Accessibility Advisory Committee

0:03So the first thing we want to do is do the land acknowledgement.

0:07Do I do that with me?

0:09Yes, you're right.

0:11Thank you.

0:12I'm going to pronounce some names wrong, so I apologize.

0:15As we gather, let us take time to reflect on our privileges

0:18to live and work in wealth.

0:20A city built over rich indigenous histories.

0:23We are guests here, and we should

0:24reflect upon the responsibility to care for this land.

0:28The people who live here today and the generations to come.

0:32If our actions today can move us towards the reconciliation,

0:36we should take pause and make those decisions

0:39with attention and gratitude.

0:41This place we call Guelph has served as a traditional lian

0:45and a place of refuge for many peoples over time.

0:49But more specifically, the Had Tiwan de Ranc,

0:54I apologize, and the Hau Den No Showni.

1:02This way, this held as the treaty lands and territory

1:07with the Mississaugas of the Grand First Nation.

1:13Wealth lies directly adjacent to the Haldeman Tract.

1:16Tract is part of the longest established traditional hunting

1:19ground for the sick nations of the Grand River.

1:22Many First Nations, Inuit, and Métis people

1:26who have come from across Turtle Island call Guelph home today.

1:33And what's the next step, Wendy?

1:37The next step would be the disclosure of conflict of interest.

1:41You can just ask the members, are they

1:44realized and the conflict of interest,

1:46if no, that we can move forward to their orientation

1:49and education workshop.

1:50Yeah.

1:51So if anyone would like to disclose any, where is that?

1:55Puginary?

1:56I don't know if that's on a tag.

1:58You know, interest.

2:00Are there any members?

2:01OK, so we're not going to disclose any P, E, C, U,

2:06and I, H, R interests.

2:14So I'm not carrying anything.

2:17Also, I probably pronounced it wrong.

2:19But I'm going to say no one has any that word interest.

2:24And then we're going to go to the training.

2:26Yes.

2:27Perfect.

2:28Thank you very much.

2:29No problem.

2:30So I will go ahead for the advisory committees of Council,

2:36general rules, responsibilities, and procedural training.

2:39So I would like to share my screen.

2:41I just want to apologize.

2:42My computer is very slow.

2:44I'm so sorry, but I will try my best.

2:50So can you let me know if you can see the PowerPoint?

2:57Yes.

2:58Thank you very much.

2:59OK, so I would like to introduce myself first.

3:02I'm Winnie Chan, the board and committee coordinators.

3:04And I'm going to deliver a kind of training,

3:08orientation section for AAC today.

3:11So yeah, the agenda is very full.

3:15I'm so sorry.

3:16But it's covering quite a lot of things.

3:19But I will just give a brief on each item

3:23to introduce some kind of governance thing work.

3:26What exactly is the legislative requirement

3:28for the local boards, some code of conduct,

3:30lobbyist registry, terms of reference,

3:34some rules about our staff, ACOC members, chairs,

3:38and some procedural trainings, what exactly

3:41should be included on the agenda,

3:43and what not to be included on the agenda,

3:46and also some best practice.

3:49So I would like to define what exactly is ACOC first.

3:56ACOC is advisory committees of Council.

4:00They're very well established, component

4:03of municipal governance in Canada.

4:05This kind of committee is just like AAC,

4:07providing a venue for ongoing interaction

4:09between the city council, the public,

4:12and also the municipal staff.

4:13So it addresses a lot of wide range of topics,

4:17just like accessibility, just like you got here,

4:19and maybe some transit, heritage, arts, culture, and more.

4:24So they offer very valuable policy advice

4:27in crucial areas of municipal responsibilities.

4:30So for the, sorry.

4:35I'm sorry.

4:36Some technical problem I would like to share again.

4:40Sorry about that.

4:50Sorry about that.

4:51So slow.

4:52I might come here.

4:52There.

4:52I'm sorry.

4:54OK.

4:54I think you guys see the PowerPoint again.

4:56Am I correct?

4:57Yes.

4:58Thank you very much.

4:59Sorry.

5:00So there's a lot of ACOC in Ontario

5:05that actually is very rarely researched, I would say,

5:08because I was the post-stock scholar for a project working

5:13on growth ACOC.

5:15So I would like to say it's rarely researched or evaluated.

5:20Actually, it's not a lot of resources

5:22to support municipalities to develop their ACOC.

5:25So the city of growth has developed a kind of governance

5:29framework to guide the creation, the design function,

5:31and also evaluation for ACOC in growth.

5:35And this is very promising because it actually

5:37is a lot of municipalities just come to us and asking,

5:40hey, I like your fling work.

5:42And can you just let me know more about that?

5:43So this is our, I would say, we designed the ACOC

5:48after because the council already

5:50approved it, the fling work, and also the implementation

5:52thing.

5:53So this is our brand new ACOC.

5:58We use community-engaged scholarship

6:00to bring both the academic and also

6:03long academic partners, including the city staff together,

6:06to identify some kind of opportunities

6:09or some kind of good things or something

6:12that we need to improve to respond to the community

6:14identified the problem.

6:16So there's a lot of collaboration between the city staff

6:19and also researchers supported by the growth lab.

6:21The growth lab actually is a kind of collaborate unit

6:26supported by both the university and also by the city.

6:31Growth lab is co-funded by both organizations.

6:35So we also use a kind of working group of eight people,

6:40of eight existing ACOC members to help us to fling the fling

6:44work and how to make the governance framework more

6:48applicable and also more practiceable to all ACOC.

6:52So this is the more important thing

6:55is about the commitment of the fling work.

6:57So for the fling work, how we define ACOC.

7:01ACOC is a kind of community engagement,

7:04just like you feel in the survey or you go to the town hall

7:07meetings, they are the same.

7:09And ACOC should help shape the city's strike goals

7:13because that is a kind of very high level thing

7:15and very policy-focused.

7:18And also that ACOC adopts some deliberate practices.

7:21That means that we talk with discuss

7:24and actually that we're very focused

7:26on the process of discussion instead of just

7:29like we agree you or not agree you.

7:31Actually, I will talk about more about how to pass motion

7:35and resolutions within ACOC later.

7:38But this is one of the very key commitments

7:40that we would like to adopt through ACOC.

7:44And also ACOC, including leave them

7:46in professional expertise, not just professional,

7:48not just leave them, but both that we found

7:51that is very promising and also very

7:54contributing to the development of ACOC.

7:57So we have diverse membership.

7:58And also we have very clear communication

8:01between ACOC and also the city council

8:03what exactly will be communicated from the ACOC

8:06to the city council.

8:07And also ACOC should be adequately resourced.

8:10That means that we need to have very good support

8:13for ACOC to function or to operate.

8:17Just like we have human resources,

8:18we have a lot of technical things to support.

8:21So another six critical features would be like communications.

8:27And we have staff liaison with threat level responsibilities

8:30that means that they take care of very high-level policy

8:34initiatives.

8:35We have clear up-to-date regular revisited terms of reference.

8:39We want to update our terms of reference

8:41to fit in the very stress level of responsibilities

8:45of the whole city.

8:46And we also employ some new recruitment

8:49efforts that don't currently lot funded yet.

8:53But actually that we would like to promote

8:55the random representative sampling

8:57to help improve the diversity of ACOC membership.

9:02And also we will provide some financial compensation

9:06and also some coverage of participation

9:09related expenses.

9:11But currently unfunded lot yet approved by the council.

9:14But this is what we propose in the governance framework.

9:17So we also need to have adequate resources

9:21to support the full functioning ACOC.

9:24Before actually we just have one board and committee

9:26coordinators, but now we will have two to support seven ACOC.

9:31So we have seven ACOC.

9:34Accessibility is one of us.

9:36And also transit one is on art and culture.

9:40And also one is on transportation.

9:42And then another one on community adjustment

9:45and also public standards.

9:47And also another one is on economic development and tourism.

9:50So we have seven ACOC.

9:52For the legislative requirements,

9:57actually all meetings must be open to the public.

10:00That means the public could come to the city hall

10:02to attend the meeting in person,

10:04or they can join us over teams just like now.

10:08And all ACOC must be made,

10:10a decision must be made through the resolutions of ACOC.

10:14That means that you need to pass resolutions

10:17to tell us what you want to tell the council.

10:20Okay, I will talk about this later in a more detailed way.

10:24So if ACOC feedback is provided on the topic

10:29that's going before the city council,

10:31they make the decision or ACOC resolution

10:33must be communicated in food to the city councils.

10:36For example, actually all the minutes

10:38will be attached to the information items

10:41that will be sent to all council managers on Friday.

10:45So what you guys discussed,

10:47what you guys make the decision on the recommended abards

10:51or like recommended resolutions,

10:53actually they will be all communicated to the council in food.

10:57So meeting notice and agenda,

10:59just like the one that I always send you guys one week before the meeting,

11:04that will be published in advance of the meeting

11:07and in public could assess all the meeting agenda,

11:11include also all the minutes.

11:13So the meeting minutes actually will be posted publicly

11:16following the meetings.

11:17We will try our best to do it ASAP

11:20so that you guys can revisit the minutes

11:22and also the agenda together.

11:27What is a meeting?

11:28This is a very good question,

11:29but for our definition meeting is something

11:33that we need to meet quorum.

11:35Quorum is something like we need to have the majority

11:38of our members attending the meeting.

11:40For all the ACOC,

11:43that we need to have 3% points one.

11:46That means that for example, in the AC we have eight members,

11:49we need to have five members to attend the meeting,

11:52that to start the meeting and also continue the meeting.

11:55If we just have three members,

11:57we couldn't continue the meeting.

11:58So my role would be like reminding the chair like,

12:03hey, we do not have quorum,

12:05so we need to stop the meeting first.

12:07So this is the very, very,

12:09the legislative features of the meeting.

12:12So quorum is a very important thing

12:16because it's representing the majority

12:19of the current appointed ACOC members.

12:21So if we do not have any public notice,

12:24that means the public meeting agenda is not here.

12:27Actually the meeting cannot be carried on

12:29or cannot be operated

12:31because there's an illegal meeting.

12:33So all meeting must be held

12:36with power of notice given to the public,

12:38open to the public,

12:39agenda materials post-publicly,

12:42and also a menace post-publicly.

12:43So all the things need to be public

12:46to this is kind of, so-called this is kind of meeting.

12:53How does the ACOC provide feedback to the staff

12:55and also the council?

12:57The only way that the ACOC provides formal feedback

13:00is through passing of the resolutions.

13:03Resolutions need to be moved by one member,

13:06second by another member,

13:08and we need to invite all the members

13:10to vote on the resolutions.

13:13Actually the resolutions could be

13:15the one recommended by the staff

13:17or the ACOC members or all the ACOC members,

13:20actually they can propose some kind of resolutions

13:23or motions and also lead to go-flu process moved

13:27by one member, second by another member,

13:30and also we need to invite all of the members

13:32to vote on that.

13:34So how to achieve the majority

13:36that would be 50% plus one?

13:38That means that we need to get,

13:42for example, if we have eight members

13:45participating in an AC meeting,

13:47actually we need to have five members,

13:49at least five members to vote on,

13:51to say yes to the motions or the resolutions,

13:54actually motions that resolutions they understand

13:57so that to get the resolution passed it.

14:02So it will be like a term in on the minutes as carried.

14:06That means that you guys support the motions.

14:10If any comments given by individual members,

14:13this is not a kind of formal feedback

14:15to the staff and also city council.

14:25Sorry, is it some questions there?

14:31Okay.

14:33There's construction noise right outside.

14:36So.

14:36I can hear someone speaking but I am not, yeah.

14:40Yeah, that's okay.

14:41It's the construction groups.

14:43Okay, thank you very much.

14:44So I'm just carrying on.

14:46If you have any questions, just feel free to ask.

14:50Thank you very much.

14:51So how is the ACOC feedback communicated to the staff

14:56and also city council?

14:58ACOC provides a direct to staff.

15:01You can tell in the meeting,

15:03you can tell staff what you are going to propose

15:06or some feedback or some comments

15:08and all flu stuff to city council.

15:11For example, if you want to propose

15:15or pass a vacillusion that you can do it in the meeting

15:19with minutes and these kind of things

15:21that will be passed to the city council.

15:24So any advice from ACOC to staff

15:27can be made through a vacillusion at the meeting

15:29and no further reporting is required.

15:31That means that we know need to submit any report

15:34or staff report to this.

15:35But of course, a lot of advice from the ACOC

15:39would be included in the staff report

15:42as a kind of consultation process or public engagement.

15:46And advice from an ACOC to a city council

15:50on the item not scheduled to go before the city council

15:53is communicated through the posting of minutes

15:55in the weekly information items.

15:57Every single of Friday,

15:59the clerk offers will prepare the information items

16:02for the city council.

16:04Any mean minutes of ACOC, including the AAC one,

16:08actually will be included in the weekly information item.

16:11So what you guys discussed, what you guys passed,

16:15actually will be reflected in that kind of documents

16:19and also those kind of information items.

16:25Another thing we would like to highlight

16:26is the cook of conduct for city council and also local boards.

16:30ACOC is the kind of local boards.

