion on how we're going to be more efficient with transit,

55:33especially with Route 99. So I think that public conversation would really help put people at ease

55:39and help just be radically transparent. And I think that's kind of the age in which we're

55:44living in now and, you know, our staff are very capable. So I have every confidence that we can

55:49facilitate those conversations when needed in an appropriate way. So I just want to say it really

55:55resonates with me. So I appreciate everyone's support on this. Thank you, Councillor Chew.

56:01Anything further? Seeing nothing, I'll call the question on the amendment. Is anyone opposed?

56:11Seeing none, that's unanimous. Thank you. Back to you Mayor Guthrie.

56:16Thank you, Madam Chair and through you. Excuse me. The number, the second one,

56:23is going to, I think, come up on the screen here. And this is more of an advocacy type of motion,

56:30but it's just in regards to action 57, the plan for safer streets be amended to add the words

56:37and testing. So it reads as follows review and support enhanced driver education training

56:45initiatives and testing with the Ministry of Transportation. And that's it. I'll look to see

56:54if there's a seconder. I guess going to see Councillor Klassen seconded. All right, you go ahead.

57:00I'll be quiet. Are there any speakers to this? Councillor Goller.

57:06Through you, Chair, just a question to staff, whether they had any concerns about adding the

57:11word testing and just to confirm that we're all on the same page. It's when someone's taking their

57:17their, their, their license tests on street. Through the chair to Councillor Goller, no concerns

57:23from staff. Is there anything further from any Councillors? Seeing none, I'll call the question.

57:31Is anyone opposed? Seeing none, that is unanimous. And now we're going to place the recommendations

57:40one as amended to and three call the question. Is anyone opposed? Oh, sorry, Councillor Goller.

57:47If I make questions, Chair. Thank you. Through you to staff, I just wanted to, to ask, I have

57:54received a few questions and I wanted to ask about action item 58, the one that talks about

58:00advocating to the Ministry of Transport to enhance minimum standard for winter maintenance.

58:05I just wanted to ask, since Council is approving the advocacy to, to improve this, is there any

58:12opportunity for the City of Guelph to actually increase our standard for winter maintenance

58:18around cycling and pedestrian safety in advance of the Ministry changing the, the regulations

58:28province-wide? Or, or do we really have to, to wait for the province to change their, their, their

58:35guidelines for the whole province? And then we, we can do a little bit more here in Guelph.

58:45So through the Chair to Councillor Goller and I do see my colleague Doug Godfrey's in the, in the

58:49audience. So he may want to add to this, but I think certainly we're always looking at how we can

58:54improve and, and, and learn from our practical experience and as new infrastructure gets implemented,

59:01you know, certainly that's something that we can continue to improve our practices with. At the

59:06same time, improving our levels of service would really probably be a budget enhancement, like a

59:10service enhancement through budget that our staff would have to, I think, consider and bring back

59:15at a future time. And so improvements come with the cost and I think it's kind of that straightforward.

59:21Okay. I appreciate that. And one other follow-up. Many of the messages that I saw from constituents

59:29talked about feeling that there was a little bit of a gotcha with the automated speed enforcement.

59:35I think many people did not realize that it was happening. So just to clarify, when the next round

59:40we're going to have more automated speed cameras in place, will there be any additional measures

59:47to make sure that it's more clearly visible that on this road there is a speed camera, like, you

59:54know, using ballers or some other physical tools? Through the Chair to Councillor Goller. So when,

1:00:04when we put out a speed camera, it's fairly prescribed for the province that the sign requirement,

1:00:09what we have done is we have put up additional signs. There's redundancy in the signs and as we

1:00:15talked about at the workshop and committee the whole, we also put it on our website. Typically

1:00:20local media picks it up as well. We do a public release once a year with all the locations. So

1:00:25we're, we're trying to be as transparent as possible while also sticking to the guidelines

1:00:31and requirements from the province. Okay. Okay. Just so that I'm clear, did you say that you put up

1:00:36additional signs above the minimum requirement by the province?

1:00:42So council, through the Chair to Councillor Goller, what we do is the sign that goes up,

1:00:47municipal speed camera and use sign is very prescriptive. It's set up by the province. What

1:00:53we do is we put up two or three of those signs. That way if one gets stolen, a pole gets knocked

1:00:59down. We're not relying on one singular sign. We have some redundancy to cover us off in the

1:01:06event something unforeseen happens. I really appreciate that and I'm really excited to see

1:01:11these changes come into place. Thank you. Thank you, Chair. Thank you. Is there anything further? Yes.

1:01:18Mayor Guthrie. Thank you. Hope you as quick as possible seeing the time frame there just because

1:01:24of the IT thing. So I just have a question through you, Madam Chair. To staff, can I just get

1:01:34an answer on, I have to ask this in the public realm because it needs to get out in the public

1:01:40realm. The time for processing these speed enforcement camera tickets, how's that going?

1:01:51Because that is the main complaint that people 30 days later are getting the tickets and the

1:01:59argument from them is if this is supposed to be about safety and change of behavior,

1:02:06then why aren't I knowing in a much quicker time frame? So can I hear from staff about how that's

1:02:13going on the processing and or is there anything else that's coming that can start to make people

1:02:20more aware that they are getting a ticket and it's processed faster? Through the Chair to Mayor

1:02:30Guthrie, we've actually had an update from our vendor lately that they're working on

1:02:35the ability to get the images to the processing center basically day of. So that's being

1:02:41piloted right now. So I am hopeful certainly by the time we do the expansion,

1:02:49point for August 1st, that that process might be in place. Okay. Okay. That's much better.

