Special Council Meeting - Budget

6:29This webinar is being transcribed and summarized.

14:37Good morning everybody.

14:39It is Wednesday, November 26th, 2025.

14:42It is 9 a.m.

14:43It is our special city council budget meeting.

14:46Welcome.

14:48Right off the top, stand if you are able

14:50as we recognize our national anthem.

16:22Thank you as we continue a moment of silent reflection,

16:25please.

16:37Great, thank you in our territorial acknowledgement

16:39as we gather, let us take time to reflect on our privilege

16:42to live and work in Guelph,

16:44a city built over rich indigenous histories.

16:46We are guests here, we reflect upon the responsibility

16:50to care for this land, the people who live here today

16:53and the generations to come.

16:55If our actions today can move us towards reconciliation,

16:58we should take pause and make those decisions

17:00with intention and gratitude.

17:02This place we call Guelph has served as traditional lands

17:05and a place of refuge for many peoples over time,

17:07but more specifically, the Aniwaterok and the Honnoshoni.

17:11This land is held as the treaty lands and territory

17:14with the Mississaugas of the Credit First Nation.

17:17Guelph lies directly adjacent to the Haldeman track

17:19and is part of a long established additional hunting grounds

17:22for the six nations of the Grand River.

17:24Many First Nations Inuit and M.A.T. people

17:26who have come from across Turtle Island

17:28call Guelph home today.

17:31All right, thank you.

17:32Any disclosure of pecuniary interest,

17:34any general nature thereof for the item in front of us.

17:40Hearing and seeing none.

17:42We're all here.

17:43This is great.

17:45All right, let's get her done.

17:51We're going to, we're gonna have the main motion table

18:00right off the top.

18:03And if I could have a mover and a seconder for it.

18:07We're not doing that because we're just jumping

18:09into the amendments.

18:10I was just testing the clerks

18:13and they have succeeded, well done clerks.

18:16Okay, we are moving right into amendments.

18:21And look, if people are okay with this,

18:25I might just go through some of the ones that I feel are,

18:31I'm gonna step out on a limb

18:32and maybe just feel our easier ones

18:34to just sort of say yes or no on.

18:37And maybe we can merge a little bit later on

18:40into some of the ones that we know

18:42might have some discussion, debate and or questions.

18:46And so what I'd like to do is make sure

18:48that when I go to any of the amendments

18:50that there is a seconder.

18:52So I will ask if there's a seconder, if there isn't,

18:56then the amendment won't come forward, okay?

19:02Just before we really kick off,

19:04just we should just say a collective thank you to staff.

19:09It's such heavy lifting to get to this point.

19:12People maybe do not understand the amount of work

19:15that it takes to get here.

19:18And for the last like week and a bit,

19:20the amount of work on staff to prepare all the amendments

19:23that we have that are coming forward right now.

19:26So thank you very much to staff for doing that.

19:29Thank you also to the citizens and others

19:33that have either reached out, spoke to us individually,

19:36come and delegated and so on.

19:39We appreciate that input as well.

19:42So let's jump in.

19:48Works, I'm gonna go, let's see here.

19:54Why don't we start with amendment five?

19:57Amendment five, Councillor Caton,

20:00I'm sorry to put you on the spot,

20:02but it is the one about increasing the budget.

20:08Well, let's go jump up on the screen here.

20:10For the data architect position, okay?

20:13So first of all, let me see if there is a seconder for this.

20:20If you know who the seconder is, Councillor Caton,

20:22you can just say it.

20:24I'll turn the mic over to you just for a second.

20:28No, no one has grabbed it yet,

20:30but someone should because we really need it.

20:33Does someone wish to second this one?

20:36Okay, Councillor Allt wants to second it.

20:38So then why don't you, I turn the floor over to you.

20:43Why don't you read that motion out for us?

20:45And then a quick little blurb

20:47as to why you think it's important.

20:49Go ahead.

20:50Thanks, can clerks put that back on the screen please?

20:55Thank you.

20:56I'm hoping that Council amend Gwell's 2026 budget update

21:00by increasing the 2026 operating budget by 74,570

21:05for the half year cost of the addition

21:07of a data architect position to be annualized

21:10in 2027 funded by the property tax levy.

21:13So we have two tech positions

21:15and they kind of have complimentary requirements.

21:19And this is bringing someone in at the half year.

21:23So this is half of the salary

21:25that would be realized in 2027.

21:28And we have a lot of backend data

21:33that isn't within, it's in paper basically.

21:37We've got a lot of old systems that we're trying to update.

21:41And a lot of people's time is spent

21:44in trying to find information for people.

21:46And this is across Freedom of Information requests.

21:50This is across every job title.

21:53This is through us asking staff for things

21:56that we can't find on the website.

21:59This is an efficiency.

22:00This will actually lower the likelihood

22:02that we're gonna have to hire more people in future

22:05because we're just spending a lot of time doing kind of data

22:10rent work, looking for things

22:12when it could be done slightly more efficiently.

22:15So that's what I'm hoping we can do.

22:17This will be a budget efficiency item longterm.

22:21All right, thank you for describing that.

22:24And I think, can I call the vote then?

22:28Yeah.

22:30Okay, all those against, please raise your hand.

22:34All right, so that's Gibson and Chu and Gawler

22:39and Richardson and Causton and Guthrie and Busatil

22:43and Downer and Hauser and Billings, thank you.

22:49All right, so that fails,

22:51but thank you again for bringing that idea forward.

22:55Let's jump to, let's see here.

23:12That was number five, right?

23:13Yeah, okay, I'll put that to the side.

23:18Hey, why don't we just stick with you, Councillor Caton?

23:21We'll go to the next one, number six.

23:23So this one is also about a solutions analyst.

23:29Let me just ask you, Councillor Caton,

23:31do you know if you have a seconder for this one already?

23:34I do not know.

23:36Okay, is anyone wishing to maybe second this one?

23:41Okay, so there's no seconder on that one, okay?

23:44So thank you again and we'll continue on.

23:52Why don't we do Councillor Caron, stick with the C's.

24:00Why don't you talk about the bicentennial?

24:03Okay.

24:04Is that okay with you?

24:05Number eight, everybody, it's about a $47,000 request.

24:09Councillor Caron, do you have a seconder?

24:14Okay, Downer's good a second.

24:16I'll turn the mic over to you, Councillor Caron.

24:19Sure, thank you.

24:20I'm moving that we amend the 2026 operating budget

24:24by increasing the Bina Centennial funding by 47,000.

24:30We've got a seconder, so my commentary is just,

24:32we know that civic celebrations have a return on investment

24:36and economic development and tourism.

24:38We also know that our bicentennial

24:40doesn't come around very often.

24:42This is a biggie.

24:43Our community has some rising energy on this event

24:48and to cut the budget in half,

24:50which went from 300,000 to 150,

24:54means that the Wealth 200 community working group

24:57that has been planning with a budget

25:00is not gonna be able to deliver on their goals

25:02and their mandate.

25:03And so I do worry that we're gonna lose some of that momentum

25:06because we're asking our community

25:08to leverage what we're putting in

25:10by asking businesses and organizations and institutions

25:13to also rise up and celebrate our 200th birthday.

25:17So things in 2025 went a little slower.

25:21We didn't get the logistics event coordinator position hired.

25:25So there's 103,000 from last year.

25:28So in a motion later in the meeting,

25:32I'll be asking to roll that over to 2026,

25:36which results in still a deficit of $47,000 for 2026.

25:40So I'm asking my colleagues to support this

25:43once in a lifetime, once in a century.

25:46Milestone in our city's history

25:48so that we can deliver on community expectations.

25:52Thanks.

25:53Great, thank you.

25:55Kipson, any commentary or questions?

25:58Yes, thank you.

25:59Go ahead.

26:00Through you, Mr. Merrill, a question to staff

26:01or to the mover.

26:02I supported this last year.

26:03I think it was a great initiative.

26:05The question I have, and I think I saw an email

26:07about this from the community group,

26:09is this a volunteer organization?

26:13What are these funds going to?

26:15Are they going to pay salaries and wages

26:16or are they going to pay disbursements?

26:19Because I'd like to hear that they pay primarily disbursements

26:21for the celebration and rather than

26:24going to pay salaries and wages.

26:25So through the mayor to Councillor Gibson.

26:28So the plan that was put forward by staff

26:30but then has been endorsed by the community working group,

26:33which is a volunteer based community working group,

26:36is that there is a combination of hiring of a coordinator

26:40for the bicentennial.

26:42I think I don't want to speak for the community working group

26:45but my understanding is they're supportive of the need

26:47to have a contracted staff person

26:51who will coordinate the activities of the bicentennial.

26:54But then in addition to that,

26:56the funds at the full amount also supports community grants

27:00because a big part of what we want to do

27:03is really seed money out into the community

27:05so that a lot of the celebrations can be community led.

27:08Okay, thank you.

27:09Just a follow-up then.

27:10Is the community organization coordinator,

27:14is that hiring process done through the city

27:18or is that done through the community group?

27:21Through the mayor to Councillor Gibson,

27:22no, that would be a contracted city staff person

27:24working through our Guelph Museums and Culture team.

27:27Great, thank you.

27:30Okay, I'll call the vote then on this.

27:33I'll just speak my mind for a moment.

27:35I think this is a creative way of kind of rolling some money

27:40over maintaining the same amount

27:41when it's added to what's already in the base

27:43that was put there at the 150 anyways.

27:46So, you know, Councillor Caron's right,

27:49it's one time thing and I wanna do it right.

27:54So let's, it's up to each of you.

27:57I'm gonna support this addition, okay?

28:00So I'll call the vote, is anyone against?

28:06Man, it was a good job, you can go home.

28:10Okay, let's find another one here.

28:22Well, actually, Molly, the next one that came up

28:24was you again, Councillor Caron, if it's okay with you.

28:27This is about the 500,000 into the 100RE, okay with that?

28:32Sure, I only have two amendments,

28:34so I might as well go back to back.

28:36This one is a little bit more than my first ask,

28:38so I'm hoping to get equal unanimous support, we'll see.

28:42So this one is that Council,

28:46oh, do we have a seconder?

28:47Councillor Goller.

28:49Thanks, thanks, Councillor Goller.

28:51That Council amends the 2026 operating budget

28:53by increasing the transfer to the 100RE

28:55is reserved by 500,000 funded through the property tax levy

29:00and increases the 2026 to 2035 capital budget.

29:04Oh, sorry.

29:04I'm sorry, I thought these other amendments were things

29:12that were gonna happen in the process part?

29:15Yeah, well, rather than.

29:17That's what I thought.

29:20That's what I thought.

29:22Yeah, we're gonna do this one.

29:23This one here, was that the one I was reading, right?

29:25Okay, okay, great.

29:27And the capital budget by 500,000 in each year

29:31for Capital Project GG, 0261, 100RE initiatives funded

29:35by the 100RE Reserve Fund.

29:39So when Council passed motions to support 100RE

29:43and net zero by 2050, we made a commitment to our community

29:48that we acknowledge that we are in a climate crisis

29:51and that we would invest in actions

29:52that would avoid financial, environmental,

29:55and social costs of climate change.

29:57And we've been making incremental progress

29:59towards our goals and we're already seeing

30:01a return on investment.

30:02And for me, the return on investment is the guiding factor

30:07in the amendments that I'm making today.

30:10Everything from energy savings to extreme weather damage,

30:13stormwater capital avoidance, and more.

30:16And actually research, Canadian research

30:18from FCM's Green Municipal Fund

30:20and the World Resource Institute

30:22analyzes over 300 types of climate action investment.

30:25And they found that for every dollar spent

30:27on adaptation and resilience,

30:30generates more than $10 in benefits over a 10 year horizon

30:34with an average annual return on investment of 27%.

30:38And in addition to that, the Canadian Climate Institute data

30:41shows that for every dollar invested,

30:44it adds $13 to $15 in ROI and capital spending avoidance.

30:50And so these stats don't account

30:52for the economic development reality

30:54that businesses are looking to locate

30:56in cities that are climate resilient

30:58and cities that have bold energy planning policy.

31:01So for me, an investment in 500K just in this year alone

31:06is projected to yield $5.4 million in savings

31:11within a 10 year horizon.

31:13That's good governance and it's good management

31:15of our fiscal resources.

31:17At this critical time, it's truly a case of the cliche,

31:22you have to spend money to make money.

31:24In previous multi-year budgets, we allocated 950K,

31:28just to put it into perspective, annually,

31:30to invest in climate action

31:32that would not only help us meet our policy goals,

31:34but future savings and capital avoidance.

31:37And that is also embedded in our multi-year budget.

31:40So the removal of this amount will also delay the benefits

31:44and the return on investment.

31:46This motion only returns half of that investment

31:49back into the budget, 500K versus 950.

31:52And we've heard from our staff earlier in the budget process

31:56that our reserves are becoming depleted,

31:59which puts further stress on future budgets

32:01when opportunities for grant money,

32:03like FCM green funds, for climate action come forward.

32:07In previous years, this council has acknowledged

32:09the necessity of having money for social housing

32:12available in our affordable housing reserve

32:15when grant money was available,

32:17because this allowed us to build shelter

32:19and transitional housing at Shelldale,

32:21Grace Gardens and Stepping Stones.

32:22So this is the same approach.

32:25Finally, a few months ago, we asked our community to step up.

32:29We asked businesses, institutions and residents

32:32to join us in a community call to action.

32:34And we must lead the way.

32:36We're sending the wrong message

32:37when we declare a call to action to the community

32:40while simultaneously cutting our own investment.

32:43So I would respectfully ask my colleagues to stay the course

32:46and continue our path towards handing over a livable city

32:49to the next generation.

32:51Thank you, Mr. Mayor.

32:52Okay, thank you.

32:54All right, so I will call the vote on this one,

32:58the $500,000 being added back in.

33:01So all those against, please raise your hand.

33:05All right, so Gibson and Chu and Richardson

33:10and Billings and Guthrie.

33:13Okay, so that one passes

33:16and we'll move on to the next one.

33:19Mr. Mayor, just a quick request.

33:22If the intention is to hear the motion mover

33:27and the justification for the motion,

33:29I just ask that you look around the room

33:30and see if there's any comments.

33:31I would have liked to respond to that

33:33before we voted, not matter, it's over,

33:35but just I appreciate it, thank you.

33:37My apologies, I did forget to do it on that one.

33:41I'm happy to allow you to, you know,

33:43it's a little off the cuff,

33:45but because I made a mistake, I'll let you comment

33:48and then we'll move on to the next one.

33:49I'll buy my time, thank you.

33:51Oh, okay, okay, all right, sorry everybody.

33:57Okay, let's see here.

34:06That one is done.

34:12Councillor, that's not, Councillor, that one's done.

34:30Okay, Councillor Klassen, why don't we do yours?

34:34Amendment number 10, sorry,

34:35I know the clerk's want me to say a number.

34:38All right, so it's increasing the operating budget

34:41to talk about council and mayor training funds.

34:45So over to you.

34:47Sure, actually, the seconder, so.

34:50All right, Gawr will second.

34:52Thank you, Mr. Mayor.

34:53And I appreciate the opportunity

34:55just to chat about this for a moment.

34:58I was thinking about how to position this to you all

35:01and I thought about how we start

35:03our council meetings typically.

35:04So we usually take a few minutes to acknowledge

35:07our staff's accomplishments and their education

35:11that they receive and we celebrate that

35:15as something that we should really be proud of

35:18to know that our staff is,

35:21we're investing in our staff

35:22and their ability to do their jobs better.

35:27And so when I ask you to consider this motion

35:30to restore the mayor and council training funds,

35:32I'd also like you to think about how we function

35:35as a council and how future councils will function as well.

35:38We have a new council coming in next year

35:41and it will be important that they have an opportunity

35:44to invest in their ability to do their jobs well

35:49and to represent our constituents

35:50as well as they can.

35:51When I first started on council,

35:53I was encouraged by fellow councillors

35:55like Councillor Downer and Quran

35:57to attend a couple of conferences

36:00where I was able to connect with my peers

36:04and to advance various pieces of advocacy

36:07but then also be able to talk about

36:09some of the issues that we're experiencing

36:11in our community with other municipalities,

36:14other councillors and often staff as well.

36:17And so I think that when we keep this budget in,

36:23we are also investing in a better gualph.

36:25And so I ask you to support the motion.

36:28Thank you.

36:29All right, thank you.

36:31Is there any questions or comments on that

36:33before I call the vote?

36:34All right, Alt.

36:36Thank you very much.

36:37Mayor Guthrie, it's through you two staff.

36:40I don't have any problems with the principle of the motion,

36:45but I'm just wondering if we have any sense

36:50of how much was spent this year

36:53so that I have a reasonable idea of what we are doing.

36:59Through the mayor, we will work on pulling that information.

37:03However, I can say that there has been a positive variance

37:07in that line over the last few years,

37:09which is about the amount that was proposed to be reduced.

37:14And so that I don't have this year's number

37:16in front of me right now, but we're pulling it up.

37:18So hopefully that will help.

37:20So what I'm hearing you saying is essentially

37:22the proposal was to even out the budget

37:27to reflect the reality of what we spend per year.

37:31Through the mayor, yes, that's correct.

37:32Thank you.

37:34If you don't mind me jumping in,

37:36I'm a little bit guessing,

37:39but I believe we're probably

37:42in the high 20s, maybe $30,000

37:45in positive variance for that sort of line item.

37:49It's a consistent line item that is unused.

37:54So we wanted to sort of write the ship a little bit

37:58on reducing the budget there

38:00because it continues to be unused,

38:02and then it just falls to the bottom line

38:04as a positive variance.

38:06If I could just, since I have the mic,

38:09just give a comment.

38:11I think Councillor Cawson has a lot of validity

38:13in what she has proposed.

38:15I think the amount might just be a little bit too high

38:17for my liking, because I have a feeling

38:20that we put the whole $43,000 back in,

38:22we're gonna end that back up with $20,000,

38:23$30,000 of positive variance at the end of the year

38:26and at the end of next year.

