Points be given to proposals close to existing services used by the same population to lower barriers to access.

1:19:50We have 10 delegations and some of them may know how we do things here and some may not know, so I'll just state it out loud here at the beginning so everyone's on the same page.

1:20:01Everyone has no more than five minutes. So if you need the five minutes, take it. If you don't, that's fine. But you will hear a chime at the four minute and 30 second mark giving you that 30 second warning that your five minute limit is coming up.

1:20:16Your microphone will be turned off at the five minute mark though. Okay. And didn't stick around just in case there is any follow up questions. And if there's not, then we'll go on to the next delegation.

1:20:26And the first one is Dean Mitchell Moore, who I believe is here in person.

1:20:31I, Dean, come on forward. Thank you for coming and whenever you start, you can go whenever you're comfortable. Go right ahead.

1:20:43Thank you for allowing me to speak right now. I was informed about this funding for a day shelter. And I do. I took off a forad pickle scale for downtown bench.

1:20:56Feeding the needy in that. Now I'm aware of a lot of the people and their personalities in that.

1:21:03The funding is great and we appreciate it. But if it's not accessible to downtown and that people are not going to use wherever you go.

1:21:13The RCM is prepared and set with new showers, new bathrooms that they're doing. That would be a great place to put the funding. I don't know what your plan is for it, but that would be an optimal place.

1:21:29I know the CHC is doing some renovations as well. But I'm not sure what all the that entails.

1:21:37But if it's not downtown, like we can get the people off the streets, but they're not going to leave downtown.

1:21:44Because that's where we feed them. That's where everything the pharmacies are. The meds are right.

1:21:51They're not going to travel and come back and travel again.

1:21:55So if that could be thought of when you decide where you want to put the funding.

1:22:01So I really got to say it's my first time in here. I don't know you're doing just fine. Thank you.

1:22:08Thank you very much. I don't want to cut you off. I just want to make sure you're good.

1:22:13Yeah, like I said, I took over for Ed. So I know most of these people personally now. I've been dealing with them for a couple years, helping Ed, Rachel, the downtown friends on Sundays.

1:22:25I've been in the community for four and a half, five years now. And some of them are some of these people that use these services I've known for over 30 years.

1:22:35I know them well. So if anybody wants to talk privately on different issues, I'll stick around.

1:22:44But I mean, as an open forum, I don't know what to say.

1:22:48It's okay. Thank you very much. I'll just see if there's a follow up at this time if there is.

1:22:54Oh, yep. Councillor Althaus, go ahead.

1:22:57Thank you very much, Marigot 3. Through you to the delegate, Mr. Mitchell Moore. Mr. Mitchell Moore, thank you very much for speaking.

1:23:04You said that people would not take advantage of a...

1:23:08If it's not downtown, no.

1:23:10Could you explain why and what might provide incentive for them to take advantage of it if it's not downtown? Or is that just out of the question?

1:23:19Well, if there's transportation provided, but I mean, they're not going to travel to the outskirts of town with their bags and come back.

1:23:28But stepping stone, they get kicked out at 8 o'clock in the morning. They got to take all their bags with them.

1:23:35And then they can't get back in there until 8 p.m.

1:23:38So if they got to go across town to a day shelter, come back into town to get the meds and go back again,

1:23:45they're just going to go sit on a sidewalk downtown in the summer weather.

1:23:50Right? Who's going to travel that much with all their bags?

1:23:55It's just more convenient for them to be downtown.

1:24:00And the RCM, the Royal City Mission, allows them to bring their bags in, sit at a table,

1:24:07and they're already got an elevator for anybody in a wheelchair or anything that needs it.

1:24:14They've got renovations on the go for showers, bathrooms. They're expanding already.

1:24:22They just... They don't open until noon.

1:24:25So when they leave stepping stone, all they got to do is wait four hours and the RCM is open to get a meal.

1:24:31They get a place that's warm, right?

1:24:35Well, I travel across town with your bags and travel back.

1:24:42Thank you very much.

1:24:43I'm not saying that's exactly where to put the money, but if it's not something in that manner,

1:24:48they're just going to wait for the RCM to open.

1:24:53Great. Thank you very much. Thank you, Councillor Holt.

1:24:56And we appreciate it. And for your first time here, you did great. Okay?

1:24:59Thank you. Thank you very much.

1:25:01All right, Morgan Dandy, who has been here often, knows the drill. Come on forward, Morgan.

1:25:26Nice to be able to stand this time.

1:25:28Whoever oppresses the poor shows contempt for their maker.

1:25:43But whoever is kind to the needy honors God.

1:25:46Proverbs 1431.

1:25:49Council members, in 2020, when I started making a point of providing service for my less fortunate neighbors,

1:26:00I would often think there, but for the grace of God, go I.

1:26:05You never really know where you're going to be five years from now.

1:26:15Because today, instead of being a monthly donor to Hope House and providing meal service,

1:26:23I now use the services provided and spend time in my new community.

1:26:30Being able to spend time with my chosen community is important.

1:26:39As Gail Hoekstra of Stepping Stone said at Breezy Breakfast during episode 216,

1:26:46around the 19 minute mark of the podcast, there are three parts needed to support our community.

1:26:53One, housing.

1:26:56Two, access to healthcare services.

1:26:59And three, community.

1:27:02With all three being of equal importance.

1:27:07Slightly before this statement to paraphrase Gail, newly housed people experience loneliness and community is the antidote and the key to successfully transitioning to being appropriately housed.

1:27:27I would have loved for you to have heard from more community members who access services at Royal City Mission,

1:27:34but 6pm's dinner time and chairs start getting packed up at 6.30.

1:27:39So people needed to choose to eat.

1:27:44And allow people like me to speak on their behalf.

1:27:48To me, the idea of having restrictions or criteria for where a day shelter is located, well, it's just not a fair process for an organization to be able to submit a proposal for a day shelter.

1:28:06Additionally, the idea of having said day shelter outside of the downtown core is strange considering the provincially approved heart hub located at the community health center on Upper Wyndham is currently being constructed and other services, housing,

1:28:24Ontario Works, the Norfolk Pharmacy, Chalmers, Hope House.

1:28:30They're all in close proximity.

1:28:34I'm grateful that staff brought forward the RFP for approval because that means stable funding and the potential of the dream Gail spoke of with a partnership between stepping stone drop in and rural city mission.

1:28:49And that could maybe become a reality, but what is that dream.

1:28:53It's a 24 seven shelter service, including 12 hours of day shelter split between the two locations.

1:29:01I'm hopeful this dream will become reality when 23 Gordon's completed and stable funding is in place.

1:29:10A reminder from Proverts 1421.

1:29:14It is a sin to despise one's neighbor, but blessed is the one who is kind to the needy.

1:29:24It's my hope that today, Council will remember that kindness and approve a fair and equitable RFP for a funded day shelter.

1:29:36Thank you.

1:29:37Thank you. Are there any questions for this delegate.

1:29:40Seeing none. Thank you.

1:29:42Tate, Kate is next joining us by video.

1:29:45Mary, God, we have for your event for your awareness and for Council's awareness. We're expecting that the individual is going to join us over the phone. We're just connecting with them at this moment.

1:29:56Okay.

1:29:57So maybe if we can just hold for a short moment, and then if we're having difficulty.

1:30:02We can we can attempt someone's actually I just got a message that they're able to join by the telephone so you can proceed.

1:30:08Great. Tate, have you unmuted? Can we hear you? Okay. You want to just say hello so we can make sure your audio is working.

1:30:18And if you can hear me, you got to just press star 6.

1:30:21Follow me.

1:30:23It works just call.

1:30:27We're having some technical difficulties.

1:30:30Is it.

1:30:34Yeah, we can circle back.

1:30:36Yep.

1:30:38Or you could just come on your screen, I guess.

1:30:42I don't know how that would work, but if that's allowed, we'll do that.

1:30:47I'm fine with it. I'll allow it.

1:30:56Hi there. Sorry about that. I was on the web X phone, but then clerks just called me. So I had to hang up the phone waiting on hold here to take that call with clerks. So sorry about that.

1:31:07Yep. Go right ahead. Your time will start whenever you're ready. Okay.

1:31:10Yep. Sounds good. Hello, Mayor and Council. I'm Kay and I'm in constituent of board to.

1:31:16I'm here to speak about the request for proposals.

1:31:19For the regarding a supportive daytime space after watching the previous meeting where possible location based restrictions were discussed.

1:31:27It's irresponsible to take a restrictive approach towards an urgently needed social space this early on in the proposal process, especially when those restrictions are based on feelings rather than data and reason.

1:31:40The focus should be on project requirements and timelines requirements such as accessibility with an open mindset towards suitable locations close to current community services and our central transit hub.

1:31:53Welcomeing streets, CHC, RCM, all these services are downtown, Chalmers, Hope House. I could keep listening adjacent social resources.

1:32:02Placing restrictions on an RFP does nothing but cause delays or make it more difficult for the people who need this space where it makes most sense close to other resources.

1:32:13This decision should consider the reality that most of the downtown core is surrounded by a substantial slope or gradation, which can be inaccessible for many.

1:32:22It can be very difficult to get up and down some of those slopes year round, but especially in the winter.

1:32:28I've spoken to some people who use mobility devices and they have told me even around the downtown core, many of the sidewalks and businesses are very difficult to access.

1:32:37It can even be difficult to get off of a bus in the winter, let alone up and down in icy or snowy side street.

1:32:44Ignoring accessibility may result in legal or even charter challenges, which is not in the best interests for Guelph, both the taxpayers and the corporation of Guelph, especially when these restrictions are rooted in stigma.

1:32:58I met with my city counselor, Councillor Goeller, and he stated he was putting a request out to legal regarding this proposal.

1:33:05I'm interested in hearing the outcome of this legal discussion and what their recommendations are before a decision is made.

