Heritage Guelph

1:15Sure, I still let you know that there are official regrets from member would and chair. So just to let you know, and we are still waiting for the 1 1 member on form.

2:17Okay, thank you have until 1215 just to establish form, but we will keep you posted.

2:23Okay, thanks.

3:41Oh, yeah, I'm sorry.

4:07Yeah, yeah.

4:31Right here, so we have all 4 members here now still pending some joining. We do have quorum so you can get started whenever you are ready.

4:46Okay, thank you so much.

4:48Good afternoon, everyone. I'd like to call the order at the February 20 workshop meeting of heritage.

4:54Welcome to many members staff and invited guests who are attending this meeting as we gather.

5:00Let us take time to reflect on our privilege to live and working well. The city built over rich and just histories.

5:06We are guests here and we should reflect upon the responsibility to care for this land and the people who live here today and the generations to come.

5:14If our actions today can move us towards reconciliation, we should take pause and make those decisions with intention and gratitude.

5:22This place because wealth has served as a traditional lands in the place of refuge for many peoples over time.

5:28More specifically, the Adironduron in the whole nation.

5:33This land is held as the treaty land in the territory of the Mississauga's of the credit first nation.

5:38Guelph lies directly adjacent to the Holman tract and is part of the long established traditional hunting ground for the 6 nations of the Grand River.

5:47Many first nations, Inuit and Métis people who have come across Turtle Island called Guelph home today.

5:56Many members before we begin, are there any disclosures of pecuniary interest?

6:00If so, please raise your hand.

6:03Okay, I don't see any hands.

6:06I have received regret today from Chair Sarah and members of Wood.

6:14So now we will move into the first workshop that we have today, which is item 2.1.

6:20The downtown Guelph Heritage Conservation District and Guidelines workshop, facilitated by Rebecca and Christina from ASI.

6:33Share my screen here.

6:44Great. Good afternoon everyone.

6:47It's been a while since I've been actually in person giving a meeting and presentations.

6:53I just want to check is my voice audible to everyone and for birthday.

6:59Okay, well, great to see you all again.

7:02I'm Rebecca Sherra from ASI and I'm with Christina Martins from ASI today.

7:10And we also have Elizabeth with us today.

7:12And Chuck who is our ACO next gen job shadow for today.

7:22You are all probably familiar with the program and runs during Heritage Week.

7:25So she's joining us today to job shadow.

7:28So great opportunity.

7:30So thank you for having us.

7:32Next slide, Chuck.

7:35So we're going to walk through a presentation around 35 minutes focused on the downtown

7:43heritage downtown Guelph Heritage Conservation District plan.

7:47I'm going to provide some background that's where we've been through the study phase and how far we've gotten into the plan phase.

7:56And then Christina will bring us through some more overview of findings and results.

8:07Sorry.

8:08Oh, are we on a timer?

8:10Yes.

8:11Okay.

8:13So yeah, we just pause here and then we'll come back to me and we'll talk a bit about

8:18heritage permits and what that means as part of the plan stage.

8:21And then we've got time for discussion amongst members at the end.

8:27And then I think we're going to break take about a 10 minute break and then we're going to reconvene for the Ward West workshop.

8:34So that's our agenda for our time together.

8:39And we're expecting to spend roughly our time split half and half between the downtown

8:49conservation district plan and then the Ward West Heritage Conservation District study.

8:55So to start off, just recap.

8:57So we've been working on the heritage conservation district plan in the downtown.

9:03So what is the heritage conservation district?

9:05So I think we're all very familiar with what's trying to be put into place in the downtown.

9:12So a district would protect significant buildings and landscape features and really create a heritage

9:18sensitive plan for the city to guide future development in the area.

9:23Next.

9:26So as many of you will remember, the study phase was completed between June 2023 and wrapped up in

9:33September 2024.

9:37And the study phase was really focused on a lot of research analysis,

9:42consulting archives and preparing a lot of history, surveying individual buildings and

9:49streetscapes and a lot of engagement with various groups and individuals.

9:55And it was really the technical phase of work that was focused on answering the question,

10:00does this area meet the criteria for designation as a heritage conservation district?

10:05There are specific criteria that do need to be met under the Ontario Heritage Act.

10:10So that work resulted in a yes to that question.

10:14It does meet the criteria and through all of the analytical work and engagement,

10:21a specific boundary was recommended for a conservation district in the downtown.

10:26The results of all that work are available on the city's website at 12.cba.

10:31Next.

10:34So we wanted to just recap a bit of what happened in terms of engagement during the study phase

10:43and will sort of bring us through to where we are today in terms of engagement.

10:48So during the study phase, there were public open houses.

10:51One on October 18th, one on February 20th, information was also posted on the city's

10:57Hector State page, including online surveys.

11:00So a range of different techniques were used during the study to try to engage

11:07a range of different individuals in different ways to share information but also collect feedback.

11:15So public notices were mailed to all addresses and property owners in the HCD

11:20about the project and about any of these events.

11:23And all notices were posted on the city's social media channels and the city's website.

11:31Next.

11:35In addition to those broad based engagement events and outreach strategies,

11:42series of small group meetings were also held to with the Heritage Rock.

11:50Guelph committee and for the project, the focus group was also developed

12:03and convened by the city to help advise on various technical aspects of the study phase.

12:09Two meetings were held with the focus group for the downtown and then there was one meeting

12:14with the downtown Guelph Business Association.

12:17And just as the city team here is working on the slide, I apologize.

12:29I'll just pause for a second.

12:31There was one.

12:35There was a little shit.

12:57I think we're in business.

13:01Just trying to keep Jack on his toes today.

13:03Thanks for your patience everyone.

13:04So if we can go to the Indigenous engagement slide.

13:08So then in addition to the small group meetings and the public meetings,

13:14there was also a separate and direct process for engaging with Indigenous communities,

13:21particularly Mississauga, so the Credit First Nation and Six Nations of the Grand River.

13:27And the focus there really focused on the nations providing their own histories to

13:36include in the study as well as provision of feedback on the boundary that was being

13:42recommended during the study phase for a district.

13:53So we wanted to again just recap some of the feedback that we heard during the study phase

14:00of the Gopen House around the district to remind everyone kind of what some of the

14:06recurring themes were and also just to characterize the pulse of what we were hearing

14:14at those engagement events.

14:15So we heard a lot of really good feedback from participants at the public open house

14:21that they liked how the heritage values of the downtown were being described.

14:28And also the specific kinds of either features or qualities or characteristics in the downtown

14:35that were important to telling the important stories in the downtown that give Guelph a

14:40distinct and unique sense of place.

14:44When at the end of the study phase where we presented a lot of the results of specific

14:49attributes that are important to conserve, we heard a lot of affirmation from participants

14:56that those were the right kinds of features to zero in on and that those are really the

15:01character defining qualities of the downtown that would benefit from a focused heritage

15:08sensitive planning framework moving forward.

15:11Thanks.

15:14So in terms of the at the end of the study phase public open house, there were a couple

15:20actions that were resulting at the end of that process based on some of the feedback we heard.

15:26So I think some of the members here will remember that we got some really

15:33important feedback at the public open house around boundary and there were some refinements that were

15:40made to respond to that feedback.

15:45The boundary was extended north and south to include some key features that we understood

15:53relate to the significance of the downtown's history.

15:56Key features like the five points intersection and the farmers market speed river itself was

16:01included in the district for its relationship to the downtown.

16:06And there was also some refinement to the description of cultural heritage values

16:11and heritage attributes to include specific name places in the downtown.

16:17So a lot of really excellent feedback generally supportive coming out of the study phase.

16:26So that all culminated in bringing forward the study to council on September 4th,

16:322024. And the study presented the results which was that the area meets the criteria for designation

16:41and presented this boundary that you see here as the area that's recommended to proceed to

16:46preparation of a heritage conservation district plan, which is a related but separate and

16:52distinct process, which is sort of the next process that will bring the city

16:57closer to implementing a district in this area. Next.

17:04So after that presentation to council in September and their endorsement of the recommendations of

17:12yes please proceed to begin preparing the heritage conservation district plan, we then

17:19began the conservation district plan phase of the project. So just a really quick overview of kind

17:26of the key, key ingredients of a heritage conservation district plan. So the Heritage Act

17:32sets out what needs to be in a conservation district plan. We don't sort of make it up or

17:37determine it. And it's really a kind of five part piece. A district plan needs to describe what's

17:44valued about the place. So that's a statement of districts. The plan needs to describe the vision

17:49for change in the district. Not all visions for change are identical or particularly equal

17:57between different places. So that's sort of high level vision objectives.