38:28And then at the end of next year,

38:30as you rightly said, Councillor Cawson,

38:31we have a new council that's coming in,

38:34and at that time they would be considering the 2027 budget.

38:37And so they, they, they at that time

38:40could maybe look to say like, okay,

38:43depending on what the makeup of council is,

38:45they could be like, we really need $40,000

38:47or we only need 20.

38:49I'm just making that number up.

38:50So I would suggest that I know that for myself,

38:53I don't think I can support the $43,000 going back in,

38:56just because of historical unuse of those funds.

39:00But I could definitely support something smaller

39:03just to get us through next year

39:04and then have the next council consider it,

39:06depending on the makeup of that next council moving forward.

39:09So councillor Altsdahl has the floor and then to the downer.

39:12My, my, my sentiments are similar to Mayor Guthrie's

39:16because I don't consider it necessarily

39:18to be common sense budgeting.

39:20If in fact we are projecting a,

39:23a positive variance every year,

39:26what we're doing is we're,

39:27we're putting money artificially into a reserve

39:31that we should be trying to balance out

39:34both sides of the ledger every year is what I'm trying to say.

39:37And it's, it's not like snow removal

39:39where there might be a good year and a bad year.

39:41This is something where we can predict the trends.

39:43And consequently, we should get closer

39:46to what's actually spent in the item.

39:50Yep. So let me go to downer and then,

39:52and then yep, downer and then the mover to Klossman.

39:54Well, I'd be willing to move an amendment

39:57to change the figure to 20,000

40:00and just give a bit of a cushion.

40:02I, cause I heard that there was,

40:04it was around the variance was around 30.

40:08So.

40:09Is there a seconder for the amendment?

40:10Okay. Richardson will second.

40:13And then speaking only to the amendment now, 20,000.

40:15Altogether.

40:16And it's the same to staff.

40:17Is that a more realistic number?

40:22Through the mayor.

40:23So we did just get the variance as of this year to date

40:27and it is 47,000 surplus or positive variance.

40:33For that line item for this year to date.

40:38Okay.

40:39And a comment from Klossman first,

40:42and then I hand on the amendment and then over to Guller.

40:47So I will just say that I also did speak with clerks about it

40:52and how potentially based on how the spending this year,

40:55there could be a concern that next year it would run out.

40:58So I, you know, I also, you know, take offense a bit to,

41:03you know, the common sense budgeting

41:04because I also did.

41:07Point of personal privilege.

41:08There was no intention of offense.

41:11This was about looking at ledgers and looking at the left side

41:15and the right side to ensure that they balance.

41:19Okay.

41:21Can't believe that we're going off the rails

41:24on a 40 something thousand dollar line item.

41:26So everyone take a breath.

41:28Number one, as the chair,

41:31councillor all,

41:33I don't appreciate you interrupting another counselor

41:35when they're trying to speak and

41:37Point of personal privilege.

41:38And let me find a personal privilege stops all debate.

41:41And let me finish.

41:43When a counselor calls a point of order

41:46or a point of personal privilege,

41:48the chair has to recognize that counselor first

41:52and you never do that.

41:54And you just did it twice in 20 seconds.

41:56So let's stop that please and respect the chair.

42:00When it is called a point of personal privilege,

42:02I recognize you first.

42:04You didn't do that twice.

42:06Let's not go down there for the rest of the day, please.

42:09So you have corrected yourself

42:11in regards to counselor Clausen's concern.

42:13Don't please interrupt again.

42:15I let the chair chair the meeting.

42:17Is everyone on board on that?

42:19Thank you.

42:20Back to you, councillor Klassen.

42:22Do you have another comment on your motion?

42:27Thank you for the amendment

42:28and I'm happy to support the amendment.

42:30Thank you, caller.

42:32All right, let's anybody else

42:34before I call a vote on the $20,000 amendment.

42:39Thank you.

42:40I'm sure everyone has received emails and concerns.

42:42I feel I will not be supporting the amendment

42:46or the original motion.

42:47I think that we need to also demonstrate.

42:50Sorry, I'm losing my voice.

42:51Also demonstrate some austerity.

42:56Okay, thank you.

42:57Gibson.

42:59Just a question to staff and remind me, please,

43:01of the decision making we've made before

43:04around sharing our training budgets.

43:07So as someone who hasn't used their training budget

43:09in probably six or seven years,

43:12we used to have a process where a council would come,

43:16perhaps they wanted to do AMO and FCM in the same year

43:19and it took them over there in their individual budget.

43:21They could ask the rest of council,

43:22do you mind sharing the budget with me?

43:25Do we still have that process in place?

43:28Or is there some delegated decision that we made?

43:32I thought we made that where we don't have to come back

43:34to council and ask for approval.

43:35All this to say is I'm happy to share training budgets

43:40up to our sort of sum total.

43:44Maybe you can answer that question, Mr. Mayor.

43:46Yeah, sure.

43:47So last year we changed the budget a little bit

43:50where AMO and FCM is a dedicated amount now, okay?

43:54And we will always have the amounts

43:56to go to those two main conferences a year for all of us.

43:59And then we had on top of that,

44:01an education extra conferences sort of budget,

44:04which is kind of what we're talking about as well.

44:07However, the process to ask to come to council

44:12and ask over and above is still something that is available.

44:16Okay.

44:17Thank you.

44:18So based on that, I'm comfortable with the decision

44:19that was made to reduce the budget by 47,000

44:23and so I won't be supporting the amendment

44:25or the request.

44:28Pardon me for the interruption and through you, Mr. Mayor,

44:30I just want to clarify for this budget

44:32that there is no dedicated FCM and AMO funding.

44:35It is all rolled up into one learning and development budget

44:38for city council that's divided amongst the 12,

44:41but can then be reallocated as folks don't use.

44:43Sorry.

44:44It is okay.

44:48Still comfortable where we are.

44:49Okay. Thank you.

44:50And thank you to Dylan.

44:52Okay.

44:54I'm going to call the vote then on the amendment only,

44:56which is 20,000, okay?

44:57Is anyone against that amendment?

45:00So Billings and Richardson and Chu and Gibson

45:04and Alt and Bousatil.

45:06I'm sorry, I should have done the numbers with my six.

45:09Okay. So that fails.

45:10So the amendment passes.

45:12Okay.

45:12So now I'm going to call the vote if that's okay

45:14on the main motion as amended.

45:17I had 20,000.

45:18Okay. Is anyone against that?

45:21Okay. Gibson and Keaton and Billings and Richardson and Chu

45:26and Bousatil and Alt.

45:30Did I just, that's a seven?

45:33Okay. It fails.

45:34Okay. Thank you everybody.

45:46All right.

45:47Guller and bike and bike lanes snow, snow plowing

45:51for bike lanes.

45:52You okay councillor Goller if you go?

45:54Absolutely. Thank you.

45:54It is number one everybody.

45:57First of all, do you have a seconder?

45:59I believe I do.

46:01Councillor Allt.

46:02Okay. Alt will second.

46:04Go ahead.

46:05We've heard from all the delegates.

46:06We know how important it is for our community

46:08that we maintain the winter maintenance for bicycle lanes.

46:13I did go back and forth with staff several times

46:16making sure and as I understand it, it is the whole amount.

46:20We're not able to divide this.

46:22I was thinking, you know, could we do the main roads?

46:24Could we just do, you know, the arterials?

46:27Could we, but it's the way that it works.

46:29We, they're putting the 650 or we have no maintenance

46:32for active transportation bicycle lanes on the streets.

46:37So I asked my council colleagues to support this.

46:41Thank you, worship.

46:44Any questions or comments on this one?

46:48All right. We'll go as a Quran first and then Gibson.

46:53Yes. Thank you, Mr.

46:55And I mean, I see the amount and I understand why

46:58in the community and amongst councillor,

46:59we have some concerns about the amount.

47:02We've built the infrastructure and in any other infrastructure

47:06project in the city, if we build it, we maintain it.

47:10There may be a lot of commentary if I don't see people using

47:13bike lanes in the wintertime.

47:14And I just want to say that as a representative of Ward 5,

47:18I commute from my home to the university and along College Ave

47:23where we've just built new bicycle infrastructure,

47:26where we have a post-secondary institution,

47:28two secondary schools, and three elementary schools.

47:31And I see teens, young adults and children riding their bikes

47:35in the winter during my morning commute.

47:38So those bike lanes are used.

47:40And what I worry about most is that those cyclists

47:43are going to be in our roadways.

47:45They have a right under the Highway Traffic Act

47:47to take a full lane of traffic.

47:49And so this for me is a safety vote

47:52because I do see those lanes being used on a daily basis

47:55for people commuting to school.

47:59Thank you. Gibson and then Alt.

48:02Thank you, Mr. Mayor.

48:03I appreciate the thought and sentiment, Councillor Goller.

48:06My comments are not personal.

48:08I'll make sure that I say that.

48:10I understand I'm up against a little bit of ideology

48:13or maybe even some orthodoxy on cycling in our community

48:16when I say these comments.

48:17But I mean them sincerely.

48:19The most common sense approach that I've seen brought to this item

48:21was a motorcyclist came to me.

48:24And they said, Dan, every motorcyclist

48:27understands that on two wheels,

48:30you are not to be on a slick, wet, icy path.

48:34That's the most dangerous thing to do.

48:35No motorcyclist with sort of a lot of common sense

48:41will do that in the winter months

48:42because of the dangers they represent.

48:44You're sharing the road with other vehicles.

48:46You're sharing the road with other people.

48:47It's just not a safe environment.

48:49The idea of encouraging, and again,

48:51in the context of a net zero, sorry,

48:53our vision zero approach to pedestrian and encyclical safety

48:57on our roads, the idea of not just maintaining

49:01but encouraging cycling during that two and a half month winter

49:06where we have snow banks,

49:08encouraging them to use the infrastructure.

49:11I just, it just creates so many safety concerns.

49:13These are two wheel vehicles on our roads

49:16or on the shoulders of our roads or in their own bike lanes,

49:18but they're most times just painted lines on the road.

49:22I just, from a straight common sense perspective,

49:26I just don't see encouraging that sort of form of transportation

49:32during that dead of winter on our roads.

49:35Separated bike lanes, perhaps trails perhaps, but on roads.

49:41I'm gonna side with the motorcyclists

49:42who are telling me it's not safe.

49:44Two wheels on roads is not safe.

49:46You're talking about bike lanes beside the roads.

49:48It's still not safe.

49:49So I know that's up against a lot of opposing opinions,

49:53but that's how I feel.

49:55Okay, no, thank you.

49:57Chu, you wanted to jump in on this and then Alt.

50:00Through you, Mr. Mayor.

50:01Just a question of clarity of staff.

50:04The multi-use paths, sidewalks, they will be plowed.

50:07Is that correct?

50:09Through the mayor to councillor Chew, yes.

50:10This is about the on-road infrastructure.

50:13Okay, yeah, that's good to know.

50:16I guess for me, just seeing some of the work on Scottsdale,

50:21like I think it's great that we have separation there.

50:23I do agree as well that there are road users,

50:26students in particular that do use that,

50:28but the way I see it is it's a seasonal infrastructure.

50:31And I feel like the level of service that it gets

50:34gets often triage and that's no disparity to staff.

50:38They do great work on the roads.

50:40I just see the stuff on Scottsdale as a big example

50:45as seasonal infrastructure.

50:47And I think it's up to every individual's discrepancy

50:51whether to use it.

50:52And I think we've seen the very low usage of that,

50:55especially in the wintertime.

50:57So I'm comfortable not supporting for those reasons.

51:00And it's for a practical standpoint.

51:05Okay, thank you.

51:07I'll turn, Kate, on the screen there.

51:09Thank you very much, Mayor Guthrie.

51:11Just comments.

51:13For me, the issue is safety and accessibility.

51:16And what I am extremely concerned about

51:19is not just active transit,

51:21but actually day-to-day transportation,

51:24in particular mobility devices.

51:25And I have real concerns about cyclists

51:28getting up onto sidewalks.

51:30Just on the way in, on the radio in Toronto,

51:34I was hearing about injuries and deaths

51:36as a consequence of inaccessibility to bike lanes.

51:41My concern truly is that what we do

51:44is that we tend to exacerbate both cyclists

51:47and others that have motorized vehicles

51:50of some type, getting up onto sidewalks

51:53and creating a hazard for pedestrians.

51:56And as I said, I wanna repeat that mobility devices

51:59are going to be used year-round.

52:01And we need to ensure that we are being mindful

52:04that they're not just being used on sidewalks,

52:06they're also being used on what we call cycle paths.

52:10They really are multi-purpose paths,

52:11if we wanna be perfectly honest.

52:13And we separate them from vehicles which go faster,

52:16cars, bikes, motorcycles, trucks, et cetera.

52:20I think that this is a safety issue for us.

52:24Okay, thank you.

52:24And Kate, please.

52:27Thank you, Mr. Mayor.

52:29Similar to Councillor Allt,

52:30I do find this as an accessibility issue

52:33and an equity issue.

52:35I know while they're not officially recognized,

52:37I use my E-Trike and I met a woman

52:40who was there at the Emma Earl Street Bridge opening

52:43who uses her E-Trike as an accessibility device.

52:47So rather than walking around on the sidewalks in winter,

52:51potentially slipping on that,

52:52it's a lot more stable to be on three wheels,

52:56on the bike paths to be able to get around.

52:58So I think that while it's not as visibly prevalent

53:03as car users, they're just as deserving as snow clearing.

53:08So I'll be supporting this.

53:09Thank you.

53:11Thank you.

53:13I am so sorry.

53:14I should have boosted it till.

53:15Thank you for reminding me.

53:16And then I just saw another hand go up.

53:19Did I not?

53:21Okay.

53:22Circling to Gibson at the end here.

53:24Go ahead.

53:25Thank you.

53:26And through the mayor, I'm really struggling with this.

53:28And Ward 4, and I, Councillor Billings can confirm this.

53:32I think we get daily, you know,

53:34at least half a dozen emails about Silver Creek

53:38and Ward 4 bike lanes and complaints about this.

53:41And please don't support this.

53:43I understand completely about, you know,

53:46when we prepare a budget, it's for the city as a whole.

53:48And I agree with safety and accessibility.

53:51I'm really torn on how,

53:53because my residents are saying, do not vote for this.

53:56This is not the time to vote for this.

53:59But at the same time,

53:59I understand about safety and accessibility for all.

54:02Good for all.

54:05Thank you.

54:07And I guess I'm going back to Gibson.

54:10Yeah.

54:10And I'm circling to Gibson then.

54:13Go ahead.

54:15I just want to make sure we're focusing the conversation

54:18on the actual premise.

54:20And I don't want to conflate it

54:21into anything that it's not.

54:22So I heard staff say that this is specific

54:25to on-road bike lanes.

54:27So I've heard a couple of times in this discussion already,

54:30the multi-use path, and I've heard it slipped in.

54:33And that's not what we're talking about.

54:34Multi-use paths will be maintained.

54:37So I just, again, I don't want to do the political,

54:41you open it up to bigger conversations.

54:43It's not, it's on-road, painted lines.

54:47Bike lanes, not separated bike lanes,

54:50bike lanes on the road.

54:51And multi-use paths are covered and sidewalks are covered.

54:54I've heard that from staff.

54:55So let's just keep the focus on,

54:57these are on-road bike lanes.

54:59Thank you.

55:01Okay. And then Chu had a comment as well.

55:04And then Downer, please.

55:05And then now I'm circling again.

55:07I have to always say circling when I go back.

55:09Yeah, but okay, no problem to Karan.

55:11Chu?

55:12Yeah, I think just to solidify that comment,

55:15if this implicated multi-use paths and sidewalks,

55:20it would be a major safety issue.

55:22I'm a big active transportation supporter.

55:25And I just feel like from a practical perspective,

55:29these are some monies that could be saved

55:31on seasonal infrastructure that people acknowledge.

55:35Most people acknowledge is seasonal infrastructure.

55:39And I think we just have to look at the design

55:42of these road configurations to help us make a determination.

55:46And that's why I'm comfortable.

55:49So I just want to share that perspective for you.

55:51All right.

55:53Thank you.

55:54Downer, and then back to Karan and then to Alt.

56:00So thanks.

56:01I have been back and forth on this,

56:02but I think I'm going to support it.

56:04I'm just listening.

56:06I understand the multi-use,

56:08but only part of college is on the multi-use path.

56:12The rest from Edinburgh West is a line on the road.

56:19And I would also point out that the biggest spine

56:23in the city is Gordon Street and Woolwich.

56:27And Gordon Street, there are a lot,

56:31having lived right by it.

56:33And when I come to City Hall,

56:34I come out this way onto Gordon.

56:37There are, and I have to be careful in the winter,

56:40there are a lot of cyclists going up Gordon Street Hill

56:44and coming down Gordon Street Hill in the winter.

56:46And when it's not plowed, they are on the street.

56:50And Gordon's not that wide.

56:52You get buses coming up and down every 15 minutes.

56:58I do think it is a safety issue.

57:00And the thought of not having that plowed on Gordon

57:05or College West where there's a lot of high school students

57:09that use it as well is of concern for me.

57:15Okay, thank you.

57:17I believe I'm to question from Ron and then to Alt.

57:22It's just a question because if this motion fails,

57:25it's all or nothing.

57:26And I know staff had given us an answer

57:28of why we can't separate it,

57:29but given Councillor Downer's comments about the spine

57:33and knowing that that's where the volume of traffic is,

57:36do we have an estimate of what just Gordon Street

57:40and Woolwich would cost?

57:42Because if this fails, I'm contemplating another motion

57:48just to fund for clearing Gordon and Woolwich only,

57:52just the spine route.

57:54So through the mayor and to the councillor,

57:56so we haven't costed that because that's not something

57:58that we can easily do.

58:00As we provided on the budget board,

58:01there's a couple of considerations.