16:32So cook of conduct applies to all ACOC members,

16:35is covering a lot of behaviors,

16:38regardless of where they take place in person

16:40or online or social media.

16:43Of course, many sections in the cook of conduct

16:46only applicable to the members of city council,

16:48that means the councillor,

16:51actually that there are some part of the sections

16:54that are also relevant to the ACOC members.

16:58For example, regarding gifts and benefits,

17:01some confidentialities, conduct, influence on staff,

17:05improper use of influence or contact of interest.

17:07So the cook of conduct actually is linked here

17:12so that if you are interested in looking into it,

17:15you just can go to this PowerPoint slide

17:17to click the link that you will see the details

17:20of the cook of conduct section.

17:24Another thing we would like to talk about

17:25the lobbyist registry is that all the lobbyists,

17:30actually what is lobbyist?

17:33Because someone would like to influence

17:36the decision making of council members

17:38or even the ACOC members.

17:40Maybe they will come to you to ask you,

17:42hey, could you just say yes or say no

17:46for some kind of decision that you would like to pass in AAC?

17:50So actually they need to be registered

17:53under lobbyist registry of the city of growth.

17:57So this is something that if someone comes to you

18:00asking about this, you can just ask them,

18:02hey, you need to go to the lobbyist registry

18:05of city of growth that you need to register there.

18:08So if you would like to know more about lobbyist registry

18:12because this is not a very key things in this orientation

18:16and actually this will be a lot of information.

18:18So I will not just like have a very in-depth elaboration here

18:23but if you would like to get more ideas

18:25and also information, just you can email me.

18:28And sorry about that.

18:31Yeah, so terms of reference,

18:33every single ACOC they have terms of reference.

18:36So there's the outlying or the mandate

18:38or the composition, the schedule, the format,

18:40actually all the things,

18:42very important things of the ACOC,

18:46they are stipulated in the terms of reference.

18:48So the terms of reference, this is online.

18:51I will send it to the new members again

18:54for your information about what exactly

18:57the terms of reference of ACOC.

19:01I would like to also go through some kind of role

19:04of staff liaison and also collect office

19:07and also ACC members that what exactly,

19:10what we are doing for ACOC or ACOC in general.

19:14So a staff liaison for ACOC actually is Alex and also Lian.

19:22And they are advising on very high level decision making

19:26and bring very deep knowledge regarding the strict goals

19:29and also priority of city.

19:31They will communicate, collaborate with the members

19:33and they are also facilitating the city staff,

19:37chairs, vice chairs, members, maximize the values of ACOC

19:40because they are very technical staff.

19:43That means that they provide very professional knowledge

19:46to ACOC.

19:47So actually that they can help the members

19:49to learn technical terms, some knowledge and skills

19:52relating to AAC.

19:54They also practice facilitations, conflict management,

19:57consensus building and also belated skills,

20:00some kind of, and also they know how inequalities

20:04can be do fluid deliberative approaches.

20:10For us, okay, when it comes from city clerk's office

20:14and also when it is off that actually another clerk office

20:18staff will come to take care of the meetings.

20:22So city clerk office, we will need to ensure members

20:25of well-informed or the meeting procedures,

20:28the rules, the legislation things

20:30and also some kind of law things or the policy

20:34how to manage the ACOC.

20:36We coordinate meetings, we do the communication,

20:39finalizing the dates, the time, location

20:41to all relevant parties.

20:43We also assist the staff liaison,

20:46provide some kind of secretariat or technical support

20:49to prepare the meetings, to publish the order at gender

20:53or the minutes and also update the terms of reference

20:57or actually the operational things of the ACOC

21:01is that we'll be taking care about the clerk office.

21:04We also facilitate a chair or the committee members

21:08representation at the city council meetings.

21:11If anyone wants to, if anyone wants to present

21:19at the city council meetings,

21:20we can also do the facilitation for that.

21:24Role of ACOC members, that we hope that the ACOC member

21:28could well prepare to attend and participate in meetings,

21:32contribute your leave and in professional skills,

21:34knowledge and also experience with respect to

21:37the AAC mandate and also objectives.

21:41Try to be more curious and also flexible in the discussion,

21:45valuing and encouraging the diverse wheel points

21:48from each members.

21:49And also we hope that the ACOC members

21:53try to understand also with respect to roles

21:55and expectations of all participants,

21:57including city staff, including other members,

22:01chairs, vice chair and also attend the mandatory training

22:05just like now that we are attending the meet,

22:08attending the mandatory training

22:09and also the orientation section.

22:11So I would talk about more about the basic meeting

22:15procedures.

22:17All the ACOC, they are aligned with the procedural bylaws

22:21and also all the ACOC meeting procedures, policy

22:25and also public appointment policy.

22:27So ACOC can only formally advise staff

22:32and also seek to consult flu-wesh solutions.

22:36So, wesh solutions are very, very important procedures.

22:40After the staff give their presentation,

22:43you can ask questions, you can do the discussion

22:46and at the end you can decide whether you pass

22:49the resolution to support something

22:51or to want to provide some advice or feedback

22:54to staff flu-wesh solutions.

22:57So city-clad office just like me,

22:59that would be your resources, okay?

23:01That any meeting procedures, if any problems

23:06or any confusing just come to me

23:08because I can explain to you according to the procedure

23:11procedural bylaws and also public policy for ACOC.

23:17So the procedures is simple.

23:21If we're very get used to it, it's very simple.

23:23Okay, so we need one member to move a motion.

23:26We leave another member to second the motion

23:29and then we can do some debate or discussion

23:32and then members will be invited to vote on the motions,

23:3650% plus one that the members present

23:39is required to get passed the wesh solutions.

23:42So every single items we need to vote

23:45that we need to go through this kind of process.

23:49How to write resolutions?

23:51Some, we would like to provide some good

23:53wesh solutions examples here.

23:56You can see the first one that the fantastic

23:58growth transit strategy included as attachment

24:01one to the future of growth transit report

24:05dated when be approved.

24:07That means that the ACOC members support this strategy,

24:11this document and the second one is that feedback provided

24:15by the transit advisory committee regarding the drop

24:18this strategy included in this attachment,

24:22dated this date be considered by staff for inclusion

24:26and in the final report.

24:28So you can also include all the feedback

24:30and also all the advice that you want to provide it

24:34to the council and also the staff

24:36including in this resolution.

24:38So they are very clear, they know what you want to pass

24:42and also you can choose including what kind of information

24:46to be included in this resolution.

24:49So after the good one, I will show you not so good one.

24:52Okay, so this report be endorsed,

24:56this feedback provided by transit advisory committee

25:00being considered by staff and nothing there.

25:02So this is the worst resolution of all

25:05because there's no resolutions.

25:06That means that it's just nothing.

25:08So I'm here or another clock office staff will be here

25:15to help you drop the resolutions.

25:16You just give me the details some of the information

25:19and we will help you to drop the resolutions on the spot.

25:25For the ACOC agenda that will be sent around one week

25:30before the meetings to all of you,

25:33I mean all the members and also staff

25:35and it will be sent along with the meeting invite.

25:39So you will see the meeting invite there

25:41will be some link or some attachment regarding

25:43is it kind of like a gender that already publicly published

25:47so that I will send to you

25:49that are including in the meeting invite.

25:52So the agenda and also agenda item

25:54will be consistent with the terms of reference.

25:56That means that the terms of reference

25:58is a backbone of the ACOC or are the ACOC

26:01and the agenda item need to be aligned

26:04with the terms of reference.

26:06So this is the work of staff is on

26:08and also us to make sure that the alignment.

26:12Members of ACOC can request items

26:14be added to the future agenda.

26:16So you will be receiving emails from us that asking

26:21if you have any items to propose

26:24or recall for items from you

26:25that you want to include those kind of items

26:29in the future agendas.

26:31And this email we will send out after this meeting tomorrow

26:35after each AC meeting,

26:38today after the AC meetings

26:40that you will be receiving an email from me

26:43or advisorycommitus at growth.ca

26:46that to ask for if you have any item

26:49want to be included in the future agendas.

26:51So information provided by staff to an ACOC

26:54will be in writing

26:56and will often include presentation and reports.

26:59So you will see there's some kind of committee items

27:03to be discussed it,

27:04maybe including some reports

27:06or and also the presentations

27:08so that you will get full information to consider

27:12and also providing your advice

27:15and also feedback to those kind of items.

27:18Reports from staff will include a recommendation

27:21usually including recommendation

27:23and also information that the ACOC needs to make

27:26and decision so that it will include

27:29some kind of recommended motion

27:31or like recommendation that hope that

27:34if you are very comfortable to pass it

27:37or you can create some kind of other recommendation

27:41if you wanted to to be included in the in the in the meetings

27:45and also passed by the majority of the members.

27:48So it will be included in the minutes later.

27:51Verbal updates will be limited to announcements.

27:54That means if some if chair would like to

27:56up provide some account of allowance

27:58or staff that is and would like to provide some

28:00announcement that will be the verbal updates

28:03in the announcement section

28:05that will be the items before the adjournment of the meeting.

28:09So this will be some verbal updates

28:11it's not including any documents

28:15or like the report but for information only.

28:20So I'm so sorry for the very boring trainings

28:24and the introduction so sorry about that

28:25but we are here to help.

28:27Okay, so you can email us at vartarycommitiesatgrowth.ca

28:33we are a legislative service team

28:34that we provide a lot of procedural advice

28:38and anything relating to ACOC

28:40and also the fling work or like the procedural things.

28:44You're very welcome to email us.

28:46And I think that's it from me.

28:52So any questions regarding it's a lot of information

28:57but any questions for you free to ask.

29:02If you have any recommendations

29:03for things to be added to the agenda.

29:07I would like to know how you decide

29:09what the outcome of the agenda is.

29:15Sorry, can you say again I'm sorry

29:17because I want an awful little bit I'm sorry.

29:19No problem, it's noisy out there so.

29:22So we send in things for recommendations

29:24for things to be on the agenda

29:27who makes the final decision as to what goes on

29:29to the agenda.

29:34Actually that this is I think Leanne

29:37would you like to answer this questions because I think.

29:42Sure, yeah, sure thank you.

29:45So there's a process it's a good question.

29:47There's a process that happens in that

29:50so an item is recommended and we put that call out

29:53for agenda items for the next meeting.

29:56You'll probably get an email tomorrow

29:58asking for agenda items for the October meeting.

30:01It'll be that far out.

30:03And that's because what we do is we then connect with staff

30:07with the question the appropriate staff person

30:10and we investigate like is this just a personal request

30:17that doesn't happen?

30:18Or is it something that we need to be looking at

30:22in general as a committee?

30:23Because sometimes I'm not really just a personal thing

30:27type of thing, right?

30:28And so if it's something that the entire committee

30:30needs to look at, then that department figures out

30:34what that response is going to be

30:35and when they will be ready to come back

30:37to the committee with that response.

30:40And then it just goes from there.

30:42So the item is addressed whether it's addressed

30:46at a committee or it's addressed just us doing research

30:50and letting the person know the answer.

30:52And if it's okay with, if we're okay with that answer,

30:55then we just don't bring it to the committee thing.

30:58But if it's a more global thing,

31:00then it comes to the committee.

31:01Right?

31:02Yeah.

31:06And that's-

31:07Thank you very much.

31:08Thank you.

31:08Thank you, Leigh Ann.

31:09That's our jobs to do all that,

31:11that language type of thing as the liaisons.

31:13Okay.

31:17So any other questions?

31:27Thank you very much.

31:29If any questions you just email me regarding

31:31the procedural things and any things

31:34regarding the framework,

31:35I'm very happy to answer any questions.

31:37Thank you.

31:41For the new people, like Leigh said,

31:43that was extremely long,

31:47but it really like,

31:48there shouldn't be anything that scares you off.

31:51We're trying to make this any better as best as we can.

31:54And these two ladies, three ladies

31:56are helping us out with condenses.

31:58So I think based on what you said, Leigh,

32:02we're going to do the approval of minutes next.

32:06Sorry, Chair.

32:07We would have an other orientation training

32:10from Leigh Ann and also Kailor

32:13on the very accessibility-focused content.

32:19So they will have another orientation

32:23and training section for us.

32:25Okay.

32:26Yeah.

32:27So Leigh Ann and Kailor,

32:31I would like to share my screen

32:33if you can see your PowerPoint nicely.

32:36Just let me know.

32:42It's almost there.

32:44Thank you, Bob.

32:45There we go.

32:46Okay. Thank you.

32:49Great. So...

32:50You're the attorney's yourself?

32:51Yep.

32:52So I'm Leigh Ann Moran,

32:54Supervisor of Accessibility Services,

32:55and I've been kicking around

32:56for quite a few years here at the City of Guelph

33:00and was with Independent Living

33:01prior to being here with the city.

33:05Independent Living for 14 years before that.

33:07So that's me and that's my experience so far.

33:12Great.

33:14Good afternoon, everyone.

33:15My name's Kayla Bessie.

33:16I am one of two accessibility coordinators here

33:19with the city that works with Leigh Ann.

33:21Keeley, you can't see her face,

33:23but Keeley's joining us online today as well.