18:02The plan also presents a heritage permit system. So presents a process for what changes in the

18:09district would require a heritage permit. And then the plan also specifically presents

18:15actual policies and guidelines. So policies direct how change will happen in the district and

18:23and are kind of very similar to like official plan policies or secondary plan policies in their

18:28language. And then there are also guidelines which are content and material that helps support

18:36implementation of the policies. They provide practical guidance and recommendations on how

18:40to actually do what the policy is directing. And guidelines are more kind of like advisory

18:50or use language like should. They're not mandatory but instead a kind of demonstration of how one

18:58would put a policy into practice. Next. So we've been advancing work on all five of those pieces

19:07since the fall. So just to drill down a little bit more into what to expect out of the work

19:14that's been ongoing. So the plan will describe the heritage values of the downtown. It will

19:20define the objectives for the area. It will provide policies and guidelines and then provide

19:27direction for changes that require a heritage permit. So it's it is really on the implementation

19:33side of things. The study is really about understanding the place and then and then the

19:37plan is really about okay well how are you going to guide change in in this district. Next.

19:48So the plan has a series of engagement events. The first key one being a public open house that

19:56was held on January 29th. And I'll provide a brief summary of that event. We're here today

20:04with Heritage Guelph. We have a focus group meeting next week as well as meeting with the

20:09Downtown Guelph Business Association. And then we sort of come back to our work after at the end

20:16of February and refine it further based on on the engagement we're doing right now.

20:21And and refine the work further and then come back to share the results of work at a public

20:28open house in April. And then we expect that there will be some further refinement to to the work

20:37following that that public open house. And then we'll be meeting with Heritage Guelph again in

20:41June. Focus group again in June and the Guelph Business Association in June. And then all of that

20:47sort of culminating in a statutory public meeting that's intended to be held right before the summer

20:55that would present the the contents of of the district plan. Some of which will will already

21:03be previewed in in April. And some of which you'll be seeing here in the rest of this presentation

21:11as well as some of which was shared at the public open house. Next. So the the open house that we

21:19had at the end of January was really great. We had it here. We had for a really cold Wednesday

21:25night in January. The attendance was was really great. We had a study stream of people through the

21:30night. A range of individuals who live, work, shop, play in in the downtown. Some recurring questions

21:43that were coming in were really focused on kind of the mechanics of a district. So a lot of questions

21:50about you know what kinds of changes require permits and how are permits approved? Who's

21:59who are the decision makers as its staff? What's the role of heritage committee? Does council have

22:04to approve everything? Or there's some kinds of changes that are sort of routinely approved?

22:09There are also a lot of questions about financial incentives that the city is planning

22:17what or questions about whether the city is planning to to develop new financial incentives to

22:24support implementation of the plan. And then there were some some further kind of process

22:32driven questions individuals had sort of wondering about how some of the other city

22:40were going on in the downtown like the community planning permit system work or the downtown

22:46revitalization work integrates with the conservation district plan or how like a

22:56heritage permit process would work alongside other permitting processes that the city is currently

23:03looking at streamlining. We also asked participants to share with us what they see as advantages

23:09of a district in the downtown as well as challenges so we can understand kind of where

23:15the the opportunities what are some of the concerns and then how can we try to work through those.

23:23Next so with that that sort of I think gives you a good recap of sort of where we've been through

23:33the study the core components of the now district plan phase that we're in

23:40as well as some of what we've been hearing through the engagement process and I'm going to turn it

23:46over to Christina Martins to bring us through the statement of significance highlights and then

23:54the results of some of the other work that we've been advancing during the district plan phase.

24:00Thanks Rebecca. Hi everyone it's good to see you again. So the statement of significance is

24:08quite lengthy so this really is high level highlights that I'll be sharing. Let's just go to

24:13the next slide Jack. We've been sharing at the pick sort of the purpose of a statement of district

24:20significance. You'll be very familiar with just statements of significance for part four properties

24:29that you spend time with in your role. The statement of district significance for

24:37a heritage district is quite similar so it's the same structure with the description of the place

24:45description of the values and then a list of heritage attributes that express those values.

24:54We shared at the pick with people who attended to the purpose of a statement of significance

25:00to help people understand how that fits within the plan. So it's really a tool to help anyone

25:08interacting with the plan so property owners, councils, your committee and municipal staff

25:14make informed decisions about alterations to the district and it sets the stage for the

25:21kinds of policies and guidelines that are embedded within the plan. Just go to the next slide.

25:28So I'll walk through four highlights from the statement. So one key piece of the value of

25:38this place is about its location on the Speed River. The river has meaning to Indigenous peoples

25:44and is a distinguishing feature of the downtown. So we heard from through our Indigenous consultation

25:50that the river was a key piece to include and our analysis really drew out that the reason for

25:57such a unique radial plan being laid out in Guelph relates to the situation on the bend,

26:04the Speed River and that idea around maximizing lock frontages along the river. So the Speed River

26:11is the beginning of everything that happens in this area. The HCD has a well-preserved collection

26:23of features that are made up by the street layout. So the radial plan in particular is what's focused

26:30on in the district. So in particular, the boundary as it is proceeding in the plan captures that full

26:42five streets of the original street layout and their full radial length as well as the starting

26:52point at the bend in the river. The lotting patterns that occur because of those triangular

26:57blocks. So it's quite a regular lotting pattern. In some cases, particularly around the original

27:05market square, those locks sort of have fronts and backs that are highly visible and have taken on

27:13different approaches to how buildings have responded to that situation. And as well, the

27:18lotting pattern has in triangular blocks ended up with buildings that respond to their corner

27:24locations, take bends, have chamfered corners. And so everything's kind of grappling with how do we

27:33lay out and maximize building within this interesting street layout pattern. The district also has a

27:43collection of streetscapes, views and landscape features. So things like within the streetscape,

27:50the very consistent use of stone, consistent cornice lines, consistent dates of buildings

28:00that together create this collection of features. And we've identified several views that are

28:06contained within the district, one of which is along Wyndham, another to St. George's Church,

28:17and then landscape features such as the various squares and a kind of evolution of market square

28:24over time. Next slide. So the historical fabric in the downtown reflects how the area grew and

28:36evolved, particularly between 1856 and 1935. So 1856 is when the Grand Trunk Railway comes.

28:47It changes the trajectory of buildings and the location of buildings pushing the downtown

28:55north of the tracks. It was distributed along Wyndham in a different way prior to that.

29:03And the railway pushes it northwards and of course changes the way market square operates,

29:10though markets square remains a place of civic and institutional buildings even today.

29:16And this evolution we see as extending through to 1935 and of course the downtown has continued to

29:25evolve in the intervening almost 100 years. But we see that as like the concentration of

29:34when changes occurring that will be particularly focused on conserving within the district plan.

29:42And 1935 marks the construction of the Dominion Public Building, which is the last cut limestone

29:49building. So it kind of bookends these like qualities that are very unique to Guelph.

30:01The district has an impressive collection and concentration of 19th and early 20th features

30:07and all of these things together express design, historical and contextual values.

30:14So moving from the statement of significance, just go to the next slide.

30:19The next key piece of work that we've been advancing as part of the plan is the statement

30:25of objectives. So a draft statement of objectives was put forward in the HCD study. We

30:32had discussion at the second public open house with the community about objectives as well as with

30:39the working group early on to start to understand what kind of district this can be. And because

30:48districts can take a range of approaches towards conservation and development and the spectrum

30:55of what's possible in between. So it really the statement of objectives is about describing the

31:03community's goals and hopes for the future of the district. So while the statement of significance

31:09looks at what's valued from the past, the objectives is that forward looking piece that

31:14provides guidance to what types of policies to put in place. Next. So overall the objectives

31:24are focused on the idea of conservation and growth. So how do we start to balance the

31:31conservation of existing buildings, streetscapes, parks and public spaces with the anticipated

31:37growth, which will bring new development to the downtown in the coming years. So we understand

31:43that growth is going to happen in downtown. So how do we shape that in a way that has conservation

31:51of key features in mind? Growth can be very positive. It has the potential to reinvigorate

31:57and enhance the downtown and its heritage fabric. We heard from a lot of people that they wanted to

32:03see more people living, working, enjoying downtown, it being a tourist destination.