1:33:11This could be a costly battle for Guelph if the legal advice about creating restrictions is not properly considered and a decision is made without due diligence.

1:33:21I mentioned being a resident of Ward 2, however, I do not own a downtown business, something that I personally feel is irrelevant to this discussion despite some counselors feeling otherwise.

1:33:32I hope this doesn't disqualify my voice in these chambers.

1:33:36This is a council which serves people of Guelph and there are Guelphites who require these services.

1:33:42This council does not exist to amplify stigma from the DGBA despite two of the DGBA seats being held by city council members.

1:33:50But when you're in these chambers, it is your responsibility to protect all of Guelph.

1:33:55There is a reason we have a council and a DGBA board as separate entities because one represents the people of Guelph and the other represents the businesses of downtown.

1:34:05This is a Guelph council decision, not a DGBA meeting.

1:34:10DGBA does not provide social services to our community.

1:34:14DGBA is irrelevant to this discussion unless they wish to get into the business of finding initiatives like the space discussed in this proposal.

1:34:23At its core, this is a decision surrounding basic healthcare, community resources, and harm reduction.

1:34:30The Association of Municipalities of Ontario, AMO website clearly states the responsibilities of municipal politics, including health and social services, shelter services, and social or community housing.

1:34:42It does not say you have to amplify unsubstantiated stigma or make feelings-based decisions which harm your community.

1:34:49It's not the municipality's responsibility to protect the feelings and misconceptions of a few business owners.

1:34:58Just because an area has a business improvement association does not mean it is exclusively an economic zone.

1:35:05If downtown is an economic zone, why are there residents and residential zoning and new residential construction?

1:35:11Why are there churches? Why are there doctors or other social supports and meal programs?

1:35:16I can actually answer that because downtown is not exclusively an economic zone and I'm baffled a resident of this ward has to explain this to their government.

1:35:25When basic needs are restricted, delayed, or unfeasible to access, people's health further suffers in a province where hospitals are overburdened to the point of billions of Ontarians' tax dollars being spent on private staffing agencies.

1:35:38This space should not be restricted by any feelings, stigma, or perception.

1:35:43What's more important in this proposal is accessibility, feasibility, and timelines to support the people who will use it.

1:35:50I encourage you to listen to the delegates tonight because selective listening and ignoring countless facts for a few feelings is not representative of a Democratic or responsible council.

1:36:01I encourage you to focus on requirements for the folks who actually need this space, who you have a duty to support by speaking to them.

1:36:08It is also your duty to challenge stigma and misinformation which harms these communities rather than validating and amplifying hatred.

1:36:16Urgently needed.

1:36:18Sorry, not your hands. Sorry. Sorry, it's cam and I just sorry that was your your five minutes there. Okay, so I did have to stop you there. My apologies.

1:36:26But thank you very much for your delegation. And is there any questions as a follow up?

1:36:33Seeing none. Thank you very much for joining us.

1:36:36Okay, the next is Sharon Felker is Sharon here.

1:36:44Front row. Thank you very much. And whenever you're ready, go right ahead.

1:36:57I would like to thank council, the mayor and city staff for allowing me to speak to a matter that is of great importance to me.

1:37:06My name is Sharon Felker. I am here today as a concerned citizen, Ward 2 resident and someone who frequents and has worked downtown.

1:37:19I would like to speak to you about the daytime community shelter and where I believe it needs to be located.

1:37:27First, I'd like to thank you for your support for a daytime shelter because it is a much needed critical service for our community.

1:37:39Standing here in front of you this evening is a bit of my comfort zone, but I believe real growth and understanding comes from allowing ourselves to be vulnerable.

1:37:52I grew up in Guelph and have many fond memories of our downtown core, the shopping, the events, but mostly the inclusion of everyone was very evident when you walk the streets of downtown.

1:38:09At that time, there were individuals living in poverty, people dealing with addictions. And yes, some people were unhoused.

1:38:20How do I know? In 1967, after the sudden death of my father, the descent into a so-called social safety net was devastating.

1:38:33This system takes every last ounce of self-esteem and worthiness, tosses it in the toilet and continues to flush it every time you feel like you might be able to muster some strength to pull yourself out of the poverty hole.

1:38:50I watched my mother deteriorate bit by bit, unable to cope with the constant barriers and demoralizing treatment she faced, and was left to feel something was wrong with her.

1:39:02I know what it was like for my family to not have the support we needed, and I can only imagine how much more difficult this is today.

1:39:13I often wonder how my life would have been so different if we had just had supports in place that could have helped us work through the trauma rather than add to it.

1:39:27To me, it is imperative that the daytime community shelter be in an area close to the resources people need to access.

1:39:37These individuals are in a deep state of survival mode. Every moment of their day is spent trying to figure out where their next meal is coming from, how to get from out of the extreme cold or extreme heat, where to lay their head to rest, and to just feel safe for a few minutes.

1:40:00Each and every one of us need to take responsibility for the crisis we are seeing as a society. Every level of government needs to take accountability.

1:40:11You cannot stop building affordable housing for decades, keep wages low, increase the cost of groceries, and expect people to thrive.

1:40:21As a resident of Ward 2, having worked downtown, I understand the complexities and the need to have a viable thriving downtown.

1:40:32But in order for a society to thrive, it has to be inclusive.

1:40:37If the daytime shelter is placed outside of the downtown core, what I believe ultimately will happen is that we will be forcing our most vulnerable citizens to go deeper into hiding, feeling even more ostracized and unworthy, putting them in a place of complete hopelessness.

1:40:58And that, I fear, will lead to an increase in the crisis we are in, and we will begin to see many more lives lost. For me, one death is too many.

1:41:14If we as a society continue to criminalize and ostracize our most vulnerable, then how can we expect that anything will ever change?

1:41:26The most vulnerable, the marginalized, those with less opportunity will continue to struggle, and we will continue to see the demise of our society, not just downtown, but throughout our entire city, as we are already beginning to see.

1:41:41Imagine if we work together to support each other. Imagine if we stop judging how a person gets to that place. Imagine if we move past our own fears so we could begin to understand their situation and how we can best assist.

1:41:57I don't believe we need to oust them further.

1:42:01Sorry, that's your five minutes.

1:42:03I tried to go fast.

1:42:04No, I could tell. I heard the beep at 30 seconds and I saw your speed go up a little bit. So we all do it naturally. So thank you. Is there any follow-up questions to this delegate?

1:42:14Thank you very much for coming. We appreciate it.

1:42:17Dominica McPherson from the Guelph-Molligan Task Force for Poverty Elimination is here in person. And whenever you're ready, go right ahead.

1:42:29Thank you for the opportunity to speak with you today. I want to begin by sincerely thanking you for your commitment to addressing critical community needs.

1:42:39Your unanimous support for proceeding with a procurement process to fund daytime shelter is a significant and commendable step.

1:42:47Stable funding like this enables real planning, coordination, consistency, and staff retention.

1:42:54Key ingredients for delivering better, more reliable support to people in crisis and in turn to our broader community.

1:43:02That kind of consistency has been lacking in the past.

1:43:05This commitment addresses that with the integrity and clarity that come from an open, transparent, and fair procurement process.

1:43:13I'm here to encourage you to maintain that momentum by not placing restrictive requirements on the procurement process or limiting where this service can be located geographically.

1:43:23Safety and vibrancy in the downtown are super important. They are not at odds with support services.

1:43:30We can respond to poverty and homelessness with compassion and effectiveness while also supporting a healthy, thriving downtown for everyone.

1:43:38In fact, well supported and well run services are part of the solution.

1:43:43Daytime shelters or drop in spaces provide safety and stability and offer connection points that support people on a path towards housing, health, and opportunity.

1:43:53They are part of the infrastructure of a caring, safe, and functional city.

1:43:58The suggestion that important services should not be located downtown or that people experiencing poverty, housing loss, or health issues could access critical supports elsewhere is not only impractical, it is harmful.

1:44:11These are members of our community.

1:44:14People who are facing issues that will not go away if there is no daytime shelter.

1:44:19They will still be downtown, but with fewer safe spaces to go, increasing risk and deepening crisis.

1:44:27Ensuring access to supports when and where people need them creates pathways to stability and contributes to a safer, more inclusive community for everyone.

1:44:36Inclusion isn't in opposition to safety. It's essential to it.

1:44:41When we respond with compassion and evidence informed services, we build a more stable, inclusive city for all residents, workers, businesses, and visitors alike.

1:44:51The poverty task force, as you know, supports collaboration to address the root causes of poverty.

1:44:57I work with partners who are committed to aligning their services, coordinating hours, using resources as effectively as possible, and building models shaped by community needs and feedback.

1:45:09The goal is not only to provide a safe place to be, but to connect people to housing, health care, and the supports needed to move forward.

1:45:16This work is already happening. Let's not constrain it before it starts.

1:45:21Daytime shelter is complex and resource intensive to deliver.

1:45:25There are very few organizations that I know of with the capacity, space, or willingness to take it on, especially not alone at the proposed scale and hours.

1:45:34While a desire for accountability and safety is entirely understandable, overly restrictive requirements or narrow geographic limitations could unintentionally make the service impossible to deliver and could prevent viable proposals from being submitted.

1:45:50This could risk leaving the community without this critical service by the end of December during the coldest time of the year, leaving people with few or no options for where to go.

1:46:01At the same time, I want to encourage Council not to lose sight of the bigger picture, which will be a surprise to none of you.

1:46:09A daytime shelter is essential, but it's not a solution to homelessness or poverty.

1:46:13We need to address the crisis while also working upstream to prevent and solve these issues.

1:46:19I want to acknowledge the difficult environment in which you're working.

1:46:23Municipalities are too often left to manage the visible impacts of poverty, homelessness, and mental health without the funding and tools you need from upper levels of government, and I want to thank you for your tireless advocacy in this regard.