58:03One, we would be very, very concerned

58:05that if we're only announcing to the public

58:07that certain roads are closed,

58:09certain bike lanes are closed, they might go down Gordon,

58:11but then turn right onto another road and not realize

58:14and then there would be,

58:15we would have significant concerns

58:16about public expectations.

58:19But, and I've, Councillor Goller mentioned this,

58:22the way that we handle the bike lanes is it's a per shift thing

58:28we can't predict, we can't pull half of person

58:31off of winter control route.

58:34And so the way we do this is with one person

58:37and one vehicle who works on all of our winter control shifts

58:41to do those bike lanes.

58:42And so it isn't something that we could easily then

58:44just split off and divide up.

58:46So it is that to Councillor Goller's point,

58:48it is, it's a totality that we need to do.

58:53Okay, understood.

58:54And I think it's important to have that explanation

58:57out in the public realm.

58:58Thank you.

59:01Alts, I think is better wrap it up.

59:03Thank you.

59:04The first comment is actually it's a question to staff

59:09and I have to confess that I don't know the answer

59:11at all to this.

59:13Do we have a number of bicycle couriers in the city?

59:19I don't recall seeing any,

59:21but I'm wondering if it's just that I haven't noticed.

59:23And I'm concerned about that as an issue of commerce as well.

59:37Through the mayor, we don't know the answer

59:40to that question, I don't think.

59:42Okay, thank you.

59:43That's fine, but I just want to clarify

59:45that my concern is main roads.

59:49I had already asked staff whether it was possible

59:51to transfer money from our maintenance of pathways,

59:55but it's main roads that are the concern.

59:57Living very close to Woolwich and Gordon,

59:59I can express with a great deal of confidence

1:00:03that there are people that are riding their mobility devices

1:00:07down the road the wrong way throughout the year.

1:00:11And that's a real concern to me.

1:00:13I know that it's illegal, but it doesn't matter.

1:00:16They're still going to do it.

1:00:17And the reality is that people take the most direct route

1:00:20to wherever it is they're going.

1:00:22So consequently, I think we need to be mindful,

1:00:24not so much of active transit as we are mindful of safety.

1:00:30And in my view, an obligation to ensure

1:00:34that our roadways, our sidewalks, and our bike paths

1:00:38are safe 12 months of the year.

1:00:43All right, let's call the vote on this, okay?

1:00:50I'm just going to call it right now.

1:00:53So if those that are against adding back in the $650,000

1:00:58to snowplow bike lanes, please raise your hand.

1:01:03All right, Richardson and Chew and Gibson and Billings

1:01:07and Guthrie and Hauser and Busatil.

1:01:12So that fails.

1:01:14Okay, moving right along.

1:01:22Let's maybe just get some of these other ones.

1:01:26I don't mean out of the way in a bad way,

1:01:28but just that they are, I think,

1:01:29they're really kind of non-budgetary,

1:01:33but I think is, in my view, easily achievable.

1:01:40Kate and I'm going to throw it back to you

1:01:42on the Sloan Park, because they're not really

1:01:472026 budgeting impacts.

1:01:49So I think in my view, they're pretty easy for us.

1:01:52It's amendment number seven, everybody.

1:01:55And I think with Gibson, like the second,

1:01:58that makes sense, it's your combined ward.

1:02:01I'll turn it over to you, Kate,

1:02:04if you want to just give a little blurb about that.

1:02:06Thank you.

1:02:08So my amendment is that the design

1:02:09and community engagement works as previously approved

1:02:11for Sloan Hill Park continue as led by Park staff.

1:02:14So that means that the budget for the design portion

1:02:17of it was already in the budget for next year.

1:02:19So that will just continue the public feedback,

1:02:22the design, all of that will happen in the next year.

1:02:25That doesn't have any budget impact on the next year

1:02:27because it's already included.

1:02:29And that council respectfully requested

1:02:30that mayor considers increasing the 2027 operating budget

1:02:34by 18,000 for capital financing transfers

1:02:40to the gross reserve funded by the tax levy

1:02:42through the 2027 budget update

1:02:44and advancing capital project Beaumont Park from 2028

1:02:48to 2027 and the amount of 815,000,

1:02:52including rubber servicing with operating impacts

1:02:54of 14,700 moving from 2029 to 2028 funded by the tax levy.

1:03:00So it had been pushed back by two years

1:03:04based on some issues with an encroachment,

1:03:07but after talking to Park staff,

1:03:09they believe that it's possible

1:03:10that that encroachment issue can be dealt with

1:03:13within the next year during the feedback time.

1:03:16So we'll be able to move it back into 2027

1:03:22so that we don't have an extra two year delay

1:03:25for that project because that particular neighborhood

1:03:28has very, very few public service options.

1:03:31There's not a lot of green space

1:03:33and it's something that the neighborhood

1:03:35has been looking forward to for a very long time.

1:03:37Thank you.

1:03:41Okay, Gibson as well.

1:03:44Yep, thank you through you, Mr. Mayor.

1:03:46I just personally want to thank my,

1:03:48my ward mate for their work on this.

1:03:50Thank you, Councillor Caton.

1:03:51Appreciate you keeping this front of mind.

1:03:53It's an important piece to that neighborhood.

1:03:56I think that just going back over 10 years

1:03:59on that neighborhood that we've understood,

1:04:02we've, I guess justified and we've done some planning

1:04:07on the parks, the community feature park,

1:04:10the community's been patient and I do appreciate

1:04:13it staying on the radar and staying in the short term

1:04:16for that community.

1:04:17Cause I think it is a missing piece to that neighborhood.

1:04:20So thank you.

1:04:22All right, thank you both.

1:04:24Are we good everybody on this one?

1:04:26Yeah.

1:04:27Okay, I'm going to call the vote.

1:04:29Is anyone against these two motions

1:04:31in regards to Sloan Park?

1:04:34Nobody that passes.

1:04:37Thank you.

1:04:38I'm going to run to Councillor Caron now,

1:04:41amendment number nine.

1:04:43Again, this has to do with the bicentennial,

1:04:45but not really nine impacts for 2026.

1:04:51Just kind of outlying kind of the next couple of years.

1:04:53So I'll turn it over to you.

1:04:56I believe Councillor Downer would probably be okay

1:04:58to second again.

1:05:01Kathy, you good?

1:05:02Yeah, okay.

1:05:02Thanks and no narrative on this one.

1:05:05So don't worry folks.

1:05:07These are just adjustments to ensure that the 2026 offset

1:05:11happens using savings from the unspent portion of 2025.

1:05:16And the second one is that once we've done all the planning,

1:05:19we need to execute all those plans.

1:05:21So the 2027 mount to be restored.

1:05:24And then because this is a one time,

1:05:26once in a century event in 2028,

1:05:28we would reduce the tax liby portion by 500,000

1:05:32to remove all of that.

1:05:34And that'll have an impact in 2028.

1:05:37Perfect.

1:05:39Again, I think pretty straightforward, right?

1:05:41Everybody, okay.

1:05:42I'm going to call the vote on this one then.

1:05:44Is anyone against?

1:05:48That's passes unanimously as well.

1:05:50Thank you, Councillor Caron.

1:05:53Why don't we go to Billings?

1:05:57Why not?

1:05:59Number 13.

1:06:01So this has to do with the hospital levy.

1:06:04And the hospital levy, as we know for the last few years,

1:06:07has been $750,000.

1:06:09I contacted the foundation and the CEO at the hospital

1:06:14asking if we could get a little bit of help this year

1:06:17with impacts because of the budget.

1:06:20And there was an agreement there

1:06:22that we could do half in 2026, half in 2027,

1:06:27still totaling the 750 and our commitment that we made.

1:06:32And luckily, the CEO of the hospital

1:06:35was here on delegation night, Councillor Billings asked.

1:06:38So it's all on record that this is a go, okay?

1:06:42So there is, well, so of course it's up to us.

1:06:46It's a go, but it's up to us.

1:06:48So Councillor Billings, I know is gonna move it.

1:06:51Do we have a second?

1:06:52Okay.

1:06:53Mr. Mayor, Councillor Gibson said he would second this.

1:06:58Okay.

1:06:59I'll turn it over to you then.

1:07:01Councillor Billings, if you wanna have a little blurb

1:07:03before we call the vote.

1:07:04Well, thank you very much, Mr. Mayor,

1:07:06but you already did the blurb.

1:07:08Just smooth it out over the two years instead of one year

1:07:12and then taking it out of the 2028 budget.

1:07:15So anything to help?

1:07:20All right, thank you.

1:07:22Is there anything more on this one at all?

1:07:25Gibson?

1:07:26Yeah, thank you, Mr. Mayor.

1:07:27I'm doing more talking today than I normally do.

1:07:29I had a great conversation with the constituent

1:07:31a couple of weeks back

1:07:32and they asked about a second hospital.

1:07:34They said, where's the second hospital?

1:07:35Where's the second hospital?

1:07:36And I said, I'm really sorry to burst your bubble.

1:07:38Like, but we have to start talking reality here.

1:07:41Like London has a second hospital, they have 500,000 people.

1:07:44I think Brampton has a second hospital.

1:07:46Like some of the major cities in Ontario

1:07:48are starting to get second hospitals.

1:07:49But what we can do is start planning for a growth

1:07:53of our existing hospital.

1:07:54Maybe not like come back when you've got 300,000 people

1:07:58and we'll start talking about maybe a second hospital.

1:08:00That's my personal opinion.

1:08:01Might not be shared, but I think talking about

1:08:03and just getting rallying around the idea

1:08:05of expanding our existing hospital

1:08:07does have community support.

1:08:08I think that that's a major piece.

1:08:10So I appreciate this and I appreciate the hospital CAO

1:08:14coming and sharing the ability to spread this

1:08:16out over two years.

1:08:18I get excited about the thought of an expansion

1:08:20at the hospital and I just want to on the record,

1:08:23this is the conversation I have when people ask me

1:08:25about a second hospital.

1:08:26I tried to temper expectations,

1:08:28but that we should get behind expanding

1:08:30our existing hospital.

1:08:31So thank you for the moment.

1:08:33All right, thank you.

1:08:35Look, while I got the mic, just give me 20 more seconds.

1:08:38I think it's important on the public record here

1:08:40to remind everyone there were three capital projects,

1:08:44three renovations that the money

1:08:47that we committed to went to.

1:08:49A new nursery, a new emergency room,

1:08:54and mental health beds, new mental health beds, okay?

1:08:59The total cost of that is well over $50, $60 million,

1:09:04but the hospital came to us and asked for $4.5 million

1:09:08and we said yes.

1:09:10So we are fulfilling that commitment that was asked for,

1:09:14okay, because if you go today,

1:09:17there is a brand new nursery, okay?

1:09:19And soon, because you can see it,

1:09:21it's under construction right now,

1:09:23the emergency room and the mental health beds,

1:09:25it's happening.

1:09:26So we did care about that issue as a council

1:09:32and we're looking to fulfill that commitment.

1:09:36I am going to go out on a limb though

1:09:41and I am going to ask for this to be separated.

1:09:47I am of the belief that the levy should possibly continue.

1:09:54Now, a new council could figure out

1:09:57what they want to do on how much, that's fine,

1:10:00but I am not going to vote in favor of number three

1:10:07because I think I would like to continue

1:10:10to send a signal to the province

1:10:14that this community is dedicated to something

1:10:17in regards to a new hospital or it's new healthcare.

1:10:21Yes, we can argue all day about it should be

1:10:25fully under the province, yes.

1:10:28But I will tell you, the communities

1:10:31that have come forward with something

1:10:34to send a signal to the province

1:10:36vote much better than those that don't.

1:10:39And so it can be a discussion of the next term of council.

1:10:43They can take it out then, they can amend it up,

1:10:46they can amend it down, whatever they want.

1:10:48But at this point, I would like to signal a little bit

1:10:51that we're still in the game.

1:10:52So I'm going to vote against number three,

1:10:57but I'll support the first two, okay?

1:11:01With that, I guess we don't need to separate all three

1:11:04since I just mentioned number one and two seem okay.

1:11:09Is that okay with everybody?

1:11:10So, okay, councillor Claeser?

1:11:13Yes, through you, Mr. Mayor.

1:11:14I just wanted to ask councillor Billings

1:11:16before we separate them out.

1:11:19Is that the intention of number three

1:11:20to end the levy in 2028?

1:11:25Just for clarity.

1:11:29Through you, Mr. Mayor, it was,

1:11:31as you know, these clauses came from staff.

1:11:34So it's just a technical reason for the budgeting process

1:11:38that they added clause three.

1:11:41I understand where the mayor is coming from with clause three.

1:11:44However, it reads that council respectfully requests

1:11:48that the mayor decreases the hospital levy in 2028.

1:11:52Doesn't mean that the mayor has to.

1:11:54It's just a consideration.

1:11:57So whether you support it or not,

1:11:59it's still up to the mayor in dealing with the 2028 budget.

1:12:08Okay, so that is technically correct.

1:12:12And yes, it came from staff

1:12:14because it is kind of an administrative sort of wrap up

1:12:16of the commitment.

1:12:17That's kind of why it's worded that way.

1:12:20I would still stand that I think it's important

1:12:24to send the signal and that's why I won't support

1:12:26that last one.

1:12:27So I'm gonna call the vote on number one and number two, okay?

1:12:31And is anyone against that?

1:12:35Okay, so that's unanimous.

1:12:37And then on number three, I'll call the vote on that.

1:12:40Is anyone against that one?

1:12:42Please raise your hand.

1:12:44Okay, so Richardson and Gawler and Hauser and Guthrie.

1:12:50So that fails.

1:12:51Okay, so that means it means still the next council

1:12:54can discuss it if they want,

1:12:56but it means that that commitment is gonna wrap up.

1:12:59Okay, thank you very much, Councillor Billings.

1:13:04We're gonna jump to amendment number 15.

1:13:09Councillor Chew, this is yours.

1:13:13And this is in regards to removing the CBA opportunity

1:13:23for the climate change and energy for an agency

1:13:28or community group to amplify the work

1:13:32that the city is doing.

1:13:33Let me see if you have a seconder.

1:13:35And do you already know if you have a seconder?

1:13:37Okay, so Gibson will second.

1:13:40Go ahead, Councillor Chew.

1:13:41You can give a little blurb on that if you want.

1:13:44Yeah, through you, Mr. Mayor.

1:13:45I just feel like we've done a great amount

1:13:49of work this term of council.

1:13:50And it's, I think in part because of the advocacy

1:13:54of folks like Councillor Kerron.

1:13:56And I think we have done a really great job

1:13:58under the leadership of some of our staff,

1:14:00like Ryan Huyang, sort of the Home Energy Retrofit Design

1:14:04Program, expanded EV charging strategy.

1:14:07There's a lot of great work in-house

1:14:09that people are already looking at

1:14:13to our municipality as an example.

1:14:15And I just see this as a trade-off rate.

1:14:17We just funded a staff position for the bicentennial.

1:14:22That's $47,000.

1:14:24And I think we can save an additional just $28,000

1:14:29if we look at this, if we look at deleting this.

1:14:33That's just my commentary on this.

1:14:36A lot of good policy work that's already been done

1:14:38is being looked at by other places.

1:14:40And we already have a lot of great work happening

1:14:43at the rec center and the Baker Street District

1:14:45with energy efficiencies.

1:14:48So, okay.

1:14:50Okay, thank you.

1:14:52Gowler, Boussatou and then Gibson.

1:14:57Blas.

1:14:58Thank you, Your Worship.

1:14:59Welcome over here.

1:15:00Okay.

1:15:00Thank you, Councillor Lutjou.

1:15:01I appreciate you bringing this forward

1:15:03for the conversation.

1:15:05I will ask my council colleagues not to support this.

1:15:08The $75,000 is meant to support our community

1:15:12in the transformation to meet our commitment

1:15:16to become a net zero community.

1:15:19The work of the city, as much as we've just approved

1:15:21$500,000 per year, will only get us two to three,

1:15:26maybe 4% of the community.

1:15:28If every city facility becomes energy neutral,

1:15:32if once we built out our bus fleet,

1:15:35the vast majority of emissions

1:15:36still rely with the community.

1:15:39If we do not support our community to move that forward,

1:15:42then we're not going to meet our goals

1:15:45as that we have said as council.

1:15:48I mean, I would be even happy to find this money

1:15:51from somewhere else,

1:15:52but I think we do need to put it forward

1:15:54for our community to drive forward

1:15:57those carbon reduction strategies.

1:16:00All right, moving along, Gibson,

1:16:03Gibson, I'm sorry, Bousatil, then Gibson.

1:16:07Thank you, and through the mayor,

1:16:08I'm just going to echo what Councillor Goller said,

1:16:11and I want to thank the mayor

1:16:11for putting this into the budget.

1:16:13What's key in this is community.

1:16:15It's not city, it's the community part,

1:16:17and I know that other community agencies,

1:16:20our hospitals, university, our school boards

1:16:22are also working on climate change initiatives,

1:16:27and this is an opportunity for leadership

1:16:29to step forward and say, okay, how do we roll this up?

1:16:32How do we put this all together?

1:16:34How do we become efficient and effective

1:16:37in our efforts to address climate change?

1:16:41So I will be supporting this.

1:16:42This is a nominal amount,

1:16:44and in future, hopefully the groups collectively

1:16:47will be able to look at supporting the work.

1:16:52And just to be clear,

1:16:53when you say I will be supporting this,

1:16:55you mean you will support the program,

1:16:56but not support the motion to remove it?

1:16:59Okay, just want to make sure we're capturing that.

1:17:01Gibson then Colossum.

1:17:03Yeah, thank you, through you, Mr. Mayor.

1:17:05So I do appreciate Councillor Chew's thoughts here

1:17:08because we're challenging,

1:17:10just because the title is associated

1:17:14with climate change action,

1:17:15doesn't necessarily mean

1:17:16that we shouldn't challenge the budget item.

1:17:18So I do appreciate that.

1:17:20A question to staff, this is getting to my point.

1:17:23What is the current work from home sort of ratio

1:17:27of our staff coming in and out of City Hall?