32:11So the downtown heritage fabric has an opportunity to anchor new development

32:16and maintain the area's ambience as a historical destination. Next. So the types of feedback that

32:23we've received on the objectives are agreement that the wealth should protect and enhance heritage

32:30properties in the public realm and private realm, including adaptive reusing buildings.

32:37Like I said, participants wanted to see the district draw people downtown and attract tourism.

32:45And participants raised a desire for programs such as funding incentives, no additional taxes,

32:52making insurance easier for owners and having district information easy to find. So these are

32:57all very common concerns or points that we hear raised through the heritage conservation district

33:05process. So the overall objective of the HCD aims to protect, conserve and manage the heritage

33:16attributes and contributing properties in the context of prescribed and anticipated future

33:21growth of the area so that the district's cultural heritage value is protected in the long term.

33:28Next. And then from this overall objective, we have several objectives that drop down from that

33:35and further describe what we see as sort of the future of downtown. So it's a place that's celebrated

33:46and maintained. It's a place that reinforces and conserves the district's built forms, streetscape,

33:54public squares, materiality and character. There are guidelines for compatible new development

34:01and infill in the district so people understand how they can add new features to the area.

34:10Within the plan, there'll be a review of existing and encourage the development of new

34:17incentives to tourism programs. There'll be active participation from the city in the promotion

34:23and implementation of the HCD and that the HCD will support the ongoing use, adaptability of

34:31existing buildings. Accessibility has been a key theme that's been drawn out in particular by the

34:37focus group as being important to the downtown and then promoting opportunities for revitalizing

34:45the historical squares and open spaces. So contributing and non-contributing properties

34:55drill down into a very specific portion of the plan but it helps to answer a lot of questions

35:02for property owners. So we know that not all buildings within a district are of the same quality

35:11or contribute in a meaningful, valuable way to the district's overall value or they may not have

35:24attributes that demonstrate the values of the district. So within the plan, under part five of

35:31the act, all properties within the district will have a bylaw registered on title. So they're all

35:37treated equally that way but within the plan properties are sorted into these two categories

35:43contributing and non-contributing. So contributing properties are those that capture historical

35:53features that are important to conserve and the plan anticipates that these properties will be

35:59stewarded as the area grows and change so that they're there for the long run and then those

36:06properties would have specific conservation policies and guidelines within the HCD plan.

36:12So it's about how do we conserve these buildings and how maintain them over time.

36:18For properties that are non-contributing they are sites that don't have envisioned

36:24conservation of extent features so they can have more change over time than those that are contributing.

36:33So for example, they could be parking lots or recently constructed buildings that don't contribute

36:39to the heritage qualities of the district. So the plan anticipates that these properties will

36:45be redeveloped and provides policies and guidance for reducing new development on these sites so

36:50that they're complementary to the district. The next slide. So we're at a stage where we've defined

37:00how we're categorizing the properties into contributing and non-contributing properties

37:05and we're working through the process of assigning these definitions to each of the properties. So

37:11when we go to the public next we'll be bringing them specific mapping but for now we have definitions

37:19in place that I'll share with you. So a contributing property in downtown Guelph will have been built

37:25during the period of significance so as early as 1827 when the plan, radial plan was laid out,

37:32to that 1935 date where we see a shift in the change in architecture.

37:39And the property should contain sufficient evidence to effectively express the district's

37:48values. So it's possible that there might be a property that dates to within the period of

37:53significance but the integrity of it is so low that it no longer expresses the cultural heritage

37:59value and that would push it into a non-contributing property. So conservation policies and guidelines

38:07would apply when making alterations to these contributing properties. Next slide. So a non-

38:14contributing property will have been developed outside of the period of significance or it's

38:20something that is of lower integrity and doesn't have enough evidence to express the cultural

38:26heritage values of the district. So policies and guidelines for non-contributing properties

38:33would address additions to those properties, alterations or demolition that would include

38:39new development and infill. I'll turn it back to Rebecca to take us through this last portion

38:49of the pieces that we've been advancing in which is the heritage permit system.

38:53Great. Thanks, Christiane. Jack, can you advance to the next slide? So we wanted to spend just a

39:00bit of time talking through what, why heritage permit system, what does it look like in wealth

39:10and I know all of you are very familiar with it but in the context of this age CD, how it

39:17could be structured and then talk through some sort of frequently asked questions because this

39:21is always where like the district becomes very real for everyone on all sides of the table,

39:27property owners, staff, heritage committee of like what requires a permit, what doesn't,

39:33what does that mean in terms of time, cost for everyone involved. So it's a requirement first

39:39off of the Ontario Heritage Act that heritage permits are required to guide major changes

39:47in a district. So things like construction of new buildings or structures or things like

39:53demolition or removal of heritage attributes or demolition or removal of entire buildings

39:59or structures. So again, it's not a process that us as the consultants or the city is creating but

40:07it's a requirement that exists in the act that if a city is going to put a district into place,

40:14there needs to be a way to actually implement it and the permit system is the way to actually ensure

40:21that it is being implemented. The act though gives municipalities, enables municipalities to find

40:31the types of minor alterations to the property that would not require a permit. So the idea under

40:38the Ontario Heritage Act is as a municipality, you need a system to implement and enforce this

40:43district if you're going to, if you're going to put that obligation on property owners but also

40:48you do have some latitude to create a permit system that works for you in your municipality

40:55in the particular place that you are conserving. Next. So as I just noted, there are some activities

41:04to properties within a district that don't require a permit at all or alternatively a minor permit.

41:12So this is what this chart is referring to and just to go back to what Christina just

41:18just brought us all through. So the idea is that permits, heritage permits are really focused on

41:23those properties within a district that we would describe as contributing. So those properties that

41:30have features that are the features that make this place the district as opposed to non-contributing

41:39properties. So just to talk a bit about the kinds of activities that would require any

41:46permits at all. So like repairs or replacements and additions to exterior building elements that

41:55are in the same style, material, size, shape, and detailing wouldn't require a permit. So basically

42:02if you're fixing up or replacing what's there to look as it does today, there's no permit required.

42:11If the kind of interventions are things like replacement or addition of new or different

42:19materials, that could require what we're calling a minor permit. Next. So then the other two kinds

42:31of permits are what we're calling major permits and demo permits. So these are the kind of like

42:38bigger kinds of things. So things like altering exterior building elements or relocating a

42:46building or structure. And again, these are for contributing properties only. Those would likely

42:52require a major permit. And then similarly, if you're demolishing a building or structure on the

43:00property or constructing a new building or structure, an application for a demo permit or

43:08new construction permits would be required. So the idea is that these are like the biggest, most

43:13significant kinds of changes that could seriously change or compromise the district. And therefore,

43:19there should be a very comprehensive level of review on these kinds of changes. Otherwise,

43:28there is not an appropriate ability for the city to ensure that the objectives are being met

43:36of the district and it's being implemented appropriately. Next. So in terms of process,

43:46this flow chart visualizes the application process for heritage permits and kind of

43:55visualizes what you need to do if you're in a minor permit situation versus a major permit

44:02situation versus a demolition or new construction permit situation. So just starting from the top,

44:13every kind of situation that you are potentially any kind of permit that you might be pursuing

44:21always starts with pre-consultation. So very much like a building permit process property owner

44:31would go to the city and understand, okay, what are the requirements for me? I'm doing this to my

44:36property and see if we clarify, okay, you don't need to do anything. Go ahead, move on. Or these

44:40are the things that you would be required to. So this is where the city kind of defines what

44:46your requirements are if there are any or confirms that there are no further requirements. And then

44:53the next tear down that you see in sort of light blue, yellow, and orange, then describes sort of

45:00who's reviewing and how approvals work. So minor applications are reviewed by city staff, the

45:10heritage planner. And if as approved, then goes through to the general manager planning.

45:19And then if there's a recommendation to refuse, then that would go to council.

45:24Major application then is where the heritage committee has a different role than in a minor

45:33application. So staff and heritage growth would be reviewing major applications. And then coming

45:40out of that review, there would be a recommendation to approve or refuse and approval then just goes

45:44through general manager planning. And then a refusal goes forward to council for decision.