1:02:54And then my last quick question is do you happen to know the high level percentage of tickets issued

1:03:06within the certain most vulnerable times compared to sort of off times that are occurring?

1:03:17You know, there's a narrative of three o'clock in the morning type of tickets or things like that.

1:03:24But my and I'm not wanting to get into any details at all about when something's on or not or

1:03:33implemented or not. I don't want to get into any of that because people should be

1:03:37following the speed limit. But I do, I am curious to know are the bulk of tickets like happening

1:03:45around the around the moments where it's most vulnerable for our pedestrians, our walkers,

1:03:51our bikers, our, you know, our school kids that are around these school community safety zones.

1:03:58You know, what, what is the percentage there? Is it high? Is it 50-50?

1:04:03Through the chair to Mary Guthrie. When we going to be putting cameras in for the ASC,

1:04:16we are looking at at places and looking to have those cameras operate at times when

1:04:24our most vulnerable users of the road are at most risk. Okay. So without I, again, those cameras are

1:04:32always in operation. So I think you can expect that if you are are breaking the law that there

1:04:43are times when you are going to be getting a ticket. Are they operational all the time? I would say no,

1:04:50but those times that what we are trying to do the whole purpose of the program is to protect

1:04:57those most vulnerable users in those places where they are at the most risk. So I don't have a

1:05:02percentage specifically for you. I can't tell you that the tickets that are issued are the bulk

1:05:09of them would be during those times. Okay. Thank you. That addresses my my second question.

1:05:17So with that I'm done Madam Chair. Thank you for the time. Thank you. We have one minute

1:05:22before we do our IT exercise. Councillor Gibson is it one minute? Sure. Perfect. Thanks. Just

1:05:29comments. One quick question. Is there any time the most effective speed reduction tool that I've

1:05:36seen in our city is the center lane ballard when like literally residents slow down to a crawl to

1:05:43pass those things? They don't want to hit their window or hit the side of the car? Is there any way

1:05:47we can in the summertime anyway or the non winter season come sort of use them together? And this

1:05:53is a question to staff where we have our cameras in place, but we also have those center line

1:05:57balls because that in my experience has really helped along Grange for example in my end of town.

1:06:03Everyone slows down when those things are in place. Maybe a question to staff. Can we use them

1:06:07together? Through the chair to Councillor Gibson. Let me take that away and I'll get back to you.

1:06:17I don't offhand know a reason why we couldn't, but I don't have all of the AAC regulations

1:06:23loaded onto my heart drop here. So let me let me take that away and just confirm if there's any

1:06:29issue with that, but I appreciate the feedback and suggestion. I appreciate that Mr. Anderson,

1:06:33because again I do want to support this. Maybe a message from myself to the residents that I've

1:06:39spoken to is that this is this should never be seen and should never be intentionalized as a revenue

1:06:45stream for the city. The idea is that we receive zero revenue because no one is speeding and that's

1:06:50the message that I really want residents to hear that the core purpose of the of the cameras is to

1:06:56keep school zones safe during those core hours and I think residents by and large accept that.

1:07:03I think that the frustration comes again with the delay in receiving a ticket or if you're not the

1:07:08actual driver and perhaps a spouse or a child is driving your car, you're the one who gets the ticket.

1:07:14That being said those are all small pieces. The effort here is to protect vulnerable areas and

1:07:22residents of our city during core hours of those vulnerable times and again just from my experience

1:07:28thanks to Mayor Guthrie for asking those questions to staff because those have been important for me

1:07:32to hear and again my message to the city is it's not a revenue stream. It's not seen as and it should

1:07:39never be a revenue stream. Ideally we'd be spending money on this and having zero revenue because

1:07:44there would be no tickets being issued because everyone's driving the speed limit through these

1:07:49areas so thanks very much Chair Busetil. Thank you Councillor Gibson so we're at 1031. I'm going

1:07:55to call the question is anyone opposed to the vision zero recommendations as amended? Seeing

1:08:05that carries okay we're going to break now for 15 minutes so we can work together to resolve the IT

1:08:11connection to chamber issue. Thank you. Thank you Councillors and thank you especially to IT for

1:35:55walking us through this problem-solving exercise. Next on the agenda is item 8.2 which is public

1:36:03space use bylaw proposed amendment. Mayor Guthrie would like to speak to this and then we have one

1:36:09delegation. Chair I guess it would probably be more appropriate for the delegation to go first

1:36:19and then now we can move from there. Okay thank you Mayor we're going to try to reach out to

1:36:29Morgan Dandy give one minute. Oh there she is. Got her. Hi Morgan can you hear me okay? Yes

1:36:35Councillor Busetil. Okay perfect so you have your five minutes and 30 seconds before the end of your

1:36:40time you'll hear the chime and just wrap up for that and then afterwards if you could stay online

1:36:46for any questions from Councillors okay thank you welcome. Thank you very much Chair Busetil.

1:36:53I had actually kind of hoped to hear what Mayor Guthrie had to say about this amendment prior

1:36:58to saying anything because I'm not really sure what the point of this amendment is.

1:37:07The fact that there is an amendment having to come through to me speaks to

1:37:16how quickly this bylaw was put into place and the reason that I put my name up is because the

1:37:26one person that I know would have been advocating today is not able to do so and I'd like you all

1:37:36to remember that Kate Nixon was named for several awards and most recently it was the Guelph Community

1:37:47Builder Award for Leadership and Vision as a young leader. You all know Kate you all know that she

1:37:58speaks truth to power and she continues to do so through those whose lives she greatly affected.

1:38:06I'm one of those lives and the fact that we're here having to revisit the public space use bylaw

1:38:15once again shows to me that this was done too quickly without proper consultation

1:38:23and that the most vulnerable amongst our citizens are being further criminalized.