33:27I have been with the city since January of this year

33:30and covering a maternity leave for a person named Sarah

33:34who you will meet in 2026 when she returns.

33:39I've also been working in accessibility

33:41for most of my career,

33:44more in the arts and culture sector,

33:47but yeah, bring that perspective to the work.

33:53And so yeah, we're just gonna walk through

33:55some more of the accessibility specific things

33:58you'd want to know that you will likely want to know

34:02as you start to do this work.

34:05And I just want to say off the top that,

34:09well, yeah, welcome to new and returning members

34:12of City Guelph's accessibility advisory committee.

34:17We'll go to the next slide.

34:21So here is the agenda for this part of the orientation.

34:25So welcome and introductions, which we've just done.

34:27Then we'll talk about why are we here, crafting emotion,

34:32how we understand accessibility, the AODA,

34:36consultations, city of Guelph accessibility resources,

34:39accessibility advisory committee,

34:42any questions that arise from these materials,

34:46getting to know each other a wee bit

34:48and your area's interest in this work.

34:51And we may have time at the end, I'm unsure,

34:55and if folks who are here in person

34:58want to see some of the space at City Hall,

35:02I believe we can arrange that.

35:05Next slide, please, Vinnie.

35:07Great.

35:09So we've gone through the staff,

35:11Leanne and myself, who is covering for Sarah,

35:15and you've met Vinnie from the clerk's office.

35:19I just want to say that there's an invitation

35:21for a relaxed environment as we gather today

35:24and at all future meetings.

35:26We understand that it could be your first time

35:28engaging in a formal political environment

35:31such as City Hall.

35:32You're welcome to engage in whatever ways

35:34are most comfortable and accessible to you.

35:37So you may attend meetings online,

35:39as many of you are doing, or in person,

35:42and it doesn't have to be the same every time.

35:44You can make a choice each month

35:47with your camera on or off.

35:49There's no expectation to dress formally.

35:52And if there's anything, like the accessibility team,

35:55so myself, Vinnie.

35:58Sorry, that's so loud.

36:00To know that would support your fellow's participation

36:02in the AAC, please let us know.

36:05We welcome communication via email,

36:07text, or video call.

36:13And what's most important to us is that there's a culture

36:16of respect for everyone's contribution.

36:18So the key reason for you all being here

36:20is to have an opportunity to let us know the barriers

36:23that you've experienced and how they may be removed.

36:31And as staff, we would never profess to know everything,

36:33so we're happy to have you here

36:35to support our mutual understanding.

36:40And I'm going to pass it to you all,

36:45the members, for a moment here.

36:48And if you'd like to share your names and pronouns

36:50if desired, I didn't say initially,

36:53I don't believe my pronouns are in.

36:56We'd like to start in the room.

36:58Do you try to go first?

36:59So my name is Giovanni.

37:04I'm the chairperson.

37:08The relevant panel is really close, so, yeah.

37:14I'm D. Martin.

37:15My pronouns are he, him.

37:19I'm new to the board.

37:20I'm not sure how many new people there are, quite a few.

37:25So I'm just interested to see how this moves forward.

37:28I know there's been issues in the past with the AAC,

37:30but I hope we can get past that

37:33and get some positive motion going.

37:37I already introduced myself, Vian Horn, she, her.

37:43Jackie Redmond, I'm Michael S.

37:47Just that you're a member.

37:48Oh, I'm a member.

37:49Yeah, this is your second meeting.

37:52Yeah.

37:52Okay, my third.

37:53Third meeting, there you go.

37:55There you go.

37:57All right, so online.

38:00Jen, would you like to introduce yourself?

38:03Sure.

38:04Jen Popkey, a returning member.

38:07Actually, this is my third kick at the can.

38:10Joined first in one of the earlier iterations,

38:14member and actually vice chair chair for a little while,

38:172005 to 2015.

38:20Joined again in the recent group

38:23that finished the two year mandate there.

38:25And happy, very happy to be able to...

38:32Excuse me, all right.

38:36So I'm just gonna pass on next.

38:39Cheryl, would you mind going next?

38:44Hello, everyone.

38:45My name is Cheryl, I'm a new member

38:47and my pronouns are she, her,

38:50and I'm very happy to be here looking forward to it.

38:55And Kathy, how about you next?

39:03Hi, everyone, my name is Kathy

39:05and I'm a returning member, really excited to be here.

39:08I was here just last year and I'm returning again.

39:12So, yeah, looking forward to this up cupping term.

39:20And Keeley, would you mind just chiming in

39:22because you are site plan?

39:28Hello, everyone, my name is Keeley.

39:30I am the other accessibility coordinator here at the city

39:33and my focus is mostly on built environment and technology.

39:37And like Leanne said, I handle site plan.

39:40So for the city, I am the accessibility person

39:42who sits on our site plan review committee.

39:45So I sit with a bunch of people from all over the city.

39:47We look at different site plans

39:48and I comment specifically on accessibility.

39:51And I'll be getting together a group of you all

39:55to do a little bit of training

39:56if you want to join me in reviewing some site plans

39:59and providing your comments from your accessibility perspective

40:02that I would then share with the developer

40:04both in a meeting and giving them written comments as well.

40:07So look for that around mid-October.

40:09I'll probably be sending out an invite too for training

40:14for our AAC site plan review.

40:17It was nice to meet everyone.

40:19Thank you.

40:21Perfect.

40:23Next slide, please, Whitney.

40:27So why are we here?

40:28That's a big question.

40:30In a few bullet points, first and foremost,

40:34we're here to advise staff and council

40:36regarding accessibility and or disability related issues,

40:41projects, and we're here for collaboration and consultation

40:47as the vehicle for greater accessibility for all.

40:51And when we are having conversations about items

40:55that staff bring to the AAC,

40:58it's important to consider various types of disability

41:01in your advice.

41:03So each of us as individuals can only know

41:06our own lived experience,

41:07but it's important to have a mind towards the diversity

41:10of experience that disability covers, that umbrella.

41:16And you might wonder what happens

41:18when we're competing needs or opinions,

41:21because that's not in any time in public space,

41:24but particularly there might be competing accessibility needs

41:28or priorities in some of the conversations that we have.

41:31And so a successful motion would ideally consider

41:34those multiple perspectives to give staff

41:36the diverse information that they need

41:38to implement accessibility in their work.

41:45Like, please.

41:46Thank you.

41:47So crafting a motion,

41:49we need to talk a bit about this already,

41:51but it's worth reiterating

41:52because it's kind of a unique form of writing

41:54that might take a little practice after realizing it.

42:09So a possible motion template

42:12as we work to write motions together,

42:15as the AAC works to write motions together,

42:18might say something like,

42:20I move that and move in this instance

42:22just means suggest or put forward.

42:26I move that whatever department is here,

42:30so let's say parks, for example, does,

42:33and then you'd insert a specific and actual piece of advice

42:37that would include words that are within the scope

42:40of the topic.

42:42So the more specific and on point with the

42:48think of the pathway,

42:49the greater chance of success there is for that motion.

42:55So just a few words of advice.

42:57Sharing your ideal situation can be part of a motion,

43:01but also consider that staff have constraints

43:03that might influence their project scope.

43:06So you could say in a perfect world,

43:09we do all these amazing things for accessibility,

43:12but staff work on a budget and an approval system.

43:15So we have to play within those constraints

43:18as we give our recommendations as well.

43:21And then it's worth repeating that we consider

43:24that barriers to accessibility are the focus

43:27rather than the preferences of an individual.

43:35So again, just trying to think holistically

43:38about the diversity of experience

43:40and what will best carry forward

43:44that diversity of experience to staff

43:47when we write motions together.

43:49Can I just pipe in just one thing there

43:51that I just want to mention

43:52is that your motions might stand alone

43:57in a department's report to counsel, for example.

44:01So that's why it's so important to make sure your motions

44:05have what you want,

44:07the message you want to carry forward in them.

44:10So it's important like that.

44:12Yes, so that's really important.

44:15So it's worth remembering that a staff person

44:18who comes to present to us,

44:20which you're gonna see today,

44:22has the full context of the full conversation that was had,

44:27but it's not the case that maybe others on their team

44:31are going to go back and watch a whole meeting

44:33and have all of that context.

44:35So to capture as much of what you want as you can

44:38into a motion will lead to greater success

44:42with the recommendations.

44:46Next slide, please.

44:49So how we understand accessibility,

44:53just reiterating what you've been saying

44:55that if we consider various types of disability

44:59in our advice bag, we'll be stronger together.

45:02And I'm not going to read through it all right now

45:04because it is a little bit lengthy,

45:06but in the handbook that has been shared with you via email,

45:11if you take a look at Appendix A,

45:13that's a document that the AAC co-writes with staff

45:17that thinks really carefully and fully

45:22about the diversity of experience

45:24within disability.

45:25And so if you wanna chat through that,

45:28feel free to reach out

45:29and we can have a conversation about what's included there.

45:32But by reviewing Appendix A, you might get a sense of,

45:35oh yeah, here's this diversity of experience

45:38and maybe there's a few that you hadn't even thought of before,

45:42but keeping that in mind will help make you

45:45a really strong motion writer and committee member

45:51to represent the diversity of the disability

45:54and accessibility community.

45:59So the AODA, which is short for Accessibility for Ontarians

46:04with Disabilities Act,

46:06outlines some specific consultations for AACs

46:10that are required.

46:12So each municipality has their own AAC that meets

46:16and we have consistency in things

46:20that we must have consultations about.

46:23And other non-required projects may be brought to us well.

46:26So staff might say,

46:29I don't have to ask the AAC for advice on this thing,

46:33but it's nice to do and I desire to do that.

46:36So you'll see on the next slide,

46:39the examples of what are required by the AODA

46:43and what are not required.

46:46Go through that now.

46:48So just some bit of background about consultations

46:52over the past few years.

46:53So in 2022, we had three required consultations

46:59come to the AAC and 10 that were not required.

47:02Similarly, or not similarly,

47:04the numbers were closer in 2023,

47:06there were 16 required consultations and 15 not required.

47:11And in 2024, nine required and 21 not required.

47:17So overall, you can see that there's a high level of desire

47:21to come and chat with the AAC

47:23even when it's not required by the AODA.

47:27Folks are still coming and seeking the feedback

47:31that the AAC wants to give, which is a really great sign.

47:35So in short, the required general topics

47:42that must come to the AAC are anything related

47:57to accessibility plans, bus stops and shelters,

48:02taxi cabs, recreation trails and rest areas,

48:06place spaces and on street parking.

48:09And then everything else is not required,

48:12but just an example here,

48:14something such as the Affordable Housing Community

48:17Improvement Plan or CIP.

48:19This is a real example where the AAC

48:22recommendation supported staff

48:24in including an extra $20,000 to the base funding

48:28for true accessibility improvement.

48:31And the AAC helped support

48:33what those improvements could include.

48:35Does that make sense to everyone?

48:36That distinction.

48:41Next slide please.

48:45Thanks Jen.

48:45That was a high line, thanks Jen.

48:48So you might be wondering,

48:50what does the accessibility team at the city of Guelph do?

48:54So we support you, the committee,

48:56including by fielding any committee

48:59and community accessibility concerns.

49:03We do agenda development with the chair and vice chair.

49:07Our vice chair, Judy is not present today

49:10with the recipe who I knew will meet her in the future.

49:15The accessibility team supports the writing of motions.

49:18Like we said, can be tricky to get the hang of it.

49:20So we're here to help you with wording

49:21and anything like that.

49:23We facilitate communication between AAC

49:26and staff and council.

49:28So if staff come to us and say,

49:31we want to bring this item to the AAC,

49:33we work with them to make sure

49:34that the language they're using is understood by you all

49:38and that they're communicating their ideas to everybody

49:41in a way that is accessible

49:43and can lead to a successful meeting.

49:46We help other staff do their work

49:48from an accessibility related perspective.

49:51And we guide you, the AAC members

49:53on the city's scope of responsibility.

49:56So for example, you might have questions

49:58about social services or other accessibility

50:02related legislation that the province

50:04or federal legislation is responsible for.

50:07And we know that that can be a lot to separate out,

50:10but if you're ever unsure, you can ask us,

50:12hey, is this a service or something

50:15that the city of Guelph is responsible for?

50:17Does that come from the province?

50:18We can help you understand the difference

50:20between those things.

50:21And any other support that committee members

50:24or committee as a whole might need,

50:26we are here as a resource to support you.

50:33One important document that you will likely encounter

50:37many times as you begin to work with more staff reports

50:41is the facility accessibility design manual

50:44or the FADM for short.

50:46So if you ever see that acronym,

50:47that's what it stands for.

50:50And there are some updates that are slotted

50:54to be timed with the AODA update

50:57and a review of that underway for next year, 2026.

51:01And the city of Guelph's FADM goes beyond AODA

51:05required topics.

51:06So it gets nice and specific.

51:09It kind of goes above and beyond even that legislation,

51:12which is really wonderful.

51:14And it often exceeds, like I said, AODA

51:16and the Ontario Building Code.

51:19And so anyone on staff working to build anything new

51:24is referring to the FADM.