45:51And then similarly, the situation of demos or new construction is an identical process

45:59with the one difference being after the recommendation by staff and heritage wealth,

46:06it then goes to council for a decision. Next. So we wanted to just walk through a couple different

46:17frequently asked questions about heritage permits. Next check. So,

46:22um, it's okay. I'm just noticing that some text is cut off here in this slide, unfortunately. So

46:39I apologize to all the attendees that that had been fixed. But so pre consultation. So what is

46:46that? It's literally a call or email to heritage planning staff. And that's where Jack or Imogen

46:51or their colleagues will confirm what's required if anything and the applicant will then move forward

46:57in in the process if there is one. Next. So then just to reiterate, when is a heritage

47:04permit not required? So heritage permit is not required for changes to the interior of properties

47:12or the properties use or minor repairs or routine maintenance. Next. So another question

47:23that obviously is really important to answer for everyone involved in this process is what's

47:28required for a heritage permit. So it is very, very similar to a build to building permit contents.

47:34This isn't really introducing something different or terribly radical in terms of what the city

47:41expects to see. So staff will identify the specific submission requirements. Applicants would fill out

47:50a heritage permit application form provided description written description of proposed work

47:56construction elevation drawings and photographs of structure and property. Next.

48:04What does it cost to submit a heritage permit cost? So there is no cost to submit a heritage

48:08permit application. It doesn't introduce an additional fee to the applicant. Next.

48:14Who approves minor permits? So just to reiterate what I walked through, minor permits

48:23are delegated to staff for review and approval and then through to the general manager of

48:30planning and building services and then if there's a refusal that goes to council for decision. Next.

48:36Who approves major permits? So again this is where staff and heritage

48:41permits are put forward of recommendation and then approvals go through at the general manager

48:48level and then of course if there's a refusal that goes to council to make the ultimate decision.

48:54And similarly, what is the approval structure in situations of new construction or demolition

49:01permits for contributing properties and again that involves heritage planning staff and heritage

49:07while making a recommendation and then council making a final decision on the

49:15permit that comes through. Next. So what are the timelines? So according to the city's current

49:22guideline, the timelines for each type application are minor is around 10 to 15 business days,

49:29major 45 to 90 and then new construction or demolition less than the 90 days is the requirement.

49:412023 to 2024, the average turnaround time for major permits was 18 days and since

49:532021 there's been an average of six heritage permit applications per year with three being minor

50:00and 20 being major or new construction demolition. So the majority of them do fall into the major

50:10category and then just from a kind of perspective on average what has been the

50:17timeline overall in terms of applications is on average six per year. Next. So I think that

50:27brings us to the end of our content. I appreciate everyone's attention. There's a lot of content

50:35to work through so we wanted to now just move into a very kind of broad set of workshop questions

50:41with the group. So we have three questions for you. One focused on advantages. So what do you

50:55find positive about the idea of a heritage conservation district in downtown Kuala Lumpur? So

51:01what's really resonating with you about the work we've done so far that's positive?

51:06What challenges do you see with a potential HCD in downtown Kuala? Is anything raising

51:16flag for you of concern that we should be aware of at this stage in the development of the HCD plan?

51:23And do you have any questions or uncertainties about a potential HCD in downtown? I think since

51:32we're just a small group with just four of you here we can just we'll just have a discussion for

51:39the next 10 or 15 minutes you can share with us thoughts on any of these questions whatever comes

51:47to mind. First we'd just like to have an opportunity to hear from you at this point.

51:54So any anyone off the top any kind of reactions or like advantages what you

52:06would you like? What you see as some challenges or concerns?

52:24Thank you for providing this it's great to see. I think one of the positives

52:31around getting the HCD in place is it really sort of codifies the vision for the downtown and

52:40I think in general from what I've heard from people is it brings guidelines

52:48in line I think with either a public perception that there is already protections or that there

52:54should be protections for the historic parts of the downtown so I think it's we're finally

53:00lining up with sort of the public's appreciation for the historic element of downtown so

53:08looking forward to seeing that come to fruition. I do have a question about contributing properties

53:15versus non-contributing properties if that's okay to ask at this time.

53:19For sure please. I understand so I guess the first question is

53:29are we going to be receiving sort of a list of what those identified contributing properties are

53:35versus the non-contributing at a later date in this process? Yes so that's something that we'll bring

53:44to our June meeting though we'll be sharing it with the public in April how that list is shaping

53:52up so I don't know if there's an opportunity for staff separate from us coming in June to bring

54:00an information update earlier if that would be advantageous to see it earlier than June

54:06but you will see that information it will be publicly available in April.

54:16Great I guess I understand the identifying the general period of focus to be between that 1827

54:28and 1935. I do worry that they might they might leave out certain buildings that you know are of value

54:35after that 1935 and I understand that there's there is exceptions for those but I think you know

54:42once we get to the stage of identifying contributing versus non-contributing I look forward to that.

54:48Yeah I think just to preview our preliminary work is that overall there's a very small percentage

54:54of the properties are falling into non-contributing. I think it's somewhere in around 40 properties are

55:03non-contributing with the balance that's 100 and some odd I'm not I'm not I don't have the numbers

55:11per fresh in my head but really it's the majority will be contributing properties it's such an intact

55:18place and I think because those boundary lines have been drawn very carefully to really contain

55:26what's most valuable in the downtown we're finding that there's not a lot of non-contributing we also

55:32have close eyes on properties that may have value outside of that period of significance range

55:45particularly ones that were built in around the 1960s or built very sensitively to downtown. I think

55:53there's been an ongoing understanding when people have been constructing in this place

56:01what they're dealing with so even without an HCD or formal recognition architects have been responding

56:10to what's in downtown so things that have been built in the last 90 years really have been quite

56:17responsive so we're thinking about how we address those through the plan in a way that's sensitive

56:25to presenting a clear understanding of those properties. Great, no I'm looking forward to it

56:34this looks like it's well put together and it sounds like you've really captured the feedback

56:41that you've been getting from the public. I do have a small question through chair to staff if I

56:52might ask that at this time. I believe that's okay Jack that's okay yeah for sure Alex go ahead.

57:01And through you chair to either Stephen or Jack I just I'm curious to understand why

57:11minor heritage permit applications are not also brought to the committee.

57:18This was developed in the heritage permit guidelines this is actually before my time so I might ask

57:26Stephen when that was but this is how we've been functioning since I've been here at least and the

57:32majority of these are either not visible from the public realm or like don't require a building permit

57:41actually construct so they're just approved at the site level but Stephen do you have anything to add?

57:49I'd just add that I think there's a certain amount of discretion on the part of staff as far as

58:01there's a difference between alterations that are so minor in nature and actually a lot of them

58:07involve repair as opposed to new construction and new elements so there's a decision that's made

58:16you know amongst staff and Jack and Edmond Jen and I would consult with with Krista just as to the

58:25the need for you know the ways to just to expedite when possible the review of a heritage permit

58:35but I can say truthfully that generally the the we generally opt for as much consultation as we can

58:45with these okay yep just curious thank you okay thanks Alex are there other I saw lots of camps go

58:57up right after Alex so I think I think maybe Kelly was next in order of hands going up but

59:04I think I thought the report was awesome you guys put so much work into that I was actually going to

59:15ask what the breakdown was looking like for the properties that were not considered contributing

59:24and you already answered that so that's but yeah good job thanks Kelly appreciate it and I'm sorry

59:31I don't remember your name and then David David thanks oh you just seem to be muted you did David

59:45sorry but that um I have one question one potential challenge again I agree with my fellow members that

59:52it's it's an excellent work done so far um so the first one is so the um is there with a lot of

1:00:02people adding more regulations of any type um is objective to um have you encountered or just for

1:00:11see any issues um arising because there's now a set of new heritage or there's a there's a new

1:00:18heritage guideline you know that that property owners will have to go through um yeah I think the

1:00:27way it's set up is really well done but just the general attitude is my first question is as you

1:00:32run into and secondly um we were involved earlier with the evolving boundary of the downtown area

1:00:41is that resolved now or something for they're going to come up on that okay one question do you want to

1:00:47first second or first I'll take the first one first yeah so um I think typically uh we see um people

1:01:00who be maybe more likely to object to a plan start to come out during the plan phase generally during

1:01:07the study phase um it's a lot of people who are in support um we were pleasantly surprised I guess

1:01:15but there was a lot of support for the district at the last public open house um I think there's

1:01:25always a chance that the plan could be objected to and we encourage people to continue to come out

1:01:34to the open house and to the statutory meeting um to express any concerns or uh support of the

1:01:44plan um yeah I think who's going to add anything to that one yeah I think um the only other thing I

1:01:52I would add is that um yeah I mean in many places where we have worked on district plans the introduction