1:46:37While many of the root causes lie beyond the municipal mandate, there are still meaningful tools in your hands.

1:46:42A strong housing affordability strategy, you can action measures like a renovation and rental replacement bylaw to prevent the loss of housing, and you can continue to champion deeply affordable housing projects to create more.

1:46:55Your decision to invest in a daytime shelter reflects leadership and commitment to community well-being. Thank you.

1:47:03I urge you now to ensure the process remains open, achievable, and responsive to real capacity and need, not constrained by limitations that could undermine its success.

1:47:13Let's move forward with a solution that supports those who need it most, strengthens our entire community, and keeps compassion, inclusion, and evidence at the heart of our decisions. Thank you so much.

1:47:26Thank you very much. Just under the wire there. Well done. Is there any follow up for Dominica? Councillor Bustel?

1:47:35Yes, thank you for your delegation. Not saying you're old, but you've got a long lens, you know, in the community many years. Do you have any knowledge of daytime shelters being done before, either here, you know, close by or so on, and what it looks like?

1:47:53Yeah, so I mean, I think some of you have even cited examples. As you may know, our organization oversees the infographic weather response of the services, so we actively have conversations with organizations.

1:48:06And I don't think it's a surprise to anyone that the pre-pandemic context where we had supports offered in a number of different locations, people predominantly, you know, earlier in the day were at the drop-in center, 23 Gordon now known as Stepping Stone is the organization,

1:48:22would be in later afternoon evening at Royal City Mission with supports more broadly provided by agencies. I can say that partners are looking to those types of models again to try and explore how we can best meet needs, and are actively talking about the needs of not just the people that first and foremost they are trying to support,

1:48:41but businesses, people accessing downtown and really trying to listen to the input and feedback to be as efficient with resources as possible, but also collaborate and align services.

1:48:52Just a quick supplemental. So just what you described, I was on council, was that developed through an RFP process or how did that come about?

1:49:05Yeah, so no, from my knowledge, at the time services, it's important to acknowledge that services were still quite fragmented prior to the pandemic and throughout the pandemic as well, with huge gratitude for your resourcing that you put out in recent years.

1:49:22But that fragmentation meant that there was still quite a few gaps in terms of service and I think it's important to consider how deeper and more significant some of the issues people are facing.

1:49:34So the need to provide this type of stable funding to prevent gaps from existing so that people have places to go is a huge difference that I think will serve our community really well, and not just people that are going to rely on these services to get by.

1:49:48Thank you.

1:49:49Councillor Allt. Thank you very much. Through you to the delegate.

1:49:54Ms McPherson, you talked about a fair procurement process. I was wondering if you could please identify what you consider to be challenging or what worries you have about what impediments might be put in place.

1:50:07Yeah, I mean, I'm not a procurement expert.

1:50:11But I think in general, organizations that that I know that would be interested in pursuing this are spread very thin at the same time recognize the importance of this and I've heard huge gratitude for your championing of wanting to support something like this.

1:50:26I think what's important to consider is also the amount of time and energy that needs to go into to participating in procurement processes. So if the process has far too many requirements, it could actually make it difficult for those organizations to respond in a timely manner.

1:50:41That would allow you to fulfill your procurement process and could preclude them from being able to apply just knowing the disproportionate barriers they face rather than it not being a commitment to want to make sure that you fulsomely have what you need for a good procurement process as well.

1:50:56But I think it's important to consider the.

1:50:58Yeah, the pressure that these organizations are facing.

1:51:02Right.

1:51:04Thank you, Dominique. No more questions. Thank you very much. Thank you so much.

1:51:08Ella Elliott is going to join us by video.

1:51:11Hi, Ella. It's it's America three just wondering if you wanted to look to turn on your video.

1:51:36Or you could just try your audio if you wish.

1:51:39Maybe we'll try to come back to Ella.

1:51:51Okay.

1:51:53Andrea Baker is going to also try to join us by video.

1:51:57And Andrea, if you're if you can hear me, it's mayor Guthrie. Just feel free to jump on turn on your video there and try your audio or if it's easier just audio.

1:52:10Oh, there you are.

1:52:11Okay, we can see and hear you. That's perfect. And you have no more than five minutes. So go right ahead. Okay.

1:52:18Through you, Mr. Mayor. Thank you for listening.

1:52:23Yeah, so echoing a couple things that I've heard today.

1:52:27Okay.

1:52:29I'm a fully equipped shelter that no one uses because it's inviolable and in an inaccessible location seems to be very cost and effective. I want you to think about that.

1:52:42As you're considering this because, you know, there's a lot of things that could be considered when deciding.

1:52:51If you're thinking about it, you know, if it's a good day time shelter and you obviously want it to be a fully equipped facility that serves everyone's needs but if that's in a place that people aren't going to use aren't going to be in anyways, which I think we've heard from a few people

1:53:07already seems to be the case.

1:53:10You know, if it was in some locations that people are already in.

1:53:17It's a waste of money. Right.

1:53:20Especially when then those people who are downtown.

1:53:25Like Dean said, we'll be needing those services anyways.

1:53:31I know Dean was talking about Royal City Mission a little.

1:53:35I've attended that as a church and also volunteered there somewhat.

1:53:40I know people are well cared for there. And it's a wonderful facility and downtown and and I, yeah, I know people are around that area regardless.

1:53:55And like Dean said, yeah, it sounds like people won't be traveling multiple times. They have a lot of bags on them right because, you know, some some people are in very transient stages where they have to carry a lot of things with them.

1:54:13And so I think you have to be realistic right like, I don't know if anyone's heard about real estate it's location location location those are the three L's of real estate right.

1:54:24And this is very responsible. This is very important very impactful. And yeah I'd like to echo Tay, when they said it seems irresponsible and irrational to place restrictions on the RFP.

1:54:39I believe I got that right.

1:54:43Because, you know, we, what is this you have to think of what is this service for, and what is it not for. And it, like, like reiterating a little bit, but they will be downtown.

1:55:04And that is what the people who know the most are saying they will be downtown, regardless, is just a matter of whether they are sheltering inside a climate controlled space, or outside on the sidewalk, tired, hot, not able to go inside, which, I would say seems like an undignifying

1:55:22experience.

1:55:25Which comes along with stigma, arguably seen today.

1:55:31I, I believe some people don't want daytime shelter to be downtown.

1:55:38And I think it's because they're trying to hide this poverty, because they're uncomfortable with witnessing this poverty. And I'd like to invite people to look at what a daytime shelter is for and what the solutions to poverty are.

1:55:54Is that discomfort? Should it be swept under the rug?

1:55:59And so, I think that's the most important thing to do in my opinion.

1:56:06Yeah, so I think that's it from me. Does anyone, yeah.

1:56:18Thank you. Thank you so much, Andrea. Any follow up for Andrea at all?

1:56:26There isn't. So thank you for joining us tonight.

1:56:29Thank you.

1:56:31Let me go back to Ella. Ella Elliott, I believe is going to try to get the video and audio on.

1:56:38Hi, Ella. It's Mayor Guthrie. Can you hear me? Can you at least hear me?

1:56:44Just try to maybe talk for us. Okay, we're going to have to, we're going to have to come back and try. We'll try a third time.

1:57:11But Laura lie root is going to join us now by video.

1:57:14There's Laura lie. Thank you.

1:57:17Yes, perfect. I was just going to ask you to test your audio. So thank you.

1:57:29And I know that I'll be, you know, lenient on the on the on the time allotment there for you. So you can go right ahead. Okay.

1:57:37I should be all right. Thanks. Hello, council. Mayor Guthrie. Thank you for the opportunity to speak to you today.

1:57:44My name is Laura lie and I'm here to urge you to ensure that the proposed daytime shelter is going to be located in the heart of downtown Guelph.

1:57:52Not moved out to the margins, but located right where the need is the greatest.

1:57:57I've also seen some proposed emotions posted online today and with those in mind I also urge you not to waste any taxpayer dollars or staff resources on developing point systems or placement guidelines when a suitable RFP process already exists that takes into account things like the

1:58:17community and other things, other factors that I saw mentioned that will likely be coming up later in this discussion.

1:58:24When we talk about an RFP for social services like this, I think we should really be asking mainly how do we meet the needs of the people that we're attempting to support with these services.

1:58:34If the goal is to support those who are unhoused or experiencing poverty or living with food insecurity, then we need to locate the shelter in the community that it's meant to serve, especially when that community doesn't have access to transportation.

1:58:47And that community is downtown.

1:58:49I know it's councils aimed to always be responsible with any funds that you have access to so I have to also point out that to put a daytime shelter anywhere else is going to be incredibly ineffective and honestly quite an efficient use of our funding.

1:59:02I call this because I work in this community. I'm a frontline worker in downtown Guelph. I volunteer and live in the community that we're talking about, and I help run an organization that provides food supplies and other necessary supports for people who need them downtown.

1:59:15The group of people that I work with is the group of people that this shelter would serve.

1:59:20I've talked to countless people who call downtown their home and I can promise you, as others have said here today, they are not going to pick up and move just to follow a service to another part of town.

1:59:31I think they shouldn't have to. The city is their home too, and that's not going to change just because some people wish it would change.

1:59:39Of course, I wouldn't be me if I didn't also highlight some accessibility concerns so I also have to remind everyone of the enormous overlap between the disabled community and the unhoused low income and food insecure communities.

1:59:51We cannot talk about daytime shelters without also talking about accessibility.

1:59:55Many of the people who need this shelter don't drive. They can't afford cabs. They can't use Guelph Transit reliably. Many can't even apply for mobility services or the taxiscript program because those systems are still impossible to access for many people, despite repeated calls from the AAC to fix them.

2:00:14So if we put this shelter outside of the downtown core, we're going to be building it outside of reach of all of the people who need it the most.