1:38:35I just have a really hard time criminalizing my neighbors that are unable to afford

1:38:47a place to live and are unable to use our inadequate shelter system.

1:38:55The reason I say inadequate shelter system is because I know that if the person that I rent from

1:39:04were to tell me that I had to leave I would not be able to use a shelter because of my service

1:39:10stop. I've said this before and I know the city can't control the shelters but the combination

1:39:22of the public space use bylaw with the closure of the supervised consumption sites

1:39:29is going to cause more issues within this city. That's all I have to say right now.

1:39:38Thank you Morgan. I'm just going to look around the circle and on the screen to see if there are

1:39:42any questions of a clarifying nature. No questions. Mayor Guthrie thank you very much Morgan thank

1:39:49you again. Did you want to say a couple of words? Thank you Chair Busuttil. No I think

1:39:59I would like to move into closed session for legal advice on the issue with my colleagues

1:40:08and to hear from our legal and I think that might be proper to do that first before

1:40:15coming back out into open session to consider the amendment.

1:40:19Thank you. Councillor Goller says he's going to second that and there is a resolution up there

1:40:24on the screen. If I will read it that's okay. Council of the City of Guelph now hold a meeting

1:40:30that is closed to the public pursuant to section 2392 subsection F of the municipal act regarding

1:40:37advice that is subject to solicitor client privilege including communications necessary

1:40:42for that purpose and so that's Mayor Guthrie and Councillor Goller. Anyone object? Seeing none

1:40:50we're going to go into close. Thank you. Hi Councillor Chew. Hi Kerry is that you? It is yeah.

1:43:52If you don't have long they're going to take. I am not sure how long they will take. You could try

1:43:57joining closed if you like. Oh are they enclosed or? They are enclosed yeah. Okay thank you. Not a

1:44:06problem. Thank you to everyone. Just reporting back from the closed meeting the summary is that

2:13:54information was received by council on item 8.2 and so right now I'm going to look to council

2:14:02chambers to see if there's anyone that would like to speak to this item. I've got Kate. No

2:14:09Madam Chair I haven't tabled the motion yet. Okay all right go ahead. All right thank you so much

2:14:19through you Madam Chair. Just wondering if the clerks could put the motion up on the screen

2:14:27under public space use bylaw proposed amendment that the definition of sensitive public space

2:14:33in section 3.51 of the bylaw 2024-20990 be amended to add after the words includes but is not limited

2:14:41to the words any public space that shares a property line with the school or child care center.

2:14:48And I believe that is seconded by Councillor Goller. I just want to confirm if that still stands.

2:14:58You got a nod there I don't know if you saw it. Okay no I can't thank you so much.

2:15:02I so with that which I could just take a moment to table excuse me my reasoning.

2:15:08So this this has come up to me maybe it's not coming up to some others but it has percolated

2:15:14quite a bit since last fall and there is a lot of concerns that I'm hearing from parents

2:15:22from educators and others that this maybe should have been defined as sensitive areas in parks and

2:15:30schools and daycares right from the get go. And I think that by adding this definition

2:15:37and this example into the definition of the bylaw that it does provide clarity around what council

2:15:43would feel if approved by council that these are sensitive areas that but not only schools and day

2:15:52cares but are also used quite often. I think of I'm hearing of Easter egg hunts coming up where

2:16:02the kids and the volunteers and the teachers are going to be hiding the eggs all over not only

2:16:09their own school property but maybe into the joining public spaces and there's concerns that

2:16:16that these public spaces where it is concerned to be sensitive for our children are could be used

2:16:23in other ways that that that that caused friction and caused sensitivities to to what those public

2:16:31spaces really in my mind should be used for and in others as well. I just want the council and the

2:16:37public to know that I did send this out to all of the school boards not just the the heads of the

2:16:45the boards the chairs but to the administration side as well. Now the timing of some of their

2:16:52meetings on both the French the Catholic and the public maybe did not meet up with today's meeting

2:16:58but I did receive confirmation from the Catholic school board both from their both from their

2:17:06chair of representing the board also from the administrative side of things from the Catholic

2:17:12school board that they passed a motion in full support and full endorsement of this amendment

2:17:20that they too have heard many concerns from parents and teachers alike so I thought I would

2:17:26just address that as well. I also wanted to say that the motion does impact around 27 areas

2:17:37give or take out of the around 119 areas that are across the city. It is a 22%

2:17:47impact if we could put it that way and look with that I don't want to belabor the amendment

2:17:56of this I I think it's straightforward I I don't mean that to be in any way

2:18:03controversial I sincerely don't I am trying to speak to to the issue based on the feedback that I

2:18:11am hearing from parents teachers volunteers and others and I would rather make this clarity come

2:18:20forward from council in a in a in a way that gets that clarity out in the open transparently for

2:18:28everyone to to realize what what we feel is sensitive. I will just say that you know just

2:18:35an hour or so ago we we we took a unanimous stance that we would like to have sensitive areas around

2:18:44our school zones when it comes to speeding and at the same time I think that's that decision speaks

2:18:53somewhat to to this as well and I think the public spaces that abut schools and daycare centers

2:19:01should be defined as sensitive areas and and for the enjoyment of those people that would be using

2:19:08them especially our children. With that I'll just leave it at that and see how the conversation goes.