1:02:00of of what are what are perceived as as additional requirements um can be um uh a source of concern

1:02:12for property owners and and some of those questions started to come up at the public open house at the

1:02:17end of January um I think that's absolutely common and typical and part part of the process and that's

1:02:26why a lot of clarity about you know what bucket properties fall into is it contributing or non

1:02:34contributing and also what are the permitting processes helps um really um explain a lot of it

1:02:44and bring down the temperature um that you know um there's not this kind of uncertainty being

1:02:53introduced into people's lives and they don't know what it's going to all mean because I think that's

1:02:58that's what you you always struggle with with with district plans like well what does this mean

1:03:02am I going to be able to do the addition I was planning six months ago and all of a sudden am I

1:03:08going to have to do it differently and am I going to have to go through different approvals and that

1:03:13of course I think we can all all understand that that that is um can can be a very unsettling prospect

1:03:20so um you know I think we'll continue to have those conversations um and the more we can provide

1:03:28confirmation about like what are the expected turnaround times and also these are the kinds

1:03:34of interventions that will require permits helps helps kind of like I said bring bring the temperature

1:03:41down as opposed to like if if it's like well anything and everything could potentially

1:03:48require a permit that of course is not going to build um sort of or or lower um the the confusion

1:03:56or uncertainty um that's that's occurring so um I expect our April Public Information Center

1:04:04there will be a lot of conversations about that um but I think another answer to that

1:04:11you know question or concern is while a plan crystallizes as as I think Alex put it really

1:04:17nicely like it codifies the vision and it lends certainty to everyone involved here about what

1:04:24the expectations are and um even though that can mean you know a new process is being introduced

1:04:33that should that should ultimately um streamline things and and enhance um expectations um so

1:04:42that's that's a big conversation that we're going to continue having with individuals

1:04:47um and then the second part question the second part of the question was it boundary boundary yeah

1:04:53okay I missed yeah so so I think um David the question was that the boundary

1:05:00sort of evolved a little bit at the end of the study phase so um the boundary is now set um

1:05:07and Jack I don't know if you want to maybe just flip back to one of the slides with the boundary

1:05:11if you wouldn't mind um that um the boundary which you see

1:05:23here is this this is locked um we've uh this is what all of the work is is being built upon

1:05:32literally every single property within within that area and all the policies and guidelines

1:05:37are being tailored to to this collection of of properties and we've heard um just continued

1:05:45affirmation that this boundary makes sense um we no one sort of raised like you know you think

1:05:52you should go back to the drawing board so this this is what you will see come forward in in the

1:05:56end plan and that would form part of the bylaw thank you thank you Kevin hi again um I'm curious

1:06:13what can you give us a sense of what you heard um from at these events and from the public

1:06:23consultation did it about the expectations from the property owners I I get asked a lot about

1:06:31you know where's the financial incentive and and this sort of thing um is there a sense that

1:06:39people have that they want to be in some way shape or form compensated for being within the district

1:06:48okay maybe respond to that in part I think um an individual property owner who's like running a

1:06:58business in the downtown is different than um a perspective like large-scale developer I think

1:07:07it's sort of a different kind of set of questions that come from those um different kinds of property

1:07:13owners and certainly I think any and every like small scale like I I work live in my building

1:07:24has a question about like are there some financial incentives I haven't heard anyone kind of talk about

1:07:31sort of compensation but like you know is there going to be some some tax relief or like matching

1:07:37granting um you know you see it in other municipalities um and that would really like be be great and

1:07:45and kind of like pair the city's um efforts in doing this in in a really strong way um I think

1:07:54that comes from from that that kind of group of property owner types um I think the other

1:08:04those questions are less um at the forefront for like a large-scale developer asking about

1:08:09financial incentives that's just right the scale of kind of what's happening and what the needs are

1:08:15totally different um so um I think for for the large majority of property owners financial

1:08:23incentives are a really important issue um that are going to continue to to be um

1:08:29strongly emphasized recommendation and and just to build on that our understanding from staff is

1:08:35that um incentive program development is tied to the ward west hcd plan um should it proceed so

1:08:46timing wise um it wouldn't be something that came into place likely as part of the downtown plan

1:08:52depending on how each one reaches their their um conclusion uh as things track forward um but right

1:09:01now it seems like it would come uh six months to a year potentially after the downtown plan is in

1:09:09place um tracking along with the work west hcd so I think I think you can kind of reassure people

1:09:17that it's on staff's work plan it's something that that's in in process Kim I was on me can you hear

1:09:31me now yeah I'm just curious about the information we've gathered and maybe if you could provide us

1:09:37a summary about um the landscape elements part of this hcd um I think before in a previous workshop

1:09:45we talked about um different landscape elements that gave us a feeling of character in the

1:09:51downtown district um and we brought up I think I specifically brought up like the street lights

1:09:56different painting patterns um street trees and whatnot um and I'm just curious like you said

1:10:02that development is net of the rule and the downtown district um and how new developments

1:10:09will be cognizant of the character that's already established through the different

1:10:14landscape elements that you see um in the hcd area sure um I think we can provide um

1:10:26sort of talk about maybe maybe broadly um for the purposes here and maybe share share some

1:10:31more information coming out of out of this meeting um that that might be helpful so the

1:10:36district of statement the statement of district significance um will be sort of organized to

1:10:45cover off a range of different types of features so um I can't remember exactly how it looks at

1:10:51the current moment but there are certainly sort of um public realm and landscape features where

1:10:59where we're calling out either specific um uh sites like squares or parks or green spaces or open

1:11:06spaces or trails um or um types of qualities in the in the in the statement of district significance

1:11:14we're not kind of like getting into the detail of like pavers um or like a specific planting um or

1:11:22kind of street furniture um uh but calling attention to um qualities of those that do exist

1:11:32and then the policies and guidelines section and Christina don't you know in terms of how the

1:11:39table contents is is currently looking yep there's a section that will address public realm um

1:11:48and I think if there's feedback or desire for a very specific um quality of the public realm

1:12:01related to things like street furniture that that would be addressed in that section so it would set

1:12:07up expectations um for the city in to occur at at some point okay yeah I just yeah I just think

1:12:18there's an importance um in identifying um landscape elements specifically in the streetscape um because

1:12:24if you do have for example um the matching street lights that we have that I believe have a Q

1:12:31and R on them um they're black um so that creates kind of a unity feeling and a character within the

1:12:40h.e. district so I think it's important not to overlook those elements and maybe include a section

1:12:45in the report that does specifically call out those elements that I'm not talking about like a

1:12:49specific tree um but maybe if there is a like a streetscape that does have all homologous or

1:12:56um if there's a specific section that uses all um like granite curves yeah um maybe calling out

1:13:03those not like little not little details but um just the overarching elements that create a unity

1:13:10already in the district that can maybe be carried over through um new development and be considered

1:13:17yeah that's great thank you that's excellent feedback I can just interrupt and interject for a minute

1:13:24um just on the matter of streetscape there's also the revitalization of windom that's ongoing and

1:13:30may actually be well underway before the h.c.d. drops so there is a conversation between myself

1:13:38and that team and some reconciling that will have to be done um with ASI's help to ensure that their

1:13:47vision and what they're actually undertaking as part of that streetscape aligns or doesn't

1:13:53directly conflict with what our goals are for the h.c.d. um so that will be limited to the windom

1:14:01expanse but of course that's one of the key elements of the downtown core um so very good

1:14:08question but um there's also several other parties in place so we gotta we gotta bring all those

1:14:15people together and get us all on the same page yeah lots lots happening at the same time

1:14:23in downtown Kelly is that a new hand or higher hand I've lost track of sorry now that's I'll take

1:14:34that down I don't know it's probably been near this whole time that's okay that's okay um so we're

1:14:40at quarter after one I think we're um a little bit off where we thought we might be for schedule so

1:14:48maybe we'll just do a check and see if people do need um a few minute break just to refresh

1:14:55themselves before we change direction into word west um or if not we can just continue along I'm

1:15:05fine to continue but or take a break either way yeah I'm fine to continue um member I'm muddy and

1:15:19and Parker you're okay I think everyone's good to continue with you guys I'm sorry

1:15:25um and I guess I'm sorry I'm missing our conclusion the downtown um just to share next

1:15:33steps so I think we we covered them off somewhat in our um description of the full engagement plan

1:15:42for the project but just to reiterate we are speaking to the downtown focus group next week