2:00:21We can't be asking disabled people to trek through the snow in the winter or the extreme heat in the summer or the downtown hills and slopes just to access a bathroom or a bite to eat.

2:00:33That wouldn't just be bad planning or nimbyism or gentrification. It would also be blatant ableism.

2:00:40We don't want to serve this community. We need to put the services where the community already is and that's downtown Guelph.

2:00:47Now I know there are some people in Guelph who don't want social services downtown mainly because they don't want to have to see unhoused people downtown.

2:00:56Maybe they don't want to be reminded of poverty when they're going to get a coffee or spend their money.

2:01:01Even for those people, and I should note they're people I strongly disagree with. I think that's a really unethical take.

2:01:08But even for those people, the solution to that problem is still a daytime shelter located in downtown Guelph.

2:01:15Because if your concern is people hanging out outside downtown businesses all day, then give them somewhere indoors to hang out downtown.

2:01:22Give them access to rest, to water, to washrooms and to human dignity.

2:01:27I think if we're all being really honest, this conversation isn't actually about the location of services. It's about the location of people, right?

2:01:34And specifically a certain type of people. We're talking about people living in poverty and experiencing a hard time.

2:01:41It's about an attempt to relocate a community, a community that is deeply rooted and has existed downtown for generations and isn't going anywhere.

2:01:49This conversation is about displacing people. But classism and gentrification and nimbyism are not new concepts.

2:01:56I grew up on Cardigan Street, which is in the heart of downtown Guelph.

2:02:00And so I've seen the pattern of attempting to relocate this community play out over and over again, including recently with the Public Space Use Bylaw.

2:02:09And that didn't work, right? These people are still downtown because you can't make it illegal to be poor in public.

2:02:15And just like every other attempt to erase people from downtown, this one wouldn't work either.

2:02:20The community is here and it's staying and it's resilient.

2:02:24And downtown Guelph is meant to be for everyone, not just business owners, not just people with property, not just people with money or the means to be sold to.

2:02:34So if your goal is to reduce the number of people with nowhere to go downtown, then give them somewhere to go downtown.

2:02:40That's how you solve that problem. Not by pretending the community doesn't exist.

2:02:45Not by shuffling them out of sight. Not by unethically prioritizing commerce above human rights.

2:02:51But by meeting people where they are at and providing them with essential services that can propel them forward in their lives and allow them the opportunity to thrive.

2:02:59So please put the daytime shelter downtown.

2:03:01And also please ensure that any requirements for shelters are also requirements for downtown businesses.

2:03:07Because like I said, I spend a lot of time downtown and I can think of a few business owners who could benefit from following a good neighbor policy like the one counselor Gowler has been advocating for the city to enforce exclusively on the recipients of social services.

2:03:20Thank you.

2:03:21Okay, thank you very much. Is there any follow up for this delegation seeing none.

2:03:29Thank you very much. Thank you, Lorelai.

2:03:34Ella Elliott, we're going to try for a third time.

2:03:42Okay. Okay, Ella, we're we're parent of the clerks are telling me that apparently you are connected. Did you want to try your audio your audio and video?

2:03:58Okay. Yeah, I'm sorry.

2:04:07Ella, we appreciate you trying to make the effort there. We're not sure what's happened, but but thank you very much and you can feel free to email any comments into us and maybe you did already but thank you for trying. Okay.

2:04:23Let's see who's next here.

2:04:26Yeah, Daniel Lopram is here. I think is Dan here in person.

2:04:33No, okay. And Shelby law. Thank you for waiting and you can start whenever you're ready. Okay.

2:04:50All right. First off, thank you for having me here today to speak. And thank you for staff for putting together the proposal for having a downtown shelter.

2:05:02I've been living here in Guelph for over 10 years. I came here as a student. I'm now an educator here in the city. And I volunteer with our community downtown.

2:05:13I've also lived in downtown. I continued to shop in downtown.

2:05:18And I would continue to do that with a daytime shelter downtown.

2:05:23As you've heard, everyone speaking here today. Everyone is in sport in support of a shelter, a daytime shelter. And specifically, everyone is telling you this needs to be downtown.

2:05:36I'm not going to repeat everything that everyone has already said tonight, because I know you still have other things on the agenda tonight.

2:05:44But I just want to implore you to not only listen to everyone saying we need the shelter downtown.

2:05:52But to really, really take that into heart when you are voting, take that into heart if you have anything to add to the motion.

2:06:02And I want you to think think about what people will think.

2:06:08If Council moves to create the shelter outside of downtown.

2:06:12I don't believe this at all. I know that Council is here to support everyone in Guelph.

2:06:20But I can't help wondering if people will think that counselors are cruel for putting the shelter where people cannot access it.

2:06:29If you knowingly put a shelter, or even suggest that we should be prioritizing shelters outside of the downtown core after hearing all these people tell you that is the wrong thing to do.

2:06:41I worry what your constituents are going to think.

2:06:45I worry that they are going to see their counselors as people that don't actually care. And I don't want them to start thinking that of you.

2:06:54This shelter needs to be downtown for all the reasons that you've heard today.

2:07:02But as people have pointed out, like Andrea said, people may think that Council is just trying to sweep the people away.

2:07:10But even talking about putting the shelter anywhere from downtown, or trying to say that places outside of the downtown core should be prioritized.

2:07:20Your would be further marginalizing people who are already marginalized by putting daytime shelters in the margins of the city. You are marginalizing people.

2:07:31The only logical thing is to have this downtown.

2:07:35Staff have provided you a system already to determine the best proposals, best places to have a daytime shelter.

2:07:44Listen to what staff tells you. You're paying them for a reason, right?

2:07:48Don't waste more money and time by arguing against what the people are telling you right now.

2:07:57The only reasons that I see to have this outside of downtown, and I think the only reasons that anyone can see, are rooted in misconceptions about our community.

2:08:06They are rooted in beliefs about who the people are downtown and what it means to be in poverty.

2:08:14So I hope that Council will vote to have a shelter, a daytime shelter, that will help us in the summer as we have these extreme heats.

2:08:24As we just heard, we've had our graphic put out for the summer and you can see there isn't enough space for everybody.

2:08:33City Hall is going to have to be open on hot days. If we had a daytime shelter, that would be one place where everyone knows it can consistently be.

2:08:43It's going to get worse than in the winter. This is a problem that needs to be solved and it's going to be solved by a downtown shelter.

2:08:52Thank you.

2:08:55Great. Thank you very much Shelby. Is there any questions for Shelby at all?

2:08:59Seeing none. Thank you for waiting and thank you for your delegation.

2:09:03That is our last delegate of this item. So thank you very much.

2:09:08We are going to look to move into a closed session right away and it is coming up on the screen.

2:09:19Excuse me. Is that Council for the City of Guelph to hold a meeting that is closed to the public?

2:09:25Pursuant to Section 239, 2F of the Municipal Act regarding advice that is subject to solicitor client privilege and including communications necessary for that purpose,

2:09:38specifically in regards to addressing gaps in daytime sheltering options for persons experiencing homelessness.

2:09:44I have someone move for that. Thank you Councillor Alts. Richardson will second that for me. Thank you. Is there anyone against that?

2:09:52No one. So we are going to have an in-camera meeting to seek that legal advice and then when we come back out, I will give a high level summary of that and then we will continue with the item.

2:10:00Okay. Thank you. Okay. Just giving the one minute warning.

2:43:14Okay. Great. I'll call the meeting back to order then please. Just one second.

2:43:18Sorry everybody. I'm fine.

2:43:29We went in camera under the getting legal advice. We received legal advice. There was no direction given. We just received legal advice under this item and as I said, no direction was given.

2:43:40And so we are back out into open session. And let me just go to my agenda here.

2:43:47So let me just ask that the three recommendations be tabled.

2:43:55Okay. Carly and I'm sorry, Councillor Klassen, Councillor Goller. Thank you and Councillor Goller.

2:44:05Okay. You go ahead ahead.

2:44:10Thank you, Your Worship. Did you wonder to be questions first or should I? Is it okay if I move a motion?

2:44:17Okay. Okay. Well, I wanted to first of all thank staff for the work on this on the RFP. I think it's imperative that the City of Guelph do provide funding for daytime shelter services.

2:44:32It's something that our community needs.

2:44:36And based on conversations that I've had with my constituents, with fellow councillors, with staff and with their support. I've come up with this wording.

2:44:51And I have two motions. The first motion acknowledges that we want to provide daytime shelter services. We know this needs to be in our downtown core.

2:45:04We have heard from some from the downtown VA from people that work and live in the downtown that they have concerns about the concentration of services.

2:45:15So with this, I wanted to prioritize some of the downtown main streets, not the entire downtown, but some of the main streets as part of our thriving business district.

2:45:27So with the wording provided here, it would provide a location score on submissions that are outside of a few of the downtown streets. But by and large, it does not restrict any organization or any group from applying.

2:45:46Councillor Coller, I'm so sorry. Can you just read them?

2:45:50Oh, absolutely.

2:45:51And let me get a seconder.

2:45:52Okay.

2:45:53So that you can continue to talk.

2:45:54There we go.

2:45:55Okay.

2:45:56So, so, so have you, have you read them all out?

2:45:58I might take a bit. Have you read them all out? I'll see if there's a seconder and then we can go back to you. Okay.

2:46:03Perfect.

2:46:04The first one is that staff directed to use an RFP scoring area that includes scoring based on the proposed locations where if the proposed daytime shelter locations are not on Wyndham Street between Wellington and Woolwich, Cardiff Street, Quebec Street, Cork Street,

2:46:20East, Macdonald Street or Wilson Street, the proposal receives a higher location score than submissions where the proposed daytime shelter locations are on one of those identified streets.

2:46:32And the second motion is that staff be directed to develop an RFP which requires proponents to include the following in the proposals without limitation.