2:19:13Thank you Madam Chair. Thank you so I've started a speaker's list of Councillor Caitlin, Alt and

2:19:20Kerron. Okay Councillor Caitlin. Thank you through you Madam Chair. I have a concern with the speed

2:19:29at which this is being brought forward and the lack of public engagement and feedback. I think

2:19:37while cars are a known risk people living in tents are not necessarily the same level of risk to

2:19:45people in school areas and I think that it should be brought forward to groups that could be very

2:19:52much affected by this like the AAC because the unhoused population has a very large disability

2:20:00community contained within and I would like to make a motion to refer this to be reviewed by the AAC

2:20:07because I believe there may be unintended consequences to the disabled community that

2:20:12I'd like to know about before making a decision on this and I've sent a motion to the clerks.

2:20:19I apologize I wasn't able to email it out because I am locked out of my email. Thank you and do you

2:20:26have a seconder for that? Councillor Allt. Okay and it's up on the screen. So my motion is oh can

2:20:36we put it back up. Thank you that the public space use by-law proposed amendment be referred to the

2:20:44accessibility advisory committee. Thank you. Speaking to the amendment Mayor Guthrie.

2:20:55Thank you to you Madam Chair, to staff. Is this a requirement that needs to happen from a process

2:21:02point of view and have any staff members heard of this motion prior to now and or was there any

2:21:13feedback from anyone for the last almost two weeks that this motion has been transparently

2:21:21tabled? Has there been any feedback at all? So through the chair answering in reverse order

2:21:33in terms of feedback that we have received I had one single inquiry from the poverty task force who

2:21:39had simply a question about the resolution that the mayor added to the agenda that was the only

2:21:45inquiry that we as staff received from anyone over the last two weeks since the agenda has been

2:21:49posted. We have not obviously there was a single delegation that you heard from this morning but

2:21:56to my awareness we've had no other inquiries or questions come in through staff on this

2:22:02and no my understanding is that it is not a requirement per the AODA to consult with the AAC

2:22:08it would be at council's discretion. Well thank you and to through you Madam Chair to the clerks

2:22:17did any correspondence come in on this matter that's been transparently posted for two weeks?

2:22:25Through you Mr. Mayor or through you Madam Chair to you Mr. Mayor there was no correspondence

2:22:30received for this agenda item. Okay thank you and to the mover did you make other members of

2:22:35council aware of this referral motion prior to you tabling it just now? Yes I had talked to

2:22:47the chair about it and I had talked to clerks about it and I would have emailed it had my email

2:22:54been operational but it was not so I came down in person to make sure that I would be able to

2:23:03talk to folks and let them know so I had a technology issue and that's why I wasn't able

2:23:09to send it out to all of council. So my last question through you Madam Chair is to the mover

2:23:17how many other people on council knew about your motion of referral because I certainly didn't

2:23:23yet I've been transparent for the last two weeks on this motion so I'm just wondering how many

2:23:27other people on council knew about this and not me? I'm sorry is that a question for me? Yes

2:23:38I sent it to the chair this morning and then we had our technology issue

2:23:46and so I wasn't able to send it to other people I only thought about it this morning

2:23:51I'm not sure what the intent of your question is. Well just about transparency Madam Chair that

2:23:59this is feels like a I got you a moment I must admit so I'll leave that as my comment on this

2:24:04I will not point of order reporting the referral. Please

2:24:11we have had referrals that have come up at the spur of the moment quite frequently and we have

2:24:15never had a question like this and I would ask the chair to determine whether this kind of

2:24:21questioning and dialogue is appropriate we are bordering on points of personal privilege.

2:24:27Thank you I think we can end this conversation I think Councillor Alta is right we've had other

2:24:33motions coming from the floor. Yeah I finished then Madam Chair. Yeah please do. Thank you

2:24:40I feel like this is coming out of the blue when an opportunity may have been presented to inform

2:24:46all of council including myself as the mover and I have every right to be frustrated that from what

2:24:52I would feel as an opportunity to give people a heads up including me as the mover was not provided

2:24:58to me when I do know that others were were informed and so with that I do not feel that

2:25:04the referral is necessary I would ask my colleagues to not approve the referral. We are elected

2:25:11officials that are here to make decisions and I think this is a moment for us to make a decision

2:25:17and I've also been told that the matter about the implementation of the bylaw has already once

2:25:24gone through the ACC and I appreciate that we would just make a decision today on this matter.

2:25:32Thank you very much. Thank you Mayor Guthrie I have Councillor Caron, Alt and then Gowler.

2:25:38Thank you and I have a question about the amendment but I do want to say that

2:25:44I was not informed by the mover that a referral was coming and I do find that the line of

2:25:50questioning is quite uncomfortable and again borders on points of personal privilege.

2:25:57My question about the amendment has to do with the inference that by posting it on an agenda

2:26:07that is public I mean it absolutely is public and it's absolutely transparent and I agree with the

2:26:13Mayor that two weeks on an agenda lets those who regularly read council agendas know that it's coming

2:26:24but the mover also indicated that you informed other agencies school boards school trustees

2:26:34that this was coming and I'm just wondering it speaks to the referral in that the pause for the

2:26:41ACC would also allow a pause for other agencies like school boards to have more time to respond

2:26:50but my question is to the mover of the original motion so I hope it's in order

2:26:54when the school boards and daycare centers were informed at what point did you send an email

2:27:01to those agencies and organizations letting them know because they aren't necessarily agencies

2:27:06and organizations that would be looking at council agendas so at what point did you send the email to

2:27:12them? Yes through you Madam Chair to Councillor Caron you would know that because I sent a transparent

2:27:22email to all of council indicating that I was bringing this motion forward about two weeks ago

2:27:29and in that email I stated that I would also be informing the school boards so in the past when

2:27:36we've had anything in regards to school board issues one of the complaints I've heard from

2:27:41members of council is that we have not actually proactively reached out to them so I did that

2:27:48based on the previous times when these types of issues have arisen so all of council is aware

2:27:54that I went to the school boards. Yeah I understand that and appreciate that you the email that we

2:28:00got informing us about your amendment and thank you for the two weeks notice when did the that you

2:28:05would be informing school boards when did the email to the school boards go out was it the same day?