1:15:51as well as the downtown wealth business association um so we'll have two really great inputs into um

1:16:01this material and as we um continue writing policies and guidelines um then we'll be hosting

1:16:08another public open house in April the HCD plan should be made publicly available in May ahead of

1:16:16the statutory public meeting in June um and then uh we expect that the plan will go to council in

1:16:26fall of this year so that concludes the downtown portion okay so we're gonna jump jump we're gonna

1:16:38the river um so we're gonna move into our the the ward west heritage conservation district

1:16:46study um portion of of the workshop um next check so we're gonna do a similar um back and forth

1:16:57between Christina and I um to bring you through so we're in the study phase right now um to bring

1:17:05you through all the work that's been been going on um and which we will be sharing tonight

1:17:13the public open house um this evening starting at 4 30 and then um we've got some time at the

1:17:21end for any questions from from the committee um so stepping back and just sort of starting um off

1:17:30from from before we were involved um the study area for for the the district study really comes

1:17:39out of and and kind of has its origins in 2020 um when the city's cultural heritage action plan

1:17:46identified 29 candidate cultural heritage landscapes across the city and um of those 29 for

1:17:56separate cultural heritage landscapes were identified in the ward so back then in 2020 the

1:18:02ward was sort of viewed as like of course this is this big neighborhood but there are these kind of

1:18:09chunks within it and and in 2020 they were described um quite simply as ward north ward west um that's

1:18:18sort of in in the the the elbow of the rivers um ward industrial which which sits right beside that

1:18:27and then ward east um so the ward west um area that was um defined back in 2020 served as the

1:18:37starting point for the conservation district study that that as i was was retained um to complete next

1:18:47so we met with this group back in october of 2024 so since then um we've been continuing to do all

1:18:56all of the work um that forms forms our scope so we've been refining the historical research

1:19:02we've been continuing to survey the built form and landscape features and streets

1:19:07we've been analyzing um features and patterns uh in the study area and trying to understand kind of

1:19:14what is what is the character in a in a very analytical way um we've had a working group we've

1:19:21had working group meetings um since since then we've been going through the ongoing heritage

1:19:27assessment of does this area meet the criteria for uh district um we've been analyzing you know

1:19:36what are the boundaries the hard lines on on the map um that would define the district and then

1:19:42um ultimately working on the description of of what is what is important about this place

1:19:50and then of course working on on bringing this all together in a cohesive report next

1:19:56so through the engagement um sessions that we've we've had through the process um we've been hearing

1:20:02a lot of consistent things from the community about um the the study area that we've been been

1:20:09looking at so some recurring themes have have really circulated around these various aspects

1:20:14of the place so um in no particular order of of importance um this place is really about um

1:20:23its proximity to downtown um a rich um social history um relationship to multiple rivers and

1:20:34they're they're coming together um a strong sense of kind of neighborliness um within the area um

1:20:46a pattern of historic or heritage buildings um as well as not just um historic or heritage buildings

1:20:55but also this this tradition of a mix of building types either in terms of kind of like uses of

1:21:03buildings or just the the variability of how buildings look um as well as this kind of um pattern

1:21:11of of natural areas um interest first um through this area next that's it okay so I'm going to

1:21:22go over to Christina in terms of themes and evaluation and then then we'll come back for

1:21:26your question yeah so we have two two major sets to the pieces I'm going to present um just to orient

1:21:31you so we'll go through themes and how it relates to the evaluation um how our historical research

1:21:38has culminated um and how we're describing this place and then the other piece will be around

1:21:46the boundary and how we've landed on a recommended boundary for this place um so the study area

1:21:54contains a concentration of landscape and built features that led to the development of a distinct

1:22:00socio-cultural context within the city of Guelph it's a context that's characterized by

1:22:06diverse population that lived and worked in the area through its early development and into the

1:22:11height of industrial operations in the neighborhood the communities established by those residing in

1:22:17the area were impacted by the physiography and early development of the area and communities

1:22:22also in turn influenced the built forms in the area as social and cultural patterns were established

1:22:29and traditions were formed and reformed and it's a process that continues ongoing in this in this

1:22:34neighborhood next time so um the the area has really influenced um quite strongly by series of

1:22:44physiographic features so there's the speed and aramosa river um and the aramosa spillway that

1:22:53creates a very low line area um coupled with the prominent drumlin in particular uh st. George's hill

1:23:03to the north um and the rivers have long served an important resource for the area's inhabitants

1:23:13and uh that's where industry was first established in the area so making use of the speed river in

1:23:19the late 19th century um and these features contributed to how, where, and when development

1:23:29occurred so the drumlins um form a natural barrier that contained development um and the low line areas

1:23:38were naturally flood flood prone near the confluence of the rivers and it really just

1:23:45heard early development in this area so while other areas of wealth were developing this area

1:23:52was slower to develop next slide development and subdivision of the area occurred um with the

1:24:00introduction of the Grand Trunk Railway so like downtown the the Grand Trunk Railway started to change

1:24:07the shape and pattern of this area um and it really did that in this in this portion of the city um

1:24:15through land speculation along its route so in 19 in 1855 um a series of registered plans were set

1:24:24in place in the study area and those established much of the existing road network and block pattern

1:24:30between the rivers and present day here on street created a distinct street pattern of

1:24:37angled roads and an emphasis on local streets that led to a contained neighborhood

1:24:43for the next line so early industrial buildings were established along the speed in the 19th

1:24:56century while the center of the study area was developing as a residential neighborhood

1:25:01following this subdivision of land in the mid 19th century the early houses constructed in the area

1:25:08were typically of stone or brick construction uh in vernacular expressions of common residential

1:25:14forms for that period uh it tended to not be a desirable area because of the flooding um

1:25:23and so the houses sort of reflect this like the modesty of the people who were living there and

1:25:29who could have borne this area compared to something like St. George's Hill um which has

1:25:36more typically architect design buildings or more affluent populations next slide

1:25:41with the introduction of the Guelph Junction Railway in the 1880s um that led to a building boom

1:25:50and that building boom continued into the first few decades of the 20th century

1:25:54the residential buildings constructed during the period continued to be characterized by their

1:25:59vernacular designs and there is a shift towards um more prevalence of brick so people really are

1:26:06using what's readily available to them in this area so when stone is readily available they use

1:26:13stone as brick becomes the affordable building material more brick is used the modest houses

1:26:20built during the period uh the modest uh jack's jack's eager to get through this presentation

1:26:30um that's okay thank you for for doing our slides for us um so uh the the the

1:26:39built form it really creates this textured visual coherence and it differentiates this area from

1:26:45other parts of the city um that were built up around the same time and maybe lead towards

1:26:51using stone or having um architect or more like a prominent like identifiable architectural styles

1:27:01the other thing about what happens in this time period is that um the the way that the streets

1:27:09are and lots are laid out um buildings become very densely packed within their blocks um the

1:27:16lots are particularly narrow um though in some cases they're quite long um so there's a lot of

1:27:26front yard and backyard to play with but often this the houses are set very close to the street um and

1:27:33instead use the majority of the property as backyard space so you get this really like compressed um

1:27:41built form within the streets what are the next slide so this narrow lot pattern was established

1:27:52relatively early and then was reinforced when james wilter lion um began offering land grants

1:28:01within the ward and an effort to bring industry um how much industry he actually brought is somewhat

1:28:08questionable depending on on sources um but he was a player in the area and um was selling

1:28:17narrow residential lots to make a profit on his investment as the lots were smaller than

1:28:23standard residential parcels in other areas of the city um it led to the neighborhood being viewed

1:28:31as an affordable place for working class residents um these lots were attractive to newcomers

1:28:38and there was additional appeal in that they were in close proximity to job opportunities in the

1:28:44industrial um manufacturers in the surrounding surrounding residential portion of the district

1:29:01so as lion scheme developed more people are living in the area and the gulf junction railway

1:29:09becomes established there begins to be increased industrial development um away from the river

1:29:15and inland particularly along a spur that runs generally north south through the area um

1:29:23and the because this is a low line area it's also quite flat and industry uh appreciated that they

1:29:33had large flat areas um to build uh large floor plates that were needed for manufacturing so as

1:29:42these manufacturers grew and maybe it grew their downtown location we're looking for something larger

1:29:48they move into this area to establish um it's like bigger industries so um what we end up with is a

1:30:02very adaptive community so in the early to mid 20th century um it starts to be changed in the