1:17:30Is it three days a week in the office,

1:17:32two days a week from home?

1:17:33Is that generally what you're going with?

1:17:35So through the Mayor to Councillor Gibson,

1:17:39we have a policy that at least two days in the office,

1:17:44but I will say that that really only applies

1:17:47to a very small part of our employment base.

1:17:50So, but yes, for certain groups.

1:17:55You're approving my point too.

1:17:56It's great.

1:17:57That does not mean to put you on the spot.

1:17:59So I have a two day from work home policy at my work.

1:18:02I'm in the office three days a week.

1:18:04That has taken my carbon footprint

1:18:07associated with my personal vehicle down 40%.

1:18:11I know that it never breaks the other way.

1:18:13Staff don't start showing up four days a week

1:18:15when they only have to be in the office two days a week.

1:18:17It's usually two days a week.

1:18:18So you can see these little wins

1:18:21on the climate change front across the entire spectrum.

1:18:24You only have to take a drive on the 401

1:18:25during rush hour now to realize our carbon footprint

1:18:28from our vehicle usage across the province

1:18:31is down significantly.

1:18:34So I would argue that probably our carbon footprint

1:18:37associated with our staff

1:18:39with any kind of work from home policy across the board

1:18:41is probably 50% improved over the last three, four,

1:18:45five years.

1:18:46That being said, like those are wins

1:18:48that we don't talk about.

1:18:50So needing a $75,000 line item to create a CBA

1:18:54to talk about wins.

1:18:55I think I've just talked about probably half a million

1:18:58dollars worth of value in carbon offsets

1:19:00in the last 30 seconds.

1:19:01We do not need a $75,000 line item

1:19:05to talk about the things that we're doing in the community.

1:19:08It's already happening.

1:19:09We just need to voice them more.

1:19:12So I'm with Councillor Chew.

1:19:14I know it looks painful to take $75,000 at a climate action.

1:19:18It's not, it's a budget item and it's just removing that.

1:19:20So I appreciate it. Thank you.

1:19:23I thank you at class and then Karon.

1:19:26Yes. Thank you through you, Mr. Mayor.

1:19:29I will be supporting,

1:19:30I will not be supporting this motion.

1:19:32I'm just going back to the strategic plan

1:19:34and why we added empower the community

1:19:39to help create a sustainable city within,

1:19:41it's embedded within the Strat Plan.

1:19:43I was thinking back to when we did that planning.

1:19:46And I think the addition of the 75K

1:19:49is a start for empowering the community.

1:19:52I think it directly empowers groups

1:19:54to be able to continue this work.

1:19:57And I do applaud, you know,

1:19:59trying to reduce budget line items.

1:20:01So I see where the intention was coming from,

1:20:04but in this case, I won't be able to support it.

1:20:07Okay. Thank you.

1:20:08Karon, all then Chu.

1:20:11Yes. Thank you, Mr. Mayor.

1:20:12Consistently through this budget,

1:20:14I've been supporting or not supporting

1:20:16based on efficiencies, based on return on investment.

1:20:19And so for this particular item,

1:20:21we know, and I won't go through all the stats

1:20:23that I did in my previous motion,

1:20:24but we know that investing in climate action

1:20:28is our best return on investment longterm.

1:20:32But this one in particular, the community energy CBA,

1:20:35isn't about getting together in a room and talking about it.

1:20:37It's about actually doing it and collecting data.

1:20:40And so to say that we've reduced our carbon footprint by 40%

1:20:43because some of our in-house office workers

1:20:47are working from home,

1:20:48we don't have data to support that statement.

1:20:51So the CBA is replacing what we used to already have.

1:20:55We had an R&G, R&G Guelph.

1:20:57We had data collection.

1:20:59We had strategic initiatives that we were following.

1:21:02And then we had some savings when that organization ceased.

1:21:08And this is to pick up where we left off.

1:21:11So I see this as a key investment in future savings,

1:21:15longterm good bang for the buck for the city of Guelph.

1:21:18Thank you.

1:21:20Alton, then Chu.

1:21:21Thank you, Mayor Guthrie.

1:21:22I would almost say Ditto on some of my colleagues,

1:21:25but first of all, I'll have a question for the staff.

1:21:31What would be the impact on our overall budget

1:21:35of reducing it by $75,000?

1:21:39Through the mayor, just one moment please,

1:21:41and I'll get my calculator.

1:21:42Thank you.

1:21:43And while you're doing it to other staff,

1:21:46from what I understand is this money

1:21:50is for a significant data collection purpose.

1:21:53I was wondering if staff could at all comment on how this,

1:21:57what the implications would be if we were to remove this

1:22:00from the overall intention,

1:22:03which is to reduce our carbon use everywhere.

1:22:11Through the mayor, the council are also with respect

1:22:14to the funding for the CBA.

1:22:16Certainly that's work that we would do

1:22:18over the course of the year with the CBA framework.

1:22:20And so that scoping exercise still needs to occur

1:22:23in terms of what that $75,000 does,

1:22:25but it's all about moving the community

1:22:28called a climate action forward

1:22:29and the partnerships that can come from that.

1:22:31And so that's what the funds go towards.

1:22:33So it's not taking away something

1:22:36that is already using data collection aspects of our work.

1:22:44Chu, then Downer, please.

1:22:47Oh, okay, yeah, for sure.

1:22:49Did you figure out what the impact would be?

1:22:51I did, thank you through the mayor.

1:22:52It's 0.02%.

1:22:55Thank you very much, our 50 cents per Guelph resident.

1:22:57Thank you.

1:22:59Okay, it's Councillor Chew and then Councillor Downer.

1:23:05And then I think I can wrap it up, okay?

1:23:10Look, I think I'm maybe, through you, Mr. Mayor,

1:23:13I think I'm just very blessed to have Electra

1:23:16and Gulf Hydro at my ward.

1:23:17So I get to go to them every quarter.

1:23:22And I would just say, if you guys aren't aware,

1:23:24that they do have a government relations staff person

1:23:30that has always, how do I put this?

1:23:35They already do this work.

1:23:36Electra does this work already.

1:23:38They've invested just in last year, $59,000 in Guelph

1:23:43for these community initiatives already.

1:23:45And they do go to classrooms.

1:23:46They do do these educational training.

1:23:51And I just feel like we're creating a redundant program

1:23:54to what they're doing.

1:23:55And I feel like they could be doing it much better.

1:23:59And for us, our purpose and our responsibility

1:24:02is to provide good in-house knowledge,

1:24:05which we're already doing through Brian's team.

1:24:08So I just feel like this is very marginal savings,

1:24:12but it just shows us that we are looking at trade-offs

1:24:19judiciously.

1:24:20You sold me on the bicentennial.

1:24:23Okay, so this is really realistically $28,000 of savings

1:24:28for work that already is happening in the community.

1:24:31And I want to encourage you to take a visit

1:24:33to Electra, Gulf Hydro.

1:24:35They invest over a million dollars every year

1:24:38into this stuff.

1:24:40Okay, and it's across the province.

1:24:42It's consistent.

1:24:43So I just don't think we need to replicate this stuff

1:24:45in-house and it's very practical.

1:24:48I'm all about energy efficiency, training,

1:24:51climate change, my family's business.

1:24:53We undergo the step code program in BC for our clients.

1:25:02Just some perspective for everyone to consider.

1:25:08I feel like we can play a role in amplifying

1:25:12these messageings without this budget asked this year.

1:25:17That's really what it comes down to.

1:25:19Yeah, okay.

1:25:21Thank you and Downer's gonna wrap it up here.

1:25:23Yeah.

1:25:24While I'm lying on the call point.

1:25:25I appreciate the intent, but won't support the motion.

1:25:28I think I just keep thinking back to those of us

1:25:31that went on the tour with the Gulf Junction Railway at PDI

1:25:36and the kind of work that they were doing.

1:25:40And it's not just about electrical,

1:25:42though they were putting solar panels on every building

1:25:44and they were retrofitting their existing trucks

1:25:46and they were looking at buying and just the data

1:25:50and the information they had and the discussion we had

1:25:53about potentials for partnership and mentoring

1:25:56in the industrial sector and Guelph

1:25:59and the commercial sectors and where that could go.

1:26:02I think this is important.

1:26:04We've been talking for years about

1:26:07and the community has been asking for years.

1:26:10City, you're doing a great job on your building

1:26:14on in your part, but what about the community?

1:26:16How are we gonna get the community engaged in this?

1:26:19And so I think this is a small part of moving towards that.

1:26:25Okay, before I call the vote,

1:26:26is there anybody else before I just say something?

1:26:29No, okay.

1:26:31So because this was part of the mayor's budget,

1:26:35I feel I've compelled to defend it.

1:26:38So no one asked like on council for this,

1:26:44no one in the community asked me for this

1:26:46as we were crafting the budget.

1:26:48But councillor Downer is 100% right.

1:26:50This has been sort of organically asked for

1:26:53within the community for,

1:26:55I'm gonna say four or five years now at least,

1:26:58more strongly in the last four, five years.

1:27:00And as Councillor Goller said correctly,

1:27:03and we all know this,

1:27:04we are like 3% of the sort of issue.

1:27:09And we are owning that 3% very well.

1:27:12I think we're doing really good work

1:27:14on the things that we own.

1:27:17But I put this in because I think this is something

1:27:22where we need to have the community group or agency

1:27:25amplify what we are doing so that people are much more

1:27:28aware of what they can do to join in

1:27:32on this collective sort of goals of trying to meet

1:27:35some of the mitigation and climate change actions

1:27:38that we're trying to take.

1:27:40And I also know that our CBAs always have accountability

1:27:45built into them.

1:27:46They will show back in reporting, what did they do?

1:27:49What impact did they have?

1:27:51And that's always under the microscope

1:27:53that we could then stop it if for some reason

1:27:56or whatever group is not doing an appropriate job.

1:27:59But I can tell you that I think this is something

1:28:03that is important.

1:28:05It has been talked about for a while.

1:28:07And I think I would also like to just say that

1:28:15Councillor Chew, I wanna respect the fact

1:28:17that you are looking for such little items like this,

1:28:21but it's not, it's $75,000 and I respect that.

1:28:25Like we, you know, Councillor, all mentioned

1:28:28it's only 50 cents or whatever per person, whatever,

1:28:30but that's taxpayers 50 cents, right?

1:28:32So I understand we can look to add a little or a lot

1:28:35and we should look at the little things to cut too.

1:28:38And I respect that because it's all taxpayers money.

1:28:42But on this one, I come back to things that maybe we've heard

1:28:44me and all of us say many times,

1:28:47which is that balance of affordability and value.

1:28:50And this to me, I think is gonna reap a lot of value.

1:28:54And that's why it's already in the budget.

1:28:56So I would ask that you not remove it, give this a go,

1:29:02see what community or agency group puts their hand up

1:29:05and let's see what they can do.

1:29:07You know, I will say, I don't know how long,

1:29:10I think it was before I was even,

1:29:12I think it was before I was even here,

1:29:15there was a community group that at the time

1:29:18they had those little packages of like those CFL light bulbs

1:29:23and the like padding that would go around your pipes.

1:29:30And I think had a shower head or something in it.

1:29:32And I remember they went around the whole community,

1:29:36they had volunteers and they went around

1:29:37the whole community door to door and they would be like,

1:29:40you know, here's this, it's free, here's this thing

1:29:42to help with water conservation and things like that.

1:29:45And I kind of imagine, maybe this won't happen,

1:29:49but I imagine sort of this groundswell

1:29:52of sort of support in that sort of vein

1:29:55of a community group or agency that can start

1:29:57to actually amplify what we need the community to do

1:30:00to join in on trying to actually do this work.

1:30:03And frankly, I think if government only tries to do it,

1:30:07it's gonna be more expensive and it won't go as far.

1:30:10We need a community group to actually,

1:30:12I think step into this space and see what happens.

1:30:15That's why it's in the budget.

1:30:17Okay, thank you, that was too long.

1:30:20But I will call the vote now on,

1:30:22so this is a vote to remove.

1:30:24So I'm gonna ask those that are against removing it

1:30:27to please raise your hand.

1:30:30Okay, so it will be Guller and Clawson and Guthrie

1:30:35and Busatil and Alton Downer and Houser and Caron

1:30:39and Kate.

1:30:41Okay, so that fails that one,

1:30:43but thank you, Councillor Chew, for bringing it forward.

1:30:45Let's stick with you, Councillor Chew.

1:30:48I'm gonna put you on the hot seat again.

1:30:52What's due number 14, okay?

1:30:54Number 14, amendment.

1:30:56This has to do with some tree planting downtown,

1:31:00it looks like.

1:31:01Let's see first of all, if there is a seconder

1:31:06to remove some of the tree planting,

1:31:10it does have an impact of about $600.

1:31:16Is there a seconder on this one first before we continue?

1:31:26Oh, Gibson, are you seconding?

1:31:28Yeah, okay.

1:31:29All right, Councillor Chew, over to you.

1:31:32You have the microphone,

1:31:33you can give us a little blurb.

1:31:35Yeah, through you, Mr. Mayor.

1:31:36So this one, I will admit,

1:31:39is more symbolic than anything.

1:31:42So I think just throughout this budget process,

1:31:45and if you allow me to indulge into this a bit,

1:31:48I've had a really hard time with page 89

1:31:53of our budget package,

1:31:54when we were looking at our long-term tools and strategies.

1:31:58Like it just didn't sit right with my conscience

1:32:03that our tax operating contingency reserve

1:32:07is below its minimum balance of $5 million.

1:32:11And I think all of our conversations collectively

1:32:14throughout this year on what our priorities are,

1:32:17are baked into our staff's work plans.

1:32:20And it's really difficult for me

1:32:23throughout these 30 days to kind of figure out

1:32:26what from capital do we actually want to defer

1:32:30because the decision has already been made a long time ago.

1:32:33And I respect staff a lot.

1:32:35And, but I just feel like this line item from capital

1:32:39is quite small.

1:32:41It shows that we're actually doing our part

1:32:44to look at every little dollar.

1:32:47And the reality of this one is,

1:32:49it's only going to be an impact of $600 for this tax levy.

1:32:55So it's nothing.

1:32:56But I think if we're being realistic

1:32:59with the work downtown and with our tree planting,

1:33:03I just feel like this work could be deferred

1:33:06from next year to the year after,

1:33:08just because we have downtown renewal

1:33:10coming online pretty soon.

1:33:12And we have updated urban design standards

1:33:15that are going to be funded.

1:33:16And I think that work can help inform

1:33:19some of our tree planting

1:33:20that we typically do on Cardin and MacDennell.

1:33:25And it can inform that we actually

1:33:27would like some silver cells, right?

1:33:28So I just look at this from a very practical lens.

1:33:32If we defer this, it would send a nice message

1:33:35that we actually are looking at everything in capital,

1:33:38even though it's baked in at the same time,

1:33:42again, from a practical lens.

1:33:44I think Gene and his staff can be better informed

1:33:47when our urban design standards for downtown,

1:33:50in particular, are updated.

1:33:52And then maybe we can have some nice silver cells

1:33:54instead of just the regular tree grates

1:33:56that get replaced every year.

1:33:58That's just the justification.

1:33:59I think it's quite reasonable and it's quite innocent,

1:34:03but obviously it's up to you guys to figure out.

1:34:06No problem.

1:34:08And again, thank you very much

1:34:09for bringing any idea forward.

1:34:11That's fine.

1:34:13So I did have a caller and then Klaassen

1:34:15and then a Koran and then Downer, okay?

1:34:18Thank you, Your Worship.

1:34:20If I could go to staff,

1:34:22could you please help me understand

1:34:23what the impact of removing $158,000

1:34:26from the capital budget for tree planting in 2026 would be?

1:34:29And in particular, as we look forward to,

1:34:32within the context of there being major construction

1:34:35in downtown and also the bicentennial early in 2027,

1:34:40what would that $158,000 mean to us?

1:34:46So through the mayor to Councillor Goller,

1:34:47and I'll do my best.

1:34:49We sort of pulled together this answer last night

1:34:51when we heard from Councillor Chew

1:34:54that this might be coming forward.

1:34:55So the first thing I just want to clarify

1:34:56is that this funding comes from the tree compensation reserve.

1:34:59So that is where the money is coming from,

1:35:05the capital, obviously, as you'll see,

1:35:06there's a $600 impact on the operating budget.

1:35:10The project really helps us overcome

1:35:12the expensive challenges of establishing

1:35:14and maintaining our tree canopy,

1:35:16which supports the downtown.

1:35:18But I want to be clear that it's not just about

1:35:20the garden and windem, it's throughout the downtown core.

1:35:23And we do have to look to those sort of

1:35:25unique or non-standard solutions

1:35:27when we're looking at tree plantings in the downtown.

1:35:29And so things like elevated tree planters,

1:35:32the systems that we use engineered rooting systems.

1:35:35And so this project specifically addresses

1:35:38the recommendation number 15

1:35:39in our approved urban forest management plan.

1:35:41And so not having this budget would certainly limit

1:35:44our ability to provide healthy trees in the downtown core.

1:35:47I just want to emphasize,

1:35:49Gene and his staff are already very well informed

1:35:51by the other departments

1:35:52and the work that's going on downtown.

1:35:54So we're already doing that in coordination

1:35:56with our partner departments

1:35:58who have those projects going on in the downtown core

1:36:01so that we make sure that we're not duplicating

1:36:03or we're not incurring costs unnecessarily.

1:36:05We do make sure that we try to do this work

1:36:07in the correct order,

1:36:09but it's a really key part

1:36:10of that urban forest management plan.

1:36:12And specifically our tree canopy within the downtown core

1:36:15that we have these funds

1:36:16from that tree compensation reserve.

1:36:18Okay, thank you.

1:36:19So if I could understand what it means

1:36:21that if a tree dies somewhere downtown area

1:36:25and these funds are not there,

1:36:26it may not get replaced as quickly as it would.

1:36:29And that we may not have as many of the tree planters

1:36:32go out next year, is that correct?

1:36:36Through the mayor, absolutely.