2:46:42The municipal address location map floor plan layout and detailed description of the proposed daytime shelter location, including buildings in their amenities, private outdoor areas and AODA compliant accessibility.

2:46:56Key staff roles, job descriptions, areas of expertise and training, including health and safety, conflict resolution and the escalation techniques.

2:47:06Plans and resources to maintain safe operations, including facility management and operational protocols, health and safety, cleanliness, waste management, pest management and general maintenance.

2:47:18Summary of operational policies, rules, codes of conduct for clients and staff.

2:47:23A summary of good neighbor approach to managing relations with neighbors and compatibility with the surrounding community.

2:47:31And sufficient wash-off facilities during hours of operation for members of the public in need, regardless of whether they use the daytime shelter services.

2:47:42Okay, and Councillor Cossum will second. Thank you. So you still have the floor?

2:47:45Yeah.

2:47:46Just remember everybody of your five minute limitation. So just starting you know, this is a warning. Okay, go ahead.

2:47:52Yeah. So I thank you, Your Worship.

2:47:56I think I have given a bit of a preamble to the first motion with the second motion. I just want to make sure that when we put out the RFP, we get a space that is good and accessible and inclusive.

2:48:13So with those bullet points, make sure that it is completely compliant. I would love to see if there was in the amenity space, outdoor amenity space, so that it could be enjoyed by everyone.

2:48:25One of the delegates talked about how every business should be required to have a list like this. Unfortunately, the city cannot control what happens in those private places.

2:48:37But if we are putting taxpayer dollars, I want to make sure that we have all of these amenities and facilities for the people that need to use these services in our community.

2:48:48Yeah.

2:48:50All right. Thank you. Is there any questions on the motions that are on the floor? Councillor Allt.

2:48:57Thank you, Mayor Guthrie. I would ask that the motions be split as well.

2:49:08With regard, first of all, to the mover, I have three, maybe four questions. I'm a bit unclear and I'm hoping that the mover can please explain to me what is meant by health and safety criteria.

2:49:22First question.

2:49:31Through your worship.

2:49:33With that bullet, it's plans to and resources to maintain safe operations, including facility management and operation protocols, health and safety, cleanliness, waste management, pest management and general maintenance.

2:49:45I think that is because it will be a municipal service. I want to make sure that it is fully resourced. I want to make sure that any submission that we get is not cutting any corners or trying to reduce funding or services.

2:49:59I want to make sure that that we get a full plan for what is being provided and that is fully resourced by the city.

2:50:05Thank you. To Miss Sales, Mayor Guthrie, would it not be a requirement that Ontario Health and Safety Laws actually be followed by any organization that is actually applying to the RFP?

2:50:21Through the mayor to the Councillor, much of what has been identified by Councillor Goller's motion number two are fairly standard service standards that we would look for in a provider as part of an RFP.

2:50:33Thank you. So it's just a redundant. Okay. Thank you. With regards to private outdoor areas, Councillor Goller, could you explain to me what you mean by that? Are there dimensions that are required? Are there activities that you would like to see go on or activities you would prefer to not go on?

2:50:49Through your worship. No. My intention here is to make sure that wherever the data and shelter is located that it has adequate space for folks to be in. I know that we are putting the shelter to the community.

2:51:06If there is, if there are multiple applicants and some of them are able to provide amenity space, outdoor space, indoor space, I think that should be prioritized versus an applicant that does not have amenity space for people.

2:51:20So just to clarify, then it wouldn't matter whether it is street facing, side facing, back facing sizes immaterial.

2:51:31Through your worship, I think that does depend on the applicant, but I think adequate amenity space and however they're able to provide that, I think that's what I'm looking for.

2:51:41And what about activities? I'm not sure what your question is. Outdoor, what are the outdoor spaces used for? Activities?

2:51:51I think Councillor Oldt, when you or I go home, we have the ability to hang on in our backyard in our front porch. I want the same to be available.

2:52:04I think when we get applications, if there is an applicant that does not have amenity space for people to hang out, to spend time in, I think that the applicant that has amenity space for people to congregate, to have fun, to spend time in community, I think that that should be prioritized.

2:52:24And I think it's the last question. It might be one more. The good neighbor approach. I wonder if you could explain to me what you mean by that.

2:52:31Yes, absolutely. We, regardless of whether this space is located, there will be other people using those streets.

2:52:44And, you know, in my experience, for example, with Wyndham House, that is a youth shelter, it's in Ward 2, and they have many policies that work to be good neighbors.

2:52:58They ensure that the relationships between them and the other people, the residential and the commercial addresses on the street, they are addressed.

2:53:08And I think that is what I'm looking for. I'm looking for policies that ensure that the services are provided in a way to be the most compatible with the other folks that are going to be on those streets.

2:53:21Just to follow up, would that be weighed against what staff is aware of? Are the realities of activities around a particular structure, say like Wyndham House? So in other words, they have a policy, but are they following it?

2:53:38Absolutely. Wyndham House is a really good job of maintaining those relationships, and they are proactive about addressing any concerns with the neighborhood.

2:53:47And this is what I'm looking for. I'm looking that whoever submits an application, that there is a consideration of how those services are going to interact with the neighbors.

2:53:58One last question for staff. Through you, Mayor Guthrie, to Ms. Sales. I have heard that there might be two or perhaps more organizations, one or two perhaps in the downtown and others outside the downtown, that are looking at a shared application.

2:54:17I don't know if that's true, but I've heard rumors of that. If that is the case, with regards to the point system in number one, how would the point system be assessed? Would the points be divided in half or third, or how would that occur?

2:54:32Through the mayor and councillor, staff haven't engaged with proponents, so I can't confirm the speculation about how many proponents may be interested in participating in the RFP process.

2:54:45However, we understand that proponents may choose to work together, given the magnitude and the scope of what's being proposed here. And so I think we've given it a little consideration, and we may use an hours.

2:54:58So if one proponent was on the preferred location, and one was in a less desirable location, let's say, or less preferred, we would use the hours to then divide the points, if that makes some sense, so that we have a mathematical and transparent approach to dealing with that.

2:55:18I think it makes as much sense as we can possibly make of it. Thank you. Last question to you, Ms. Sales. Do restrictions or criteria that go beyond the RFP program cause potential delays, and is there a cost-effectiveness issue with facilities located outside the core that might have to be assumed by the city over time?

2:55:44Through the mayor and councillor, I'll potentially two parts to your question. I think if council expresses some preferences tonight through a number of motions, staff are able to move forward with an RFP process as planned to meet the timelines.

2:55:59Obviously, if there are preferences expressed, I can't tell you if that impacts the number of proponents that then submit, as you sort of heard other delegates articulate who work in the sector and understand some of the challenges.

2:56:15And so if we find ourselves in later in the summer without a successful RFP project and a proponent, certainly, you know, we would be delayed in awarding and we'd probably be back to thinking about how to move forward with filling the gap that may exist in January as our current service provider is set to expire at the end of 2024.

2:56:38And the other thing I'd say, I believe you asked some questions about cost. Certainly, the more that we put into the scope of an RFP, the more that that impacts on the cost of the proposal that we receive.

2:56:49And I guess this is the last question you keep leading me to more. What happens if we don't get a competitive field?

2:56:59The mayor or council are all we're hopeful that we can get to the other side of this project. And and I think through the health and housing planning table and many of the other community groups that we're involved in, sort of we would look to those tables to talk about the gap that may exist in our community.

2:57:15If if we're not able to find a proponent who can be successful. And and we'd really be working with other members of the community to talk about filling that gap.

2:57:25Thank you. Thank you. Councillor Klassen, please.

2:57:34Yes, thank you through you, Mayor, to staff. I just had a question with regard to the current wording of Councillor Goller's motion. It currently has a list of preferred areas. Does this will this also what what happens if folks

2:57:53are within that area? Will they still be able to apply through the mayor to Councillor Klassen as the motion is proposed? It would really just be part of the weighted evaluation criteria where we would consider the location.

2:58:07But the but proponents from throughout the city without restriction should be able to apply to the RFP. Yes.

2:58:14Okay, so if if if no one, you know, got points in that area, it would, you know, just kind of wouldn't matter.

2:58:24Okay, thank you.

2:58:30With that, I guess I'll call the vote that okay, Councillor Pussateau.

2:58:34Through the mayor, sorry, I thought you saw my hand. So I have similar questions to Councillor Alton. It's about part two of the motion. When I read that to Councillor Goller, I felt that it was a bit of an overreach.

2:58:49And so my question for staff is, are these elements not something that staff would inherently include as part of our RFP process? Because for me, this feels operational. And there's a lot of value laden language in there, like,

2:59:05whereas the private outdoor areas, you know, and amenity space, compatibility with surrounding community and so on. Is that not stuff that staff or elements of an RFP that staff would have included?

2:59:21Through the mayor to Councillor Pussateau, absolutely. As I explained to Councillor Allt, these are fairly fairly standard service standards that exist in for the provision of these types of services.

2:59:33And the way that this looks for someone who is a proponent to the RFP is that we are asking them in a section of the RFP to describe how they undertake those things. And so, so from staff's perspective, do you have outdoor amenity space?

2:59:48What is that amenity space? Can you describe it so we can understand it better as part of their submission to the RFP?

2:59:54Thank you. It feels a bit performative. Is there anything in there that you would not have included as part of your RFP process, the staff operational process?

3:00:04Through the mayor to Councillor Bousetel, no.

3:00:08Thank you.

3:00:09Thank you. Councillor Caiten, please.

3:00:15Through you, Mr Mayor, I had just comments. Is that okay to do now?

3:00:19Absolutely.

3:00:20Thank you.