1:30:11neighborhood um through the conversion of residences into shops and businesses so what was

1:30:17residential industrial neighborhood um starts to provide services for itself um so people are

1:30:26altering buildings adding to properties to have um commercial uh aspects and functions available

1:30:37so the prevalence of shops and services led to the development of a local economy

1:30:41and highlighted the adaptability of the bell form of the neighborhood to suit the

1:30:47cultural and social needs similarly there's also institutional buildings that are established

1:30:53such as churches and schools um and the local enterprises contributed to this self-sustaining

1:31:01community that formed in the district so those are the pieces that really make um this area what it

1:31:09is today so we'll just go to the next slide um we'll start looking at boundary and boundary is

1:31:18really a big question within an hcd study so once we bring together our understanding of the history

1:31:25with our understanding of what exists today um we're looking at bringing together a boundary

1:31:31that really makes a lot of sense for this district that holds a high concentration of elements um

1:31:38that together tell the story um and express the values of the district so we'll go to the next

1:31:45slide so um an hcd boundary is intended to define an area that should be managed through

1:31:52heritage policies and guidelines but an hcd boundary doesn't define the limits of a neighborhood

1:31:57and i think this is particularly important for this neighborhood to understand um because the

1:32:05neighborhood is a larger place and that's something that we heard at the first public open house that

1:32:11people really saw the neighborhood as a larger place um that extends all the way to victoria

1:32:17the cultural heritage action plan recognized that there were distinct pieces to this place

1:32:24and the area that we're looking at is one portion of this larger neighborhood

1:32:32with the intent to manage this place through policies and guidelines so that's the what we're

1:32:36trying to find with the boundaries what is the place that we're going to manage um through a

1:32:41potential plan so next slide so how is the boundary determined so the study area is reviewed

1:32:50in detail so the study area gives us a starting point um for our research work um we've done a lot

1:33:00of work um within this area to understand the surroundings of the study area um we i would

1:33:09say we've done it even more intensely than we regularly would because it's such a key question

1:33:15like where where does this place start and end so um the role of the study uh within the study

1:33:24the boundaries determined and sometimes it's different than the study area and we know that

1:33:29from downtown right that that area changed to become what the hcd boundary area is so it's

1:33:37based on extensive analysis of the history of the area the streetscape and individual properties

1:33:43surveys of what exists today and public input so so there's four um considerations that are set up

1:33:53within the Ontario heritage toolkit that we can use to understand um where boundary lines may be

1:34:03drawn so we consider um where there's a framework of structured elements and those elements may

1:34:10include uh natural features or built forms so natural features could be things like topography

1:34:17landform landscapes or water courses while built form um may be things like pathways or street

1:34:24patterns landmarks or nodes or intersections um or ways that uh places approached or edges that

1:34:33become very distinct next the next consideration is for a distinctiveness which enables the

1:34:42district to be recognized and distinguishable from their surroundings or from neighboring areas

1:34:47so how do you know when you're in this place or not in this place what what distinguishes that

1:34:54difference next there is also a concentration so within that boundary we want to see a concentration

1:35:06of heritage buildings sites structures designed landscapes or natural landscapes and that those

1:35:13features are connected by some type of common aesthetic historical or social sociocultural

1:35:21context or use so they're related to each other next and then the last consideration is looking

1:35:30for a sense of visual coherence so um that's through the use of elements such as building scale

1:35:37mass height material portion color um and that those together convey a distinct uh sense of time

1:35:45for place and I think it's important with visual coherence to understand that it's not a bit of

1:35:50consistency or sameness but a unifying element so go to the next slide so I'm just going to take you

1:36:00through a series of maps and uh that we're using for our analysis to understand where to place the

1:36:09boundary and and what kind of considerations we're looking at so the rivers in the topography

1:36:17are very distinct boundary lines because of how they shape and enclose the area so

1:36:26the speed and air moose of rivers create very strong boundaries the air moose in particular

1:36:32because it has no crossings between the ward and the neighborhoods to the south

1:36:40whereas the speed river and st. George's hill creates strong visual distinction between

1:36:48the adjacent neighborhoods go on next uh at the edges of what we're seen as the potential district

1:36:59there's gateway markers so these are places where you start to say ah I'm in a different place I've

1:37:07arrived somewhere um so we have four uh gateways marked on this map that surround um the study area

1:37:17so there's one at the Macdonnell bridge by Alan's mill on Elizabeth street that is sort of a

1:37:27gateway between downtown and the ward do you feel this transition between places another is the

1:37:34hundred steps at the end of Huron street as this marker of a feature that's distinct within the ward

1:37:44people have brought it up every time we've spoken to them about this neighborhood and

1:37:52uh so it's a strong gateway marker as you travel along Elizabeth street or um make this journey

1:38:02along the steps between st. George's and the ward the next is on going clockwise around is at the

1:38:12spur line where it crosses um York road and this um gives you a distinct sense of this openness of

1:38:23the industrial lands um that tell you that this place is distinct or different from the neighboring

1:38:33areas and leads you into the beginnings of the irregular street pattern within the western

1:38:40part of the ward and then the last is right at the confluence of the speed and Aramosa rivers

1:38:46where there's the covered bridge that connects into um downtown and brooklyn and college hill

1:38:54and that that's a a gateway for pedestrians traveling between those two places the next slide

1:39:03so within those confines the area has a concentration of the largest and earliest

1:39:10water and rail based industries so there's a pattern of water based industries along the

1:39:15speed and rail based industries along the um junction spur line and all of those

1:39:23within that is the residential um piece that is concentrated next slide and these this residential

1:39:35area is the earliest modest houses within the within the neighborhood as a whole um with readily

1:39:44available materials on small affordable blocks and the map we're showing here is a 1906 ward map

1:39:53and um you can see on the west western portion of st. Patrick's ward west of Huron street the

1:40:01area's been very subdivided whereas um to the east there's still just very large lots there's not

1:40:09that fine grain residential pattern yet um we also see this in the dates of construction of the

1:40:16buildings that the west is earlier next next these um buildings uh both residential and industrial

1:40:32in particular the residential areas are set within an irregular street pattern which distinguishes

1:40:38the feel of this area next to the river so those surveys that were laid out in the 1850s create

1:40:48this irregular street pattern where you have angled streets different distances from one block

1:40:57to the next and lots of change in lot sizes and shapes because of that street pattern while in the

1:41:06eastern portion of the area there's a highly regular pattern to the street so it's a grid pattern

1:41:15that's much more typical of areas that we would see throughout wealth and throughout Ontario next

1:41:25further because of this irregular street pattern that gets laid out you get a series of what we're

1:41:30calling t and y intersections so t intersection people are very familiar with street ends and you

1:41:38only have a choice to turn left or right and not continue through the y intersections are created

1:41:45when angled streets about each other and they often also sort of the street ends and you just

1:41:52have a left or right decision without an opportunity to go straight through what this has done in this

1:41:59neighborhood is created a pedestrian friendly environment and restricts a lot of through

1:42:05vehicular traffic so there's only so many points of entry into this neighborhood and it becomes

1:42:10quite enclosed and that that's contributed to the sense of closeness um and neighborliness that

1:42:18people are describing because it's a place that you go to if you live there it's not a place that

1:42:25a lot of people are traveling through next slide so all together this culminates in this being a

1:42:33significant early 20th century working class place so we see the early 20th century is like the

1:42:39height of all of these elements coming together as a place where people are living and working and

1:42:48shopping and socializing and these are some examples of of sort of key places within the

1:42:57district so allison here on the street where you get a meeting of all of these um

1:43:03very juices we have the railway being such a prominent piece throughout with level crossings

1:43:11and visible tracks irregular shaped buildings where they're grappling with the the irregular

1:43:19street pattern and a blend of of building types next slide so our recommended boundary is larger

1:43:30than the initial study area um so it's the red dashed lines we also have some dashed lines on

1:43:37there to delineate where downtown the hcds as well as where brooklyn and college hill hcds because

1:43:45all of these um these hcds are in very close proximity to each other so the boundary um

1:43:57goes to north to um st george's hill so we include the elizabeth street gateway we include

1:44:07the topography as it goes up the drumlin it goes over to the 100 steps travels down here on the

1:44:14street um and then goes across ferguson and then travels down morris street and includes all of the

1:44:24area contained by speed and aeromo says so it doesn't cross over either of the rivers

1:44:31um but remains contained and i think that that's something we were hearing um from the public