1:36:37You're correct on both of those.

1:36:39Okay, thank you.

1:36:40Thank you.

1:36:42Lastly, you mentioned that the $150,000 came

1:36:45from a reserve that is fed.

1:36:48Could you tell me what feeds that reserve?

1:36:50You mentioned that it's a tree compensation.

1:36:52Does that mean that it's,

1:36:55is that money coming from people

1:36:57that are paying compensations after three removals?

1:37:00Through the mayor, yes, that's right.

1:37:02Okay, thank you.

1:37:04I think our downtown has a big uphill battle

1:37:07for the next couple of years

1:37:08with the reconstruction of major streets.

1:37:10I think we need to do everything we can

1:37:13to support and beautify our downtown

1:37:16through the reconstruction phase

1:37:18and into the year where we're going to have our bicentennial.

1:37:23You know, it's such a small operating amount

1:37:25of just, you know, 600 bucks that I think

1:37:29we really need to send the measures

1:37:30that we support our downtown

1:37:32and we want to support the businesses in our downtown.

1:37:34And that's why I will not be supporting this motion

1:37:38to remove that funding next year.

1:37:43All right, thank you.

1:37:44Colossan down our Koran,

1:37:46and then I think I'll go back to the mover

1:37:49then to wrap it up.

1:37:50But I think our voice can be our vote as well

1:37:54on some of these items.

1:37:55So just remember that,

1:37:57Colossan and then Downer.

1:37:58Thank you.

1:37:59Councillor Goller answered my, asked my question.

1:38:03And Downer and then Koran, please.

1:38:07Thank you.

1:38:07I just, yeah, Councillor Goller asked my questions.

1:38:09But I do, I really do want to emphasize what he says,

1:38:12that, you know, the downtown,

1:38:13that the trees are a big part of it.

1:38:15Wind, it's only wind, it's not only Windham Street.

1:38:19Windham Street is the one,

1:38:20but there's the downtown is a lot bigger than Windham Street.

1:38:22And there are a lot of streets that go off

1:38:25and even along Norfolk is considered downtown

1:38:28and all the way to London Road.

1:38:31So there's a lot of trees

1:38:33and we've made a commitment around our tree canopy.

1:38:36And there's a lot of pavement downtown too.

1:38:40And the trees are very important for cooling our planet.

1:38:45And I would hope that we wouldn't do this

1:38:49for the sake of $600.

1:38:51I don't, I think it's symbolic in the other, you know,

1:38:54no offense, but I think it's symbolic in the other way,

1:38:56actually in a negative way.

1:38:59Okay, thank you.

1:39:00Koran, please.

1:39:02All right, thank you.

1:39:03And I had similar questions.

1:39:04So thank you for answering them.

1:39:05In my kind of previous narrative,

1:39:07I said that efficiency and ROI were important

1:39:10in a lot of the lens and decision-making for me here.

1:39:13But the third one that I didn't mention is capital avoidance.

1:39:17And tree planting we know is stormwater infrastructure.

1:39:21And downtown is bigger than Windham Street.

1:39:25So we've got a lot of streets adjacent

1:39:28to the downtown cork in Northumberland and Essex

1:39:30and that these tree plantings are also for those areas.

1:39:34We've just redone Wellington and Surrey area.

1:39:37So, you know, these trees are important

1:39:39for stormwater infrastructure because we are on a slope.

1:39:42And a lot of those streets south of Windham Street

1:39:46are on that slope to the river.

1:39:48So I see this as essential stormwater infrastructure

1:39:51and capital avoidance.

1:39:53Okay, back to the mover to wrap it up.

1:39:57Go ahead, Councillor Chew.

1:40:00Yeah, no, thank you, Mr. Mayor.

1:40:01I think I just wanted an opportunity around this horseshoe

1:40:06to be able to have that conversation

1:40:07on how, you know, we are deficient in our capital risers

1:40:12and everything is quite baked in.

1:40:17And it doesn't sit well with me

1:40:18because I do feel like maybe this is for future councils.

1:40:21We need to exercise more of our authority

1:40:23to reconcile some of those operational expenses

1:40:28that are baked in and intertwined.

1:40:31But yeah, this is more for conversation

1:40:34and I kind of see where everyone is at here.

1:40:37So I'm happy to withdraw actually.

1:40:40So I'll do that, but we had the conversation

1:40:42and I can say that we had that conversation.

1:40:44Okay, okay.

1:40:47Who seconded that?

1:40:50Are you okay to withdraw then?

1:40:54No, no comment, just if a request has been to withdraw,

1:40:58I just need to get right to withdrawing and I'm sorry.

1:41:03Okay, and then I need to go from the process point of view,

1:41:06I need to go to all of council now to ask

1:41:08if it's okay that this be withdrawn.

1:41:11Okay, so thank you that's off the table then.

1:41:19Okay, how's everyone doing?

1:41:26Let's do this.

1:41:30We only have two more things to discuss.

1:41:34And yeah, and one of them, I think it's gonna have a discussion

1:41:39a little bit at the beginning in camera.

1:41:42So I think the only two to discuss that are left is route 98

1:41:46and the daytime shelter.

1:41:49So why don't we have like just a five minute break right now?

1:41:52Just get up and just walk around for a little bit.

1:41:55Come back, we'll do the route 98

1:41:58because I can kind of be done here.

1:42:00And then we'll have, just wanna make sure everyone

1:42:03in the room knows and then we'll,

1:42:05when the route 98 is settled,

1:42:07we'll do an in-camera meeting potentially,

1:42:09it's up to council on the daytime shelter space

1:42:12and then come back out, we'll finish that off

1:42:14and then we're good, okay?

1:42:17So it's right now, 1027.

1:42:20Why don't we come back at, let's make it 1035.

1:42:23A couple extra minutes.

1:42:25So 1035, we'll come back and yeah,

1:42:29we'll just kick off right at 1035.

1:42:31Be on time please, thank you.

1:52:21Okay, everyone, this is your 10 second warning.

1:52:33I just don't know why he wouldn't go

1:52:35to back organizations.

1:52:37Well, he's not a servant, goes to the house.

1:52:39He put a proactive advance.

1:52:41That was why he's always.

1:52:46Take advantage of the niche.

1:52:50Oh yeah.

1:52:51Okay, that's just one question.

1:52:52It's not about the same thing.

1:53:15Seconder first to add this back in.

1:53:19Downer will second and yep, just one second.

1:53:25So just hold on one second, Councillor Caton.

1:53:52Okay, Councillor Caton over to you.

1:53:53Go ahead.

1:53:55Thank you, through you, Mr. Mayor.

1:53:57So this is a motion that council amend

1:53:59wealths 2026 operating budget

1:54:02by implementing route 98 expansion

1:54:04effective November 1st, 2026 with an impact of 642,

1:54:10235,000 and that the 2027 operating forecast

1:54:13will be updated to include 1,385,813 for the annualized

1:54:18impact funded by the property tax levy.

1:54:22So when we think about our infrastructure and equity,

1:54:28the bus system and creating the grid system

1:54:32is a big part of that.

1:54:34And especially now that we've just voted down

1:54:38winter bike clearing, it's even more important

1:54:41that we give people affordable alternatives

1:54:44to be able to get around the city.

1:54:46We have the Memorial Cup upcoming

1:54:50and we have a very limited options

1:54:55in the downtown for hotels and stays.

1:54:58Everyone's gonna be traveling from outside

1:55:01because basically we've got hotels on the edges of our city

1:55:04and we have events in our downtown

1:55:07without substantial ways to get there.

1:55:11So we need to create this grid system

1:55:14and anytime we push back on the bus plan,

1:55:18we're making that harder and harder to do.

1:55:21So I think this is incredibly important to support.

1:55:24I think bus and transit is essential infrastructure

1:55:27that we really need to be keeping up on our plan with.

1:55:32Thank you so much.

1:55:33I'll go to the seconder, Councillor Downer.

1:55:37Yeah, so I've used this analogy before the wheels on the bus

1:55:40and this is where when we get to the budget,

1:55:43this is where the wheels tend to fall off

1:55:45on the bus plans that we've had transit plans for years.

1:55:49And we've also heard in our community that,

1:55:53and it's an own fact that frequency is very important

1:55:58factor in improving our transit and getting people

1:56:00to start using transit more along reliability.

1:56:04And I just see what a success Gordon street is

1:56:08in the increase ridership on that

1:56:10and what that frequency has done as well.

1:56:14So it's really important that we remove this,

1:56:19these types of routes forward because you need to,

1:56:23if we don't do this in 2026,

1:56:27the next council won't be voting on this

1:56:30until the February of 2027.

1:56:34It probably, if they approve it at all,

1:56:37it wouldn't be implemented until May or June of that year.

1:56:41And then that again puts off the Edinburgh route

1:56:44another year or two, which is another frequency issue,

1:56:47which is another important route for people to get around.

1:56:51And this is an affordability issue.

1:56:54This is an environmental issue.

1:56:56This is an economic issue about getting people to work.

1:56:59I just think that improving our transit

1:57:02is one of the most important matters in our city

1:57:06that goes across a number of different pillars

1:57:10and improving it.

1:57:13Great, thank you very much.

1:57:14I'll go to Gibson and then Gowler.

1:57:19Yeah, thank you through Mr. Mayor to staff question.

1:57:24642,000 as a net impact.

1:57:30Forgive me, I know we subsidized transit to the tune 40, 50%.

1:57:35But the 642,000, is that inclusive of the revenue increases

1:57:39that we would expect to receive?

1:57:40So 642,000, but we're expecting to increase ridership

1:57:44and get 300,000 of that back.

1:57:46So really the impact's only 342,000 or 640,000,

1:57:51the sunk cost into transit and not including revenue.

1:57:56Through the mayor, that includes the revenue.

1:57:59The revenue is baked in.

1:58:00So that's the net amount.

1:58:02Okay, so can I ask from the outset,

1:58:05and I know that the expectation is that ridership

1:58:07will grow to continually offset that,

1:58:09but what is the subsidization rate then of that route

1:58:14at 642,000?

1:58:16I guess there are $100,000 of ridership revenues

1:58:19that you're not telling us about.

1:58:20So really we're subsidizing that route 90% in the first year.

1:58:24Like what is the balance there?

1:58:27To the mayor and council Gibson,

1:58:28we don't calculate a subsidization rate

1:58:32on a per use basis because we are on the past system.

1:58:34And so that's not something that we can easily quantify.

1:58:38Okay, so through you Mr. Morales, get a different way.

1:58:42What is the increase in ridership revenue

1:58:45that you would expect from the speed veil

1:58:48for the $642,000?

1:58:51What is the increase in revenue

1:58:52that you expect from that route?

1:58:57Through the mayor, we have $50,000 budgeted in 2026

1:59:01as part of that net offset because it's only starting,

1:59:05it would only be starting in November.

1:59:07And so most of that revenue would come in the following year.

1:59:10And Colleen wants to add to that, I think.

1:59:13Just through the mayor, I also just want to make sure

1:59:15that I also remind council that we did sign the agreement

1:59:18with Conestoga College for their U pass.

1:59:20And so that revenue I believe would be other,

1:59:24in addition to that, that is attributed

1:59:27across the whole transit system,

1:59:28but one of our commitments to Conestoga College

1:59:31when we entered into that negotiation with them

1:59:37was the enhancement of this route.

1:59:39Generally when we enhance or grow a route,

1:59:42it takes us three to four years to see the full ridership.

1:59:45It is a bit of a build it and they will come kind of situation

1:59:47with our transit.

1:59:48And so that it would be forecasted out

1:59:52over the next three to four years.

1:59:55And over the next three to four years,

1:59:58do you have a projection?

2:00:01I'm only asking because I just heard,

2:00:03I just heard $700,000 of cost with $50,000 of return

2:00:10in terms of new revenues.

2:00:11So $640,000 net loss.

2:00:15Again, call it a loss on a paper.

2:00:17I know there's better other benefits to having transit,

2:00:20on a straight ledger, $700,000 approximate cost

2:00:23for the last quarter next year,

2:00:25and only about $50,000 of revenue for ridership.

2:00:29Through the mayor, I think, I mean, transit is

2:00:31about the bigger picture.

2:00:33A lot of these costs are about bringing the staff on,

2:00:37adding to our staff compliment.

2:00:39Those costs get amortized across the full year

2:00:42once we're offering it for a full year.

2:00:43So I think what you're seeing,

2:00:45the two month cost is simply about getting up and going

2:00:49with this enhanced route.

2:00:51But the transit system, we budgeted across the whole system.

2:00:56It's one revenue bucket and we aren't able to break it out.

2:01:01The 99 obviously has higher ridership,

2:01:03but the transit system is about having that balanced,

2:01:08those balanced transit routes, and across the whole system.

2:01:11Okay, so my last question, for the 27 year, the one point,

2:01:16I can't remember, I have to call it the motion,

2:01:18the one point three million dollars for 27.

2:01:21What would be the revenue projection for 27?

2:01:27It's through the mayor, so the revenue

2:01:28that's baked into that amount is $257,000.

2:01:38I mean, I don't know what else to say, Mr. Mayor.

2:01:41I don't think it's justified.

2:01:43That's just my personal opinion.

2:01:46I don't think that route expansion is justified yet.

2:01:48I think it will be one day, but I don't think it's justified

2:01:50now.

2:01:53Thank you, Gower, and then I think I saw two as well.

2:01:58Thank you, through your worship to staff.

2:02:01I believe that when I first saw this on the budget,

2:02:04it was a reduction of about $850,000.

2:02:07But now I see this coming back at $642,000.

2:02:11Is that because this motion starts at November 1st,

2:02:15as opposed to September 1st?

2:02:16Could I have that clarity?

2:02:18Yes, through the mayor, we were asked to cost it

2:02:20three different ways.

2:02:21So originally, the September 1st, then what it would look like

2:02:25if we deferred the start till November 1st,

2:02:27and then there's also a costing on the budget board

2:02:29of what if we waited until May 1st, 2027?

2:02:33Okay, okay, so in a way, this is already a reduction

2:02:36of about $200,000 from what staff would have seen

2:02:41as the cost for this route.

2:02:44And I am really, really struggling here

2:02:47because of the burden on wealth taxpayers.

2:02:52But at the same time, pushing this out,

2:02:54as Councillor Downer pointed out,

2:02:57pushes out the expansion of wealth public transit.

2:03:00And I do feel that getting people on transit

2:03:06is the most effective way for us to address climate change

2:03:10and reduce the carbon footprint.

2:03:12As Councillor Gibson mentioned,

2:03:14when people don't get on their cars and drive to work,

2:03:16it has the biggest impact.

2:03:18So I think I will be supporting this motion

2:03:21to bring this back for the concern of not pushing out

2:03:26the implementation of the linear bus routes

2:03:30on Edinburgh and on Speedvale.

2:03:35Thank you, Chair Lombus-Otto.

2:03:37Thank you, through you, Mr. Mayor.

2:03:39Just the staff, can you explain how some

2:03:42of the construction impacts on Speedvale

2:03:46would implicate some of the plan evaluation for the route?

2:03:49Because for me, a lot of it is about timing,

2:03:52not so much how important this route is.

2:03:54Like it's a 90 series route.

2:03:56It's important for the Conestoga students.

2:03:59I get that.

2:04:01But I'm concerned about the plan evaluation, right?

2:04:04If we're timing this for like next year,

2:04:07and there's significant construction taking place.

2:04:09So can you kind of just help me reconcile that a little bit?

2:04:14Sure, so through the mayor to Councillor Chew,

2:04:16a couple of things there.

2:04:17So first I just wanted to get back to the earlier question

2:04:20of Conestoga College.

2:04:22I just wanted the chance to clarify our answer on that,

2:04:25which is that there is $356,000 in revenue

2:04:28coming from the Conestoga U pass.

2:04:30In terms of the route 98, as you said, Councillor Chew,

2:04:32it is one of our 90 series routes,

2:04:34which is these routes that are spines

2:04:36or horizontal spines in this case.

2:04:38And it's been well planned and phased around construction.

2:04:42So this isn't the end state for the route 98.

2:04:46We currently do offer the Speedville route this expansion.

2:04:50Currently we only offer service Monday to Friday

2:04:53during daytime hours.

2:04:55This expansion takes us to full service coverage

2:04:57seven days a week.

2:04:59And it also adds all the stops along the route.

2:05:01Whereas currently we have very limited stops

2:05:03between the Conestoga campus and Guelph Central Station.

2:05:05It also increases the frequency of the route.

2:05:08So this expansion is about expanding frequency

2:05:11and the hours of the day.

2:05:15Once we are able to then add the full extension

2:05:18of the Speedville 98, that will be added

2:05:21in a future budget year.

2:05:22And that is what's been phased around construction.

2:05:25Okay, just a follow up, maybe it could get our DCAO IDE

2:05:30to maybe weigh in.

2:05:33Like what are the forecasted construction or Speedville

2:05:38and like how significant are these construction,

2:05:41time constructions for next year?

2:05:45Through the mayor to councillor Chew.

2:05:46So the current plan for Speedville construction

2:05:50has the bridge being worked on in 2026 and into 2027.

2:05:55The teams have been coordinating in terms of transit,

2:06:00emergency service impacts, those kinds of things.

2:06:02There's plans in the works now to have one lane open

2:06:05on the bridge to the extent possible.

2:06:07And so there's some nuances to all the things

2:06:09you're discussing and some of that will also depend

2:06:11on sort of the contractor methods and means

2:06:14as that project gets awarded.

2:06:17And so next year, just a follow up on that,

2:06:20the construction on the bridge,

2:06:23that's probably the biggest undertaking for Speedville.

2:06:27Is there anything else that's forecasted out?

2:06:30Or is that just the main body of work

2:06:32that you guys still have to take care of?

2:06:36Through the mayor to the councillor,

2:06:37there still are additional phases of sort of full

2:06:40rural reconstruction as part of the overall

2:06:42Speedville corridor work.

2:06:44And again, just to crystallize in my head,

2:06:48the bridge is the biggest one for next year, right?