3:00:22With a preference against these streets, we're saying that groups like Lakeside, Hope House, Chalmers, Royal City Mission, Guelph Community Health Centre, Guelph Neighborhood Support Coalition, your downtown Guelph friends are not shame and ten seat would get less points if they applied.

3:00:36I don't understand why we would have a preference for streets in the downtown that exclude existing facilities that are easily accessible to community staples like Wellington County Social Services, which exists on one of the non preferred streets.

3:00:47It's counter to the advice that we were given by collective results.

3:00:52It's great that the Hope Health Clinic and the Church of Latter-day Saints on either side of the Children's Art Factory on Yarmouth won't be deducted points or that the Youth Resource Centre on Woolwich won't be.

3:01:02I do worry that our preference for streets creates waiting that favour some groups over others.

3:01:07Without data to support why this preferences would unfavorably grade some of the values of the non-profits on the streets, I can see a few who benefit while a lot don't.

3:01:17The point of the RFP is to provide a service that works for the people who need it.

3:01:21Based on data from Wellington County in the downtown, 141 Woolwich contains 71 and 2 bedroom rent geared to income units, 17 other units get a housing benefit.

3:01:31And several locations just outside of the downtown make up roughly 285 rent geared to income and affordable market units for singles couples, families and seniors.

3:01:39Those are just the units. If we guess an average of two people per unit, that's 744 people.

3:01:44All of those people might need meal services, may not have air conditioning or might just be lonely.

3:01:49And also downtown we've got 65 people living in temporary housing on Norfolk and Stepping Stone and 11 people are experiencing unsheltered homelessness.

3:01:58And these are all Ward 2 and Ward 3 residents taking points off streets in a location of high need where current providers exist doesn't feel logical to me.

3:02:07This is an RFP for a daytime drop in center that provides three meals a day, toilets, showers and storage. Some items look to be property standards based summer public health based.

3:02:19I have the largest concern with a good neighbor policy. I'm just wondering, like, the library which hosts about 50 to 100 people a day for similar daytime hangout space.

3:02:30Do we have a good neighbor policy? Do we have a good neighbor policy for our cooling and heating centers when those are times of needs?

3:02:41I think that the addition of ensuring toilets be accessible to anyone, which I think is a great provision, is a bit perplexing why you'd give less points to it existing on those streets where we have more folks and then that leaves the burden for public toilets to the mall and local businesses.

3:03:01So I'm just confused on a lot of those points. Thanks.

3:03:05Great. Thank you very much.

3:03:12Sorry, Councillor Downer, please.

3:03:15Thank you. So I'm going to support the motion. I don't see offering a preference. It's not excluding that the anybody can apply to do this or respond to the RFP or partners can. I think that would be ideal.

3:03:34It's about stating what some of the preferences might be and just understanding a bit, you know, a bit of the history of what's happened on these main business streets in town over the last, you know, and Councillor Allt has certainly alluded to that recently in something he wrote around retail spaces having gone to government services, which this is.

3:04:00And you will notice back in when Mike Harris downloaded services to the municipalities.

3:04:09The county of Wellington had to take up street space office space in the downtown. It doesn't matter what the services is, it's government service on.

3:04:20I think it was, I can't remember where there was the walkers or marks and Spencer stores. They took up two of them and then the post office. They took up the post office and the post office then moved to another spot that had been a retail space.

3:04:34And so this sort of continues has created problems around economies of scale in the downtown around creating a balance between government services.

3:04:47Businesses in the downtown and those economies of scale that need to happen in order to make those businesses successful. So for me, it's, it's, it's, it's not about competing values. It's understanding the value of yes, we want to shelter space.

3:05:01Ideally, it would be in the surrounding downtown area.

3:05:05But our preference is that these main retail streets that they're not on those streets or they're not going to be expanded on those streets where they are. That doesn't mean that also the mission or the community health center will not be open to the public or that they will know still

3:05:23not have the offering those services. It doesn't say that they're going to shut down because of this. There's none of that says this that so they will still be available to them. So I to me it's around the, the, not about competing, competing values or try to divide people

3:05:41between anti anti homeless and or pro business. I think it's about, well, what would our preferences be? How do we deal with these two competing value and not competing, but the values that we have around, around servicing vulnerable people in an accessible way.

3:06:04Probably it will still be in the downtown area and also ensuring that we have these balances and retail and businesses in the downtown as well without losing space to those.

3:06:17So that's, those are my main reasons for supporting this and to me it's not excluding those. I mean, that could this could still happen, but it's how we wait this and how we make the decision on who's going to be granted the the RFP.

3:06:33Thank you. Is there anything further before I have the votes come up? Okay. Did I see your hand too?

3:06:44Yeah, but is it comments?

3:06:45Yeah, yeah, you get comments, comments, questions. We'll start. Yeah, you as well, Carly.

3:06:52Yeah, anytime. Yeah. Okay, so I'll go. Yeah, counselor. No, she has so I will counselor boost until I'll go. Yeah, sure. Commons is fine and then counselor class and then counselor also. Okay.

3:07:02Thank you. And through the mayor. Thank you, counselor downer. I remember the days when in the Gummer building in the top floor I ran the Center for Employable Workers for many, many decades.

3:07:11And so the transformation of downtown. I don't refute that, but it's, it's social services that provided a very important service downtown that is now very important housing. So transformation of urban spaces is, is think, you know, a good thing.

3:07:26I do want to speak to I want to speak about the process and for me what I struggle with is when it comes to processes like RFPs front and center for me is the objective of providing daytime services for vulnerable member of our population and yes, consideration for the community and so on.

3:07:45And so I believe I can support number one. I cannot support number two for me it just, you know, it sticks in my craw. It's, it's me it's an overreach. It's operational. It's performatory. It's us as politicians stepping into an arena that quite frankly I want arms length and trust our good qualified

3:08:06intelligent staff to go through that process. We give them the direction to develop an RFP. Yes, we can include some streets and a scoring a little bit there. But number two for me is as a politician, I do not feel comfortable waiting into those criteria staff that staff.

3:08:27So I will not support number two at all. I can support number one, but I will not be supporting number two.

3:08:35Thank you.

3:08:36Class in please.

3:08:39Thank you, Mr. Mayor and thank you, Councillor Downer for your comments about balancing values.

3:08:47Maybe this is a comment, an overall comment, but I'd like to express that I'm grateful for staff bringing forward the these recommendations for daytime shelter. And I hope that today we will bring them closer into, you know, our community and put them as centralized as we can.

3:09:10My, my, my comment is just with regard to, you know, number two, some of the policies. I, I, you know, in preparation for today's meeting, I was thinking about why I got involved in politics and I, I, I harken back to my days as a library board member.

3:09:28And one of those, those things that, that I did was start to learn about all of, you know, the things that a board member does. And one of those things is set up policies and suggest new policies. And so I, I think number two, you know, I'm actually, I've got the operational policies of the library pulled up right here.

3:09:45And there's quite a lot of them. And one of them is a code of conduct. And I think that what, how I've interpreted it, Councillor Goller is suggesting, you know, we want these spaces, we want these services.

3:09:57And they are shared and they are public services. And there, there's a code of conduct. There's a, and we're suggesting that it be developed and shared as part of this process. And I think that it's absolutely fair to request that.

3:10:10And, and that's not taking away from the fact that we all are in support of, well, I shouldn't say that, but I am in support of having daytime shelter in a centralized location to serve as many people as we can.

3:10:24Thank you.

3:10:25Thank you.

3:10:26Thank you, Councillor Cossin. Councillor Aulpe.

3:10:32Thank you very much, Mayor Guthrie. I will ironically support number two and not number one. And it's interesting because it is as, as Councillor Boussetteel stated, it is somewhat performative.

3:10:46And I think actually redundant to, to what staff is already doing. I cannot support number one because I do, I do think that it seems perverse that the providers that are currently downtown are being penalized if they apply because they are downtown.

3:10:59If the irony is they're downtown because that's where the support is needed. Tomorrow, Chalmers is still going to be downtown. Hope House is still going to be open with lots of outside space.

3:11:12The Royal City Mission is going to be open and by the end of the summer, we'll have showers, laundry facilities, and we'll continue to deal with the clientele that are down there.

3:11:21My biggest concern though with the point system, the way that it is presented is I'm very concerned about the city's reputation regarding our commitment to social service provision, addressing mental health issues and even housing, because we've talked a lot about these things.

3:11:38And then when the providers downtown are perhaps looking, we don't even know if they're going to look at this RFP to further enhance what they are doing.

3:11:49We're stating that there could be a discount on their application because of location.

3:11:55Consider that the library is a daytime shelter right now and will continue to be. If we do not have a daytime shelter downtown, the new library will be our largest and our most popular daytime shelter.

3:12:09And I don't have a problem with that. I believe libraries are for everyone. But I also believe that we need to have daytime shelters that have exactly what Royal City Mission is building in right now and is not going to go away.

3:12:22As Pastor Kevin said to me yesterday, we're going to be open for business. It might not just be as often.

3:12:27I'm also very concerned that there might be a consortium of organizations that will be looking for funding to distribute the load, so to speak, because I understand Royal City Mission will not be applying because they can't do it all.

3:12:43Similarly, I also understand that others can't do it all. They're doing it collectively because if somebody has already identified, we have countless people on the street that need these services at 7am.

3:12:58Okay, I've heard a point of order. What are you? Go ahead. What's your issue?

3:13:07I would caution Councillor Allt to speak on behalf of organizations that haven't responded here to this tonight.

3:13:17I respect that. I'll also recognize that within some of the letters we have identified some organizations said quite clearly they're not going to be applied.

3:13:26You've given names of an organization that hasn't written a letter.

3:13:29So as the chair, I'll jump in. Thank you so much to both of you.

3:13:33Fair enough. It's my role just to kind of be the arbiter here. So I'm going to suggest that Councillor Allt just be careful on maintaining still the ability of an open RFP process that we don't prejudice it with statements that you're saying on behalf of other organizations.