51:26And so you may hear that come up in staff reports

51:29and presentations that something is compliant with the FADM

51:33or it's been brought into consideration.

51:38And that's a really helpful document

51:40because it means that they're not starting

51:42from scratch with their questions.

51:44There's these standards that help everybody

51:47be on the same page to make sure that everything new

51:50is being built as excessively as possible.

51:53Is there anything else you'd like to say about that, Leigh Ann?

51:55Yeah, we're doing an update of the FADM in 2026.

52:00We've gathered all the comments from staff

52:02and we're just formulating all of that

52:05and getting to the point of hiring a consultant

52:09early in 2026.

52:11And then the consultant will then engage the AC, you guys,

52:17about the FADM.

52:18So the FADM is about built environment.

52:20So when we build things like City Hall

52:23was one of the first buildings

52:24that we use the facility accessibility design meeting along.

52:28And so you'll see lots of things

52:29like the mayor's position is fully wheelchair accessible,

52:33same with council, we were the first ones

52:36to do that type of thing.

52:37And then we also use the FADM in the renovation

52:40of the whole City Hall, the POA court.

52:42And over there, one of the main courtroom has the justice

52:48as well as the clerk position are both fully accessible

52:51and we were the first ones to do that in Long Territory.

52:55So, and we had a special permission to do that.

52:58And now there are others that have built in that way as well.

53:02We put it right online.

53:03So if anybody wants to look at this facility

53:05accessibility design manual, they're perfectly welcome to

53:08encourage other municipalities and private business

53:11to also look at that document and build to it as well.

53:16It's using universal design principles is how it's done.

53:20So people still may need a personal accommodation happening

53:24or something happening specific for them

53:27to use maybe a desk or a space,

53:29but for the most part it is universal design.

53:32So that's the approach on that one.

53:34So you'll be seeing that because we want it approved

53:37by the AAC and then approved by council is the next order.

53:42And hopefully that all happens in 2026

53:44is what we're eating for.

53:46So thank you.

53:48Next slide please.

53:54So, Keely mentioned the AAC site plan review a little bit

54:01and the AAC site plan review engages members to provide

54:06comments on both new developments

54:09and renovations on current buildings.

54:12These buildings will be standing for many years

54:15and we wanna make sure we build them as excessively

54:17as possible.

54:18And while contractors and developers know

54:20the basics of the AODA, it's very helpful

54:23to have limb experience comments that explain more

54:26of the why or a better practice.

54:29And while anything covered under the AODA

54:31is considered a requirement, the AAC can also provide comments

54:36that go over and above the AODA

54:38in the form of recommendations.

54:40And these recommendations can increase accessibility

54:42and be more practical in design for people with disabilities.

54:47So, can chat with Leigh Ann or I and we can connect you

54:51with Keely if that's something that's exciting to you

54:53to participate in.

54:59Great.

55:00So accessibility advisory, maybe some more notes here

55:06and what is required from you.

55:12So you wanna be understanding information given by staff

55:15about projects and services that fall

55:17within the responsibility of the city.

55:19So like we were saying, if you're like,

55:21wait, is this a city project?

55:23I'm not sure.

55:24We're here to help you understand that.

55:27You are going to participate in staff consultations

55:30required by the AODA.

55:32And right after we finish this, you'll have

55:35for the new members your first staff consultation

55:38coming right up after this.

55:40And you're responsible to prepare for meetings

55:43by reviewing staff reports that are emailed out to you

55:46and begin to think about motions before meetings.

55:48So maybe you read a report and you're like,

55:51oh, actually I have some strong feelings about that.

55:54And maybe I have some expertise about this thing.

55:58Feel free to reach out and say,

55:59hey, I've been thinking about emotion already.

56:01Like, can you help me write this down?

56:04And so you kind of get the gears turning

56:06before you even get in the room.

56:08And then we can use our time together really effectively

56:10to collaborate.

56:19So what happens leading out to a recorded public AAC meeting

56:24just to restate it again.

56:25If anyone from the public wanted to attend an AAC meeting

56:30that meets court, they are welcome to do so.

56:33So there may be other folks in the room

56:35and or online in future meetings

56:38they all must be public.

56:40So you'll receive an email for agenda items

56:43about five weeks before the AAC meeting.

56:47And then the chair, Giovanni here and vice chair, Judy

56:50who's not present today, meet with the liaison.

56:53So Leanna, myself and Clark staff

56:55to set the agenda about three weeks before the meeting.

56:59And then the agenda and any staff reports

57:01for the upcoming meeting,

57:03but they sent out one week before

57:05for committee members to review.

57:07And again, please contact us, the liaisons

57:09if there's any questions about the agenda

57:11for the reports.

57:13And then after the meeting,

57:14the minute they're generally sent out

57:17within a week or so of the meeting

57:19that may vary based on staff capacity at the time,

57:23but those minutes are also posted publicly.

57:32So you might be wondering

57:34how you can bring it to an AAC agenda.

57:37You can contact the accessibility liaisons

57:40by feeling accessibility at 12.ca

57:43or calling 519-822-1260 extension 2670.

57:49You don't need to write that down to these slides.

57:53And if there's any other way

57:54we can make communication more accessible for you,

57:56if you prefer to text or you mean something else,

57:59let us know and we are more than happy

58:01to meet your communication needs.

58:07So some terminology from the agendas

58:09just to explain if you're unfamiliar.

58:12If something says that it's for information,

58:15that means that something has taken place

58:17or there's an event that the committee member

58:19should be aware of.

58:21So for example, the wealth barrier free committee

58:26does something called access recognition awards.

58:30And that's not something that is like a staff discussion item

58:34but something going on that we might want you to be aware of.

58:38So those items are labeled as for information.

58:42If something's labeled as for recommendation,

58:45the committee may make a motion

58:47that provides a recommendation to council and or staff.

58:51And then if something is labeled as for discussion,

58:55the committee will discuss a topic

58:57and provide the liaison with insights

58:59and possible direction.

59:01So for example, any topics reported in detail

59:05to the committee council.

59:11Thank you.

59:13And then if something is labeled as for AODA engagement,

59:20this means there's formal engagement

59:21of committee members on topics

59:23which are directly related to the engagement

59:25requirements in AODA.

59:28So I know some of those are a little bit similar.

59:30Are there any questions about those distinctions?

59:33Stop.

59:43I beat myself to my next slide.

59:44Any questions about today's meeting?

59:46We just gave you a lot of information you can ask now

59:50or if you prefer to let things sit for a bit,

59:53please send us a email at accessibilityandgwelf.ca.

59:58Anyone online have any questions right now?

1:00:09Already did the introductions of one another

1:00:12but Carmen I see you just joined us online.

1:00:16Maybe you'd just like to share your name

1:00:18and pronounce if you like with the group

1:00:20because there's new members.

1:00:23Yeah, for sure.

1:00:24My name's Carmen Loisal.

1:00:26I'm also at the University of Guelph.

1:00:27I don't know if I mentioned that.

1:00:29And this is my first year on the committee

1:00:31and my pronouns are she, her.

1:00:34Awesome, thank you.

1:00:38And yeah, I believe everyone else is present

1:00:39has introduced himself.

1:00:41So one more go around question

1:00:44just before we wrap up the orientation.

1:00:48We'd love to know what's your area of interest

1:00:51in joining the committee if you'd like to share.

1:00:54We can start in the room again, G-Fonny.

1:00:57Yeah, I guess based on the information that we've seen,

1:01:01it would be the 52 years of experience

1:01:04that I've went through with this disability.

1:01:06Just sharing, making the world a better place.

1:01:16My interest, because I started experiencing more and more

1:01:20I'm talking to you diabetic.

1:01:21So I'm losing feeling in my feet.

1:01:24So accessibility for me will be a growing concern

1:01:28as I move forward.

1:01:29So this is a chance for me to learn

1:01:30what other people look for

1:01:35as I kind of become more dependent on accessibility issues.

1:01:40I also have a grandson that is autistic.

1:01:43So there are some accessibility issues

1:01:44that he may be facing in the future.

1:01:46And I have friends that have accessibility issues also.

1:01:49So I think it's with an aging society,

1:01:56such as myself, it's something that's something

1:01:58that keeps growing and it's something that

1:02:03we need to be conscious of moving forward

1:02:05with building designs and things like that.

1:02:07So for me, it's like being Martin, now accessibility.

1:02:23That's okay.

1:02:25That's good.

1:02:25Yeah, thank you.

1:02:28Moving online, I see Kathy at the top of the screen

1:02:31if you would like to share anything.

1:02:34Yeah, definitely.

1:02:35I think what interests me most from everything

1:02:38that I've learned on the committee

1:02:39and with my lived experience and work experience,

1:02:43just to understand all parties

1:02:44and really understand what the gaps are in the systems

1:02:49and the conversations to be able to work towards

1:02:53just developing policies that are actually gonna make change

1:02:56within accessibility and inclusion.

1:03:01Thank you.

1:03:02Cheryl?

1:03:09Hi, yes, just to mirror a lot

1:03:12of what the other committee members are saying,

1:03:15I have an interest based on professional experience

1:03:19and also personal experience with disabilities

1:03:22and just looking at ways to all come together

1:03:28to identify barriers, increase inclusion,

1:03:33look at collaborative efforts.

1:03:34So I'm just interested in hearing everyone's perspective

1:03:42and working together and just continuous learning

1:03:47and trying to participate by using my background

1:03:52and my lived experience as well.

1:03:56Wonderful, thank you.

1:03:58Jen, if you'd like to share.

1:04:02Sure, love the answer so far, by the way.

1:04:06It's been wonderful to see everyone

1:04:08here is guided by a fantastic North Star.

1:04:12I'm right there alongside all of you.

1:04:17I would say I'm a big supporter of the idea

1:04:20of the social model of disability versus medical model.

1:04:23Really quickly, medical model means the person is broken

1:04:26as though you've broken your arm

1:04:28and will try to fix you to fit into the wider model.

1:04:33Social model of disability is where the elements

1:04:36around the person, the person is not broken

1:04:39with the disability.

1:04:40The elements around the person are poorly designed

1:04:43for them to thrive.

1:04:44So that's communication, environment, technology

1:04:47and attitudes, for example.

1:04:50So those when they're not designed well

1:04:53for someone to succeed, they create the barrier

1:04:57and make a place that's accessible.

1:04:59That's why I love this committee

1:05:01because we're actively solving for design problems

1:05:04in all of those areas, communication, environment,

1:05:07technology and the products and services

1:05:11that this city proudly offers.

1:05:13So I'm happy to be here.

1:05:15I love the idea with everyone's different backgrounds.

1:05:18We all bring our strengths and diversity

1:05:21of experience to the table.

1:05:23So we can make really strong recommendations

1:05:26to the city and make this place of Guelph

1:05:30a really accessible and proud place to be.

1:05:37Thank you, Jen.

1:05:38And last but not least, Carmen, you'd like to share it.

1:05:44Yeah, for sure.

1:05:45So as I said, I go to the University of Guelph.

1:05:47I am in psychology and neuroscience.

1:05:49So I'm very interested in how that's related

1:05:53to accessibility, especially like invisible disabilities

1:05:56and also learning about the challenges

1:05:59that multiple people face

1:06:00because I think this is a great opportunity

1:06:02for me to learn about other people's experience

1:06:04because obviously I'm not gonna experience

1:06:06the same things that other people might experience.

1:06:08So I'm really looking forward to learning as well.

1:06:14Thank you, Carmen.

1:06:15Thank you everyone for sharing.

1:06:17I'm really excited about the group

1:06:19we've gathered here today

1:06:20and wonderful timing from Tiffany

1:06:24who will present momentarily.

1:06:28We're not going to physically break

1:06:30for a tour of City Hall at this moment, I don't believe.

1:06:33It's a little hard to get there

1:06:35because of the construction.

1:06:36This is happening.

1:06:36Yeah, it's okay.

1:06:38We can put up those photos though.

1:06:41Because that illustrates what Liam was talking about.

1:06:44When do you think we wanna go to the next slide?

1:06:51Can you go to the next slide, Nini?

1:06:52Yeah.

1:06:54Please, that's great, thank you.

1:06:56So you'll see here, I mentioned earlier

1:06:59about the mayor's position being wheelchair accessible.

1:07:02And so you'll see that where the flags are, that's ramped up.

1:07:06The mayor of course has to sit up above others

1:07:09because of the stature of the position.

1:07:11And then he drives into his position

1:07:14and the picture on the left is from the mayor's seat.

1:07:17So if you were sitting in the mayor's area,

1:07:19that's exactly where you would be.

1:07:22And did we miss the picture?

1:07:25No, the next picture.

1:07:27Sure, oh, the picture before, sorry, the slide before.

1:07:31Yeah.

1:07:32So this is showing from the delicate side.

1:07:36So when people attend City Hall council meetings,

1:07:41there is a podium that elevates up and down.

1:07:45So depending on your height

1:07:48and where you're comfortable with the podium being,

1:07:51we can adjust it just with the push of a button

1:07:53type of thing up or down.

1:07:55Or the person can do that themselves as well.