2:28:12I think so I'm sorry I'm in front of me I think it was sorry through you Madam Chair I think it

2:28:21was either the same day or the next I can't recall oh actually I remember now it was it was the day

2:28:28before the agenda went public because I did not from a courtesy point of view I did not want them

2:28:35to find it on the agenda so it was the day before. Okay thank you those are the end of my

2:28:43questions just I don't can we can we speak to the referral because I do see some merit in

2:28:48in having a little bit more transparency in in agencies knowing that this was coming I agree

2:28:55I agree being on a public agenda is is transparent but many of those organizations such as school

2:29:03boards don't have an opportunity to meet to discuss a matter as a board so that they can

2:29:10adequately respond I mean certainly a chair could respond but the chair may not be responding on

2:29:15behalf of their organization because they haven't had an opportunity to meet so so that's where I'm

2:29:23wavering on on my support of the referral is is whether there's benefit to having that additional

2:29:27time thank you Madam Chair thank you I have Councillor Allt and then Gowler

2:29:31thank you very much Chair Boussatiel I will support the referral and there's one very

2:29:38simple reason for that I cannot support the motion as it currently stands because I'm very concerned

2:29:44about charter challenges challenges in the court and it strikes me that if we do not have some sort

2:29:51of input from the AAC as a an advisory committee of council what we are doing is is that we are

2:29:59playing with some fundamental principles in Canadian law including mobility rights and

2:30:05really the questions of of of life there are people whose lives are actually being put in

2:30:13in a in a rather uncomfortable situation as a consequence of this and until such time as I'm

2:30:19quite confident that we are not in the position where we are opening something up that actually

2:30:24can have ramifications far beyond Guelph I can't support this particular resolution so I thank

2:30:29Councillor Caton for bringing this forward even if it was not brought forward in such a fashion

2:30:35that I would have learned about it a week or two ago thank you I have Councillor Goller and then

2:30:41Richardson thank you through you chair there was a question asked about about how many people have

2:30:51written about this I personally receive five emails from constituents and the and the poverty

2:30:58elimination task force with concerns about about this this change to the public use bylaw

2:31:05but going back a little bit when the bylaw was first put into place I received concerns from

2:31:12close to two dozen people about specifically the bylaw permitting incomes to be set up in areas

2:31:20close to schools so I think we've heard from both sides people that are concerned about this

2:31:25happening and and speaking to specifically to to the amendment to the referral I think it would

2:31:34not hurt us to have hear from more people I'm from the accessibility advisory committee on the

2:31:40impacts of this change it is it is a sensitive issue and I think the more voices that we hear

2:31:46from to make a better informed decision I think that would be helpful thank you thank you I have

2:31:52Councillor Richardson and then Gibson and thank you through you chair Boussatel and I'm not sure

2:31:59if my question is for staff but if I understand correctly this is not a change to the bylaw it

2:32:05does not affect the material impact of the bylaw but it's only a clarification so I'm questioning

2:32:12why we would need to go back for more input when we're not really changing anything but just trying

2:32:19to make the bylaw more clear so through the chair to Councillor Richardson so under the bylaw there

2:32:27is the provision for defining what is a sensitive public space and if you think back to at the end

2:32:32of August you as a council voted to designate st. georgia square and market square as sensitive

2:32:37public spaces so you have that ability within the bylaw to make that determination as to how

2:32:45sensitive public space is defined so to your question it is not fundamentally changing the

2:32:50bylaw it is simply adjusting the definition of sensitive public space as you did back in August

2:32:57for those two locations if this were to if the the motion as presented were to pass you would simply

2:33:04be amending the definition of sensitive public space to include those properties those public

2:33:10spaces that share a property line with a school or a child care center so it is not changing the

2:33:15bylaw it is simply adding an additional definition under that sensitive public space thank you

2:33:23thank you just a reminder to council that what we are discussing is the referral motion to the

2:33:28accessibility advisory committee not the not the original motion so I have Councillor Gibson

2:33:35and then Councillor Downer and then Councillor Keaton. Through you chair Busatel I thought to

2:33:42pose a question but I won't I'll just leave it at comments I I believe this amendment has been

2:33:51brought forward in a transparent way it's been public for two weeks lots of people have asked

2:33:56questions lots of people have inquired I know this referral is coming up as a bit of a surprise

2:34:04but the the concerns I've heard around council around charter risks and charter challenges and

2:34:11and the depth of expression my comment would be why have why has the motion come forward with

2:34:22simply focusing on the AOC like the the accessibility advisory committee with the depth of concern

2:34:29that has been has been expressed around council you would think that surely there's more groups that

2:34:36we would want to hear from but it's not it's being singled into one committee that's being

2:34:42that's going to be targeted on consultation be given an opportunity a proactive opportunity to

2:34:49weigh in when there's been two weeks to do so it doesn't seem like there's concern to have this

2:34:57sent out to all of our advisory committee or all the user groups or all the different stakeholders

2:35:01across our city and so I just I struggle with targeting to one committee and I'm and for those

2:35:09reasons I think the immaterial nature of the amendment the clarity that brings I don't I just

2:35:16don't believe it needs to be sent to one committee at this time thank you

2:35:21Councillor Gibson both Councillor Goller and Councillor Kerr on raised other stakeholders

2:35:27you're welcome to make an amendment to the referral motion for broader consultation or

2:35:33engagement if you'd like if that would make you more satisfied with this thank you through you