3:13:49So please continue. I do concur with Councillor Dought.

3:13:52Okay, fair enough.

3:13:53Be careful. Okay.

3:13:54I understand a consortium of unnamed organizations could be considering applying for joint support in the downtown and other areas. And I'll leave it at that.

3:14:05However, I think it is very important for us to recognize that without funding, the library is still clearly our largest daytime shelter.

3:14:13Point of order.

3:14:16Okay. Point of order, Councillor.

3:14:18Yes, through you, Mr. Mayor. The library will always be an available daytime shelter for everyone to visit.

3:14:25By having a daytime shelter that the city is funding, we aren't saying don't go to the library. We want people to go to the library. It is a place for everyone.

3:14:35And there's not a competing interest there. So I just want to be really clear about that.

3:14:42Thank you very much, Councillor Klassen.

3:14:45I'll wait for the mayor.

3:14:46Yeah, thank you.

3:14:47Okay. We're getting into sort of back and forth on opinions. I'm going to let Councillor Allt's statement stand. That was his opinion. We can like it or not, but I'm going to let it stand.

3:14:59And I would just let it go from there.

3:15:00Thank you.

3:15:01Okay. Thank you.

3:15:03Where were we?

3:15:07Okay. Thank you. Okay. Councillor Gibson. And then if I don't hear anybody else, I will jump in with closing comments. Councillor Gibson.

3:15:16Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Great conversation, Council. Really appreciate the back and forth. Thank you, Councillor Gowder for bringing forth. Well, I'll say this. Thank you, Councillor Gowder for putting work in to get together with staff to create an RFP that's fair, transparent and is simply just a weighted version of what Council seeks for equitable service to providing and as well as balancing off the needs of all the needs of the downtown.

3:15:42On the comments around, you know, shepherding or moving or, you know, the precedent of stating where we want a service to be.

3:15:51I'm always cognizant of history. And, and you know what, it was, it was a member of Council just recently that was talking about the process that we went through for the library that triggered my thinking on.

3:16:03It was a decision of Council that the conversation was, was not going to be had anymore. The new state, the new library would be on Baker Street.

3:16:13I can remember that distinctly taking the vote that said, you know, we're not going to look at other sites anymore, the conversation is Baker Street. So it's not above us to take it upon ourselves to choose locations for services to be provided.

3:16:25This is an RFP process. So we are not choosing the location. We're simply setting the context, setting the environment for going through a proper process to identify where that service will be provided.

3:16:36So again, I'm always cognizant of history. This is not, this is a step back from stating where it will go. It's simply creating the environment for competition to occur.

3:16:45So I do appreciate it. I've read through the motion well in advance of today's meeting and I thought it was sound. Thank you to staff for providing your insights and I will be supporting. Thank you.

3:16:56Okay. Thank you, Councillor Gibson. Is there anybody else at all?

3:17:07Okay.

3:17:08Oh, sorry, Councillor Chew. Thanks, Councillor Pustil. Go ahead.

3:17:15Thank you through you, Mr. Mayor. I wasn't going to speak tonight, but I just feel to compel to just set the tone clear. Like there is enough downtown to go around for everyone.

3:17:27So I just hope that the fiction that we're excluding people from downtown is demystified tonight because I think our heart is all here in the right place and we're trying to be as transparent as possible.

3:17:39And I applaud Councillor Goller for speaking up and putting in place this process for us to have this conversation. But thank you.

3:17:48Thank you, Councillor Chew. Is there anybody else before I jump in? No. Okay. So I was wondering, first of all, just process wise, could you throw those motions back up as we move through them as it's been asked to be separated?

3:18:05Yes, Mayor Goller. We'll pull them up. We also separated them out so we can pull up the first clause and then the second clause or we can pull up both at your preference and then move from there.

3:18:16Okay, I better get my, okay, let's look at the screen here. Okay.

3:18:20Okay. Thank you. So, okay, so I'll call the vote on this one. And that's very quick comments. I think I have a preference that I don't see activated downtown BIA main streets as becoming only social services or institutionalized with government.

3:18:47That's, that is my preference. And when we are using a lot of money from taxpayer dollars to go to a good thing, my preference is that we do not have it in those areas. But I think the way that you framed it, Councillor Goller, in the waiting is the appropriate way to move forward. So thank you.

3:19:10The other thing I'd just like to demystify, thank you for using that word, Councillor Chew, because I'm going to borrow it now, is that, you know, no one, excluding me, has ever said, if it's maybe, you know, the waiting on these streets compared to others, I have never said I want it in the Hanlon Creek Business Park.

3:19:33I have never said I want it by the Honda dealership. I just have a waiting and a preference on these streets to help with the vibrancy of the downtown with my lens of also economic vibrancy, tourism, events, and so on, that I think downtown main streets should have. That's it.

3:20:00So any wine that has a narrative out there that we were thinking of putting it in the corner of the city somewhere.

3:20:07That's never come up ever, ever. And that would be completely false if anyone were to describe that as something that I've ever said or even advocated for.

3:20:19It is these streets that in my preference and in my opinion, I want to see activated from a more of a business thriving entrepreneurial small business area, which is the, which is the core of a BIA.

3:20:39It's the core of a BIA, the business improvement area, the business improvement area.

3:20:48And so it's still open because of the way the motions were did. Thank you. I hope that people will apply from wherever.

3:20:59And what we're doing here is even if we don't like some of this wording, but the overall direction to staff, if we say to go ahead with an RFP process, we are raising taxes.

3:21:16This is a new service. This is a brand new service that in perpetuity will be a lot of money.

3:21:23A lot. And we are basically saying as a council, we find it to be a priority. We think it's important and we want to get this service provider up and running so that there is certainty for the provider and certainty for the clients that would be using that service.

3:21:38And we are willing to say, we are going to raise your taxes with a brand new service as of 2026. That cannot be forgotten here.

3:21:49Okay. So I think it's really important that we look at the positive here, which is we have a, our, our professional staff have rightly come forward and said, there is a gap.

3:22:04We have been throwing $100,000 here and $450,000 there and 300 up over the last few years.

3:22:13And it's time to stop doing that. It's time to actually make a commitment to helping with the daytime shelter space for the people that we all collectively actually want to help.

3:22:22That's a good thing. I think that's that that's the takeaway for me.

3:22:26And we'll see what happens. Like, we're not even coming to a conclusion here tonight. This is a process to kickstart an RFP. And then we'll see what happens. We'll see what happens after that.

3:22:35So I just think I want to thank staff. And I really want to thank, you know, thank the discussion. And I'd like to thank Councillor Downer with some of your comments as well about the not pitting sort of anti homeless, you know, narrative that's out there.

3:22:53We literally, I believe are unanimous in wanting to actually start providing new money to a daytime shelter space. That's not anti homeless.

3:23:01That's not anti homeless. That's not anti homeless to me. So, okay, thank you with that before I start coughing. I will call the vote on just this one that is on the screen. Okay.

3:23:13Is there anyone against that's Councillor Goller's first one. Okay, so just alt and sorry, alt and Titan.

3:23:22Okay, let's go clerks. I'll have you move through the next ones for me. So that passes just so I say it out loud.

3:23:29Okay, just bear with me for a second. Okay. So number two, I will call the vote who is against number two. Just boost it till.

3:24:00Okay. And so that passes. And then we will go to back to the main motion. Okay, Councillor, Kate.

3:24:12Press your hand.

3:24:14Yes, I have another motion to add before we finish off.

3:24:17Go right ahead. You have the floor.

3:24:20If clerks could pull it up for me, please. So I have some extra motions and I'll speak to them after I just introduced them. So that points begin to proposals located in areas with easily accessible wealth transit stops for roots that cover all areas of the city.

3:24:45Number two, that points be given to proposals located in areas with topographical street sidewalk slope and pitch consistent with accessibility standards for manual wheelchair users using 80 a ramp standards as a baseline for accessible inclines.

3:25:01And number three, that points be given to proposals located in areas with the highest identified need for the service using existing data and collaboration with Wellington County.

3:25:14And number four, that points be given to proposals within the operating area of welcoming streets.

3:25:20And number five, that points be given to proposals close to existing services used by the same population to lower barriers to access.

3:25:27And ask if there's a second or okay, all tools second.

3:25:34So I'm going to jump in right away.

3:25:37Can I introduce it?

3:25:39No.

3:25:40Okay.

3:25:42Let me just because I think a few of those are not in order.

3:25:56So number one, I find to be okay.

3:25:58Number two, we just passed a motion from Councillor Coller that spoke about all the AODA.

3:26:07That has to do with the inside of the building. This has to do with the outside of the streets.

3:26:11So like if it's located on a hill and your sidewalk is up to the hill, you can't actually get up that sidewalk.

3:26:17I'm going to just let me walk through them.

3:26:19Sorry, just one second. Okay.

3:26:22Number three, I guess I would let stay and but I think maybe Jodi should jump in because she said in one of her comments that she would be already going to them for information, but whatever.

3:26:36We'll get to that.

3:26:38And then number four would be out of order because it's the same operating area that we just passed under Council Guller.

3:26:47No, because there's two streets.

3:26:50No, because there's two streets in the downtown that are not weighted less that are still in that encatchment area. And it's about waiting. It's not about.

3:27:04Okay.

3:27:05Let me look at the last one.

3:27:08Okay, I'm not sure about the last one, but I so the one that's jumping out at me that might be out of order would be would in my view would be to okay, I'll just I'll just stop with number two.

3:27:20I'm going to call number two is out of order.

3:27:24So number two isn't about the inside of the location, which is what Councillor Goller's motion was about. It was about 808 standards for the building itself. This is about the location and the streetscape.