1:07:58And then on the right, the image shows the ramp

1:08:01that leads down from the audience area

1:08:03down into the delicate area.

1:08:04So if you were to delegate to council,

1:08:08it is awfully accessible.

1:08:09And then there is a ramp behind,

1:08:11there's a TV on the wall,

1:08:13there's a ramp behind the dark part of wood that goes up.

1:08:16So council and the mayor could come down to this area

1:08:20to present awards and that type of thing.

1:08:22And that will happen sometimes with barrier free.

1:08:26They present awards, sort of they arrange

1:08:28to have awards presented by the mayor

1:08:31to businesses that have done well.

1:08:33And so the difference between barrier free

1:08:35and the accessibility advisory committee,

1:08:36because both were around at the same time.

1:08:39And John smiled there on that one

1:08:42because he was around in this time.

1:08:44So the barrier free committee was around

1:08:47before the legislation, the provincial legislation.

1:08:50And so what happened was the city decided

1:08:54here was a committee already advising on accessibility

1:08:57within the city, let's invite them

1:09:00to be the first accessibility advisory committee members.

1:09:03And so that was back in 2001.

1:09:05And so they became those members.

1:09:08And then later on there were adjustments

1:09:11to the membership on both committees.

1:09:14And so we didn't want accessibility advisory committee

1:09:18meeting items brought to the barrier free by accident,

1:09:20things like that.

1:09:22And so we had a facilitated meeting

1:09:24where we divided out the work between the two committees

1:09:26so they could coexist and they do connect still.

1:09:30And Kayla is liaison for both committees.

1:09:34So she knows everything that's going on with both of them

1:09:36and facilitates for both of them.

1:09:38So barrier free focuses on business

1:09:41and the accessibility advisory committee

1:09:43focus on working with council and staff.

1:09:46And so that's how it's been divided up,

1:09:47but we all work together still type of thing.

1:09:51So that's how all that works.

1:09:55And I think that's it for the presentation for this stuff.

1:09:59And Tiffany has joined us then for the first committee I am.

1:10:06This is no longer training.

1:10:08This is the real thing.

1:10:11So I'm Tiffany and I'm a partner here at the city.

1:10:15I have presented to the AC many times.

1:10:20If you have any questions.

1:10:21Excuse me, I'm sorry.

1:10:23We will lead to do the approval of gender first

1:10:27and then do the approval of minors first.

1:10:29And then we will go to Tiffany to introduce your item.

1:10:33Thank you very much.

1:10:34That's right. Thank you, Wendy.

1:10:35Tell them about my fault.

1:10:37My fault. My fault.

1:10:38Thank you very much.

1:10:39Your fault.

1:10:39So it's not a shared possibility.

1:10:42So I think what you said, Wendy,

1:10:43was we have to approve the agenda for this meeting.

1:10:46Yes.

1:10:47Okay.

1:10:48So does anybody approve the agenda for the meeting?

1:10:54Sorry, chair.

1:10:55We would need one mover first

1:10:57and then the seconder.

1:10:58And then we need to ask the members to vote on that.

1:11:02Thank you.

1:11:04So what's the best way to...

1:11:07So we have a member that would make a motion

1:11:10to approve the agenda.

1:11:13Yes, Jen here.

1:11:14I'll make a move to approve.

1:11:17Thank you.

1:11:18And can I have a seconder?

1:11:21It's Cheryl. All second.

1:11:23Thank you.

1:11:24And I have to say something about...

1:11:31Also, anyone like...

1:11:33Follow me, please.

1:11:36I don't have these when I don't see anyone.

1:11:40Opposing? No.

1:11:41Yeah. Yeah, you can say that.

1:11:42Yeah. If either...

1:11:43Does anybody oppose the motion?

1:11:45Okay.

1:11:46Does anyone oppose the motion regarding the approval

1:11:48of the agenda?

1:11:52Hearing nothing.

1:11:53The approval is done?

1:11:58Good.

1:11:59Yes.

1:11:59Good.

1:12:02Now then I have to do...

1:12:03What was the next one you said?

1:12:05The approval of minutes.

1:12:10Can I explain a little bit?

1:12:12You have to have attended the meeting.

1:12:13So been a member to be part of approving the minutes.

1:12:17Correct, Whitney?

1:12:18Yes.

1:12:19So it was only Janet, myself, that's not...

1:12:21And...

1:12:24Yeah, okay.

1:12:25So would anyone like to move to approve the minutes

1:12:29from our June meeting?

1:12:31Do you wanna approve minutes?

1:12:35Jackie is approved now.

1:12:37Okay.

1:12:37One, can I get a seconder?

1:12:41Okay, can I do it?

1:12:45Just John, that's not...

1:12:47Three months.

1:12:48Right, there's no seconder.

1:12:49So do you want just...

1:12:51So Jackie has approved or has made the motion

1:12:55to approve the minutes from the last meeting?

1:12:57And John is the only other person here

1:12:59from the last meeting, the chair.

1:13:03I do have a question.

1:13:04If they really wanted to give people the last meeting,

1:13:07how was Quorum meant to have the last meeting?

1:13:12Is there only four people?

1:13:16No, there's only four people.

1:13:17Yeah, and one person has called in their regrets

1:13:19for today, there was another person.

1:13:21Okay, that's just...

1:13:22That's a good question.

1:13:23Yes, and the same question.

1:13:25Yeah.

1:13:27So Whitney, can you give us direction on this?

1:13:30When we don't have a person here to second the minutes,

1:13:34do we carry them to October when we do have a seconder?

1:13:37When, if Judy attends?

1:13:39Yes, yes, we could do this.

1:13:41We just put her...

1:13:42Opposing this item to October.

1:13:45I said on the cutting medium board,

1:13:48and that's if there isn't enough,

1:13:50yeah, we just carry it forward.

1:13:52Yeah.

1:13:53So we'll get that carried forward

1:13:55if that's something that's everyone.

1:13:58For those like Sheryl, Sheryl, I'll start getting up though.

1:14:02Yeah, I was just gonna ask,

1:14:03because I know on other committees I sit on,

1:14:06if we weren't present during the last meeting,

1:14:08then we have to go formally on record and say

1:14:10that we abstain.

1:14:11So do you require members to do that?

1:14:15Is this not required for a member to do this in this committee?

1:14:18Yeah, thank you.

1:14:19Okay, perfect.

1:14:20Thank you.

1:14:21I also think because he asked for who's opposed,

1:14:25if you don't have to respond, right?

1:14:30If he asks if you approve, you can't agree to approve it,

1:14:33but you can say silent that you don't oppose it.

1:14:36Totally better to use opposed versus approved.

1:14:39If thinking you can't...

1:14:39It's more usually.

1:14:40It's more efficient.

1:14:41It's more efficient.

1:14:42The opposed.

1:14:43Yeah, does anybody oppose the motion?

1:14:45It's more efficient.

1:14:46Okay, even though it sounds negative or...

1:14:48It sounds negative.

1:14:49Yeah.

1:14:51So we're gonna move that to next meeting in October, yes?

1:14:55Okay.

1:14:56Thank you.

1:14:58And then now, can we go with Tiffany?

1:15:01We have a consent agenda.

1:15:02Do you want that approved?

1:15:04Or no, I don't.

1:15:08We now can move to Tiffany's item on the park.

1:15:17Do you have my presence?

1:15:18I don't know.

1:15:19I'm looking at maybe Kayla or maybe...

1:15:22You can pull up please.

1:15:23Okay.

1:15:26I'm pulling it up.

1:15:27Yeah.

1:15:33While she's pulling it up,

1:15:34I'll just introduce the project to myself.

1:15:39So before I'm a park planner,

1:15:42so what we're doing right now is we are going to instruct

1:15:47and trail between Deer Path Drive and Castlebury Park

1:15:51in the city's west end.

1:15:54So if you are not aware,

1:15:58we follow the city's facility accessibility design manual

1:16:02for any work that we do in the city.

1:16:04So for this path, it's only 100 meters long.

1:16:09So we make sure that it's three meters wide

1:16:12so that people can pass on the path.

1:16:14It's going to be asphalt surface.

1:16:18We are concerned about the slope of the trail,

1:16:21so we don't exceed 4%.

1:16:25In this case, our trail is less than 3% in most cases,

1:16:29or like along the trail.

1:16:31And we don't have a cross-loop that's larger than 2%.

1:16:36The other thing that we consider from the FADM

1:16:38is the location of rest stations.

1:16:39So in this case, we don't have enough space

1:16:42to fit one at the beginning of the trail

1:16:44because we only got a very small slimmer of land

1:16:49for the trail.

1:16:50We have one located 100 meters into the park,

1:16:54right where the trail meets the existing trail in the park.

1:16:58At the location of the curb cut and the road,

1:17:02we'll have detectable warning plates.

1:17:06And we will have weight-hining signage

1:17:08be installed at the completion of the project

1:17:11when we have finished the weight-hining strategy.

1:17:16So we don't have that information yet.

1:17:18The only thing to note from a non,

1:17:21like that we are not providing the most accessible

1:17:25is our benches.

1:17:27So the trail itself is located within a Hydro 1 corridor

1:17:30and it underneath Hydro towers.

1:17:33So we are unable to use any metal objects.

1:17:37So we are installing the city's concrete benches

1:17:41with wood slabs.

1:17:42So it won't have arm rests and it won't have like the,

1:17:46we usually put a bar along the bottom

1:17:48for it to be cane detectable.

1:17:50So we're just doing the one that our city staff

1:17:53can build themselves because we know

1:17:56it doesn't have any metal in it.

1:17:57Otherwise, like it's hard to find a metal,

1:18:00or it's hard to find a wood bench

1:18:02that doesn't have metal fasteners.

1:18:04And that was a Hydro 1 requirement.

1:18:07So for this agenda item,

1:18:10our proposed recommendation is that you,

1:18:12I think I wrote to support the design

1:18:16of the new multi-use trail.

1:18:17And I think your path to the castle very part.

1:18:22So I think I'm not sure what the next step is.

1:18:25You can ask questions or other emotions.

1:18:31So we can, yeah, we can invite members

1:18:34to ask questions or like some discussions.

1:18:37Yeah, thank you.

1:18:43Does everybody understand what like,

1:18:44well, 4% slope is?

1:18:51You can take it online as well.

1:18:54I think the easiest way to explain that is

1:18:57for every 100 feet across, it's four feet up.

1:19:02So think of it as a triangle.

1:19:04So when they say the 4% slope or 2% slope,

1:19:08for those who understand what they mean,

1:19:09but how the slope is measured,

1:19:11for every 4% slope would be 100 feet out,

1:19:15is four feet up, and then the hypotenuse is the slope.

1:19:20Is that the best way to explain it?

1:19:22Yeah, like for a person that's walking,

1:19:27like 5% is typically what you would,

1:19:30when you would notice an incline,

1:19:34usually below 5%, it's like,

1:19:36you'll notice the exertion, but like,

1:19:38it's fairly flat for the local's part.

1:19:42I don't know if that's the appropriate way to describe it.

1:19:44Yeah, yeah.

1:19:45So a ramp that is not a very steep ramp

1:19:51in the MPDM is five weeks.

1:19:53So this is less than a ramp.

1:19:56So why do you have to drive?

1:19:59Why can you not have to drive?

1:20:02Because like, I have mobility issue.

1:20:05I cannot, like, use the ramps.

1:20:10I can't use, it's too steep for me.

1:20:15So why can you not make it flat?

1:20:21So we're putting a trail in an existing area.

1:20:24So we have to connect the road, which is down here,

1:20:30and the existing trail, which is up here.

1:20:32So we do our best to try and get it as flat as we can.

1:20:37For the most part, it's fairly flat.

1:20:41There are a few places where we have to go down

1:20:43and go up to match the existing topography.

1:20:47And we also only have like five meters of land

1:20:51that we can build on.

1:20:52So if we wanted to make it flat,

1:20:53we can't just like,

1:20:55like usually you would do a switchback or something like that

1:20:58to make it as flat as possible,

1:21:00but we don't have the land to make it 2%.

1:21:03But we're at 3% on, in this case,

1:21:06we're just bunch less than our range.

1:21:08Because, see, any incline,

1:21:12I personally can feel infants going up,

1:21:17even though she's like two centimeters,

1:21:21I can feel it, and infants not even,

1:21:25is very steep for me to grip.

1:21:29So do you have any safeguards to prevent

1:21:36tripping the surface itself?

1:21:39That's going to be asphalt.

1:21:41And in our tender package,

1:21:42like we have a very low tolerance

1:21:44for the deviations of the asphalt.

1:21:47And if it's not like smooth, it will be rejected.

1:21:52I guess a question that I would pose back,

1:21:55if that's a cloud, is what can,

1:21:57like other than making it flat,

1:21:59what are other things we can actually do

1:22:02to make it easier for you to use?

1:22:05Okay, what about, and I told you,

1:22:11what about having like a railing?

1:22:16You know, so it's,

1:22:19gives a person that we self support

1:22:25to hang on to, you know, the incline.

1:22:30I think because of the location

1:22:31what Tiffany said earlier, it's on a Hydro-1 right away.