1:44:38was that's a logical edge for like the southern portion of the boundary we've included the river

1:44:47within the boundary um to recognize that that's a key part of the beginning of industry in this area

1:44:55and um other features that it includes are things like the two railways so a portion of the grand

1:45:03trunk and a portion of the junction railway the junction spur line and the former industrial

1:45:11lots along its length as well as all of these features that come together within that boundary

1:45:20so a close proximity residential a blend of types and dates of housing but that we see this

1:45:30concentration in the early 20th century so this is the boundary that we'll be bringing to the public

1:45:36tonight we'll be bringing all of this material to get their feedback and to understand how people

1:45:43react to this we'll be communicating to them how we how we got to this place just like this so

1:45:52we'd love to answer any questions we have just take a good slide but i'm sure we'll come back

1:45:59to the mastery slide um so yeah just any questions or reactions to the material that we presented

1:46:08we're really um sort of nearing the end of the study phase and so we're thinking about we're

1:46:16finding the way we're talking about the district um and i'll turn it over to you

1:46:24if anybody wants to just lead us off yes david do we have any sense how many applications

1:46:36see it in a year might be affected by the uh by the new district by the this new um district

1:46:45but that sounds like a question for staff yeah um it's hard to say um the significant portion of the

1:46:58western part of um this district is within the downtown secondary plan which has increased

1:47:05heights proposed through the downtown heights study so there's an anticipation of more development

1:47:11in this area um this is also one of the neighborhoods that is seeing more

1:47:17billman permits issued than elsewhere in the city thanks david potentially there it really

1:47:28affects them but we don't have an idea of numbers and not right now but uh we can look into that

1:47:54again thank you for that presentation um it's great to see the depth that you drilled down into

1:48:01when you're sort of evaluating the study i are you uh wanting feedback on the recommended

1:48:08boundary or is that something that's coming back to us at a later time to discuss or

1:48:14this would be the moment in time if you had feedback yeah okay um i'm i'm happy to see the

1:48:22river included i think that's a really good um part of the new recommended boundary i i do

1:48:30worry that between and since we were discussing both today between the uh the ward west uh

1:48:38boundary and the the downtown boundary that there's that neighborhood an upper knave that sort of acts

1:48:48it's part of in my mind a gateway to the ward and and sort of is in line with some of the you

1:48:55know things that were identified um within this presentation about you know being small

1:49:00lots affordable proximity to downtown and and again that connection with the bridge over the river

1:49:07at knave and i'm just wondering if if uh it might we might regret down the line because this is

1:49:15going to be a bit of an orphan neighborhood now between these two hcds that we may regret not

1:49:20offering the same level of guidance um in conservation efforts within that neighborhood

1:49:26as we do with both downtown and the ward west so that would that would be just my feedback yeah

1:49:33and and just to be specific about what i'm referring to it's it's um uh sort of it's surrey street um

1:49:42knave um you know the the one side of fountains street that's not maybe contained within the

1:49:48downtown hcd uh and i think it's grant street is that small dividing street um there's there's

1:49:55that collection of you know residential houses there's maybe a couple businesses in there but they

1:50:01they seem to meet the same visual criteria as what we see in the ward again those lot sizes and

1:50:08just because it is that transition area between the the downtown and the ward um i think also given

1:50:15that you know these are two hcds that are contained or or have majorly or you know within the

1:50:24downtown secondary plan which we've received already um an update for the the heights and as

1:50:31jack has mentioned there's an increased development pressure i i think it would be worthwhile to

1:50:36include that neighborhood within the recommended boundary okay thanks alex and yeah we we did

1:50:45look carefully at this area um after our last conversation because i know the committee raised

1:50:53this area as a spot for potential inclusion so um we did a visual review of what's there today

1:51:03um and looked at how it connects into the history and so historically we know this was part of

1:51:12the formal boundary of st patricks ward um and you can see that on the 1906 map that i showed

1:51:20um but otherwise we're not finding strong compelling evidence that this area had the same

1:51:29um integrated relationship that the area on the east side of the speed river

1:51:36does so well there may be um sort of like a blending of

1:51:45building types and materials it's uh not underpinned by a common history and settlement

1:51:56and use pattern that that we see so that's why we've decided to stay on the east side of the

1:52:06river in terms of the the built form pieces that are are included and not go into that area that's

1:52:17sort of between downtown and and the speed river um do you want to add anything to that Rebecca?

1:52:27yeah i think um just that i think it's a really important point that alex has raised about kind

1:52:34of the orphan the resulting orphan aspect of the area that we're talking about in terms of the

1:52:41sort of straight meave album to grant and um you know what might be an appropriate approach

1:52:51approach there so um uh i think that's um certainly um an important kind of question

1:53:00internally for for staff but but also because it's outside of the area we were we were asked to to look at

1:53:08um like we would traditionally make some recommendations in in an area that we've been asked to look at are

1:53:14are there any individual buildings that you know the city might want to should or may consider

1:53:20for part four designation but that might be um an approach there of a series of part four designations

1:53:27to help guide um what happens there and and address that that absence of a district um

1:53:34and i think it is for that very reason that because it is kind of this place between or this kind of

1:53:41this area between two distinct places of the downtown and this residential neighborhood it is

1:53:45this kind of like it's not fitting there it's not fitting here and that that is that does present

1:53:51risk to it for sure um so i think certainly the study should acknowledge that um but i i don't think

1:53:59that there there is christina said continues to be um a compelling kind of boundary rationale to

1:54:06to extend this boundary and you know on to the other side of the river so i just wanted to add

1:54:11that perspective another thing that may be is important um to mention too is that um the downtown

1:54:21district as well as if the ward moves forward to an hcd plan will also address adjacent properties

1:54:28so adjacent um as defined in the in the pps i'm not well it doesn't have a specific

1:54:35definition of adjacent so it follows the pps uh definition so uh it is anything

1:54:41contiguous to the hcd boundary so um any properties that fall outside of the downtown

1:54:51on bound street would be considered adjacent as well as anything on the like southwest side

1:55:00that's immediately adjacent to the speed river would be an adjacency to ward west and so

1:55:10those properties typically adjacency will be addressed in the same way that it would be

1:55:18for part four so a recognition of the context that those properties are within steven

1:55:29no i just wanted to to mention you you were talking about adjacency being defined um

1:55:36guelph's official plan does define adjacency pretty pretty uh succinctly i think it's based on the

1:55:43provincial model but we've we have our own definition that it and it actually was expanded a bit

1:55:50when we did the brookline college hill district uh because adjacency doesn't always um kick in if we

1:56:00were talking about a proper a large property if let's say a large property was adjacent but

1:56:08the the very east end of it was you know maybe like some distance away from the protected property

1:56:16then then the adjacency was uh the definition there has a limitation as to what's considered

1:56:24adjacent but i think it it's important just to know that guelph has a pretty strong definition

1:56:29of adjacent in this context okay thanks steven okay other other questions that we can answer about

1:56:40ward west at this point see none okay do i have one more slide there jack with

1:56:57next steps yep so we have our second public information center tonight um so if you're

1:57:06available we welcome you to come we'll be delivering this same um type of information but if you want

1:57:12it to provide for the feedback you can do it in that form or interface with um community members

1:57:19that are there this evening um you can certainly always provide ongoing feedback um to jack that

1:57:27can be passed along to the consultant team um after the public information center we'll be um

1:57:35advancing our draft report for circulation to indigenous communities for their feedback and

1:57:41we'll be making any revisions as needed and then there'll be a staff report to council in may

1:57:50so just a few months from now there'll be a report publicly available ahead of that council meeting

1:57:57and then presentation to council so we're well well on our way at this at this point

1:58:03so thank you very much to everyone i know this was a lot of material to get between

1:58:09both hcds and so thank you for setting aside um additional time for this special meeting

1:58:18to bring you these updates awesome thank you so much for all your work and taking the time to

1:58:25share your work with us we really appreciate it um as expressed by many of the members um

1:58:31you've really gone in depth and we really appreciate that um so i'm going to move to a

1:58:36german then unless there's any other questions david no no oh you're you're moving a german okay

1:58:47um may i please have um hands for movement of a german uh david and then drive a seconder

1:58:54i see kelly's hand and then all in favor i see all hands okay so that's been carried

1:59:08so the meeting is adjourned and the next carriage wall feeding will be hosted on march 6 2025 at 12

1:59:14p.m thank you so much everyone thank you thank you bye