2:35:39Chair my my comment was just around the the dialogue that I've heard from council that

2:35:48I'm just surprised that the the angst that has been expressed about the lack of input would only

2:35:55be limited to one if it was if it was to the extent that's been expressed that it's only been

2:36:01extended to one committee so I'm what I'm saying is I don't believe that my opinion is that I don't

2:36:08believe that it has to be consulted on to the to any further extent I believe it's been a very

2:36:13transparent process similar to a notice of motion that would come forth from council

2:36:16and so I believe it's time to make a decision thank you I have Councillor Downer and then

2:36:22Councillor Caiten yeah I'm just you know ruminating on this but I don't think it needs a

2:36:31referral it's it's a further clarification of that specific part of a bylaw that has already

2:36:39gone through public consultation and it's 20 I think it's around 22 parks out of 120

2:36:47that are further defined I don't see it any different than the original bylaw and how that was

2:36:54how that was managed it's not a ban it's no you need to move here as we've had before

2:37:03and and that was handled handled quite well I heard at our last joint social service committee

2:37:13that there were 11 encampments 11 people living in encampments right now and I would say that

2:37:21that the bylaw also helped people you know get into shelters and and housing and when you read the

2:37:29reports coming from the county it they're we're moving along it's not it's not perfect and it

2:37:36certainly hasn't been solved but I just I just see this as a further clarification of the existing

2:37:43bylaw and I don't know what other accessibility issues and I know the ACC did not support the

2:37:49original bylaw and I know there are council members that didn't support the original bylaw

2:37:55but I don't see this as fundamentally different than what we passed before thank you I have

2:38:04Councillor Keaton thank you for you chair so while the addition to the bylaw may not be

2:38:11significant the amount of property that affects with the change is significant we have John McCrae

2:38:19school Mitchell Woods Mary Feelen the WCA Fred Hamilton Guelph outdoor school hearts and smile

2:38:26daycare they all border on very large green spaces and so the effect and the cumulative effect

2:38:35on people who are unhoused trying to understand the bylaw find a place be able to move within

2:38:43those spaces because the further you push them out find a voter chair this this sounds like

2:38:51a justification for voting against the amendment not a justification for voting for against the

2:38:55referral this is directly speaking to why I want the AAC to provide feedback on it because there

2:39:04it's a large area that wasn't considered when the AAC originally provided feedback

2:39:11Councillor Gibson I'm just going to rule it in order if thank you and so this is why I want to

2:39:18refer it to them and while we did have two weeks based on our processes the AAC meets every two months

2:39:30they don't have the ability to meet directly on something with two weeks notice and provide feedback

2:39:39or create delegations so I'm asking that they're given the opportunity to provide feedback

2:39:47on this process thank you so I have Councillor Chew and then Mayor Guthrie

2:39:55thank you through you Madam Chair for me like the intent of this amendment like

2:40:07in other circumstances like I would be very happy to allow the AAC to have more consultation but

2:40:16I do want to stress I think the intent of this the original motion is an active good faith and

2:40:25transparency and the fact that it's not changing that the original intent of the bylaw as a whole

2:40:33I think it warrants our exercise of discretion just to be discerning of you know where we are

2:40:42and how we got here and I just want to say to public watching you know we've had many reforms

2:40:49in efforts to reform our governance processes we have more transparency with the Joint Social

2:40:54Social Services Committee and I get fielded questions over email all the time I meet with

2:41:00people regularly all the time constituents who have concerns no matter what they are and it's also

2:41:08our duty as well to continue the dialogue and I think we have to acknowledge that here today

2:41:14not it's not it hasn't been a two-week process it's been an ongoing process that people are

2:41:19seeking clarity from all each of us and I think you know respectfully we all have had a role to play

2:41:26and to facilitate that dialogue and that should be acknowledged as well and I just want to say

2:41:34like I think there is consensus whether you voted for or against the bylaw originally there is

2:41:42consensus that we want to really see this see the process as smoothly as possible so that we don't

2:41:50hurt the most vulnerable that we are trying to protect which is the school children and which

2:41:55is the homeless population thank you thank you I have Mayor Guthrie thank you Madam Chair and through

2:42:06you just a question through to staff then just I kind of appreciated the commentary from Councillor

2:42:16Downer the the entire bylaw did it eventually go to the ACC already is that correct so through

2:42:29the chair uh yes as requested by council we went and met with the AAC on October the 17th

2:42:36at that time council had already approved the bylaw but we were asked to take the bylaw and the

2:42:41implementation of that bylaw to the AAC for a fulsome discussion which we did on October the 17th

2:42:47and we held off on our implementation of the bylaw until after we could have that meeting

2:42:53yes is there any way you can describe through you Madam Chair what their

2:42:59be back was about the bylaw in its entirety I'm just wondering if we're not going to really

2:43:04receive any any different type of any different type of commentary that would come out of of

2:43:11referring it through the chair to Mayor Guthrie I don't I'm hesitant because I don't want to speak

2:43:20on behalf of the AAC we can certainly go back and look at their minutes from that meeting and

2:43:26provide that to council they did provide I think I think the chair also delegated as part of the

2:43:32initial August consideration of the public space use bylaw and then again in October there was

2:43:40feedback provided I know that they did have some feedback about the bylaw as a whole but at that

2:43:46point staff were not there to because the bylaw had already been passed and so we really focused

2:43:51the conversation on the implementation aspects of that bylaw yeah okay that's fair all right then

2:43:57I based on that I will have my other question Madam Chair I'm done thank you so much and I

2:44:03would ask that council not not refer this thank you are there any further comments on the referral