1:22:35So because we can't have railings,

1:22:37it'd be hard to have something.

1:22:39That may go wooden rail.

1:22:41But we have to make it the lake-loss environment

1:22:43and every lake-loss to the weather, through the weather.

1:22:47Yeah, but the problem with even made it wood

1:22:49is the fasteners would be metal.

1:22:52So the worry is, is any metal could,

1:22:55if there was something to have the Hydro-1s,

1:22:58even though it's wood,

1:22:59it should still have like metal nails or metal screws.

1:23:05So then, yeah, it would be hard

1:23:10to get around the metal issue.

1:23:17John, I think that's your answer.

1:23:18You know, you know.

1:23:22Yes, thank you.

1:23:23Yeah, I had just a quick question

1:23:25and it was about the bench.

1:23:28It is separate from the previous conversation.

1:23:32Totally understand, while I can't see the immediate picture

1:23:36of the bench you're talking about,

1:23:37understand what the design of it is.

1:23:40Have we received feedback in the past

1:23:43if somebody needs help,

1:23:45somebody who might use a hand rest

1:23:49or an arm rest, typically on a chair,

1:23:51to push themselves up out of the bench?

1:23:55Have we had feedback of people not being able to use

1:23:59the standard concrete and wood combination in the past

1:24:03or that it's been a struggle or difficulty?

1:24:06And the reason I ask, as a two-part,

1:24:09is if it's possible,

1:24:11if these are not already ready-made designs

1:24:14with the concrete, could the arm rest come up

1:24:17a little bit higher so that somebody could feel

1:24:19that they could use the bench and sit down

1:24:22because it's actually set up for them

1:24:24to be able to push themselves back up

1:24:28once they're ready to get up later.

1:24:32I can ask, so the benches that we selected

1:24:35for this are the ones

1:24:36that our parks team manufacturers themselves.

1:24:40So it's standard, like it just has one end,

1:24:44I should have included the image,

1:24:45but it just has one concrete end and one concrete end.

1:24:49And then we go through,

1:24:51I can ask them if that's possible to,

1:24:55I wouldn't know about the complaints, Leanne, maybe.

1:25:00But yeah, we could look at a different humane

1:25:03for the bench to make it more inclusive.

1:25:06If that's possible, because I know thinking of buildings

1:25:11that someone might want to go into,

1:25:14they're very tired, someone may want to sit down,

1:25:18but the chairs offered in a beautiful foyer,

1:25:22so don't have any arm rest.

1:25:24So somebody's saying, I can't sit down there

1:25:26because if I sit down, I literally won't be able to get up.

1:25:30So that's what I'm wondering if the city is designing them

1:25:34to increase is of the arm rest,

1:25:37or at least as part of consideration for research

1:25:40to see what's possible and what,

1:25:43how could we make it a little bit easier

1:25:46still while not using any metal in that location?

1:25:53You can reach out to your people.

1:25:55Yeah, but I feel like Leanne had a comment on that.

1:26:00Yeah, so.

1:26:01Sorry, Jen, I wasn't sure if you were talking in general.

1:26:04So in general, we do have benches that are made by Magland

1:26:08that have the third arm rest.

1:26:11So a person can have both arm rests

1:26:14in one location on the bench to push up.

1:26:18And then there's another arm rest at the other end type of thing

1:26:21that's quite a distance.

1:26:24So the only thing, those are metal though.

1:26:28So this is a one off, one bench, one off.

1:26:31That's stout.

1:26:33Absolutely.

1:26:33I was thinking, sorry, more if we compare it to the metal ones

1:26:37that we often see in many of the parks

1:26:39that we're fortunate to have,

1:26:41what is the height of those arm rests

1:26:43that are only at the end?

1:26:45And are the concrete ones much lower or shorter

1:26:49because that's the mental image I have in my mind.

1:26:52I can't think right now of the exact measurements.

1:26:55If they're much lower, could they be actually brought up

1:26:58to be a little bit higher so that somebody

1:27:00with even one arm can help push themselves up

1:27:04off the bench afterwards.

1:27:07Don't know if that makes sense.

1:27:09It's a clear, are you asking about the existing metal benches?

1:27:15The concrete one.

1:27:17They get the height of the...

1:27:20I can talk to our operations folks,

1:27:22they just use a mold.

1:27:24So I don't know if they can remake a mold.

1:27:28I can also look into other benches,

1:27:31but we kind of look down in line

1:27:34and we're like, most of them are fan metal fasteners

1:27:37so an hygrobline won't let us.

1:27:40Are there existing inches to turn them?

1:27:43There might be.

1:27:44I can...

1:27:44You're not sitting in the office.

1:27:45Oh, no.

1:27:46Yeah, no.

1:27:47So can I...

1:27:48Not without metal.

1:27:49Not without metal.

1:27:50No.

1:27:51So is that maybe a motion that you want to put forward?

1:27:56Yeah.

1:27:58A motion to put forward to look at the height

1:28:01of the armrest on the concrete benches?

1:28:05Well, I can comment on the height of the armrest

1:28:08on the concrete benches right now.

1:28:10There really is no armrest.

1:28:15It's basically where the woods slats go.

1:28:18There's like a one inch thickness of concrete above that.

1:28:23So there is no armrest currently

1:28:25on the concrete woods slab benches.

1:28:30My question is, did the City of Guelph

1:28:33actually make those molds?

1:28:39I know that the...

1:28:40I know our operations folks just make them in-house.

1:28:43Yeah, so they bought the mold.

1:28:45Yes.

1:28:45So the question would be,

1:28:48where whoever made that mold

1:28:50or where they bought that mold from,

1:28:53because I have seen concrete benches in other cities

1:28:56that have armrests

1:28:58and actually had a wood slab across the bottom

1:29:05or like you said, or...

1:29:07Cane detectable.

1:29:08Yeah, cane detectable.

1:29:09Okay.

1:29:10So there are molds out there,

1:29:14but whether those cities made those molds themselves

1:29:17and cast themselves,

1:29:19yeah, or they bought those molds someplace,

1:29:23it does what we need to look into.

1:29:26Can I do an emotion?

1:29:28Wait, hold on.

1:29:29Sorry, Kathy, I see you over your hand up as well.

1:29:33Yeah.

1:29:34I just wanna go back to the previous conversation

1:29:36in regards to the very...

1:29:38Even though a very slight slope, still a slope.

1:29:41And I'm curious if there's not a railing

1:29:43and please excuse me if this is already explained,

1:29:46but what about using some type of traction

1:29:49that's just durable

1:29:52that we use sort of in an accessibility space

1:29:54at a crosswalk to grip

1:29:56because we live in a country with a lot of ice and snow.

1:30:00And so I'm curious if we can't do something

1:30:03sort of above ground,

1:30:04what type of actions can we make on the ground

1:30:07to reduce that mobility issue

1:30:10of managing a type of slope

1:30:13and navigating up the slope without falling or slipping back?

1:30:22So the VIST trail won't be winter maintained.

1:30:28And even our trails that are not winter maintained,

1:30:31they still have, like they're not plowed right to the ground

1:30:34because it'll hit it.

1:30:37So like the plow will hit the granulars and remove it.

1:30:44There are opportunities we can do that and look into it.

1:30:49I don't know what we're using at crosswalks.

1:30:51Like this is asphalt and not concrete.

1:30:54So yeah.

1:30:55Is it closed?

1:30:57Sorry, is the trail closed to the public over the winter?

1:31:02It's not closed.

1:31:03We just have signage that says it's not winter maintained.

1:31:05We don't winter maintain all of our trails in the winter.

1:31:10We only maintain some of them.

1:31:13The sidewalks are differently maintained than trails are.

1:31:17Okay, I think something to remember too

1:31:20is that able-bodied people get to kind of move around

1:31:25as they please as best fit.

1:31:27And when you have mobility issues,

1:31:30you don't have equitable access to nature.

1:31:34And so sometimes it's not the winter

1:31:37and it's still a little bit slushy or something.

1:31:39Like I understand it's not maintained

1:31:41and it's at your own risk.

1:31:43But just looking into when there is a slope

1:31:47offers an extended use of something

1:31:51when it's not, because fall could last for like three months

1:31:55and spring could last for three months as well.

1:31:58So just to keep in mind any type of slope,

1:32:00maybe making it a question or a thought

1:32:03and to create some type of traction on those slight slopes

1:32:09so it can be used as long as possible.

1:32:14Sorry, it's very loud, but when we're talking about slope,

1:32:18are we talking about over 5% or any change in grade?

1:32:23I think any change in grade,

1:32:25like I do understand the AODA in terms of a guideline,

1:32:31but sometimes people experience slopes,

1:32:34they feel the full slope even though we don't consider it

1:32:37because it doesn't hit a point that somebody suggested

1:32:41as something we have to consider.

1:32:42But if we have it, the idea of an inclusive design

1:32:46within all of our designs,

1:32:47a tiny slope could make a large impact with an individual.

1:32:50So just to keep in mind when we're paving something,

1:32:53just to try to find a solution in these tiny pieces

1:32:58to make a more equitable experience for all

1:33:01would be, I think, just a good idea

1:33:04because I'm not having that issue,

1:33:07but I hear somebody is having that issue

1:33:10and it's so easy to be forgotten.

1:33:12And then now that that individual has to think

1:33:16about that all the time, not to speak for others,

1:33:18but I just wanted to re-bring that up

1:33:20and ensure that this is a part of the discussion as well.

1:33:24Kathy, I like you.

1:33:28Okay, I mean, like, see you brought up a really good point.

1:33:35Okay, but, you know, so you're going to tell me

1:33:39for people with mobility issues, that's a selling, okay?

1:33:44Can I use your part like in the summertime?

1:33:51That is, yeah, I mean, what I came across,

1:33:56that's not what I communicated.

1:33:58When we designed space,

1:33:59that's what I'm just saying is because, you know,

1:34:04like, at the end, say, you know, a slight in-kind uptick,

1:34:10I, myself, personally, can feel it, okay?

1:34:16And I mean, you know, people such as myself

1:34:21and I don't know if Kathy has a mobility issue,

1:34:26but it's like people with mobility issues

1:34:29need something to grab on to as they are walking

1:34:34a back-sliding, you know, in-kind.

1:34:40So what do you suggest?

1:34:45I would like to engage with the committee outside of it

1:34:52to have a better understanding of what things we can do.

1:34:56Okay, I think that would be the only thing that I can offer

1:35:00is from our first perspective to meet with members

1:35:04of the AAC, the AAC as a whole.

1:35:07And so we can better understand those lived experiences.

1:35:11All of what we're doing is meets the city's FADM,

1:35:15which I understand is being updated.

1:35:18So the only thing we can do is like learn and understand

1:35:23like how we can make it better

1:35:25and which are the, like, where are the areas

1:35:29that are common?

1:35:30We have 139 kilometers of trail.

1:35:34We don't have railings on 95% of them.

1:35:39So if we need to be putting railings on all of our trails,

1:35:42then we need to start planning for that,

1:35:44but that's not something that we have done.

1:35:48I know the trail that I'm constructing now has a railing

1:35:52because it's a train track,

1:35:54but I just think we need a better understanding

1:35:57and need to lean on our kind of guiding documents

1:36:01on how can we do things better, I think.

1:36:05But what's the answer?

1:36:07Be as slow as you have, it's fall of 2025.

1:36:10Do you have a like that?

1:36:11Like in a few weeks.

1:36:14Okay.

1:36:15So I think-

1:36:18I'll explain the rationale is that we knew we had to bring

1:36:23the project to the AAC,

1:36:26but we had to wait until we got confirmation from Hydro One

1:36:30that they would permit it.

1:36:31And then we were racing against a construction schedule

1:36:34to get it in because we had to use funding this year

1:36:37or we would lose the funding to build it.

1:36:40So I think the fact that it's not just

1:36:42if they're in the city of Guelph,

1:36:43we also have Hydro One involved as well.

1:36:45They're kind of limiting our aids that can help us.

1:36:53But can I maybe get a motion to-

1:36:59Yeah, because it's, I don't know what to do here.

1:37:01What can we do?

1:37:03If somebody want to make a motion,

1:37:04I think all comments are in,

1:37:06so the next step would be for the committee

1:37:08to make a motion of recommendation.

1:37:11So-

1:37:12It's Kat here.

1:37:13What, Kat?

1:37:15Yeah, I've never done this.

1:37:17I despise making motions, but something,

1:37:19if someone wants to put together a motion,

1:37:21just exactly what you had said

1:37:23where we would go back and explore

1:37:26what other accessibility options

1:37:29that can be solutions for the time

1:37:34that we are working with,

1:37:37as well as like exploring it further for future projects.

1:37:42But I think going back and having a conversation

1:37:44is a wonderful idea.

1:37:48We also had a time like that,

1:37:51like next week or right?

1:37:54Sorry, Chair, on the tree, I'm here, can you end up?

1:37:57Yeah, sorry, I agree with what Kat was saying,

1:38:01and I just wanted to add and ask if it was possible,

1:38:05especially with the design of the bench

1:38:08and some of the things raised,

1:38:09would it be possible to get some kind of visual aid

1:38:11so we can really see what is being recommended,

1:38:14like a photo or a diagram?