2:06:57Sorry, through the mayor.

2:06:57Yes, the bridges is scheduled for next year.

2:07:04You wanna clarify, Mr. Mayor?

2:07:08I'm sorry, I got distracted by a question over here.

2:07:11Can you say that again?

2:07:12Sorry, was there a point of clarification that,

2:07:15on Council's end or on your end?

2:07:19No, okay, we're good, sorry.

2:07:20I just thought there's something that you guys

2:07:22were talking about, some information that you had that I

2:07:25wasn't.

2:07:26No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.

2:07:27Okay, I'll just wrap up then.

2:07:29Yeah, for me, I just see the bridge reconstruction

2:07:35and all that body of work,

2:07:37it's gonna hinder some of the data collection

2:07:42that's gonna take place.

2:07:43And I also see this as like an integrity thing as well.

2:07:49I just feel like we won't be able to get the best data

2:07:54to show how optimized our route is for next year

2:07:59if we're going to do this next year.

2:08:01And I just feel like the timing of it is not great.

2:08:05We heard from Adam Donaldson quite a lot of times

2:08:08that the delays from Gulf Transit,

2:08:10and I just don't want that image to,

2:08:12and that perception to, I guess, incubate.

2:08:15So I feel like this is a timing issue.

2:08:18I have no problem promoting route expansion.

2:08:23I had to defend that in my early term with Route 19,

2:08:29but I see the efficacy, I see the value,

2:08:32and I see the value of Route 98 as well.

2:08:34I just don't know if next year with the bridge construction,

2:08:37this is really a worthwhile effort, quite frankly.

2:08:40I think we could push it once the bridge is completed.

2:08:45That's just where I come from.

2:08:48Yeah.

2:08:50Yeah, okay, thank you very much, Councillor Chew.

2:08:53Just don't worry about this, I boost it

2:08:54until then downer, okay?

2:08:57Thank you.

2:08:58I will be supporting the motion.

2:09:02I've heard a lot from Connozoga College students

2:09:04in Ward 4 that this is important to them to get to school,

2:09:08but also the industrial sector in Ward 4.

2:09:11And I think it's really important to connecting

2:09:13to the rest of the city of Guelph,

2:09:15whatever's happening downtown and elsewhere as well.

2:09:18So I will be supporting this and just a comment that,

2:09:21I think there is disappointment

2:09:22that it will be delayed until November,

2:09:25but everyone has to do their part and we're happy to,

2:09:28I'm happy to support a delayed implementation.

2:09:33Thank you and finally, Downer, please.

2:09:36Yeah, so just a point,

2:09:37I do have a point of clarification through you, Mr. Mayor.

2:09:40My understanding is that the improvements

2:09:43on the enhancements on Speedville

2:09:47are from Woolwich Street West.

2:09:50So the bridge does not factor into this.

2:09:53The routes on where the bridge is are staying the same.

2:09:56Can you, is that the case?

2:09:59Through the matter, Councillor Downer, yes.

2:10:01So the enhancement that is proposed here

2:10:03is about the frequency and the scheduling

2:10:05for the current Route 98.

2:10:07It will not be impacted by the construction.

2:10:09And so there is no impact.

2:10:11Our data collection won't be impacted.

2:10:14If the expansion of Route 98

2:10:18through across to the East side

2:10:19is not scheduled to happen until after the bridge construction.

2:10:23It's two different phases.

2:10:24So I just want to make sure I'm really clear on that.

2:10:26This is not at all impacted by the bridge construction.

2:10:29We were very intentional.

2:10:31Transit and engineering worked together,

2:10:33as we always do, to make sure that we're phasing this

2:10:36to do that in a logical way.

2:10:37So this enhancement, as Councillor Downer says,

2:10:40is on the West side,

2:10:41it's not impacted by the bridge construction.

2:10:44Okay, thank you.

2:10:45Thank you.

2:10:48Okay, so I'll just comment

2:10:51and then we'll call the vote, okay?

2:10:53So, okay.

2:10:57A quick question from Councillor Chew.

2:10:58Go ahead.

2:10:59Okay, I'm just curious, through you, Mr. Mayor,

2:11:02does this route not go through the bridge at all?

2:11:05I just need to know that.

2:11:06Through the Mayor to Councillor Chew, no, apologies.

2:11:08I don't think I can pull it up on screen,

2:11:10but if you go to the Guelph Transit route map

2:11:12and you can see the Route 98,

2:11:13it does not cross the Speedvale Bridge at this current time

2:11:16and it won't with this enhancement.

2:11:17Okay, no, that's good for me to know.

2:11:19Thank you.

2:11:22Remember the movie Speed, The Bus and the Minnaus?

2:11:25The, do you remember that?

2:11:27That's so cool.

2:11:28All right.

2:11:33Okay.

2:11:35I, coming in this morning,

2:11:39was thinking about supporting this,

2:11:41but I want to go to what Councillor Goller said.

2:11:45Councillor Goller said,

2:11:46you know, we can help with affordability issues

2:11:50for transit riders.

2:11:52We can help with,

2:11:53we can also help you said with climate change.

2:11:56All true.

2:11:59But then Council put $500,000 into 100RE,

2:12:05which is an opportunistic reserve.

2:12:09It's an only if something comes up,

2:12:11maybe we will do something and maybe it might help.

2:12:14Fair enough.

2:12:16But this,

2:12:18this actually we know would help with affordability,

2:12:22help with new transit routes and help with climate change.

2:12:26And so now the issue is for me,

2:12:28it's a question of where we're moving this budget,

2:12:32higher and higher and higher.

2:12:35And so I have to make a choice.

2:12:38And so now my choice,

2:12:40because $500,000 went into 100RE,

2:12:44is now not, I'm not going to support this.

2:12:47So I'm kind of disappointed a little bit,

2:12:49but I am trying to balance what's happening here

2:12:53in the budget.

2:12:54Just so everyone knows, we're over,

2:12:55just over 3% right now.

2:12:58Okay.

2:12:59So if we do this,

2:13:00if we do the daytime shelter, however that looks, okay.

2:13:04We're broaching over 4% or more.

2:13:07Okay. And the outside boards are still at 4.6% as of today.

2:13:11So we're at 8. something percent.

2:13:15So choices in my view, my personal view,

2:13:17choices have to be made.

2:13:19I would have actually rather seen some money go into this

2:13:22than an opportunistic account reserve of $500,000

2:13:27that might to do a project.

2:13:30I would rather have it go into this.

2:13:32I say that out loud,

2:13:34because there's an opportunity here today

2:13:36for a notice of reconsideration.

2:13:39If members of council want to think about

2:13:41where their choices are today, maybe it's both.

2:13:44You have the right.

2:13:45But if there's an opportunity to do one or the other,

2:13:48maybe over the next little while,

2:13:50as we are sitting here today,

2:13:52you could consider saying, you know what,

2:13:54maybe we will reopen the idea on the 100RE.

2:13:58That's opportunistic.

2:13:59And maybe we'll put some money into this

2:14:01that is actually tangible on the ground

2:14:03starting something next year

2:14:04that can address affordability and climate change

2:14:07as you rightly said.

2:14:08So I'm gonna vote no against this right now.

2:14:10I think we're starting to get to a place

2:14:12that I'm feeling very uncomfortable with

2:14:14in regards to where this budget is going.

2:14:16And I'm just trying to be aware of that.

2:14:20So with that, I'll call the vote.

2:14:22Those that are against the $642,000 in the budget

2:14:27starting in November 1st next year for the Route 98,

2:14:30please raise your hand.

2:14:32All right, Richardson and Chu and Gibson

2:14:35and Billings and Guthrie and Hauser.

2:14:38Okay, so that is passed.

2:14:42Okay, Route 98 is in.

2:14:45Correct?

2:14:47Okay.

2:14:48All right, so now we are at the last one,

2:14:52which is the drop in space, the daytime drop in space.

2:14:57And I think off the top,

2:15:00we are looking to have a,

2:15:02probably a concise enough conversation in camera

2:15:06just for getting a little bit of some clarity

2:15:09before we come back out here

2:15:11and decide where we're moving on this item.

2:15:13And I think Councillor Goller wished to maybe move a motion

2:15:16to go in camera and that will come up on the screen.

2:15:21And I'll just read that out.

2:15:22That Council of the City of Guelph now hold a meeting

2:15:25that is closed to the public

2:15:26pursuant to the Municipal Act

2:15:28to consider daytime drop in space

2:15:30with the 2026 budget implications,

2:15:32which is under section 239, 2K of the Municipal Act

2:15:36regarding a position, plan, procedure, criteria

2:15:39or instruction to be applied to any negotiations

2:15:42carried on or to be carried on by

2:15:44or on behalf of the municipality or local board.

2:15:47So thank you, Councillor Goller.

2:15:48You've moved it with someone maybe on my left second it.

2:15:52Bousatil will help us with that.

2:15:54And I'll call the vote.

2:15:55Is anyone against moving in camera on this discussion?

2:15:59Nobody? Okay, perfect.

2:16:00So we will go in camera.

2:16:01We'll have a quick discussion.

2:16:03Well, an appropriate amount of time discussion.

2:16:05And then when we're ready, we will come back in.

2:16:07All right, thank you very much.

3:45:27All right.

3:45:28Oh, sorry.

3:45:29Are we back on line?

3:45:30Okay.

3:45:31No.

3:45:32We don't need quorum right now.

3:45:33I'm just making an announcement.

3:45:35Am I back online though?

3:45:37Okay. Thank you.

3:45:40We will be back at one o'clock.

3:45:42So there's my announcement.

3:45:45Thank you very much for all the patience,

3:45:47but we will be back at one o'clock

3:45:49and we will, I will give the high level summary

3:45:52as I always do.

3:45:52And we are just taking a break right now for a bite.

3:45:55And I hope that our media partners and staff

3:45:59and others might do the same.

3:46:01Okay. So back at one o'clock.

3:46:03Thank you so much.

3:46:17Okay. All right, everyone.

4:15:33We're just about to start here.

4:16:17Okay, everyone.

4:16:18Just before we kick things off,

4:16:19I just want to give an opportunity

4:16:21to our deputy CAO calling Clackbush

4:16:25just to make sure that there's a couple sentences of clarity

4:16:29just so it's out in the public realm

4:16:31around the plowing of the multi-use paths.

4:16:36There's just one quick little nuance on that

4:16:38that we want to make sure is expressed

4:16:40just so that everyone understands.

4:16:42So calling over to you.

4:16:44Thank you and apologies that when I answered,

4:16:45I was probably a bit too simplistic.

4:16:47And so I want to just provide that clarity.

4:16:49And so there's a really great budget board response

4:16:51on this already, but I just wanted to make sure

4:16:54I said it out loud that with this new direction

4:16:57in terms of not doing the winter maintenance

4:16:58of the bicycle lanes, our sidewalks will be plowed

4:17:02as they always have been, which is what I answered yes to.

4:17:05The multi-use paths, what I should have been more clear on

4:17:07is that our multi-use paths will now be maintained

4:17:10for pedestrian access only as part of our sidewalk

4:17:13winter maintenance program.

4:17:14So the multi-use paths will be winter maintained,

4:17:17but what I should have added the clarification on

4:17:20is that it is now going to be just the minimum width needed

4:17:23for that safe pedestrian access.

4:17:24So apologies that I didn't answer that

4:17:26as clearly earlier as I should have.

4:17:28All right, thank you very much.

4:17:29Just good to have it out in the open.

4:17:31Okay, I am going to now just go to our summary

4:17:36from the closed session that we went into earlier,

4:17:40and it was only on the one item.

4:17:44And as I normally do, there is a summary,

4:17:49but really I don't have a summary

4:17:51because we actually have some motions

4:17:53that are coming out of closed.

4:17:54So there was direction given to steps

4:18:01that staff enclosed on the matter,

4:18:04but there is two motions that are going to be tabled

4:18:07right now in the open session.

4:18:10So if I could have the clerks just throw those up

4:18:12on the screen for us, that would be great.

4:18:14We'll at least get this on the table here.

4:18:17Councillor Goller is willing to move this.

4:18:22So that city council and mangwells 2026 budget update

4:18:25by increasing the 2026 operating budget by 850,000.

4:18:29Further provision of daytime space

4:18:31funded by the property tax levy,

4:18:33focusing on the weighted criteria included

4:18:37in the request for proposal.

4:18:39And the second is that the city,

4:18:41that city council respectfully requests the county

4:18:43of Wellington to contribute 10% of these costs

4:18:46of the daytime space provision as a share

4:18:49of that discretionary service.

4:18:52So Councillor Goller has moved.

4:18:55And is there a seconder for that?

4:18:58Okay, Claeson, thank you.

4:19:01And now we can throw it open to the floor

4:19:03if there's anything more on this.

4:19:05Feel free to do questions in or comments

4:19:07at the same time if you wish, okay?

4:19:09Starting with Councillor Busuttil, please.

4:19:12Yes, thank you.

4:19:13And I apologize, I should be familiar with this.

4:19:16I was wondering if staff could help clarify

4:19:18what I know it's public, the weighted criteria

4:19:22is that will be the lens for this.

4:19:26Through you, Mayor Guthrie to Councillor Busuttil.

4:19:29Yes, so in the publicly available RFP,

4:19:33the rated criteria are as follows.

4:19:36So there were proponent profiles,

4:19:38demonstrated experience, model of service,

4:19:42commitment to housing first principles

4:19:44as defined in the terms of reference,

4:19:46the location of services, team qualifications

4:19:50and experience, as well as project understanding,

4:19:53approach and methodology and then the fee proposal.

4:19:57Thank you.

4:20:01Councillor Allt, please.

4:20:02Thank you very much, Mayor Guthrie.

4:20:04With all due respect to my colleagues in the proposal,

4:20:08I will not be supporting this.

4:20:10I support it in principle.

4:20:12I will be very, very clear on that.

4:20:14I do believe that we have to support

4:20:16and provide for all of our residents in Guam.

4:20:19I do have some concerns which will remain with me

4:20:23that I believe this will face significant challenges.

4:20:32Okay, thank you very much for your comments too.

4:20:35Gibson.

4:20:37Thank you, through you, Mr. Mayor.

4:20:38Just so you know what, Councillor Kessler,

4:20:39I'm so sorry, Councillor Caitlin is first

4:20:41and then it's you, okay?

4:20:43Sorry, Councillor Caitlin, go right ahead.

4:20:46No worries, thank you.

4:20:47Through you, Mr. Mayor.

4:20:49So I will be supporting this.

4:20:50I know it's not the amount that was in the response

4:20:55and I'm supporting this in the spirit of

4:20:59something is better than nothing.

4:21:00And I hope that there is something

4:21:03that can be done in the negotiation

4:21:05and that ultimately people will get help,

4:21:10people will have warmth or cooling

4:21:13and there will be a space for folks in the long run.

4:21:17Thank you.

4:21:18Thank you, Councillor Caitlin.

4:21:20I'm so sorry I jumped over you by accident there.

4:21:22Councillor Gibson, please.

4:21:23Yeah, thank you, through you, Mr. Mayor.

4:21:24So I just, I always like reflecting on timelines

4:21:28and how we've responded to this issue.

4:21:31We've gone from needing a service downtown,

4:21:34supplementing that service downtown for a few years

4:21:37with reserve money or for different money.

4:21:39We created a table.

4:21:41We did a call to sort of a call to action as a council.

4:21:44We wanted to get a daytime shelter up and running

4:21:47for our city and we received RFPs

4:21:50and we are continuing to work through that.

4:21:52And I think it's for the speed of government,

4:21:55I think we're moving pretty quickly on this,

4:21:56which I think should be a powder pad on the back.

4:21:58It's just a reality.

4:21:59We are working towards a solution here.

4:22:02And thanks to the staff for the work they've done so far.

4:22:05Thanks to the colleagues and for Councillor Rodrigo

4:22:09for sort of looking at this through a different lens,

4:22:12working with staff and bringing forward it.

4:22:15For those who don't know,

4:22:16I've gone through this many times with the budget.

4:22:18It takes a lot of work to bring forward a motion

4:22:19with language.

4:22:20So you're asking staff dozens and dozens of questions,

4:22:23you're refining it, you're getting the language back

4:22:24and then you're bringing it to council and you might fail.

4:22:26So like it's appreciated the effort goes in.

4:22:28It's not always, you don't always bear the fruit

4:22:30of your effort, but I'm hopeful that this one will come forward.

4:22:34Thank you.

4:22:35Okay, thank you so much for your comments too.

4:22:38And to Downer, please.

4:22:40So mine's more of a question kind of comment too,

4:22:43is that we're, we continue to walk in space

4:22:47that doesn't, isn't within our jurisdiction.

4:22:50And this is just another example of that.

4:22:53But I believe this is a two year plan.

4:22:57And what is a, what is there,

4:23:01is there a longer term plan that we can get into

4:23:03that's sustainable or that creates more certainty

4:23:09or for the community?

4:23:11Through the mayor to councillor Downer,

4:23:13thanks for the question.

4:23:14I think it's an important one.

4:23:16This is a two year commitment as a pilot project almost,

4:23:20but the longer term goal is to move

4:23:22to a daytime hub solution that would see the county

4:23:25of Wellington with partners from the social services agencies

4:23:29come together in a shared space to provide

4:23:31not just daytime space, but other supports

4:23:33that people in our community need and have access to.

4:23:36And so through the health and housing planning table

4:23:38and a sub working group of that table,

4:23:40we will be working towards that over the next two years

4:23:42with the hope of having something in place

4:23:44at the, at the end of this daytime space pilot.

4:23:50Thank you.

4:23:52Okay, I'm going to get ready to call the vote on this.

4:23:56And I just want to just say one quick thing

4:23:58then before we do that, if you'll recall,

4:24:02there's been twice now that I have said out loud this year,

4:24:07this decision will raise some properties, raise property taxes.

4:24:12I said it when the RFP came here and we made the decision,

4:24:15I said it right here.