2:44:10motion okay seeing none I'm going to call the question all those opposed to the referral motion

2:44:19if you could so on screen I have Councillor Chew, Councillor Gibson, Mayor Guthrie, Councillor

2:44:26Billings, Councillor Richardson and Councillor Downer so that motion fails thank you we're back

2:44:35to the original motion are there any speakers to the original motion sorry Councillor Gibson

2:44:46yeah thank you through you Chair Bousatel so my my reflection on this amendment and through

2:44:52discussions with the mayor the mover as well as staff the the idea of bringing clarity to the

2:44:59bylaw is a good thing it brings it brings clarity to the community I've had numerous

2:45:06constituent meetings in recent months with just these questions being asked I am a daycare provider

2:45:11what does it mean for me are I what do we mean with properties attached to school school areas or

2:45:18public spaces and I do think the clarity is needed so I appreciate it coming forward the other piece

2:45:26that I wanted I've been dwelling on just since the start of our meeting today is that we spend a lot

2:45:30of time regulating public spaces specifically sensitive areas and we have deemed these areas to

2:45:37be sensitive the central there's a sensitive population that attends school in these locations

2:45:43every day and we have taken it upon ourselves to regulate the areas around public school property

2:45:50case in point this this earlier this morning we we have heavily regulated and used technology to

2:45:55enforce our rules on public roadways in and around school years so I see just as a natural

2:46:03extension of of that protection that we're providing and for our sensitive populations

2:46:11our school zones and so I I really do applaud the idea of bringing clarity I think the community

2:46:17welcomes this clarity on the bylaw and and for that for those reasons all those reasons I'll

2:46:23be supporting it because again it it just adds to the regulation and appropriateness of properties

2:46:33adjacent to those sensitive areas thank you thank you councillor Caton thank you through you chair

2:46:45so I think that what we're doing is we're leaning into a stigma saying that people who

2:46:53are living in tents are inherently dangerous to school children which they're not we have the

2:47:01sensitive public space areas for cars because cars can kill people and we know that any kind of

2:47:11issues that someone who might be living in a tent is doing towards children that could be dangerous

2:47:17is already covered by other crimes and can be dealt with by police and the law I think that what

2:47:25we're doing right now is we're expanding it unnecessarily due to borders on areas that with

2:47:31the list that I've already mentioned of schools and daycares that are on large large green areas

2:47:38that we're going to be further reducing the space that people who are unhoused can be and I think

2:47:46it's confusing I don't think it's necessary and I think that our current public space use bylaw

2:47:53was always able to deal with the issues we were told that when people were complaining earlier

2:48:00so I don't understand why we need it I think that it will have unintended consequences of removing

2:48:06large large areas of green space and I'm very opposed thanks thank you have councillor downer

2:48:14yes can I just ask a question of staff so through you Madam Chair to staff

2:48:23so my understanding is I just want to make sure I got this right there's

2:48:27there's about 22 or 23 parks that this would cover out of 130 20 I can't remember through the chair so

2:48:39because this could move depending on new child care centers coming online or not we're not able to

2:48:45provide a definitive list because it will evolve because as schools and child care centers change

2:48:52at this point based on our analysis of and so this does apply to public spaces but generally

2:48:57that's predominantly parks and so when we look at our parks and we did the analysis we believe

2:49:03there are 27 impacted parks out of 119 which I think to your point is 22 percent of our total

2:49:10number of parks is where the 22 came from but at this point looking at the list that we were able

2:49:15to get from the province of those child care centers in the schools we believe that there are 27

2:49:20locations where a property line is currently shared and so that those would be now defined as

2:49:26sensitive public spaces and how many would have to be removed today I don't need the location but

2:49:31if this bylaw was put into so at this point in time there is one encampment that we are monitoring

2:49:39that would be in violation or would be in a sensitive public space where this motion to pass

2:49:45although we actually are we believe that encampment may have been recently abandoned

2:49:51but based on what we've been tracking over the last two weeks since this motion came forward

2:49:55there is only one current encampment we are aware of in the city and we do track all encampment

2:50:00locations that would then need to shift the location if this motion okay and so they're not banned

2:50:06from having an encampment they're just not allowed to have one in that area so they would have to

2:50:11move so through the chair this one again if it if it in fact if it has been abandoned then it becomes

2:50:17a moot point but if it has not then there is one individual in one encampment who would need to

2:50:23move the location of their encampment okay and what have you received complaints from places

2:50:29from schools or or daycare centers or in the last year or so through the chair uh no uh we have not

2:50:39and I suspect that's partly because we have not seen a practical situation where we have had

2:50:45an encampment in close proximity to a school um however certainly when we uh when the original

2:50:50public space use bylaw came forward and there was a lot of feedback there was certainly a lot of

2:50:55questions about proximity to schools back sort of in I think that's September timeframe and we did

2:51:00provide a lot of clarifying information out because we did get a number of inquiries from people who

2:51:07asked about proximity to schools but since the time of the bylaw being implemented we have not but

2:51:13again I suspect that's because we don't actually have other than this potentially one we we have

2:51:20not had a significant number of encampments that are in any proximity to schools or child care

2:51:25centers okay if so okay that's all the questions I have um I'm gonna support this originally I

2:51:33was a little cool to it but I do see is it a further refinement of the definition of sensitive

2:51:39spaces um I think again it it goes back to I'm not too concerned about charter challenges and

2:51:50it takes us back to our original bylaw that this isn't a ban that we didn't have a challenge to it

2:51:59again it's it's it's a public use bylaw there are certain areas that you can do things in which

2:52:05we regulate throughout the whole city so I'm not um I am going to support this as a further

2:52:13refinement of the bylaw um and because I don't think it fundamentally changed what we already