1:38:21We're working on it,

1:38:22and the opportunity is trying to look like.

1:38:25I will try, I don't even have my own computer

1:38:28because apparently it was a...

1:38:30It's kind of like she yard-hanned up as well, maybe?

1:38:35Yeah, it was just to ask if the idea of creating a motion

1:38:41to look at a concrete bench,

1:38:45sorry, a bench made of the same materials

1:38:47as recommended by the department,

1:38:51if we can look at making a motion

1:38:53to recommend higher arm rests,

1:38:57to make them more accessible for park users.

1:39:03I just didn't know if that would be incorporated

1:39:05in the more fulsome motion that was just been suggested.

1:39:10Do we have a motion to look into

1:39:15the stadium offices, cement, park benches,

1:39:20and look into the height of them?

1:39:22No, sorry, height of the arm rests.

1:39:25Well, to have them incorporate arm rests

1:39:28and then on the concrete.

1:39:30Right, okay.

1:39:32So I can make that motion forward, right?

1:39:34I'd like to put forward a motion

1:39:36that the city of Guelph look into the concrete

1:39:41wood slab benches to incorporate arm rests

1:39:46and aim indicators.

1:39:49At the bottom, there's another piece of wood

1:39:51at the bottom, we said, okay.

1:39:53Can I have someone to second that motion?

1:39:55Can, just before we go to that, sorry, Leanne,

1:39:59I'd appreciate your counsel on this.

1:40:01If the motion is to look into it,

1:40:03are we asking for it to look into it or to do that?

1:40:10Are we making a recommendation to use a bench

1:40:13that has higher, has arm rests and has,

1:40:16and forgive me, what was the other term?

1:40:20Okay, you can move to the next speaker.

1:40:23Thank you, yeah.

1:40:24Is the motion actually not to look into it,

1:40:26but to include those elements into a bench?

1:40:35That would be my recommendation is not to look into it,

1:40:38but to include that,

1:40:41but open to conversation amongst the council

1:40:44or committee, my apologies.

1:40:46But the motion to look into it,

1:40:48well, let us know where there's a valuable option on.

1:40:50And then after that,

1:40:53or whether it's an option or not,

1:40:55it may not be in existence in the city of Welf,

1:41:00which means we'd have to look in game

1:41:01and a mold made and stuff like that.

1:41:03So it's kind of like a step by step.

1:41:06So motion to investigate into it.

1:41:10And then when we get the feedback from that,

1:41:12then the more than the,

1:41:15then there would have to be a motion to,

1:41:18to getting a mold made to incorporate that.

1:41:23Okay, so it's a motion to look into researching those elements

1:41:27and report back to the committee

1:41:29before a bench is created.

1:41:33Correct.

1:41:36Yeah, okay.

1:41:38So what Jen just said,

1:41:40do we have someone that second that

1:41:42we're going to repeat the motion again?

1:41:46It was a really good motion, it was really long ago.

1:41:48Did you get it, Wendy?

1:41:51Yeah, I am working on it, I'm sorry.

1:41:54So I would like to,

1:41:57I would like to repeat the motion

1:41:58is that the accessibility advisory committee

1:42:01recommend the city look into the information

1:42:04and report back to the committee before it,

1:42:09sorry, before it work on the armrest for the benches.

1:42:17It's good.

1:42:18Can you put that up on the screen for us please?

1:42:20Yes, yes.

1:42:21I also sent you a picture of the type of bench.

1:42:26Yeah, okay.

1:42:26So can you give me a sec, Leanne,

1:42:29so that I can type on this, I'm sorry.

1:42:32That's okay, all good.

1:42:34Yeah, we got time today.

1:42:37Yeah.

1:42:40How far is the accessibility,

1:42:43that's a bit of a weird tip,

1:42:45how far is the accessibility,

1:42:46how long is the accessibility?

1:42:47It's only 100 yards.

1:42:49Pretty good.

1:42:57I'm not so used to this, but that for me.

1:43:00Yeah, it's going to go into the motion,

1:43:02what you're saying.

1:43:06I think the only part we threw the motion.

1:43:08Yeah, well, there's having the bench just,

1:43:11I'm tapping the boat.

1:43:13We're breaking into different parts.

1:43:15So right now we're talking about the bench,

1:43:16then we're dealing with the motion on looking

1:43:19to what we do about the grade.

1:43:23Is this motion about the benches?

1:43:25Won't just be about this trail,

1:43:27it'll be a motion that will affect developments

1:43:29down the line.

1:43:30So that's why it's a separate motion.

1:43:33And then we'll do a motion on,

1:43:36we'll see what we do about the monitor for the grade.

1:43:40Now my question, here's a question.

1:43:43When you're walking across a field,

1:43:52that's technically flat,

1:43:56is there a natural grade to a lot of these fields type of thing?

1:44:01Typically 2% between half a percent and 2%.

1:44:05They can't be 0% or water won't move.

1:44:09So they have to be between half a percent and 2%.

1:44:12Is your issue is, especially on ramps,

1:44:17because they're too stiff,

1:44:18because I think they're 15% grade ramps?

1:44:22Maybe, it varies.

1:44:25I don't, you would know about it.

1:44:275% is a ramp.

1:44:29That's considered a ramp in our world,

1:44:32right here at WELF, accessibility-wise,

1:44:34but out there, no, it can be 15 or 12%.

1:44:38Right. Yeah.

1:44:40Because the problem is, is if there's no gradient that's flat,

1:44:44then there's just gonna have to be steps at the bottom

1:44:47or steps at the top to make up that difference.

1:44:53But if this is, if, and I don't know where to measure it,

1:45:02because if it's a 2% grade,

1:45:07which is kind of a natural occurring

1:45:09when you're walking across a field type of thing,

1:45:11that kind of thing you're okay with.

1:45:13But if it gets any more than that,

1:45:14that's what you started your problems?

1:45:17I have problems in my own backyard.

1:45:20Okay. I mean, like, you know,

1:45:25it's like the grass is not left.

1:45:29Yeah. Okay.

1:45:31And I have problems with that too.

1:45:34Well, that's why I was asking whether this 5% grade

1:45:36is kind of more in line with a natural grade

1:45:40that you have way across the lawn

1:45:42or seems to be a little bit steeper

1:45:46than what would be in a class field.

1:45:50It's Kathy.

1:45:52I think that's a really difficult question to ask.

1:45:54Yeah.

1:45:55And this is not in regards to what our natural landscape

1:46:00looks like because it's very difficult

1:46:02for people with disabilities to interact.

1:46:04It's not something that is planned for

1:46:07in terms of the natural,

1:46:08but the city can make arrangements

1:46:10to put that in the design.

1:46:12And I think that's sort of the larger point.

1:46:14I don't think it's easy to make a simple decision

1:46:17and solve all the problems. Absolutely not.

1:46:20But I do think as we have these very difficult conversations,

1:46:23it's important to remember that there can be solutions

1:46:26made within the design in order to...

1:46:32This is what inclusive design is.

1:46:33We're not exactly solving one problem,

1:46:35but finding a solution that could support

1:46:38many different people's intersectionalities

1:46:41is going to make the community more equitable.

1:46:44So I think that's what the idea is,

1:46:47because when we start analyzing each individual

1:46:51with their needs, there's absolutely no way we can solve it,

1:46:54but then we can't ignore an individual's needs.

1:46:56So selecting this data is gonna be really supportive

1:47:00when we have these larger decisions

1:47:02and we have these small solutions to be able to input

1:47:06to develop less barriers with the design

1:47:11that's ultimately going to be a barrier

1:47:12because our world and our systems

1:47:14are not set up equitably to begin with.

1:47:16Right.

1:47:17Well, I think I can see Winnie's creating

1:47:20about the bench that is in question.

1:47:24Just to wonder what we're looking at.

1:47:27So it looks like it's one, two, five, two, my bars, maybe.

1:47:34And so that's like a sign up by hydra.

1:47:37Can we just hold for a minute?

1:47:38Sure.

1:47:39I sent that to Winnie because that uses no nails.

1:47:43Are you sure, Tiffany?

1:47:45It's this one that you're demonstrating

1:47:47because I don't know how do you attach the wood to the one?

1:47:50They have to use non-conductive fasteners for a one-off bench.

1:47:54It's that one?

1:47:54Okay.

1:47:55Yeah, they'll have to use it.

1:47:56I just sent you a new picture.

1:47:57If you can put that up instead.

1:47:59You're the one behind this.

1:47:59I just asked, stop, I sent that photo,

1:48:02like a photo like that, and then the photo like this.

1:48:04And I said, which one do you guys make?

1:48:06And it's the one we just have to discuss.

1:48:08We just have to make them do it with non-conductive fasteners,

1:48:14which is a big thing to see.

1:48:20But that being said, in regards to Cathy's point

1:48:23and Jackie's points, is it better to,

1:48:27like we're not going to be able to solve all of every single

1:48:32problem or issue, but can that be something

1:48:35that we can bring up to be at 8 p.m. to look into?

1:48:41Okay, this is the 8 p.m. right?

1:48:42Yes.

1:48:43Is it something that we can bring up to them

1:48:46to look into something for,

1:48:52to pass up every one might be a hard one,

1:48:54just because it is lacking anything metallic.

1:49:02But for future parks or trails,

1:49:04maybe there is something for that, like Cathy said,

1:49:07and Jackie regarding some type of railing.

1:49:14So that'd be something that we could bring up

1:49:15to maybe the 8 p.m. plan, maybe?

1:49:18Yes.

1:49:19Okay, wait, I have to say that, I don't like.

1:49:21Do I have a motion to bring up the railing

1:49:28to be at 8 p.m. for future trails?

1:49:32That's not a question, let's bring it

1:49:33more of a speaker, Steve Mountain.

1:49:35So I think we have a couple of motions on the floor.

1:49:38We should only have one motion on the side at a time.

1:49:41You got it.

1:49:42Yeah.

1:49:42So the only one he has on the screen,

1:49:45which is a good example of what a motion looks like.

1:49:49So us recommends that the city of Guelph

1:49:53look into the information report back to us

1:49:58before working on the armrest of the benches.

1:50:04Can I get a skip?

1:50:07Sorry, it does say the armrest, okay.

1:50:11Okay.

1:50:12Can't indicate yours.

1:50:13Yeah, on the last part of that,

1:50:14I need you by putting indicators at the bottom of the bench,

1:50:19or sorry, the bottom front.

1:50:21Yeah, and we have a spec for that,

1:50:2326 and a half inches off the ground,

1:50:27which the bench will probably meet

1:50:31that 26 and a half inches off the ground for cane detection.

1:50:35Oh, I see what you're saying, okay.

1:50:38Okay.

1:50:38Oh, no, okay.

1:50:43I just wondered too about the,

1:50:45if there's clarity needed in the words,

1:50:48look into the information,

1:50:51if we need more specificity there,

1:50:55like the height of the armrest type of thing.

1:50:58How about we say the specs, specifications?

1:51:03Yeah.

1:51:10Is it okay?

1:51:12Okay, go ahead next.

1:51:14How long is the specific?

1:51:15Yeah, the armrest and cane guiding specifications.

1:51:20Okay, sorry.

1:51:24Give me a second.

1:51:25No, not at all, it's collaboration.

1:51:26Should we put something like regarding the specifications,

1:51:28like the height of the armrest or his specs good enough?

1:51:36Say that again.

1:51:36Yeah, when I got these regarding the specs and locations,

1:51:42do we put like actually height of the armrest,

1:51:46or is it just like overall specs?

1:51:51Armrest and cane guide specifications,

1:51:54that will give you the height,

1:51:56but yeah, like when he's adding in there,

1:51:58if you guys wanna be that specific with emotion, do it.

1:52:02Like if that's what you're wanting to know,

1:52:04cause we can give you specifications,

1:52:05but we might miss a specific specification

1:52:08that you're really looking for.

1:52:09So yeah, tell us what you're wanting.

1:52:12Does everyone agree with the motion that's on Wendy's,

1:52:16or the motion that's on the screen?

1:52:20Recording the wording of that motion?

1:52:24Yes, yes.

1:52:25Does anybody need to read it again?

1:52:26Go ahead and read it yet.

1:52:27Do you want me to read it out?

1:52:30Yes, please.

1:52:32I don't need water.

1:52:33Okay, so that the accessibility advisory committee

1:52:37recommends the city look into the armrest

1:52:40and the cane guiding specifications.

1:52:43Example, the height of the armrests

1:52:45can report back to the committee, sorry, committee,

1:52:48before working on the armrest of the benches.

1:52:51Or how about before producing the benches?

1:52:54Yes, before, like Lee and so,

1:52:57before producing the benches.

1:53:01How many benches are gonna be there?

1:53:02That's just fine.

1:53:03The bench, the bench.

1:53:08Just one bench.

1:53:10Cause it's only in one place that we need to do this

1:53:12because all the other benches can have metal

1:53:14and half all they have is art right,

1:53:16and everything we need.

1:53:17Yeah, this is just a one off.

1:53:19I have a motion to approve the first motion.