4:24:17I said, if we move into this space,

4:24:19it will raise property taxes.

4:24:21I also said it for those only three others of you

4:24:25at the Joint Social Services Committee at the county

4:24:29when it was the winter response program that came forward.

4:24:32I said, this will raise property taxes.

4:24:34And so I think why I say that is because of a few things.

4:24:40One is that there was in a way, an acknowledgement upfront

4:24:45when we were stepping into this space,

4:24:46it was going to raise property taxes.

4:24:48Like we were pretty transparent about it.

4:24:51And the second piece I would just say is,

4:24:56I don't, I can only speak for myself,

4:24:58but I heard a lot of people really concerned

4:25:03about the budget this year, okay?

4:25:06And rightly so.

4:25:08However, on this particular item,

4:25:11there was a lot of empathy and buy-in.

4:25:15There was a lot of people that, look,

4:25:22it's easy for us politicians to say this,

4:25:24but we actually do live in a very caring,

4:25:27on it we really do.

4:25:29And so when it comes to the questions like,

4:25:34would you feel okay if we stepped into this space

4:25:38to help out the most vulnerable people in our community?

4:25:40It was an overwhelming, really, yes.

4:25:43There was an acceptance to do that

4:25:46and to have a few more, and it literally is that.

4:25:50It's a few more dollars to go towards helping

4:25:54the most vulnerable in our community.

4:25:56And so I just think that we were upfront about it.

4:26:00And I think we've all engaged on the item.

4:26:03I believe probably many of you are experiencing

4:26:06the same type of positivity that came back

4:26:08from our community, that it's okay

4:26:11if we could step into this space right now.

4:26:13And so I think it is an important thing to do.

4:26:17And so, yeah, I sort of want my head to hit the pillow

4:26:22at night knowing that others have not only a space

4:26:26during the night to try to have their own head

4:26:28hit the pillow, but during the day,

4:26:30they have also a place that can help them find

4:26:33that pillow where their head can land as well,

4:26:35which is some of the services that will be provided

4:26:38as this moves forward.

4:26:39So, you know, Councillor Gibson,

4:26:42I think you rightly said too, there's a lot of heavy lifting,

4:26:45like with Councillor Caller on the wording, stuff like that.

4:26:47But I just do want to acknowledge all of Council

4:26:50equally here.

4:26:50There was like a lot of heavy lifting

4:26:52in like kind of questions and debates

4:26:54and ways of trying to figure this out.

4:26:57And I would hope that this is a unanimous vote

4:27:00because I think the public also looks to us as a team

4:27:03to say that this is important moving forward.

4:27:06So thank you with that, I will call the vote.

4:27:10Is anyone against?

4:27:12Oh, sorry, I know that you gave us the heads up Councillor Allt.

4:27:15I apologize, I didn't mean to rub that in.

4:27:18Yeah, I know you are absolutely.

4:27:20So, okay, it passes with only Councillor Allt

4:27:24of voting against.

4:27:25Thank you very much.

4:27:28Okay, let me just get rid of these notes here.

4:27:33Just one second, everybody.

4:27:36Okay, actually speaking of Councillor Allt,

4:27:39we have a non-monetary motion

4:27:43that I would like to go to Councillor Allt on moving.

4:27:47And right off the top, is there a seconder

4:27:50for this one that's coming up?

4:27:52Busatil would be happy to do that.

4:27:54Okay, thank you.

4:27:55I will turn the microphone over to you, Councillor Allt,

4:27:58for your kind of preference.

4:28:01You can preface this and give us your little blurb

4:28:03before we discuss it.

4:28:05Thank you very much, Mayor Guthrie.

4:28:07Do you wish for me to read this into the record?

4:28:11Sure, I think it's important, go ahead.

4:28:12Thank you.

4:28:15Motion that I put forward has two parts to it.

4:28:17Number one, that the Guelph City Council expresses

4:28:19continued urgency and concerns that municipalities

4:28:23across Ontario are negatively impacted

4:28:25by provincial legislative changes

4:28:27resulting in further downloading and underfunding

4:28:30that is not revenue neutral

4:28:32and places a disproportionate burden on property taxes

4:28:36and property taxpayers to fund services

4:28:38such as but not limited to court administration,

4:28:42social services, mental health and addictions

4:28:45and deeply affordable social housing,

4:28:48costing Ontario's municipalities

4:28:49nearly four million per year, four billion, thank you.

4:28:53And urgently request that the province

4:28:55re-assume full financial responsibility

4:28:58for such services as well as acknowledge

4:29:00and provide municipal taxpayer relief

4:29:03on any future policy or legislative changes.

4:29:07Clause two, that a copy of this motion

4:29:09be sent to Premier Doug Ford,

4:29:12Minister of Municipal Affairs and Housing Rob Flack,

4:29:15Minister of Finance Peter Petkin-Falvi,

4:29:18Minister of Children, Communities and Social Services

4:29:21Michael Parza, Minister of the Environment,

4:29:24Conservation and Parks Todd McCarthy,

4:29:27Attorney General Doug Downey,

4:29:30Associate Minister of Mental Health and Addictions

4:29:32Vijay Thanagha Salam,

4:29:35Member of Provincial Parliament Mike Shreiner,

4:29:38Leader of the Opposition Merit Styles,

4:29:40Leader of the Third Party John Fraser,

4:29:43the Association of Municipalities of Ontario

4:29:45and the Federation of Canadian Municipalities.

4:29:50The reason for making this motion is that

4:29:53as Mayor Guthrie has stated and with which

4:29:56I have a fair bit of sympathy,

4:29:58is that this has been a very challenging budget.

4:30:01And the reality is that we are going to be facing

4:30:04continued challenging budgets in the future

4:30:06if the provincial government does not start to step up

4:30:09and take responsibility for much of what has been downloaded.

4:30:13Many people have heard over time

4:30:15that there's only one taxpayer.

4:30:17However, there are three levels of government

4:30:19and how they fund the expenses of running a province

4:30:23or a federal government or a city are different.

4:30:26But the big difference is that when the province

4:30:29downloads services with the promise

4:30:31of being revenue neutral, they're not.

4:30:34So cities, counties, other municipalities

4:30:37have to fund social services, housing, court services,

4:30:41even the inequity in the heads and beds taxes

4:30:43which wealth of somewhat benefits from

4:30:47but not much has an impact on our budget.

4:30:51The disruption of DC's parkland dedication

4:30:53is something we've most recently had to grapple with as well.

4:30:58The city has one main foundation for revenue

4:31:00and that's property taxes, which is as everyone knows

4:31:03the most regressive form of taxation.

4:31:06By contrast, the province has nearly 30 envelopes

4:31:09into which taxes are collected.

4:31:11And the inequity in the capacity to distribute costs

4:31:14and sustaining quality living in municipalities

4:31:18is significantly handicapped as a consequence of that.

4:31:21We have no choice but either raise taxes

4:31:24or consider reducing the care that we give

4:31:27to our residents, to our roads, to our buses,

4:31:30to virtually everything that we deal with at this council.

4:31:34And in this motion, I'm not asking at this point

4:31:36for new tax bases, but there is room for amendments

4:31:40if people wish, but I'm calling on the provincial government

4:31:43to resume provincial responsibility

4:31:45for everything from courts to social services.

4:31:49Let's just look at some fun facts.

4:31:51The heads and beds tax, which is an offset

4:31:53for university students at the University of Guelph,

4:31:57is by our staff's admission, $3.1 million deficient this year

4:32:02which is 0.75 of a point on our budget.

4:32:06For this year, I'm not asking to change our budget.

4:32:09We need the services.

4:32:11We cannot become service deficient

4:32:13as well as raising taxes at the same time.

4:32:17But we will need to admit that unless the public

4:32:20and municipalities persevere

4:32:23and are strong enough to challenge

4:32:24the provincial governments,

4:32:25we will continue to see extraordinary increases

4:32:28in municipal governments, municipal budgets,

4:32:31seven, eight, 9% across the province.

4:32:35These annual increases are not sustainable

4:32:37and they can only be avoided

4:32:39if the province does its duty and pays for what it should.

4:32:42Basically, I'm asking the province to pay its share.

4:32:46We need to consider issues like infrastructure upgrades.

4:32:49We need to consider that the community deserves better

4:32:53and we can do it, but only if we have the opportunity

4:32:57to stay in our lanes and not assume much

4:32:59of what the province has been doing,

4:33:01has been downloading to us.

4:33:04And I defy anybody to tell me why we should be responsible

4:33:07for court services, to be perfectly honest.

4:33:09But that's the way it is.

4:33:13Mayor Guthrie, we have a choice,

4:33:15but really that choice should only be about city building.

4:33:19It should be about how do we improve the buses?

4:33:22How do we consider sustaining and increasing our reserves?

4:33:26We have been put into a pincer by the government,

4:33:28by the provincial government,

4:33:30and we need to finally say no,

4:33:32and I hope municipalities and the public

4:33:34across the province will join with us.

4:33:38Thank you very much, Councillor Hald,

4:33:40and for bringing this forward for us.

4:33:43And if there's anything more, I don't know if there is.

4:33:46I can call the vote.

4:33:47Oh, sorry, Councillor Keaton, go ahead.

4:33:51Thank you.

4:33:52I'm just thanking Councillor Hald for bringing this forward.

4:33:55I think it's a really important motion

4:33:56and I know that it's something

4:33:58that we've all discussed several meetings through

4:34:01when we get a lot of tendrils into our own operations

4:34:07that the province likes to do.

4:34:08It'd be really great if they just focused

4:34:10on what they're supposed to be doing

4:34:12because it's very unfair for us to have to make the choice

4:34:16between raising property taxes and stepping into our lane

4:34:20and allowing people to suffer and go without

4:34:23and potentially become homeless.

4:34:25It's not sustainable and it's not fair

4:34:28and we don't have any recourse

4:34:30other than to just ask them to do their job.

4:34:33So I would hope that they would take this seriously.

4:34:39Thank you, Councillor Keaton as well.

4:34:41With that, I think I'll call the vote.

4:34:43Okay, is there anyone against this motion?

4:34:47Okay, there's not that as unanimous.

4:34:49So thank you very much.

4:34:51The next one is the update companion report.

4:34:54This is maybe for you, Councillor Houser.

4:34:59This is a very administrative in nature.

4:35:01It happens every budget.

4:35:02So it's kind of a big two slider that comes up here.

4:35:06But it's, yeah, it's all part and parcel

4:35:10of what was made up the budget from staff and such.

4:35:14So it has to, I'm not gonna read all of these,

4:35:17but it's very, yeah, it's just,

4:35:21actually Councillor Houser,

4:35:22would you like to move it?

4:35:24Okay, would someone like to second it?

4:35:26Okay, Councillor Gibson, is there anything further on this?

4:35:30No, oh, sorry, Councillor Gibson, go ahead.

4:35:33Thank you, Mr. Regis.

4:35:34So I don't get locked out here.

4:35:35I do have a couple of thoughts on the budget in general.

4:35:39I generally like to try and summarize a budget

4:35:41in my own thoughts and my own head

4:35:42when I'm having these 30 second conversations with people.

4:35:45Not with that, not with standing.

4:35:49Oh, there's more.

4:35:50Okay, no, no, I'll make a comment at the end then.

4:35:55Sorry, I'll wait.

4:35:58Just don't let me lose that.

4:35:59Okay, no problem.

4:36:00Okay, so I'm gonna call the vote then on this, okay?

4:36:04Is there anyone against these?

4:36:06Okay, that's unanimous as well.

4:36:14Next one is also very administrative in nature.

4:36:16It's the budget impacts for Ontario Regulation 28409,

4:36:22public sector accounting standards, reconciliation,

4:36:27would someone be willing to move that down

4:36:29or in Boussatil?

4:36:30Thank you.

4:36:32Anything on that, anybody?

4:36:35Okay, I'll call the vote.

4:36:36Is there anyone against that?

4:36:39No.

4:36:41Okay, so the last one is shortening

4:36:44of the 30 day budget amendment period.

4:36:47So I just need to confer with the clerk

4:36:49for one moment here.

4:36:50So, okay, so council, I think I would,

4:37:03I need the clerks to jump in just on a process question

4:37:07because we've never done this before,

4:37:09but I would like to take some sort of a break

4:37:12because I would like to consider videoing

4:37:14some of the decisions that have been made.

4:37:16So can I ask Dylan, can you please just walk us

4:37:19through that process for a second?

4:37:21And if this motion is needed now or later?

4:37:24Through you, Mr. Mayor, thank you.

4:37:25So the motion before council right now

4:37:27is to shorten the 30 day window that you have

4:37:29to amend the mayor's proposed budget.

4:37:32Once council passes this resolution,

4:37:34your ability to amend the proposed budget will end

4:37:36and that starts the clock in a veto period for the mayor.

4:37:39So should council wish to shorten the period

4:37:42to enable those vetoes to happen today,

4:37:44it's that motion that would need to be passed

4:37:47and we can throw it up on the screen

4:37:48for council's consideration.

4:37:54Okay, just so just one second.

4:37:56Thank you.

4:37:58Sorry, councillor Goller, what do you say?

4:37:59Thank you, worship.

4:38:00I just sent out a message of notice of reconsideration

4:38:03for one of the things that we approved today.

4:38:07I'm wondering if that might be in order before these motions.

4:38:14Through you, Mr. Mayor, to the councillor Goller,

4:38:17that motion would be out of order

4:38:19if the amendment period is shortened.

4:38:23And we would also need to suspend the rules of procedure

4:38:26to allow a notice of reconsideration to come forward

4:38:28or can we do it in on the fly within the budget meeting?

4:38:32I think we can, right?

4:38:33Through you, Mr. Mayor, council can reconsider decisions

4:38:36that were made at that same meeting

4:38:37with a simple majority vote.

4:38:39So you'd vote to reconsider

4:38:41and then you would vote on something to replace

4:38:42presumably what was reconsidered.

4:38:44Okay, sorry, I'm just, I'm just seeing this email now.

4:38:49Okay, let's follow the procedure then.

4:38:54Just one second.

4:38:58Okay, we can't debate this

4:39:01until we even allow ourselves to consider debating it.

4:39:05It all is dependent upon whether or not

4:39:07a motion to reconsider would even pass,

4:39:11which requires a super majority of council

4:39:14or does it only require a regular majority?

4:39:17Through you, Mr. Mayor,

4:39:18reconsideration is done at the same meeting.

4:39:20It requires a simple majority.

4:39:22We can be moved, seconded and voted on

4:39:23like any other motion and we have it ready to display

4:39:25if it is moved.

4:39:26Oh, okay, all right, you're ahead of me.

4:39:28Okay, so then, okay, you have the right to do that.

4:39:33We're in the middle of a budget meeting.

4:39:34So you go ahead, you can table that

4:39:37and then if you could put it up on the screen,

4:39:39but I would like to see if there's even a seconder.

4:39:41So I'm sure.

4:39:42I'll just say what it is.

4:39:45I'm asking that we reconsider the motion

4:39:47to allocate 500,000 to the hundred RE,

4:39:50just looking at where the budget is now

4:39:53after all the other things that have been approved.

4:39:56I personally, when I supported this,

4:39:59I did not think that some of the other motions

4:40:01would be getting approved.

4:40:02So I would like us to reconsider.

4:40:04And instead, if this is approved,

4:40:06I will be moving a motion that puts it at 250,000

4:40:09instead of the 500.

4:40:12Okay, so from a clerk's perspective,

4:40:14that you're okay with this?

4:40:15Okay, is there a seconder?

4:40:18Downer.

4:40:19Okay, so it's moved and seconded.

4:40:22And now I've got a question from Councillor Gibson.

4:40:24Moved by someone who was in favor of it before,

4:40:28but also seconded by someone who was in favor before.

4:40:30Just want to make sure this is a reconsideration.

4:40:33So you were in favor of this.

4:40:34Is this within the same meeting?

4:40:35Yeah.

4:40:38No, we don't have to do a super majority

4:40:40to even talk about it.

4:40:41So this motion has now passed.

4:40:45So it's on the table for debate and discussion

4:40:48as it was presented,

4:40:49which is to the clerks is reducing it down to 250.

4:40:52So that's basically what we're doing now,

4:40:55or do we just do a motion to reconsider that's passed?

4:40:58And now this motion needs to be tabled.

4:41:01Through you, Mr. Mayor.

4:41:03I apologize if I missed a vote there,

4:41:05but I believe there's a motion on the floor

4:41:07for the resolution to be reconsidered.

4:41:09After that reconsideration, if it is passed,

4:41:12then a new motion can be moved.

4:41:15Okay, yep.

4:41:16Okay, so this vote is the one that would basically

4:41:20allow us to go back and reconsider.

4:41:22So can I call the vote on that?

4:41:25Okay, is there anyone against that?

4:41:29Okay, Councillor Kerrant.

4:41:30Okay, fair enough.

4:41:31Fair enough.

4:41:32Okay, so now this item is sort of live on the floor.

4:41:39Okay, so was there a second part of that motion then?

4:41:44Sorry, Councillor Gaur, I just, I didn't know.

4:41:47I'm glad, but I just didn't know.

4:41:50Thank you, Chair Worship.

4:41:51Okay, so now you could table this as an actual amount

4:41:55and you could, we'll look for a seconder.

4:41:57Do you want to just read it out

4:41:58and then we'll see if there's a seconder.

4:42:00Yes, your Worship.

4:42:00I move that we allocate $250,000 to the 100REGGO261 reserve,

4:42:08which is, yeah, we previously had 500,000 in there,

4:42:12but given everything else that we have approved,

4:42:14I think this amount would still allow us to do some work

4:42:18to leverage grants from other levels of government

4:42:21that may become available

4:42:23while reducing the overall impact to our community.

4:42:29Okay, is there a seconder for 250?

4:42:31Okay, downer, we'll do that.

4:42:36Okay, can we have like 10 more motions that are all reducing?

4:42:42Is this a trend?

4:42:45Okay, Councillor Kerrant wants to talk about that.