2:52:19approved and it's not an out ban it's a telling telling people this is where you can be and this

2:52:25is where we you can't be thank you I have counsel alt thank you very much as I said earlier I will

2:52:35not be supporting this particular motion I'm very very skeptical about its potential to actually have

2:52:41any positive impact at all although I do think that there is a potential for some negative

2:52:46repercussions to occur including a legal challenge I'd made reference to the possibility of legal

2:52:51challenges but the other thing that I really want to address is whether this bylaw will

2:52:56actually enhance child safety and I'm not certain it does I don't have any statistics on children

2:53:03that have actually become vulnerable as a consequence of people living in encampments

2:53:09unless those children are living in those encampments themselves and I think that what we are doing is

2:53:15we're addressing something that everybody including those who live in encampments don't like and that's

2:53:22homelessness the only problem is we're not solving homelessness by doing this we're just moving it along

2:53:30and that's one of my big concerns if you talk to workers on the street right now they will point

2:53:35out that one of the great challenges this winter was actually getting to the encampments that were

2:53:40out there because some people don't want to go into shelters for various reasons we'd heard from one

2:53:47delegate today that that if she were made homeless she could not go into a shelter because of her

2:53:53companion animal there are other reasons as well I'm not about to get into all of those but when

2:53:59we get to the very basic issue of public safety I think that there's a fundamental difference

2:54:05between the highway traffic act and actually encouraging those who need to live in encampments

2:54:12to move on I think we're we're not addressing the real issue and that's homelessness thank you is

2:54:20sir anything further from counselors seeing nothing with counsel's indulgence I will share that I

2:54:27will not be voting in support of this I am concerned that it is overly broad and one of my colleagues

2:54:35talked about the large swaths of land that are attached to schools such that an encampment could

2:54:43be a kilometer away or greater from a school because of the park land and my concern and and I've

2:54:50gone out and I've talked to the encampments the residents of the encampments my concern about

2:54:55pushing people further further out from the services and the supports that are tend to be

2:55:01downtown and within transit accessibility so and I also agree I think you know I've raised it and

2:55:10thank you to Mayor Guthrie for reaching out to the school boards I've raised concerns whether it's

2:55:14a fireworks bylaw and so on about the need to really consult with the other stakeholders in

2:55:21the community so I'm concerned about this the other thing is that I heard quite clearly from staff

2:55:27is that they haven't heard about problems related to schools on this issue so I concur with

2:55:35Councillor Caton that you know I don't want to fuel the an encampment equals um unsafety and

2:55:42and unsavory people who are going to harm your children I don't want to fuel into that so I will

2:55:48not be supporting this and I think we're ready to call the question so Councillors who are not in

2:55:58support of the recommendation please raise their hand and so I have Caron, Ault, Busatil, Gawler

2:56:12and um Caten and so that falls fails okay so the motion is carried pardon me Madam Chair I just

2:56:22want to make sure we have the vote I have that carrying on a six five vote so maybe if we could

2:56:27confirm we have 11 members present one two three four five five five against so it fails it passes

2:56:37it passes six five with five against that's correct thank you for thank you thank you okay the

2:56:43last item and Mayor Guthrie I'll turn to you this should be a quick item item 8.3

2:56:50well thank you hopefully this doesn't get referred thank you for the last discussion

2:56:55by the way everyone I know it's a sensitive thing so thank you for you Madam Chair for that

2:57:01um and moving on to this one though it I was made aware last week that I was approved by

2:57:11the Large Urban Caucus of the Association of Municipalities of Ontario to join the

2:57:20the AMO Association with the Large Urban Caucus sorry I might have said Large Urban Mayors Caucus

2:57:27I do not mean to say that Large Urban Caucus uh under AMO and uh so what's happened is that

2:57:36there was a vacancy and so uh there was an opportunity across the province for people to

2:57:44send in their resume and their cover letter uh to make the case as to why they could be appointed

2:57:52to this caucus and so I did that I think it's a really great thing for Guelph

2:57:59and AMO does such great work for us and all other 443 municipalities and it would enable me to

2:58:09be a part of this caucus uh be working alongside colleagues across the province and

2:58:16really with the province themselves and so I need a motion of council to approve that appointment

2:58:26to the AMO Large Urban Caucus and so if you don't mind I'll move it myself and uh Councillor Richardson

2:58:35told me that she would be willing to second that and I'll leave it at that thank you oh sorry it

2:58:40would start in June and it would go through to the end of this term okay thank you so much

2:58:46thank you so move by yourself seconded Councillor Richardson you did have some other

2:58:50Councillors here that put their hands up as well so uh I'll go straight to the vote is anyone opposed

2:58:58seeing none that carries thank you very much for putting your name forward and the work that you

2:59:02do I'm going to move to item number nine bylaws and Councillor Caron thank you I move seconded

2:59:11by Councillor Richardson's that bylaw Councillor Richardson bylaw numbers two thousand twenty

2:59:17five two one zero three three told me to read through all the numbers through 2025 two one zero

2:59:23four one two one zero five two two one zero six seven two one zero six eight be approved subject to

2:59:29section two eight four point one one of the municipal act and without being read thank you so that has

2:59:36been moved and seconded is anyone opposed seeing none that carries thank you item 10 mayors announcements

2:59:46the only announcement I have is that you did a fantastic job chairing today

2:59:52thank you I'll I'll be settling up in your office next okay all right all right get the measure

2:59:57can take get the measure and take that feed up on your desk okay uh motion to adjourn please

3:00:02Councillor Caiten and Councillor Richardson anyone opposed that carries thank you very much everyone

3:00:09thank you everybody bye bye