1:53:29What's the wording of that?

1:53:30Can I get a motion?

1:53:32No, can I get approval for that motion?

1:53:35Oh, we would leave.

1:53:35It's Jen.

1:53:38Jen will be the mover, I think, right?

1:53:40Oh, Jen, sorry, go ahead.

1:53:41Yeah, yeah.

1:53:42Can I get a seconder?

1:53:44Oh, second it.

1:53:45P.

1:53:49And then.

1:53:50We need to vote for the motion.

1:53:52Does anyone, yes, right, thank you.

1:53:54I'm gonna get this one there.

1:53:55Does anyone oppose of that motion?

1:54:01And since hearing no nays, motion has been passed.

1:54:07Yes.

1:54:08Okay.

1:54:08Do we look into the second?

1:54:13The, are we resting?

1:54:15The second part was the slope.

1:54:18The slope, right, okay.

1:54:19How are we going to do that?

1:54:26Because the slope is needed to get

1:54:28from one height to the other.

1:54:31So we don't, if you make it flat,

1:54:33then there's either gonna be stairs at the beginning

1:54:36to get up to make a flat across or stairs at the end

1:54:41to go up to that point.

1:54:44So I don't think there's any way to get around the slope,

1:54:47but it would be possible to do railing,

1:54:54wooden railing with wooden pegs.

1:54:58Like how the, as I call it,

1:55:00mid-nit technology.

1:55:01Right, yeah.

1:55:02Right, that way you get around the,

1:55:05the metal aspect.

1:55:10Can we make a motion to have this city

1:55:16look into wooden rails?

1:55:22Wooden railings?

1:55:23I think it's a hard one to,

1:55:25for a OSD team.

1:55:26Good time.

1:55:30I would suggest it would be a question for the F-8N

1:55:37rather than this construction.

1:55:39Yeah, this project.

1:55:41Yeah.

1:55:43The other concern that I would have about putting railings

1:55:47along all trails is the perceived safety

1:55:55of having channelized,

1:55:57like people channelized and like if there's a hazard

1:56:02or a person, the feeling of not being able to get away easily

1:56:07would be a concern.

1:56:09Encyclists.

1:56:10Encyclists.

1:56:11It gets out of a, to a cyclist running into a bench.

1:56:15So they try to keep a clearance on both sides of all trails.

1:56:19Right.

1:56:20Just because for, you have multiple use.

1:56:23Like your mud walkers.

1:56:24There's multiple multi-use and it could run in

1:56:27and injure a spleen or something like that, right?

1:56:30Like there's, that's a very good possibility

1:56:33that would happen.

1:56:33And like Tiffany said,

1:56:34because this is a little bit of a time restraint,

1:56:37is there maybe we can set a motion to bring it to the F-8N?

1:56:41To look into future trails?

1:56:47Chirinoliterations.

1:56:49Yes.

1:56:50Sorry, did you get that, Whitney?

1:56:56Would you mind repeat it again

1:56:58because it's on and off a lot of the noises behind.

1:57:00I'm sorry.

1:57:02We're going to see if we can make a motion

1:57:05to have this brought to the F-8N

1:57:11to look into future,

1:57:17how future railings along trails.

1:57:20But that, does that sound good, Jackie?

1:57:22Like what we're needing to want to see in that?

1:57:27Just with railings, okay.

1:57:30But I don't want them like really wide.

1:57:35The railing tops and all wide.

1:57:38They have narrow, for times, too narrow.

1:57:43So you can rip it.

1:57:44Yeah, exactly.

1:57:46The F-8N has a detail of what that's,

1:57:50what my group is.

1:57:51Like we got you to come start from there.

1:57:52I'm going to go up here.

1:57:55Up here.

1:57:56That's all I'm going to do.

1:57:58Please, mind Whitney's screen.

1:58:04But then Chirinoliterations, I think too further.

1:58:07We'll just wait for that.

1:58:08So it says that the Accessibility Advisory Committee

1:58:10recommends the city bring up to the F-8N

1:58:16to look into the future railings along trails.

1:58:22So.

1:58:23Or grip, like more support, stability.

1:58:27Like do we need to be that split?

1:58:29It's good to say why.

1:58:30Yeah, right.

1:58:31Like for, for,

1:58:34or to increase the ability of.

1:58:37Yeah, for increasing the stability or ability to,

1:58:46grip.

1:58:47Kathy, what, what, what are your thoughts on how we can make

1:58:51it specific sounding?

1:58:56I'm just learning this as well.

1:58:58I'm so sorry.

1:58:59I just kind of wanted to make sure that we advocated

1:59:01for that point.

1:59:02And I know we have that time restraint.

1:59:05And honestly, I didn't have like a set solution for this.

1:59:09So I think just, I don't know if it's broad or if I'm stumped

1:59:13or it's not the right space for this.

1:59:16So I do apologize.

1:59:17Cause I don't know how to articulate it more specifically

1:59:20in this case.

1:59:21And this is kind of what I'm sort of learning as well.

1:59:25Do we want, because we're past five o'clock

1:59:28and we should have made a motion to go past five o'clock.

1:59:31So.

1:59:32Actually, we know, we know need to,

1:59:33we know need to make a motion to get passed by a five o'clock

1:59:38because according to procedural values,

1:59:40we know need to do that.

1:59:41So as long as we have quorum, it will be fine.

1:59:45Okay. Yep.

1:59:46Do you want to move this motion to the October meeting

1:59:52for further discussion?

1:59:54Cause it seems like there's different perspectives yet

1:59:56that we have not fully investigated.

1:59:59That's a recommendation just from,

2:00:01you don't have to take it.

2:00:02You can do it.

2:00:02I agree, Dan.

2:00:04Yeah. I think that's a good idea.

2:00:07I think that the in my own same age.

2:00:10Good.

2:00:11So we don't need the left screen then?

2:00:14So the left screen would be that

2:00:16move all the way to the blue.

2:00:17That the accessibility advisory committee

2:00:20defer this, the item of

2:00:25slopes and railings on trails to the October 2000,

2:00:322026, 2025 meeting.

2:00:36I've had a day.

2:00:37I've had a day.

2:00:39So I'll go off.

2:00:42So is everyone okay with

2:00:47first you need someone to move the motion.

2:00:49Is someone like to move this motion?

2:00:52I'll move it.

2:00:53Jackie,

2:00:54and then we have someone who will second it.

2:00:57It's Cheryl.

2:00:58Oh, sorry.

2:01:00Yeah, Cheryl.

2:01:01Okay. Perfect.

2:01:02And anyone opposed of the motion to move

2:01:05this conversation to next month?

2:01:08This meeting.

2:01:10Hearing nine.

2:01:12I'm gonna say we're good to go for that.

2:01:19That's it.

2:01:20I think for this topic.

2:01:20So motion to adjourn.

2:01:22Do we have a motion to adjourn

2:01:24for this September 16th meeting?

2:01:30That can be.

2:01:31It can have a second.

2:01:32If we for a first or first.

2:01:34So do we ask first?

2:01:35Do we actually ask first?

2:01:36There are questions about doing the trail.

2:01:43Talk about other things around it,

2:01:45but actually approving the grade.

2:01:47We didn't really answer that.

2:01:50My recommended motion was that you support

2:01:52the design of the trail,

2:01:56but you didn't provide any.

2:01:58So I guess not.

2:02:00I had one.

2:02:00Yeah.

2:02:03Yeah, me.

2:02:06So yeah,

2:02:07so we still haven't dealt with her initial motion

2:02:09that she brought here.

2:02:11First, we just a recommended motion.

2:02:13Right.

2:02:14Like maybe can do whatever they like with it.

2:02:16Oh, yeah.

2:02:17Yeah.

2:02:18Yeah.

2:02:19So just a recommended motion.

2:02:22Recommended motion.

2:02:24It's just a recommended motion.

2:02:26She's not part of the committee.

2:02:27She can't make a motion.

2:02:28Staff just make a motion to help guide

2:02:32what they would need to move forward.

2:02:34But in this case, she's engaged the committee on this.

2:02:37The committee has decided to talk about this further

2:02:40in October.

2:02:42And it's more of a FADM conversation,

2:02:45but it looks at it.

2:02:47So should we not have them here?

2:02:51So I think we just got started.

2:02:54The FADM?

2:02:55Yeah, it's me.

2:02:56Oh, welcome to that.

2:02:57It's no worries.

2:02:58You're welcome.

2:02:59It says me, no worries.

2:03:01Sorry.

2:03:03Do you think I also,

2:03:05so Leigh and you're probably more of an expert on this,

2:03:08but I think the AODA and the FADM legislation

2:03:11is I just have to bring the topic.

2:03:16With the AODA, you have to bring the topic to the AAC.

2:03:19If you want comfort,

2:03:21maybe the committee would add something in that motion

2:03:25that it would give you information.

2:03:29Well, I would have it more like

2:03:32that they have that discussion in October

2:03:35to begin discussing the FADM or something like that.

2:03:40So it's pointed at the FADM.

2:03:41The committee is pointed at the FADM rather than your project.

2:03:45If that's what the committee wants,

2:03:48keeping in mind, Tiffany's project is a small connector trail.

2:03:53It's only 100 meters.

2:03:56It's like the smallest trail I've ever built.

2:03:58We've never,

2:03:59I don't know of any other trail we have that's this short.

2:04:03Usually we build new trails that are like a kilometer

2:04:06or 500 meters or, you know.

2:04:09So, I think, sorry, I just, I agree with that.

2:04:13I think that's a great start.

2:04:15And I think that there's a time crunch on this piece.

2:04:18And thank you for having the conversation.

2:04:23And if we made a motion to bring that conversation to October,

2:04:30I suppose, I guess this is a question that we do approve this

2:04:34and then ensure that we continue for future projects

2:04:39or just bring the conversation for future projects.

2:04:44And that would be the one that Winnie had on the screen, right?

2:04:46Like bringing it to the FADM.

2:04:49Yeah.

2:04:50So can we have a friendly amendment to that one, Winnie?

2:04:56Yeah, sure.

2:04:57Give me a sec.

2:05:04OK, we might say again, sorry.

2:05:08Well, he said that very well.

2:05:10That.

2:05:13Related to future projects.

2:05:18And not that one, isn't it?

2:05:19Although, no, it's not one.

2:05:22Slopes and randlings along trails to October, 2025,

2:05:26meaning to discuss.

2:05:31Future.

2:05:33Yeah.

2:05:33For future.

2:05:34Thinking for future.

2:05:36Trail development.

2:05:36Yeah.

2:05:38That's for future.

2:05:39As long as trials and trials are for future trail development,

2:05:46take and out.

2:05:47Yeah, thank you.

2:05:50Awesome.

2:05:51Do I still need to get that motion, even though we already motion?

2:05:55You need a motion now for the second part.

2:05:57OK, yeah.

2:05:59Can I get a motion to like to amend or to approve the amended motion?

2:06:08I'll be in.

2:06:09All right.

2:06:10Can I have someone second it?

2:06:13Yeah.

2:06:15Second your all second.

2:06:18Dean Scott.

2:06:18OK, and are there anyone opposed to the amended motion?

2:06:25Hearing no objections, I think the motion is passed.

2:06:31Now, do I also have to motion to go away?

2:06:35So I'm sure.

2:06:36Oh, yes.

2:06:37Yeah.

2:06:38So I have.

2:06:42Oh, yeah, motion to adjourn.

2:06:46Anyone can.

2:06:47Jackie, I did that motion to adjourn.

2:06:48Any kind of a seconder?

2:06:52The seconder.

2:06:53It's Cheryl.

2:06:54All second.

2:06:55Oh, sorry.

2:06:56No, nobody wants.

2:06:57So that's great.

2:06:58Carol seconded.

2:06:59If anyone opposed, I'm leaving now for a amend the ending.

2:07:04That word.

2:07:07Hearing none, I think motion adjourned.

2:07:10But I should mention that our next meeting is on October 21st at 3 p.m.

2:07:19Can I just say that this the development of the motion as we move through this meeting?

2:07:28The way that it progressed was amazing.

2:07:31I don't know if anybody I got chills thinking about it.

2:07:36If anybody wants to watch the meeting again, you'll see that you guys were,

2:07:43you know, it was a real stumble and then you move forward and like you guys got that down

2:07:48in that last motion so well.

2:07:51I just I'm so proud of you guys.

2:07:54You did really well.

2:07:55That's on record, right?

2:07:56So it's so recorded.

2:07:57All right, good.

2:08:00So I think we're good.

2:08:01So thank you.

2:08:02Yes, yes, very good.

2:08:04And I just want to say I agree with Leanne fantastic.

2:08:07You know, you guys, yeah, everyone.

2:08:09Yeah, it was good.

2:08:10I think thank you.

2:08:12Thank you, everyone.

2:08:14I don't know.

2:08:14They.

2:08:15Thanks everyone.

2:08:18Have a good evening, everybody.

2:08:19Bye, Woody.

2:08:20Thanks for your help.

2:08:25So is everyone maybe is everyone like brand new or some to returning to returning?

2:08:33OK, I wasn't sure.

2:08:34And to to from the last three, three will be here the next.