3:27:39So if you try to go up Cork Street, for example, towards the church, you have to go up on an incredibly steep incline. So if the location were to be, if that church were to apply, it would be very, very hard for people to get up the street to get to that area.

3:27:59We've got a lot of hilly areas.

3:28:01Okay. So, all right, at this point, I'm going to not interfere. I'm just thank you for letting me as the chair just kind of wade through it.

3:28:10But I feel, I feel like the I'll just be quiet. That'd be a good thing.

3:28:19Who's a counselor all the second at it. So we'll go to figure out what council decides. So go ahead, Councillor. Kate and you still have the floor.

3:28:29Thank you.

3:28:30Thank you. So I'll talk about accessibility first because that's what was just brought up. So as identified in the report and study on homelessness by collective results that we've we got.

3:28:42There is a lack of daytime low barriers locations for people. So in this report, the hub model and location of services near each other was recommended.

3:28:52And many people who use this service are disabled.

3:28:55Guelph is quite hilly downtown is a slightly angular plateau surrounded by hills. It's either uphill or downhill. If you're kind of on the edge of downtown.

3:29:03And there's differences in those heights. Some of them are more steep. Some of them are less steep.

3:29:09So the external accessibility of the location in my opinion needs to be a consideration.

3:29:19Similarly, people from all over the city could need this service. So access to wealth transit that has various routes and easily accessible service would be really quite necessary.

3:29:32I know that certain food services aren't near bus stops. And so they get used less or only can be used by people who have cars.

3:29:42And regarding the welcoming streets location area in the 2023 impact report for the community benefit agreement with welcoming streets.

3:29:52They said that they responded to 404 businesses contacted almost 2000 clients and they supported 115 unique individuals and held all sorts of meetings and such.

3:30:05And as any providers only responsible for crisis management within their own property. It only makes sense to give some points to providers who operate within an area service by a group that can help participants who may experience crisis outdoors.

3:30:20So that the neighborhood feel supported in a similar good neighbor agreement that was just passed in the motion by Councillor Goller.

3:30:32So I think that when we're considering our RFP to be good neighbors, having waiting for a group that we pay for that is meant to help with de-escalation and mental health crises on the street would be a good move from us.

3:30:50And I'm happy to also have these broken out by number in case people don't want to vote for them as a batch.

3:30:59Thank you so much. Councillor Busuttil and then Councillor Gibson.

3:31:13Thank you for this Councillor.

3:31:16Great. And similar to the last motion, the entire number two, I in my governance role feel completely uncomfortable about relief getting involved in this.

3:31:29And what's different from number two from this one is that this is really prescriptive saying that points be given versus the other one speak about thinking about this, which I would hope that the staff already do this.

3:31:42And so again, you know, I objected to number two because I think that's performative that's telling the community stuff that the staff is already doing in their good roles.

3:31:53So I'm going to ask the staff, you know, would they not consider these kinds of things as part of the RFP process?

3:32:05I think that's something that we would see in the response of the RFP and we would note that as part of our evaluation criteria.

3:32:27Item number two relates to the topographical street sidewalk slope and pitch and I'm no engineer or expert in this.

3:32:36So I look to my colleagues to my left, but regardless our RFP would be looking for a fully AODA compliant service.

3:32:46So I can't speak to the impact that the slope of a street would have on our evaluation, but we would be looking to under we would be looking for any successful service provider to be AODA compliant in their facility.

3:32:59And then the next three.

3:33:03Number three suggests that we would work with the County of Wellington and certainly staff are planning to work with the County of Wellington and invite them in fact to participate as part of our scoring criteria of any successful RFP process.

3:33:19And then the last two motions we understand to be more preferences for location. And I think that's contradictory in some ways to the motion that has been passed by council and staff would struggle with how to implement that because of these two weighted

3:33:39criteria have the potential to cancel them out. And and so I think from an implementation perspective, it would be challenging for us if it were one point based on location as previously passed by council and then there are two motions here.

3:33:56So I think that's a good idea. I do I do a half a point or one point and I don't really want to be the person who's responsible for deciding that, you know, the intention of council with these motions.

3:34:08So, so sort of that's the quick step overview of those five motions. Councillor Bustetil, if that's helpful for you.

3:34:15Thank you. And just as a supplemental, if I may, mayor, if it didn't say that points be given, you know, in item number four and five, would you not consider an operation that included welcoming students.

3:34:25We included welcoming streets. When we talk about, you know, collaborations and wraparound services welcoming streets is very much part of the service delivery downtown.

3:34:37Would you, if it didn't say points, would that not be part of your RFP consideration.

3:34:44Certainly, our report, I think it's on page five talks about the importance of collaboration amongst service providers and with the downtown and certainly if we just step back for a moment.

3:34:55And think about the longer term goal of working towards a daytime hub, whether it be integrations with health services or a relationship in existing relationship with a service like welcoming streets.

3:35:07All of those things would form and round out the response to our RFP and help us understand the provider and how they how they work in the community.

3:35:21Yes, thank you. Okay, thank you.

3:35:27It was on my list. Councillor Gibson. Go ahead.

3:35:30Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Mayor. So I think this this motion, my opinion only is an extension of the previous debate. I think all the all the values that the mover is speaking to in the motions are a reiteration of the debate that we just had the like the reasons why they only wanted in the downtown.

3:35:51So I feel like this is although you may have found the motion in order, that's fine, but I do feel like this debate's becoming bit cyclical. I would encourage you to call the vote that you're at your convenience place.

3:36:04Are you officially asking me to call the vote.

3:36:12Sure, I've asked you to call.

3:36:14Okay.

3:36:16I'm good with that. It's been asked to be separated.

3:36:20And as long as there's nobody else. Okay. Can we have number one on the screen, please?

3:36:28Mr. Mayor, we haven't spoke the votes out, but perhaps we can just pull up the screen and have all I can go through each one. Sure. No problem. Thank you. Sorry about that.

3:36:38So we'll just call the vote on the accessible, easily accessible transit stops for routes covered in all areas of the city. Okay, is anyone against that one? That's unanimous. Okay.

3:36:54And then the second one is points proposed in locations with topographical streets sidewalk slopes and pitch consistent with accessibility standards for manual wheelchairs users using a ODA ramp standards as baseline for accessible

3:37:08inclines. So on these ones here, I just want to state just a quick comment. I'm not going to be supporting these because we're getting into more now points and waiting, which which I don't think we should do.

3:37:20So, so it has nothing to do with like me not being in favor of these types of things. Of course staff are going to look into it, but but the specifics on points doesn't make me feel comfortable. So is anyone against that please raise your hand.

3:37:34Right. So to you praying or is that a hand? Okay.

3:37:39Two, two caller Richardson Guthrie, Clausen Downer and Billings and Gibson. Okay, thank you. So that fails. Number three is the proposals located in areas with highest identified needs for service. Again points being used with existing data and collaboration with the

3:38:03Wellington County. Well, you heard Miss sales already say that she's doing that. And just to remind everyone part of our motions coming up here is that we're asking the Wellington County to pay 10%. So obviously going to be talking to them. So if anyone's against that one please raise your hand.

3:38:19I just to a point of order.

3:38:22Just from a process perspective, if we voted against these does that mean staff can't look at these like I just sort of.

3:38:30Okay, thank you. I'll just go to staff to like because then when we've now directed staff not to look at these right or they non motions because they fail like I don't. I'm trying to figure out like no problem.

3:38:42Let's go to the clerks. Thank you, Mr. Marin through you to counter down or these are amending motions to the main motion. So these are adding items to the main motion.

3:38:51So if they fail here, we will vote on the or you, pardon me, will vote on the main motion as amended with whatever is added and that would be direction to staff at that point.

3:39:01So no, the answer is no, they don't they don't affect staff's decisions until they're instituted in the main motion as amended.

3:39:10For that clarity. So again against number three, please raise your hand. So downer and gloss and and got three and Richardson and Gowler and chew and Billings and Gibson that fails as well.

3:39:25And then number four, that point be given to proposals within the operating area of welcoming streets.

3:39:33Again, I won't be supporting this because of the points portion. I also want to remind everyone to and welcome streets knows this welcome streets was only funded for this year.

3:39:44So like that's they they've known that it's going to end at the end of this year. Now we can have a discussion about that a council don't get me wrong at budget time but they that's that's a known thing that's not in that's not moving forward in the base budget.

3:39:56Okay, so so without anyone against please raise your hand again to go for Richardson, Guthrie, quas and downer.

3:40:06Gibson, Billings and Quran. And then is there, I'm sorry, my, my screen is cut off. Is there a fifth. Yes, that points be given to the proposals with the existing services used by the same population for low barriers to access.

3:40:22Again, those against please raise your hand to go Richardson Guthrie, quas and downer. Quran Billings Gibson. Okay, that fails as well. So clerks can we go back to the to the main motion now please.

3:40:49Yeah, three Mr. Mayor we're just adding that one approved amending motion to the main motion will have it up shortly.

3:42:04Well, thank you. So all that is now captured clerks you're comfortable with all of that so now it's it's as amended. Okay, I don't do I need to split this as well or no because I don't think so because we've already made our points and okay so you're either for or against the main motion as amended.

3:42:23Okay, so all those not in favor raise your hand.

3:42:29Okay, that's unanimous. And thank you for the discussion and debate Council I appreciate that thank you to staff and delegates as well. We are going to take a five minute break I think we deserve that.

3:42:40And actually I'm going to make it an eight minute break. So we're going to come back at 740. And we'll, we'll kick off with the call to climate action. Okay, it's the next agenda item so eight minute break.

3:55:30Hey everybody let's, let's get back at it.

3:55:36I don't need any more. No more candy.

3:55:40I am done.

3:55:43We are moving to the Gulf Community call to climate action we got two delegations. First one, no stranger actually both no strangers here Adam Donaldson is coming forward and Evan Ferrari I saw you Evan there you are.