4:42:48Sure, I'm sure it'll come as no surprise

4:42:50that I want to address it.

4:42:51And I actually, I do appreciate the reason why

4:42:53is that we're at the end of our budget meeting

4:42:56and we're dealing with a whole number now

4:42:59and we're seeing what the impact that whole number is.

4:43:01So we're looking for ways to get that number down

4:43:03a little bit and I do appreciate that.

4:43:05So thank you, Councillor Goller.

4:43:07I will be voting against it though

4:43:08because as I'm evaluating all those line items

4:43:11and I'm looking at the massive amount

4:43:13of capital spending we're doing

4:43:16and operational spending that we're doing.

4:43:18And I go back to the principle of sometimes,

4:43:21sometimes you have to spend money to save money.

4:43:24And this is one of those line items.

4:43:25So there was a comment a little earlier

4:43:28where it's just going into reserve.

4:43:29We don't have an earmark for anything.

4:43:31So our reserve is currently at 1.9 million.

4:43:34We do have money going into it in 2025

4:43:36but we have, according to our finance staff,

4:43:39and correct me if I'm wrong,

4:43:41because we did have that budget impact

4:43:44part of our budget statement.

4:43:47We have $2.2 million in projects

4:43:51that we've already committed from this reserve

4:43:54that includes wealth transit and fleet services facility,

4:43:58route reviews and transit bus replacement

4:44:00with electrification of our fleet.

4:44:03And yes, we do have money going in in 2026 as well.

4:44:07But we know that transportation is only one part.

4:44:10So the commitments that we've made on transportation

4:44:13from the 100 RE reserve.

4:44:16We also have the number two,

4:44:18actually I think transportation is number two

4:44:20and the number one bank for your buck is buildings.

4:44:24And ironically, or serendipitously, at 1203

4:44:28while we were at lunch,

4:44:30we all got an email from Built Green Canada that came in

4:44:33that talked about green infrastructure

4:44:36and green investments in multi-res commercial buildings,

4:44:38high density older buildings.

4:44:40And we talked about that during a lot of our,

4:44:42like why can't landlords apply for some of our green funds

4:44:47to be able to lower their energy costs

4:44:49and therefore create more affordable housing with utilities.

4:44:53So today we funded, and rightfully so, social services,

4:44:58which is clearly out of our lane.

4:45:01But city building is our lane.

4:45:04Long-term fiscal planning is our lane

4:45:06and keeping taxes down and protecting ourselves

4:45:08from the rising and unpredictable energy costs

4:45:11is definitely our lane.

4:45:14So we've depleted this reserve

4:45:15and this reserve is helping our residents

4:45:18reduce their utilities and saving households money.

4:45:20The next frontier, like if we're saying

4:45:22it's going into reserve, it's going nowhere.

4:45:24Our next frontier, and we've already talked about this,

4:45:27is rentals, because buildings are the number one contributor

4:45:29to climate change.

4:45:31So programs for conservation and conversion of high density

4:45:34and multi-residential to lower utility costs,

4:45:37especially if we use the 100 RE money with conditions

4:45:41that are related to passing on those services

4:45:44to tenants, or savings to tenants.

4:45:45This money is going directly back into the pockets

4:45:48of residents who need the relief the most.

4:45:50So if we reduce this to 250, I think we're losing out

4:45:53on all those benefits and compounded savings over time.

4:45:57So again, I just, you know, I won't keep going on,

4:45:59but for every dollar we invest in climate action,

4:46:03$13 to $15 worth of benefit within 10 years.

4:46:07So I think that's good value.

4:46:08I think that's fiscally responsible.

4:46:10I think that's in our strategic plan,

4:46:12and that's meeting our obligation to the next generation.

4:46:15So I'd like to keep it at the 500K,

4:46:17but of course the will of council always prevails,

4:46:19and we will follow the will of council.

4:46:24Okay, thank you.

4:46:28So based on what Councillor Caron just brought up,

4:46:32I just do have a clarifying question then for staff.

4:46:35You currently, I'll just kind of try to make them yes or no.

4:46:39You currently do have 1.9 in the reserve, is that right?

4:46:46To you, the mayor, there is a projected balance

4:46:50at the end of 2025 of 1.9 million

4:46:53in that 100RE reserve fund.

4:46:54And I just wanna, if I could have a moment to just clarify,

4:46:57there's two separate things called 100RE.

4:47:00There's the reserve fund, the capital reserve fund

4:47:03that helps to fund capital projects,

4:47:05including transit electrification.

4:47:08And then there is 100RE capital project

4:47:11that helps to, that leverages that funding for retrofits.

4:47:18And there's probably more to say about that,

4:47:20that DCO gaming could add if anyone needs clarity.

4:47:25No, I think that's where I was going on my question,

4:47:27is just to make sure that it wasn't one reserve,

4:47:30that there is two earmarks for the two different things,

4:47:34but not as one whole.

4:47:37And then I'd like to just ask about the leveraging

4:47:40of upper levels of government question.

4:47:43So with my specific question is,

4:47:48if there is no money put into this account,

4:47:52does that mean you will not leverage

4:47:54any upper levels of government funding for this work?

4:48:00So to the mayor, I would say that right now we've utilized

4:48:05and we've leveraged the 100RE reserve funding

4:48:08for the ISIP grant.

4:48:10It's significant, it's a significant amount of money

4:48:13that we've leveraged with that money.

4:48:16If there was a new opportunity that we're not aware of right

4:48:19now and that there was no other way to leverage

4:48:24or to access that grant,

4:48:25we would be back in front of council to have that discussion.

4:48:30Okay, I appreciate that.

4:48:32Okay, so let's take the vote, okay?

4:48:38So the vote is to go to 250, it's as simple as that, okay?

4:48:49Yeah, so it's, yeah, the vote is 250

4:48:54or it won't be anything, yeah, so, okay?

4:48:57So, yeah.

4:49:01This motion here is to replace the previous motion.

4:49:04So if it fails, it means the previous motion still stands.

4:49:09We would have to place the previous motion

4:49:13back on the floor.

4:49:14Yard clerks will answer that, okay?

4:49:17Through you, Mr. Mayor, to council the crown,

4:49:19when council reconsider a decision,

4:49:21it effectively takes you back to the moment

4:49:23before the original decision was passed.

4:49:25So there is nothing on the books right now

4:49:27related to 100RE unless this motion passes.

4:49:30But council could put forward another motion.

4:49:32So it could fail and I could put 350 or 400 back on.

4:49:36Okay, well, I was gonna vote against anyway,

4:49:38now I'm gonna vote against twice.

4:49:41Okay, okay, okay.

4:49:44If I may procedurally, I believe that if this fails,

4:49:48we're not going up.

4:49:49So if someone wants to increase it,

4:49:51maybe now as an amendment,

4:49:52it could be increased to a different amount, just, right?

4:49:56It is a live motion that could be amended.

4:50:01If without any amendments,

4:50:02we're just voting on 250 or not, okay?

4:50:05Is there anything else on this, councillor Caron?

4:50:09I'm gonna make an amendment.

4:50:10Okay.

4:50:11Because I'm recognizing I'm hearing my council colleagues

4:50:14uncomfortable with 500K, I respect that.

4:50:17250 just doesn't give us leverage

4:50:19to be doing major projects

4:50:24that I think are gonna get us that bang for the buck.

4:50:27So I'm gonna amend it to $350,000.

4:50:33Go middle ground there.

4:50:36Is there a seconder for 350?

4:50:39Okay, councillor Allt will second that for 350.

4:50:42Okay, so we're gonna call the amendment,

4:50:45a vote on the amendment only of 350, okay?

4:50:49I'm gonna call that vote now.

4:50:50Anyone's against that, please raise your hand.

4:50:57Billings and Guthrie and Gibson and Chu.

4:51:00Sounds like I'm doing like a Christmas Carol or something.

4:51:04Oh my, oh my, okay.

4:51:07Billings and Guthrie and Gibson and Chu and Gaulder

4:51:12and Richardson and Kloss and Boussatil

4:51:15and Downer and Hauser, okay.

4:51:18Yes.

4:51:20All right, so that fails on the amendment.

4:51:22So we're back to the 250, okay?

4:51:25If there's, so I'll call the vote on the 250.

4:51:27If you're against the 250, please raise your hand.

4:51:31Okay, so it's just Cron and Guthrie

4:51:37and Richardson and Chu and Billings and Gibson.

4:51:43I think that's seven, no, it's seven, six, right?

4:51:48Yeah, so it passes, so it's at 250, okay?

4:51:53Okay, thank you.

4:51:56All right, so now we can get to this part here,

4:52:01the shortening of the 30-day budget amendment period.

4:52:04So can you please put that up on the screen?

4:52:08I have a point of order on this as well, Mayor Guthrie.

4:52:10Sure, go ahead.

4:52:12I'm just curious, is this enabling for this budget alone

4:52:16or is this ongoing for budgets in the future?

4:52:21Through you, Mr. Mayor, this would apply only

4:52:22to the 2026 budget process.

4:52:24Thank you.

4:52:28Councillor Allt, would you move this one?

4:52:31Just want to move this?

4:52:33Yeah.

4:52:33And Hauser will second it, okay.

4:52:36And so I'll call the vote on that, is anyone against that?

4:52:41Okay, nobody?

4:52:43Okay, so now I'm gonna ask for a 15-minute break

4:52:48as I consider whether or not I'd like to veto anything.

4:52:52Okay, so it is, it's the time.

4:52:57Let's make it two o'clock, let's make it a little bit longer.

4:53:00So at 2 p.m., we will come back

4:53:03and we will consider what the next steps

4:53:05of the process is in the budget, okay?

4:53:07Thank you.

4:53:13I'm sorry, Shanna, before we go,

4:53:16could you just tell us what we are currently at right now?

4:53:19I think it's like 3.4-ish or something.

4:53:24Yes, we are at 3.36% plus the hospital levy.

4:53:29So, and that's 11?

4:53:31Point 11, yep.

4:53:32Yeah, so 3.47.

4:53:35That's right, yes.

4:53:36But I think it's appropriate, Council,

4:53:38that we separate the hospital levy out, that is separate.

4:53:43Would you say 3.?

4:53:443.36.

4:53:453.36, okay, thank you.

4:53:47So let's come back here at 2 o'clock, okay?

4:53:48Can I just meet with the clerk

4:53:50and the executive team in the back room for a second?

4:53:52Thank you.

5:04:22Mic test, mic test, audio mic test, mic test, mic test.

5:15:51Okay, just seeing if Councillor Blings is here online.

5:16:11Okay, everyone, I have decided not to veto anything.

5:16:14And I'm just gonna give you my reasons why.

5:16:17I like to break things down into those buckets of value

5:16:25and affordability.

5:16:27I've said it many times.

5:16:28So I just wanna give you the numbers

5:16:32because I actually drilled down a little bit, okay?

5:16:34So 100RE is 31 cents a month

5:16:41or the average assessed home here in Guelph.

5:16:44Is there value in that?

5:16:46I think there is.

5:16:49The transit expansion is 78 cents per month

5:16:55for the average assessed home in Guelph.

5:16:58And is there value in that?

5:17:00Yes, I think there is.

5:17:04Especially on the transit one, I will just say,

5:17:07I should have maybe said this earlier,

5:17:11is that there is the reference to Conestoga College.

5:17:17But, and it was mentioned earlier in another meeting,

5:17:20but I forgot too about the expansion

5:17:22of the Medical Imaging Center

5:17:25that's there too from the hospital.

5:17:28So all the other benefits too, I'm not discounting those,

5:17:31but there is that there.

5:17:35I thought Councillor Downer made a really good point

5:17:38at our intentions night about this route

5:17:42that like if we don't sort of commit

5:17:46to putting something in here as an enhancement now

5:17:50for 2026, it's gonna be much harder moving into 2027.

5:17:56And I also feel too that with increases in ridership

5:17:59that also can sometimes look to help us with grants

5:18:02from other levels of government

5:18:03when they base things on ridership numbers.

5:18:06So there's sort of the revenue side on that too.

5:18:09The last part I would just say is,

5:18:17and I hope you, my colleagues will agree,

5:18:23is that I know that I've been using the strawmere powers

5:18:25a few times, but I have always used it in a way

5:18:31that has never countered democracy.

5:18:34I've never done that.

5:18:35So I've brought forward items of information

5:18:41or research and review, which is allowed

5:18:43under the legislation, and I've always brought them forward

5:18:46for all of Council.

5:18:49I've never brought forward something

5:18:52where it has been what's called a bylaw,

5:18:56which only then would require a one third vote of Council.

5:19:01And the reason why that is important to me

5:19:07is that it dilutes the position

5:19:15of an elected official as a Councillor.

5:19:17And so if I were to come here today

5:19:20and do sort of a reverse and say, well, I'm gonna veto this,

5:19:25and then it would only require a one third,

5:19:30it does go against some of the positions

5:19:34that I've had that I've held fast on

5:19:36and true on on the democracy front.

5:19:39I think there is a role for strawmere powers

5:19:40on the other things I have used it on,

5:19:43and I have no hesitation to continue using them

5:19:45to further things faster, housing,

5:19:49other important issues in the city.

5:19:51I will not apologize for that,

5:19:53but I think overriding my colleagues

5:19:58from a democracy point of view has still considered,

5:20:02is to me something that is difficult.

5:20:05And so I just wanna respect that for my colleagues.

5:20:08And again, I come back to the whole value

5:20:10versus affordability position.

5:20:13If I, at the end of the day,

5:20:18I own the decision of, I added it up,

5:20:22it's $1.09.

5:20:24So I own that $1.09 that I,

5:20:28per month of the average assessed household

5:20:30that is not, that I didn't veto.

5:20:34And I will stand behind that decision.

5:20:39And as you could tell too,

5:20:42I didn't obviously touch the daytime space as well

5:20:47that we did as a council.

5:20:48So, so yeah, sorry, that was a long way

5:20:52of just saying I didn't veto.

5:20:54But there's some of my, I think I'm allowed that space

5:20:58to tell you why.

5:21:00Because if I did veto, I would have been forced

5:21:03to tell you why.

5:21:04So I'm telling you why not.

5:21:06Okay, so with that, we're actually done.

5:21:09But I know that Councillor Gibson,

5:21:11I promise you I'd go back to you.

5:21:13I mean, go ahead and say what you wish.

5:21:16But after you're done or anybody else,

5:21:18it is a motion to adjourn, we're done.

5:21:22Thank you.

5:21:23Go ahead.

5:21:24Through Mr. Mayor, just acknowledgement,

5:21:25the, I always try and sort of frame the budget

5:21:30in my own mind.

5:21:30And I think from the, from the beginning,

5:21:32early budget workshops,

5:21:33we talked about development slowing down in our city.

5:21:37So therefore a weakens whole revenues

5:21:39or new development charges or new taxation,

5:21:42this growth is on the decline.

5:21:45And to that point, I think that should be stated publicly

5:21:48that the projected revenues on growth are down

5:21:51and it will continue probably to trend downwards

5:21:54until something changes.

5:21:55But you took that and you incorporated that into the budget

5:21:59that you brought to council,

5:22:01Mayor and CEO and the executive team

5:22:03in terms of your capital deferrals.

5:22:05So you took that list of things

5:22:07that we have projected to want to do.

5:22:09You tried to align it with our decreasing overall revenue

5:22:14and you reset expectations.

5:22:16So the deferral list on capital

5:22:18is always a little bit depressing,

5:22:20but that is a splash of reality that has to happen

5:22:23when you're going through,

5:22:25quite frankly, an economic downturn.

5:22:27So that, from that perspective, thank you for the work.

5:22:31You took a lot of that burden away from us council.

5:22:34It's very hard to find seven votes around the horseshoe

5:22:37when you're trying to take things out of the budget.

5:22:39So I do appreciate that.

5:22:41As someone who's introduced much motions before,

5:22:44it's difficult to win one if you bring forward 10

5:22:47and you get two, that's great.

5:22:49So the fact that that work was done a lot in advance

5:22:52when the mayor brought forward the budget

5:22:53is very much appreciated.

5:22:54So we're not wrangling over every last project.

5:22:58I didn't like everything in the budget.

5:23:01I respect the mayor's desire not to veto.

5:23:06I think it's always hard,

5:23:08even again, we talk about the conversations

5:23:10we have in our household,

5:23:12it's always hard as costs go up

5:23:13and as costs keep going up,

5:23:16acknowledging councillor Alts emotion,

5:23:18there's some reality in that.

5:23:20But I do want to give credit where credit is due

5:23:25to the mayor and to the rest of council.

5:23:26I think we did collectively get along pretty well today

5:23:29and through this process.

5:23:31So for those who haven't experienced a tough budget,

5:23:34like this has been pretty mild.

5:23:36So to my council colleagues,

5:23:40we all wear this budget together.

5:23:42So I appreciate that.

5:23:43Thank you.

5:23:45Right.

5:23:47Thank you.

5:23:48Do I need to go to anybody else

5:23:50or can I look for adjournment?

5:23:52Okay. So before adjournment,

5:23:55I do want to say thank you to staff.

5:23:58Again, I said at the beginning,

5:23:59I'm going to say at the end.

5:24:00So like since February,

5:24:04there has been a ton of work

5:24:06and you really helped with everything so much.

5:24:09And I can't thank you enough personally

5:24:11for holding my hand a little bit

5:24:13through this whole process like you did.

5:24:14And I also want to say thank you to my council colleagues too.

5:24:18Like it was great.

5:24:19I mean, it really was.

5:24:21It was a nice process to get where we landed

5:24:23and we did it together and that's a good thing.

5:24:25So with that, I bet you Billings

5:24:29would move a motion for adjournment.

5:24:31And why don't we stick to the screen?

5:24:32Will Kate and second adjournment?

5:24:35Okay, excellent.

5:24:36I'm going to call a vote.

5:24:37Please vote unanimously on this.

5:24:39Is anyone against adjournment?

5:24:42Nobody.

5:24:43Okay. Have a great day everyone.

5:24:44Thanks for all your help.